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Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!

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dianeguinn
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2014-12-15 11:18 AM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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Streakysox, I would be interested to know what the preventative program is. Would you mind telling?
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rachellyn80
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2014-12-15 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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dianeguinn - 2014-12-15 11:16 AM
lexyy12 - 2014-12-12 9:36 PM  I was able to find it at least a little cheaper at $749 for the whole treatment  My whole fear is spending all of this money and her not getting better. I guess no matter what there is never a guarantee. My vet strongly advises this for her case. 



I have a question though...is this something worth getting a second opinion on? Can the test be wrong? Could he read it wrong? I know nothing about this except it needs treated ASAP!



Im afraid to try something else cheaper and it not work and her get worse and then have to go through with this anyway. Im very upset about this news..I really thought we were just going to get an injection and be over with. This mare means a lot to me...Ive put so much blood, sweat, tears and love into her. gaaahhhh....the life of owning horses. Perfect timing with Christmas and all...
Any test on animals or humans can be wrong, and a second opinion is always a good idea. Sounds like your vet is way behind the times on EPM research. Marquis was the first treatment that was widely used for EPM, and it's not very effective. In fact, I think the protozoa has become immune to it, just like worms become immune to wormer, and that's why it doesn't work well. I would agree with what everyone else said on here....the cheaper treatments are actually better if they're the Diclazuril or Orogin 10. Sometimes it takes several treatments to get rid of it, as some treatments will just cut the number down (once again, similar to worms....it IS a parasite....but is a protozoa, not a worm and it attacks the nervous system which is much more dangerous), but not clear the infection. Most of the time horses will need a couple of treatments before it's gone. I've had the best luck with the Orogin 10 (pill given for 10 days) followed by Levamisole for 14 days. That total treatment will not cost you as much as one tube of Marquis. ;)

Dr. White is shipping me Orogin for three more horses today.  My 3 yr old doesn't show any physical symptoms at all.  Fat, sassy, and rides around like a dream....just a complete schitso on the ground.   I couldn't even consider being able to brush his tail or pick up his feet.  I treated him with some ReBalance that I happened to have on hand and saw such a drastic change in his disposition I took him to Dr. White to have him tested after I finished the bottle.  ReBalance helps, but it won't last, so I knew we'd have to go with something stronger.

...he called me last week to tell me that the colt had the highest numbers he's ever seen on that test.

FYI:  after the fifth day of ReBalance I could pick up all of his feet and lift his tail straight up.  His eyes were quiet and he stopped pacing the fence.
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HorsePoorSince96
Reg. Jun 2004
Posted 2014-12-15 12:19 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!


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I just finished day 56 (2 straight rounds) of Marquis.  My horse only showed clinical signs in the head region.  Trouble eating grain, quidding his hay into balls at 1st and then he got muscle atrophy of the left side of his face over night.  His muzzle was even tilted to the right.  We started treatment immediately and it seems that only his head region was affected.  I have good improvements on the Marquis.  His eating has improved and his muzzle is straight again.  I am thinkful he was never lame or felt off so I hope we caught it early.
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dianeguinn
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2014-12-15 12:46 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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rachellyn80 - 2014-12-15 11:55 AM

dianeguinn - 2014-12-15 11:16 AM
lexyy12 - 2014-12-12 9:36 PM  I was able to find it at least a little cheaper at $749 for the whole treatment  My whole fear is spending all of this money and her not getting better. I guess no matter what there is never a guarantee. My vet strongly advises this for her case. 



I have a question though...is this something worth getting a second opinion on? Can the test be wrong? Could he read it wrong? I know nothing about this except it needs treated ASAP!



Im afraid to try something else cheaper and it not work and her get worse and then have to go through with this anyway. Im very upset about this news..I really thought we were just going to get an injection and be over with. This mare means a lot to me...Ive put so much blood, sweat, tears and love into her. gaaahhhh....the life of owning horses. Perfect timing with Christmas and all...
Any test on animals or humans can be wrong, and a second opinion is always a good idea. Sounds like your vet is way behind the times on EPM research. Marquis was the first treatment that was widely used for EPM, and it's not very effective. In fact, I think the protozoa has become immune to it, just like worms become immune to wormer, and that's why it doesn't work well. I would agree with what everyone else said on here....the cheaper treatments are actually better if they're the Diclazuril or Orogin 10. Sometimes it takes several treatments to get rid of it, as some treatments will just cut the number down (once again, similar to worms....it IS a parasite....but is a protozoa, not a worm and it attacks the nervous system which is much more dangerous), but not clear the infection. Most of the time horses will need a couple of treatments before it's gone. I've had the best luck with the Orogin 10 (pill given for 10 days) followed by Levamisole for 14 days. That total treatment will not cost you as much as one tube of Marquis. ;)

Dr. White is shipping me Orogin for three more horses today.  My 3 yr old doesn't show any physical symptoms at all.  Fat, sassy, and rides around like a dream....just a complete schitso on the ground.   I couldn't even consider being able to brush his tail or pick up his feet.  I treated him with some ReBalance that I happened to have on hand and saw such a drastic change in his disposition I took him to Dr. White to have him tested after I finished the bottle.  ReBalance helps, but it won't last, so I knew we'd have to go with something stronger.

...he called me last week to tell me that the colt had the highest numbers he's ever seen on that test.

FYI:  after the fifth day of ReBalance I could pick up all of his feet and lift his tail straight up.  His eyes were quiet and he stopped pacing the fence.

I am coming to realize that the first signs of EPM are extreme nervousness (I thought they were just being hot) and some of them don't want to load in the trailer after they had been loading fine....this shows before any of the physical signs....
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astreakinchic
Reg. Sep 2011
Posted 2014-12-15 12:57 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!


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streakysox - 2014-12-15 12:03 PM

casualdust07 - 2014-12-12 1:42 PM

I treated with oroquin and did not have success. Treated a second time with Marquis and cleared it.


Diclazuril is an off label option for EPM, but its a good choice and if your horse didnt respond to Marquis I would try it.

Marquis is expensive and there's no way around the cost.

Honestly, EPM is a hard infection to clear, so I'm not surprised to see horses not respond to one drug and respond to another, or require multiple rounds of treatments to clear it.

Nitazoxanide is another drug that is approved to treat EPM in horses, I believe it's called Navigator but I personally haven't heard of it until taking pharmacology in vet school... and the prof giving the lecture was a small animal vet so for all I know it may not even be available.

According to my vet. Navigator has been taken off the market. I have used tow different drugs. One is Rebalance (pyrimethamine) and Baycox (toltrazuril) I have had good success with both. My vet put my horse on a preventative program and he will probably have to have it the rest of his life. Neither of these treatments are excessively expensive.

I want to know the long term program


What is Dr. White recommending long term? Like in times of high stress?
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casualdust07
Reg. Mar 2005
Posted 2014-12-15 1:18 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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astreakinchic - 2014-12-15 12:57 PM

streakysox - 2014-12-15 12:03 PM

casualdust07 - 2014-12-12 1:42 PM

I treated with oroquin and did not have success. Treated a second time with Marquis and cleared it.


Diclazuril is an off label option for EPM, but its a good choice and if your horse didnt respond to Marquis I would try it.

Marquis is expensive and there's no way around the cost.

Honestly, EPM is a hard infection to clear, so I'm not surprised to see horses not respond to one drug and respond to another, or require multiple rounds of treatments to clear it.

Nitazoxanide is another drug that is approved to treat EPM in horses, I believe it's called Navigator but I personally haven't heard of it until taking pharmacology in vet school... and the prof giving the lecture was a small animal vet so for all I know it may not even be available.

According to my vet. Navigator has been taken off the market. I have used tow different drugs. One is Rebalance (pyrimethamine) and Baycox (toltrazuril) I have had good success with both. My vet put my horse on a preventative program and he will probably have to have it the rest of his life. Neither of these treatments are excessively expensive.

I want to know the long term program


What is Dr. White recommending long term? Like in times of high stress?

I had a feeling about Navigator... most of the profs are so unrelated to equine medicine it's not even funny.

Toltrazuril metabolizes in the body to Ponazuril, the active ingredient of Marquis...so I mean if you can get it cheaper that way, makes sense to me. That's interesting about pyrimethamine. It's a human anti-malarial drug and it works similar to how the sulfas/ sulfa+trimethoprim works.
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RunningOnPaints
Reg. Feb 2004
Posted 2014-12-15 3:57 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!


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lexyy12 - 2014-12-12 9:36 PM

 I was able to find it at least a little cheaper at $749 for the whole treatment  My whole fear is spending all of this money and her not getting better. I guess no matter what there is never a guarantee. My vet strongly advises this for her case. 

I have a question though...is this something worth getting a second opinion on? Can the test be wrong? Could he read it wrong? I know nothing about this except it needs treated ASAP!

Im afraid to try something else cheaper and it not work and her get worse and then have to go through with this anyway. Im very upset about this news..I really thought we were just going to get an injection and be over with. This mare means a lot to me...Ive put so much blood, sweat, tears and love into her. gaaahhhh....the life of owning horses. Perfect timing with Christmas and all...

You can get a 2nd opinion...

HOWEVER, start her on the med's ASAP... b/c it will get worse before better...

but if they did the test they sent it off and got results... so the 2nd opinion is going to do the same..

treat your horse for EPM and start the treatment now... it can get bad / ugly to watch and breaks your heart so trust me the earlier the better with the med's...

1 days they will act fine the next they will walk sideways, the next they don't want to walk all of this even giving med's... so don't freak out... keep in touch with your vet and let them know the status of your horse..

but don't stop the med's... then 1 day she will just start showing improvement.. and get better from there..
if you caught it in time..
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rachellyn80
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2014-12-15 4:43 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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Location: Beggs, OK
dianeguinn - 2014-12-15 12:46 PM
rachellyn80 - 2014-12-15 11:55 AM
dianeguinn - 2014-12-15 11:16 AM
lexyy12 - 2014-12-12 9:36 PM  I was able to find it at least a little cheaper at $749 for the whole treatment  My whole fear is spending all of this money and her not getting better. I guess no matter what there is never a guarantee. My vet strongly advises this for her case. 



I have a question though...is this something worth getting a second opinion on? Can the test be wrong? Could he read it wrong? I know nothing about this except it needs treated ASAP!



Im afraid to try something else cheaper and it not work and her get worse and then have to go through with this anyway. Im very upset about this news..I really thought we were just going to get an injection and be over with. This mare means a lot to me...Ive put so much blood, sweat, tears and love into her. gaaahhhh....the life of owning horses. Perfect timing with Christmas and all...
Any test on animals or humans can be wrong, and a second opinion is always a good idea. Sounds like your vet is way behind the times on EPM research. Marquis was the first treatment that was widely used for EPM, and it's not very effective. In fact, I think the protozoa has become immune to it, just like worms become immune to wormer, and that's why it doesn't work well. I would agree with what everyone else said on here....the cheaper treatments are actually better if they're the Diclazuril or Orogin 10. Sometimes it takes several treatments to get rid of it, as some treatments will just cut the number down (once again, similar to worms....it IS a parasite....but is a protozoa, not a worm and it attacks the nervous system which is much more dangerous), but not clear the infection. Most of the time horses will need a couple of treatments before it's gone. I've had the best luck with the Orogin 10 (pill given for 10 days) followed by Levamisole for 14 days. That total treatment will not cost you as much as one tube of Marquis. ;)
Dr. White is shipping me Orogin for three more horses today.  My 3 yr old doesn't show any physical symptoms at all.  Fat, sassy, and rides around like a dream....just a complete schitso on the ground.   I couldn't even consider being able to brush his tail or pick up his feet.  I treated him with some ReBalance that I happened to have on hand and saw such a drastic change in his disposition I took him to Dr. White to have him tested after I finished the bottle.  ReBalance helps, but it won't last, so I knew we'd have to go with something stronger.



...he called me last week to tell me that the colt had the highest numbers he's ever seen on that test.



FYI:  after the fifth day of ReBalance I could pick up all of his feet and lift his tail straight up.  His eyes were quiet and he stopped pacing the fence.
I am coming to realize that the first signs of EPM are extreme nervousness (I thought they were just being hot) and some of them don't want to load in the trailer after they had been loading fine....this shows before any of the physical signs....

I just finished a month of Gastrogard on one that seems to be pretty nervous...he arrived totally burned up with ulcers.  He will be getting tested and treated next, because I completely agree with you.  

First it's unexplained change in behavior and weird lameness...then ulcers...then we decide to inject something not knowing that steroids exacerbate the problem.  Then it goes on so long that the horse has fallen and really hurt themselves and still don't seem to be truly lame anywhere or they are showing muscle atrophy because we haven't caught any of the other completely ambigious symptoms. All the while seeking chiro, dentist, injections, ulcer treatment, supplements, calming drugs, etc...

We have decided to start treating everything that we bring in...it's much easier to head it off before it starts the chain reaction of physical issues that don't always resolve 100%.
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lexyy12
Reg. Apr 2010
Posted 2014-12-15 4:44 PM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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RunningOnPaints - 2014-12-15 4:57 PM
lexyy12 - 2014-12-12 9:36 PM  I was able to find it at least a little cheaper at $749 for the whole treatment  My whole fear is spending all of this money and her not getting better. I guess no matter what there is never a guarantee. My vet strongly advises this for her case. 



I have a question though...is this something worth getting a second opinion on? Can the test be wrong? Could he read it wrong? I know nothing about this except it needs treated ASAP!



Im afraid to try something else cheaper and it not work and her get worse and then have to go through with this anyway. Im very upset about this news..I really thought we were just going to get an injection and be over with. This mare means a lot to me...Ive put so much blood, sweat, tears and love into her. gaaahhhh....the life of owning horses. Perfect timing with Christmas and all...
You can get a 2nd opinion... HOWEVER, start her on the med's ASAP... b/c it will get worse before better... but if they did the test they sent it off and got results... so the 2nd opinion is going to do the same.. treat your horse for EPM and start the treatment now... it can get bad / ugly to watch and breaks your heart so trust me the earlier the better with the med's... 1 days they will act fine the next they will walk sideways, the next they don't want to walk all of this even giving med's... so don't freak out... keep in touch with your vet and let them know the status of your horse.. but don't stop the med's... then 1 day she will just start showing improvement.. and get better from there.. if you caught it in time..

 thankfully..i think we caught it in time. i took her in thinking her hocks were bothering her but x rays came back clean and a couple other things he did made him think epm..so we tested. the only sign is her being a little off in the back end. mostly just in the fact that she wasnt using it in the run and wasnt firing as hard. right now she is in the pasture running and bucking..hoping it stays that way. the meds should be here by wednesday at the latest 
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Southtxponygirl
Reg. Nov 2006
Posted 2021-07-28 11:19 AM
Subject: RE: Update! Kate has EPM! Experiences with Marquis?!?!



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Giving this a bump up. 

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