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2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?
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Bibliafarm
Posted 2013-12-16 9:59 PM (#6894721 - in reply to #6893952)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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SaritaStorm - 2013-12-16 12:25 PM
Bibliafarm - 2013-12-15 8:21 PM The livestock and horses will die .. in the heat here.. its winter but not cold down south. its clearly in the 80's.. coming from northern states with their winter coats and acclimated to cold.. it will be very hard on them here.. bad decision .. stay in cold climates.
That is ridiculous! 

NO Kidding. it is tongue in cheek.. good grief.. They will have to acclimate but  NO kidding. 
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thomas paine
Posted 2013-12-16 10:04 PM (#6894723 - in reply to #6894684)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?





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HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 9:12 PM

I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.
For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?
Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  
NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.
NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  
Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 

I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  

as someone who grew up around horses/rodeo scene (like pretty much everyone else on here) I just don't think rodeo can get anywhere close to the "pro sports" level. a couple of random thoughts - if you want to watch the NFL you have 14-16 games a week that you can choose to either attend or watch at the house. as an advertiser, which game will you choose? nascar has one "game" at one location a week and if you want to watch the nascar race on a sunday afternoon, you have that one choice. little bit easier as an advertiser to pick where to spend your $$.

I agree with the statement that given the opportunity of experiencing multiple sports (to include rodeo) youth may lean towards rodeo. the reality is that not many teenage boys/girls that live in a cookie cutter subdivision with "non horsey" parents will be able to make that rodeo dream come true.

a saddle pad costs $200+, which doesn't get one far in the horse world, and for about that same amount a kid can outfit themselves with any of the following: basketball and goal, a skateboard, about half a bag of golf clubs, or just about anything else sports related to get them started.
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HotbearLVR
Posted 2013-12-16 10:13 PM (#6894731 - in reply to #6894723)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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thomas paine - 2013-12-16 10:04 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 9:12 PM I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.

For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?

Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  

NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.

NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  

Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 



I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  
as someone who grew up around horses/rodeo scene (like pretty much everyone else on here) I just don't think rodeo can get anywhere close to the "pro sports" level. a couple of random thoughts - if you want to watch the NFL you have 14-16 games a week that you can choose to either attend or watch at the house. as an advertiser, which game will you choose? nascar has one "game" at one location a week and if you want to watch the nascar race on a sunday afternoon, you have that one choice. little bit easier as an advertiser to pick where to spend your $$. I agree with the statement that given the opportunity of experiencing multiple sports (to include rodeo) youth may lean towards rodeo. the reality is that not many teenage boys/girls that live in a cookie cutter subdivision with "non horsey" parents will be able to make that rodeo dream come true. a saddle pad costs $200+, which doesn't get one far in the horse world, and for about that same amount a kid can outfit themselves with any of the following: basketball and goal, a skateboard, about half a bag of golf clubs, or just about anything else sports related to get them started.

I'm not saying any of those sports are the same....hence my "apples and oranges" qualifier.  How the hell does a professional wrestler deserve more than a pro cowboy/cowgirl?  It's all about exposure and marketing and you have to try something new, when the status quo is that little progress is made over a span of nearly 3 decades.  I don't see how they can do much worse.  I'd love to see more PRCA rodeos on the East Coast.  
As far as the cost of tack and horses for a kid, I guess you haven't had a kid who was seriously into hockey!  Between the equipment, ice time, and camps, you can spend a fortune.
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Stitch4k9
Posted 2013-12-16 10:15 PM (#6894734 - in reply to #6894684)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 9:12 PM I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.

For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?

Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  

NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.

NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  

Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 



I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  

Keep in mind PRCA/WPRA is a unique "sport" in the way players are funneled to the finals.  So to compare to other sports isn't just apples and oranges.  It is more like apples and fire wood.  

One of the cool things about rodeo is that every kid can grow up with the dream and a realistic shot.  Not so much for NASCAR, NFL , etc....  I am all about building a better customer base.  But, even on BHW there is a thread with people wondering who Joe Beaver is.......  

Heck we lost the Bull Fight tour years ago because of lack of sponsor money.  And believe me there has been plenty of work done to bring it  back.  

Moving to FL or any place else is not going to magically fix these issues.  PRCA is doing a much better job of marketing but they have a ways to go.  And the WPRA couldn't even get current results up on their web site.  

I would LOVE to see both orgaizations spend more time in promoting the local rodeo.  Help get the citizens in the seats.   Talk to the kids about how to get started in rodeo.   We are not getting new members by the numbers we need to sustain.   The PRCA should be paying a retired Gold buckle member to go out and promote.  Kids need to meet the heros of our sport.   I was 9 years old when I met Martha Josey.  It blew my mind and made such a hugh impression.  And to hear her story made me believe anything was possible. 

Hopefully the talking heads at PRCA are smarter about this than the last time they decided to become a "Sports" venue and not rodeo.  As I stated before it darned near was the end of the PRCA. 

karen
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HotbearLVR
Posted 2013-12-16 10:17 PM (#6894738 - in reply to #6894723)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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thomas paine - 2013-12-16 10:04 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 9:12 PM I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.

For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?

Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  

NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.

NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  

Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 



I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  
as someone who grew up around horses/rodeo scene (like pretty much everyone else on here) I just don't think rodeo can get anywhere close to the "pro sports" level. a couple of random thoughts - if you want to watch the NFL you have 14-16 games a week that you can choose to either attend or watch at the house. as an advertiser, which game will you choose? nascar has one "game" at one location a week and if you want to watch the nascar race on a sunday afternoon, you have that one choice. little bit easier as an advertiser to pick where to spend your $$. I agree with the statement that given the opportunity of experiencing multiple sports (to include rodeo) youth may lean towards rodeo. the reality is that not many teenage boys/girls that live in a cookie cutter subdivision with "non horsey" parents will be able to make that rodeo dream come true. a saddle pad costs $200+, which doesn't get one far in the horse world, and for about that same amount a kid can outfit themselves with any of the following: basketball and goal, a skateboard, about half a bag of golf clubs, or just about anything else sports related to get them started.

I'm not saying any of those sports are the same....hence my "apples and oranges" qualifier.  How the hell does a professional wrestler deserve more than a pro cowboy/cowgirl?  It's all about exposure and marketing and you have to try something new, when the status quo is that little progress is made over a span of nearly 3 decades.  I don't see how they can do much worse.  I'd love to see more PRCA rodeos on the East Coast.  
As far as the cost of tack and horses for a kid, I guess you haven't had a kid who was seriously into hockey!  Between the equipment, ice time, and camps, you can spend a fortune.
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HotbearLVR
Posted 2013-12-16 10:34 PM (#6894753 - in reply to #6894734)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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Posts: 21082
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Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 10:15 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 9:12 PM I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.

For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?

Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  

NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.

NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  

Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 



I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  
Keep in mind PRCA/WPRA is a unique "sport" in the way players are funneled to the finals.  So to compare to other sports isn't just apples and oranges.  It is more like apples and fire wood.  



One of the cool things about rodeo is that every kid can grow up with the dream and a realistic shot.  Not so much for NASCAR, NFL , etc....  I am all about building a better customer base.  But, even on BHW there is a thread with people wondering who Joe Beaver is.......  



Heck we lost the Bull Fight tour years ago because of lack of sponsor money.  And believe me there has been plenty of work done to bring it  back.  



Moving to FL or any place else is not going to magically fix these issues.  PRCA is doing a much better job of marketing but they have a ways to go.  And the WPRA couldn't even get current results up on their web site.  



I would LOVE to see both orgaizations spend more time in promoting the local rodeo.  Help get the citizens in the seats.   Talk to the kids about how to get started in rodeo.   We are not getting new members by the numbers we need to sustain.   The PRCA should be paying a retired Gold buckle member to go out and promote.  Kids need to meet the heros of our sport.   I was 9 years old when I met Martha Josey.  It blew my mind and made such a hugh impression.  And to hear her story made me believe anything was possible. 



Hopefully the talking heads at PRCA are smarter about this than the last time they decided to become a "Sports" venue and not rodeo.  As I stated before it darned near was the end of the PRCA. 



karen

I agree with the highlighted part.  The effort needs to be made on several levels.  I used "apples and oranges" to emphasize there are differences between those other "sports" and rodeo, and I agree rodeo is unique.  In NASCAR, for example, every driver is basically part of a multimillion dollar franchise, but they went from where they were in the 60s to the #1 spectator sport in the country.  All I am saying, is maybe they ought to take a few pages from their playbook.  This move to Orlando might be a huge boost for rodeo along the eastern seaboard.
I wonder how this might play out with the executives at NBC/Comcast/Disney?  Could that somehow be in the equation?  Just thinking out loud.

If I had a choice to take a family somewhere for a winter vacation, I think Orlando in early December would be fantastic.  It's a heck of a lot more family friendly than Vegas if your family includes young kids.  
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HotbearLVR
Posted 2013-12-16 10:45 PM (#6894759 - in reply to #6894717)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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Posts: 21082
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Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 9:55 PM Want better payout.  Support the current sponsors and help find new ones. 



And could someone point out Where in the FL press release it says the contestants are getting better money?  



Then keep in mind that the PRCA is able to increase the payout anytime they want.   The NFR rules and regs have not been written by LVE. 



karen

I wouldn't expect the payouts to be drammatically better for the first few years.  I certainly wouldn't expect them to be worse, either.  Orlando is making a huge committment, and that tells me a lot.  I can see NBC/Disney potentially involved with promotion, and that might well include television.  As far as supporting sponsors....well, the NFR ran the same 5-6 ads for 10 days.  I promise I will never buy one of those pizzas, and I don't like whiskey (Pendleton Wiskey - neat ad though), and I don't have a need for a recliner.  I already drive a Dodge pickup!  LOL
 
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EnterUp
Posted 2013-12-16 10:59 PM (#6894766 - in reply to #6893670)
Subject: RE: NFR in FlORIDA?!





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kboltwkreations - 2013-12-16 4:47 PM

Ask anyone in Vegas and they will tell you the NFR keeps the city alive during the "dead" time until New Year Eve.  They are not going to lose the RODEO CROWD. 
Im ready to see what they have up their sleeve.  I wouldnt doubt that it will be something like "The American" as a series through the year, that finishes up in Vegas.
Way too fishy that the PRCA dropped GAC and RFD and now they are set on moving from Las Vegas as well.  

The PRCA is finally listening and standing behind their contestants. It was the contestants that banded together and said, enough is enough, if Vegas wants us here then they need to step up to the plate. The PRCA Board of Directors did not make this move on their own, it was contestant driven. So forget your conspiracy theories, there isn't one here. And I for one applaud the cowboy/cowgirl for finally pushing back
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Stitch4k9
Posted 2013-12-16 11:06 PM (#6894769 - in reply to #6894759)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 10:45 PM
Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 9:55 PM Want better payout.  Support the current sponsors and help find new ones. 



And could someone point out Where in the FL press release it says the contestants are getting better money?  



Then keep in mind that the PRCA is able to increase the payout anytime they want.   The NFR rules and regs have not been written by LVE. 



karen
I wouldn't expect the payouts to be drammatically better for the first few years.  I certainly wouldn't expect them to be worse, either.  Orlando is making a huge committment, and that tells me a lot.  I can see NBC/Disney potentially involved with promotion, and that might well include television.  As far as supporting sponsors....well, the NFR ran the same 5-6 ads for 10 days.  I promise I will never buy one of those pizzas, and I don't like whiskey (Pendleton Wiskey - neat ad though), and I don't have a need for a recliner.  I already drive a Dodge pickup!  LOL

 

Okay pick your favorite wine and get them on board.

   Before Pendelton it was Crown.  Both have been great sponsors and obviously both have benefited from the relationship.   I can think of a number of "out of the box" companies that would be great sponsors. 

Seriously I don't want NBC nor Disney to have ANY say in what happens with the NFR.  That is when you lose control and it becomes a made for TV production.  

I would like to see the PRCA and WPRA get serious about marketing their brand. Working together to pick up new, unique sponsors.  If they would build the product the TV coverage, etc. would come. 

karen

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Nevertooold
Posted 2013-12-16 11:17 PM (#6894776 - in reply to #6894769)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 11:06 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 10:45 PM
Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 9:55 PM Want better payout.  Support the current sponsors and help find new ones. 



And could someone point out Where in the FL press release it says the contestants are getting better money?  



Then keep in mind that the PRCA is able to increase the payout anytime they want.   The NFR rules and regs have not been written by LVE. 



karen
I wouldn't expect the payouts to be drammatically better for the first few years.  I certainly wouldn't expect them to be worse, either.  Orlando is making a huge committment, and that tells me a lot.  I can see NBC/Disney potentially involved with promotion, and that might well include television.  As far as supporting sponsors....well, the NFR ran the same 5-6 ads for 10 days.  I promise I will never buy one of those pizzas, and I don't like whiskey (Pendleton Wiskey - neat ad though), and I don't have a need for a recliner.  I already drive a Dodge pickup!  LOL

 

Okay pick your favorite wine and get them on board.



   Before Pendelton it was Crown.  Both have been great sponsors and obviously both have benefited from the relationship.   I can think of a number of "out of the box" companies that would be great sponsors. 



Seriously I don't want NBC nor Disney to have ANY say in what happens with the NFR.  That is when you lose control and it becomes a made for TV production.  



I would like to see the PRCA and WPRA get serious about marketing their brand. Working together to pick up new, unique sponsors.  If they would build the product the TV coverage, etc. would come. 



karen



I agree...

The word on the street is Florida offered 4 million more in prize money and the rounds would pay $30,000 and the average $100,000. That's double for the average and $12,000 for a go round win. If I was a contestant..I would be packing for Florida.



 
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CYA Ranch
Posted 2013-12-16 11:40 PM (#6894788 - in reply to #6894776)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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Nevertooold - 2013-12-16 11:17 PM
Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 11:06 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 10:45 PM
Stitch4k9 - 2013-12-16 9:55 PM Want better payout.  Support the current sponsors and help find new ones. 



And could someone point out Where in the FL press release it says the contestants are getting better money?  



Then keep in mind that the PRCA is able to increase the payout anytime they want.   The NFR rules and regs have not been written by LVE. 



karen
I wouldn't expect the payouts to be drammatically better for the first few years.  I certainly wouldn't expect them to be worse, either.  Orlando is making a huge committment, and that tells me a lot.  I can see NBC/Disney potentially involved with promotion, and that might well include television.  As far as supporting sponsors....well, the NFR ran the same 5-6 ads for 10 days.  I promise I will never buy one of those pizzas, and I don't like whiskey (Pendleton Wiskey - neat ad though), and I don't have a need for a recliner.  I already drive a Dodge pickup!  LOL

 

Okay pick your favorite wine and get them on board.



   Before Pendelton it was Crown.  Both have been great sponsors and obviously both have benefited from the relationship.   I can think of a number of "out of the box" companies that would be great sponsors. 



Seriously I don't want NBC nor Disney to have ANY say in what happens with the NFR.  That is when you lose control and it becomes a made for TV production.  



I would like to see the PRCA and WPRA get serious about marketing their brand. Working together to pick up new, unique sponsors.  If they would build the product the TV coverage, etc. would come. 



karen


I agree...



The word on the street is Florida offered 4 million more in prize money and the rounds would pay $30,000 and the average $100,000. That's double for the average and $12,000 for a go round win. If I was a contestant..I would be packing for Florida.




 

When my daughter gave me those same number increases I have to say it impressed the heck out of me.  I can see why the contestants will put up with traveling all the way across the country for it.  I can't imagine those on the Pacific NW and Alberta.  That's going to be a heck of  a haul.  I also wonder about the Canadian quarantine problem too.  
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Ethel
Posted 2013-12-16 11:52 PM (#6894790 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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I wish you all could read the posts on Charlie Horky's page on facebook.. He and Jade Corkill and some others have made some really good points.. I wish it would let me copy and paste but, it won't.. Charlie lives is Vegas and owns one of the largest limo companies there.. He is who has the Hork Dog roping every year too.. He also is generous enough to fly some of the cowboys from rodeo to rodeo during the 4th or when they need it on his private jet..  I think we can all see where this is heading.. Calgary, Houston, Vegas and whoever else will have a huge finals like The American.. And it will pay like a slot machine!!   There are some BIG ideas being floated around..
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HotbearLVR
Posted 2013-12-16 11:52 PM (#6894791 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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Karen, I was just thinking of NBC/Disney in terms of televising the NFR.
Maybe it's far fetched.  I think it's possible that the NBC Sports Network Channel might be a possibility.  Seems like a good potential match with Orlando, Disney, NBC, etc.....  
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phoenix
Posted 2013-12-17 1:43 AM (#6894804 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?




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Although Vegas is a good place for the fans, it is definitely not the best venue for the contestants. The arena is very small and really not the best for any event with the exception of the bull riding since most of the bulls come out of the chute, don't go very far and just start spinning (so they don't need much room.) It is not a good sized arena for the steer wrestlers, calf ropers, team ropers or barrel racers. And not very good for the bronc riders.
Also, the warm up facilities are substandard - the contestants have to warm up in a circus tent with some dirt thrown on top of the paved parking lot. Not the best situation.

When Vegas first got the NFR contract, they promised lots of things such as larger payouts to the contestants as the years went on (which happened to a degree in the beginning, but I believe the payout has only increased by about $4000 since 2004), and they even "semi-promised" building a new equestrian facility with a larger arena, better warm up and barns, etc. and that has never happened.

I don't blame the Cowboys/Cowgirls and PRCA for entertaining other options that could possibly be more lucrative for the contestants. I understand the fans are very important, but I think a priority should be making sure the contestants are taken care of. I believe that the wonderful fans of Pro Rodeo and the NFR will come and support our great sport no matter where the NFR is held.
And don't forget........Las Vegas does have the option of "upping the ante" in their location and offering a bid that can match or beat the other locations. They do have a choice in this matter and if they choose not to do so that is their decision. JMHO.......
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yellowhorse1
Posted 2013-12-17 3:07 AM (#6894812 - in reply to #6894622)
Subject: RE: Tyson Durfey's take on moving the NFR..




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DD2012 - 2013-12-16 8:14 PM

dhdqhllc - 2013-12-16 8:05 PM

RoadToVegas - 2013-12-16 7:50 PM
TXBO - 2013-12-16 7:47 PM Tyson needs to stick to roping.
Why? He is one of the only people that should really have a say in this lol without the contestants there would be no show. Fans who want to see the best of the best will go where ever the NFR is.
i would wager that the number of 'fans' that actually go to the performances is dwarfed by the number that maybe go to one or none and go to vegas for the experience of it all.......yes, without the performers there is no show but without a huge amount of fans showing up and spending 100s of millions of dollars, their is no big paycheck for petulant athletes......

all of this


I'm all for the contestants getting all they can, but the fact is the fans are who generate the revenue to pay them.

Yes, and if some cities are willing to pay more than Vegas then what's the problem? Do you think the people making those offers aren't smart enough to know what they are doing??? Lol
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ThreeCorners
Posted 2013-12-17 6:51 AM (#6894832 - in reply to #6894708)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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Swannranch - 2013-12-16 9:39 PM
HotbearLVR - 2013-12-16 10:12 PM I have to say that I think this has been a good thread, actually.  I haven't really said much about this because I simply don't know enough facts, but my first reaction was this is a bad move.   Over the past 3 days I've learned a lot, and I'm left with the opinion that this might be a good move.  I'll say one thing, and that is I applaud the PRCA's bold decision.

For the longest time I've been wondering why pro rodeo isn't more profitable all the way around.  Just for the hell of it I looked up a random "Ultimate Fighting" list of ticket prices for a random venue...."Duluth Georgia".  The prices for that fight ranged between $70 and $220 for a night.  Look at pro wrestling, which is basically a farce.  One source I found quoted the "average WWF talent" earning $550,000 per year.  According to Sporting News, the base salary of a NASCAR driver ranges from a low of $500,000 a year, all the way up to $10 Million a year, and that doesn't even count endorsements, which can be several million more.  Hell, just for the fun of it I looked up "Professional Skateboarding"....the top 20 skateboarders are all millionaires.  You never hear about people flocking from all corners of the country to watch skatboarding, do you?

Now look, I realize a lot of this is like comparing apples to oranges, however, nobody can convince me that pro rodeo can't do better.  

NASCAR used to be where pro rodeo is today...back in the 60s and 70s.  What happened?  Basically, in a word, marketing.  That's the one commonality between WWF, Ultimate Fighting, and  NASCAR.

NASCAR is now the nations #1 spectator sport.  I'll bet you anything, that if you took a dozen inner city kids and spent one afternoon at a NASCAR race, and another afternoon at a PRCA rodeo, hands down, the kids would want to be a rodeo cowboy!  I hope to see the day when at least the top tier rodeo competitors are REAL professionals, in the literal sense of the word.....to the extent that they actually get invited to compete at BIG rodeos and don't have to pay to put on the show out of their own pocket.  

Another thing is this may be a good move in terms of moving rodeo to the more densely populated east coast, where there's a greater opportunity to pique the interest of "FANS".   If this works out well, I think we can all look forward to the more realistic expectation that in the not too distant future Networks like ABC, NBC, FOX, and ESPN will actually compete for the television rights for the NFR.  When that happens......just watch and see. 



I hope this move is partly based on a gamble to think "outside of the box" and a first step that is probably long overdue.  We can only hope.  I think I'm going to go to the NFR next year.  Heck I even can picture taking my grandkids one day.  We can do Disney, Sea World, and the NFR.  I like that a hell of a lot more than some smelly Casino full of long ashen faces from losing the noight before, prostitutes, mafioso, and drug pushers.  
I could not agree more (don't care where or if they move it).  I have often wondered why the money isn't better.  But the Skateboarders and NASCAR are all Sponsor supported.  Not totally, but a major part of the money comes from major sponsors.  

Rodeo has to fight the PETA and Shark type organizations and people that do not understand livestock or animals at all for that matter.  I believe that will be a hugh battle.  Yet the Race Horse industry seems to have gotten around that hurdle, at least enough to profit (I think). 



I would also love to see the PRCA-WPRA money spread out around the country more.  I know the rodeo tradition is in the West, and I understand but one reason the contestants from the weat are so numerous is partially because if you live on the east coast...it's hard to earn enough money to make the NFR.  And the more spread out the money is the more spectators you get.  I know that's a product of getting big sponsors from this area, but I think the marketing is a gigantic part of why it's not bigger everywhere (the money I mean).


 

Race horse industry has gambling money. Without the wagering, racing would fold. PRCA should apply for wagering license. People could bet on the rodeo contestants per rodeo. That would generate ALOT of money, and new interests.  
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3canstorun
Posted 2013-12-17 7:15 AM (#6894836 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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While rodeo needs new investments/interests, marketing will be the key.  Also, dealing with quarratine on the animals.  I read alot on the FL web page.  A lot of othe rodeo bucking stock are exempt from some of the regulations.  What it will boil down to on the FL requirements for health certificates, etc.  is that the contestants will have to do more paperwork and research.  But, that is why they are professional.  The first year will be hectic and then they will learn the ropes.   Going from 32 degree weather to 80 degree weather will really make it hard on the animals.   I see this as a problem for the participants. 

Orlando is more family friendly for those of the spectators who wish to take their children.  But, it will not be cheap.  And, decent hotels are not cheap.  Traveling in that area is horrid to say the least.  Traveling sometimes takes more than an hour to go 14 miles.  

I understand and support the fact that the participants need/want to be paid more.   But, please WPRA and PRCA listen and make wise decisions. 
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barrelracr131
Posted 2013-12-17 7:29 AM (#6894839 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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In terms of expanding interest in rodeo.... I work in downtown Chicago.... I'm sorry, but the folks I work with have ZERO interest in rodeo. I mean none. Unfortunately a lot of the country is like that- most of our nation's population is in large cities and suburbs.
I think the majority of our population have come too far from rural life to have any desire to follow rodeo. While I was one of the lucky subdivision kids whose parents got them into horses, I am not the norm. My folks are not horse people.

I'll be honest, while I have the utmost respect for the contestants, I don't really follow rodeo myself until the NFR. I think I'm like a majority of fans, as well... Vegas offers a lot to the pseudo-fan like me... adult atmosphere, lots to see, great resturaunts, and nightlife (though I really don't drink, others go places to party). Come on...it's VEGAS! To deny the fact that the environment of Vegas is a draw to people, helping to sell out performances, would be silly.

On a personal level, I'd love to see these talented folks make more money. My fear would be that somewhere like Orlando doesn't have the inherent draw that Vegas does, and that ticket sales (and therefore the sport) will ultimately suffer over time. Sure, lots of people go to FL...for the parks, resorts, etc. It is also WAY more expensive to hit the sights in FL than it is in Vegas. Hotels, flights, food, and theme parks are significantly more expensive. It just doesn't have the same draw. I hope other cities are considered. JMO
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ThreeCorners
Posted 2013-12-17 7:30 AM (#6894840 - in reply to #6894836)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?


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3canstorun - 2013-12-17 7:15 AM While rodeo needs new investments/interests, marketing will be the key.  Also, dealing with quarratine on the animals.  I read alot on the FL web page.  A lot of othe rodeo bucking stock are exempt from some of the regulations.  What it will boil down to on the FL requirements for health certificates, etc.  is that the contestants will have to do more paperwork and research.  But, that is why they are professional.  The first year will be hectic and then they will learn the ropes.   Going from 32 degree weather to 80 degree weather will really make it hard on the animals.   I see this as a problem for the participants. 



Orlando is more family friendly for those of the spectators who wish to take their children.  But, it will not be cheap.  And, decent hotels are not cheap.  Traveling in that area is horrid to say the least.  Traveling sometimes takes more than an hour to go 14 miles.  



I understand and support the fact that the participants need/want to be paid more.   But, please WPRA and PRCA listen and make wise decisions. 

Most typical rodeo fans can not afford the average $300 a night hotel rooms. This alone makes it pretty formidable to get the numbers of fans needed to make it float.  
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bocephus's mama
Posted 2013-12-17 7:30 AM (#6894841 - in reply to #6893421)
Subject: RE: 2015 NFR- Vegas or Florida?



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Rodeo isn't mainstream. Could it happen? Anything is possible. For instance, a show focusing on a rodeo even on a mainstream channel....like maybe A&E?  
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