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Just Curious
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jkrm
Reg. Mar 2008
Posted 2019-04-12 2:54 PM (#7426914)
Subject: Just Curious



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So a friend and I were discussing all the extra's people to do to be successful at barrel racing and whether it is all necessary. Or can one be successful without breaking the bank to pay for all these extra's.  I'm talking things like special feeds, supplements, injections, all the latest body work stuff like Osteo, massage, chiro, special shoeing. 

Then there are all the fads that barrel racers seem to jump on yearly.  First we had Back on Track products then everyone seemed to be selling back on track to by Hansbro.  Now the body suit things (can't remember what they are called) and the boots for horses to stand in for hauling.  Then their is swimming, magna wave, theraplate and whole host of other stuff out there. 

It honestly overwhelms me a little trying to keep up with it all, even knowledge wise (which I don't).  Let alone how does one afford all this and how do you decide what truly works. How much is hype and do we need all of this to win?  Are horses now just not bred for soundness and toughness like 30 years ago?  Can a person actually be successful with a good basic feed program and a good basic riding to condition your horse program?  I know if I have to do all this extra stuff to win I won't be winning much because I just can't afford it.  I invested a lot of money on back on track products now it seems I should be investing in Hansbro instead or maybe the body suits.  I don't know?

I am all for injections if truly needed but it seems everyone is injecting on a pretty regular basis.  I might add I'm also a reiner and to be honest the reiners I'm showing with don't do near what the barrel racers do in the same area. You might see the odd back on track blanket around.  Once in awhile someone comes with a theraplate or magna wave but I don't see the endless stuff I see with barrel racers.

I showed my one reiner for about 5 years (from aged 8-12) she is now 15 and still sound and no injections.  She is getting patterned right now on the barrels to start a new career.  I do plan on giving her legend periodically through the year.  

Anyway a friend and I were having this discussion the other day and curious if it's all actually needed or more for our own piece of mind.  Would love to hear what others think.

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JLazyT_perf_horses
Reg. Dec 2010
Posted 2019-04-12 3:26 PM (#7426917 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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I'd say 95% of it isn't neccessary, but some of the "extras" help. For me my neccessities are a good feed program, joint support of some kind, gastric support,  good exercise program, shoes, and keeping up with my vet work and chiro. I can get by with these things if I need to cut costs. My horses get better traction with shoes and I know I do better in life with routine chiro work, I assume the same applies to them. For the extras, I use MVP for mine, covers my joints, muscle, gastric, etc. It's what I've found that I've actually seen proven results from. I do get one injected, didn't start until mid teens and just once a year. I have a lot of PHT items and use them, I believe in them. They're a luxury, I don't need them to run but I believe they make my horses feel better and they deserve it. I use EquiPulmin because it works well for my bleeder, he runs harder and haven't had any known bleeds since. I can get by without it and use lasix. I have a massage person who does maganwave, that's an extra luxury. I like to pamper mine, when I have the funds I do. If I don't have the funds we skip it. It's not a make or break. Do most of these extra things give my horse an added egde on the clock, probably not that much. I just feel like the better they feel, the better theyll perform, that's the bottom line. It's just about how much you want to spend to keep them feeling good. I run one and am seasoning one, and I'm at my limit of paying for extras already lol 

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Mighty Broke
Reg. Jul 2004
Posted 2019-04-12 3:34 PM (#7426918 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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Posts: 5236
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Some need to spend less on all that stuff trying to win and invest in riding lessons. IMO

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lonely va barrelxr
Reg. Apr 2005
Posted 2019-04-12 3:37 PM (#7426919 - in reply to #7426918)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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Mighty Broke - 2019-04-12 4:34 PM


Some need to spend less on all that stuff trying to win and invest in riding lessons. IMO


 

 

Hey - if I could find a good instructor I'd be taking at least 2 lessons a week. It's amazing how lazy or 'off' you can get after years and years of no one picking on you while you ride. 

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Mighty Broke
Reg. Jul 2004
Posted 2019-04-12 3:37 PM (#7426920 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



Guys Just Wanna Have Fun


Posts: 5236
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Location: OH

To answer your question--people will buy a product because such and such famous person said to. If you want to try a product--make sure there is good research and developement backing it--not someone that is paid to do so.

I swear, in barrel racing if a person would come in with their horse covered in mud and win--the next weel they will al be covered in mud. LOL

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MOGirl07
Reg. Feb 2012
Posted 2019-04-12 3:51 PM (#7426921 - in reply to #7426919)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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lonely va barrelxr - 2019-04-12 3:37 PM


Mighty Broke - 2019-04-12 4:34 PM


Some need to spend less on all that stuff trying to win and invest in riding lessons. IMO



 


 


Hey - if I could find a good instructor I'd be taking at least 2 lessons a week. It's amazing how lazy or 'off' you can get after years and years of no one picking on you while you ride. 


I was going to say this. Lessons!

I never have the latest product; I can't afford it. Quality hay, and some suppliments, yes, injections, chiro, keeping up with vet work....I budget for those things. But I'd much rather have lessons, or a clinic, over the latest fad product. I NEED lessons more than the latest fad product. LOL. 

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OhMax
Reg. Feb 2013
Posted 2019-04-12 4:21 PM (#7426923 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


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Yes and no.  To me it depends on if you’re a weekend local racer or you’re putting in thousands of miles a year on the road.

I don’t think the average horse with the average barrel racer needs everything.  I do think there are specific situations that may warrant them - such as a horse who runs sound with corrective shoeing staying more comfortable with SoftRides.  Or a horse like mine who stocks up benefiting from Back on Track boots.

the products I use, I believe in.  I’ve seen the difference in a couple horses with and without their PHT (like day to day over a long period, not one weekend race to the next).  

I’m investing in Hidez ice socks because I believe in icing...and they are just going to make life easier than the way I currently ice legs after a run.

 

i try not to judge what people want to spend their money on.  I’m sure I spend mine on somethings that other people find silly.  If you know your horse and notice something in them that you feel could benefit from a therapy, look into it.  

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hereiam
Reg. Apr 2018
Posted 2019-04-13 11:58 AM (#7426951 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


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Are all these products going to make a 4D horse a 1D horse? Most likely not but could some or a combination of some products help with taking hundreths or thousandths off a run to take someone from middle of the 1D to winning the barrel race it is very possible. All depends on what your horse is needing I believe. 

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madredepeanut
Reg. Aug 2017
Posted 2019-04-13 12:39 PM (#7426952 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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I’m in agreement with basically all of the posts above. Not every horse needs the extras, but this goes back to the discussion that was presented awhile back- what is considered “normal maintenance” to some might be over the top for others. I do believe some horses benefit from more “pampering” than others, especially ones that are used to it- I had a mare from the track that I ran in high school and college, and she ran her best when she was absolutely doted over and spoiled; she was definitely high maintenance. Other horses, like a lot of ranch horses, have never been pampered a day in their lives and still give it their all and do well. I think the harder one hauls and runs (for example the pro girls), the more wear and tear their horses face than just the weekend warriors, so more maintenance is to be expected.

If someone has the means and desire to try the latest and greatest, then I say go for it. But there is such thing as doing too much- look at the prevalence of ulcers and what we have done to horses by taking them out of their natural habitats and molding them to fit our lifestyles.

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madredepeanut
Reg. Aug 2017
Posted 2019-04-13 12:48 PM (#7426953 - in reply to #7426923)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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OhMax - 2019-04-12 2:21 PM


Yes and no.  To me it depends on if you’re a weekend local racer or you’re putting in thousands of miles a year on the road.


I don’t think the average horse with the average barrel racer needs everything.  I do think there are specific situations that may warrant them - such as a horse who runs sound with corrective shoeing staying more comfortable with SoftRides.  Or a horse like mine who stocks up benefiting from Back on Track boots.


the products I use, I believe in.  I’ve seen the difference in a couple horses with and without their PHT (like day to day over a long period, not one weekend race to the next).  


I’m investing in Hidez ice socks because I believe in icing...and they are just going to make life easier than the way I currently ice legs after a run.


 


i try not to judge what people want to spend their money on.  I’m sure I spend mine on somethings that other people find silly.  If you know your horse and notice something in them that you feel could benefit from a therapy, look into it.  


THIS. I am in complete agreement with this. If someone wants to spend their money on xyz, that is their prerogative. Pretty sure I've spent money on things that have left people shaking their heads, but it's my money and I can do with it as I choose. My husband might have a differing opinion, but that's what good communication is for

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Liana D
Reg. Sep 2008
Posted 2019-04-13 3:37 PM (#7426957 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


Defense Attorney for The Horse


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Location: Claremore, OK

A good feed and fitness program go along way. Good horsemanship and constantly working on your horsemanship (which includes caring for your horse) goes a long way. Seems these days a lot of people want a shortcut. They would like to throw on a magic blanket  on instead of taking time to ice or rub their horse’s legs. There are no shortcuts ;-)

No, horses aren’t built like they were 30 years ago.  Conformation has gone out the window. Offset knees, bad feet and post legs are the norm so you’ve got to know how to maintain the mess if you’d like to win. A farrier can make or break you. With today’s crooked legged horses medial/lateral balance and landing flat  is critical. Some farriers shoe like they did 30 years ago .

if you’ll look at the most dominate barrel horses (Scamper, Hotshot, Stingray ) that have LONG, successful careers, solid conformation and and a big heart are common denominators. 

Injections are needed on most horses if you strive to be in the top of the 1D. Most Horses don’t have the heart to compete thru pain. What we’re doing (barrels) is totally not natural and stresses parts of the body that aren’t built for high speed turns .(some are built better than others). To those people that think that an unused 3 yo shouldn’t need injections, my experience has been they’re the ones that probably need it the most (not all of them). Get them thru training and things will get better. It’s not so much the maturity of the horse, it’s how you’re using him. Again, fitness and conditioning has a lot to do with it.

no, you don’t need a lot of extras, but you do need basics (mentioned).

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gypsykalgirl
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2019-04-14 5:22 PM (#7426994 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


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Posts: 149
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Out here in the rainy muddy PNW many horses live the majority of their lives in stalls with limited turnout. IMO the worst thing you can do to them is stall them 24/7. Horses can't move and get rid of inflammation caused by training and competing when they are stalled like they can when they are turned out.  My horses live outside with access to shelter and get to live like herd animals. Not to mention they keep themselves in good shape running around like idiots ;)  

 

I think good shoeing, turnout and quality feed is the key to happy sound horses in the long run. Too many horse owners don't know what proper shoeing looks like.



Edited by gypsykalgirl 2019-04-14 5:23 PM
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DashNDustem
Reg. Dec 2010
Posted 2019-04-14 5:44 PM (#7426997 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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Posts: 795
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Location: Idaho

jkrm - 2019-04-13 12:54 PM


So a friend and I were discussing all the extra's people to do to be successful at barrel racing and whether it is all necessary. Or can one be successful without breaking the bank to pay for all these extra's.  I'm talking things like special feeds, supplements, injections, all the latest body work stuff like Osteo, massage, chiro, special shoeing. 


Then there are all the fads that barrel racers seem to jump on yearly.  First we had Back on Track products then everyone seemed to be selling back on track to by Hansbro.  Now the body suit things (can't remember what they are called) and the boots for horses to stand in for hauling.  Then their is swimming, magna wave, theraplate and whole host of other stuff out there. 


It honestly overwhelms me a little trying to keep up with it all, even knowledge wise (which I don't).  Let alone how does one afford all this and how do you decide what truly works. How much is hype and do we need all of this to win?  Are horses now just not bred for soundness and toughness like 30 years ago?  Can a person actually be successful with a good basic feed program and a good basic riding to condition your horse program?  I know if I have to do all this extra stuff to win I won't be winning much because I just can't afford it.  I invested a lot of money on back on track products now it seems I should be investing in Hansbro instead or maybe the body suits.  I don't know?


I am all for injections if truly needed but it seems everyone is injecting on a pretty regular basis.  I might add I'm also a reiner and to be honest the reiners I'm showing with don't do near what the barrel racers do in the same area. You might see the odd back on track blanket around.  Once in awhile someone comes with a theraplate or magna wave but I don't see the endless stuff I see with barrel racers.


I showed my one reiner for about 5 years (from aged 8-12) she is now 15 and still sound and no injections.  She is getting patterned right now on the barrels to start a new career.  I do plan on giving her legend periodically through the year.  


Anyway a friend and I were having this discussion the other day and curious if it's all actually needed or more for our own piece of mind.  Would love to hear what others think.


I agree with the others, I say it really depends on the owner and the horse. 

I've had horses that were spoiled, other's that needed certain things and we good to go. I have some back on track products (such as hock wraps, and the saddle blanket) mainly because I use BOT on myself for my broken ankles (I wear the ankle wraps every night) and they keep down inflammation, swelling, and the achiness. Even my physical therapist was impressed by the lack of swelling when I came in. I've also used them for my lower back and my knee's. So I KNOW that they work.. I am a little hesitant to use the support boots, mainly because horses generate a lot of heat anyway.. and I feel the BOT support boots may just overdo it especially because it uses your own body heat to soothe injuries and promotes healing. 

I had a gelding that was navicular and he needed corrective trimming to keep him sound, but the same farrier that kept him sound would lame up my colt, even with xrays. So I had to have a different farrier take care of him. My navicular gelding got soft rides before, during, and competition days. It kept him comfortable and he LOVED them. Then in his later years, he got a joint supplement in which I saw a HUGE difference in his movement.. when he got turned out with other horses, normally he would make a couple rounds in the arena and be done. After the supplement, he ran a lot more, wanted to play with the other horses etc. He passed 2 years after his diagnosis with navicular(where the vet said to retire him immediately) still sound and running. 

Otherwise keep up on my vet and chiro work, getting their teeth done, vaccinations, a good farrier, maybe some things to help them feel better as they need it, good feed, a good joint supplement (if they need it) or an all-around supplement (Like Formula 1 Noni), aloe vera juice for ulcers. Never had a problem. I guess if I had the money maybe I would invest in many other things but I would really like to see the studied done on it and make my own evaluation on if it is worth it in the end. If the horse NEEDS it to keep working right, that is a different story. 

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casualdust07
Reg. Mar 2005
Posted 2019-04-14 9:19 PM (#7427013 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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I don't do a lot of the extra stuff.

 

Things I do invest in:

Soft Rides and hoof packing like Forshners, Magic Cushion, Hawthorne Sole Packing etc..

Dentals, annual vaccines

Lameness exams every 3-4 months 

Inject as needed 

I'm trying an IRAP series on my horse to see how that goes and see if its worth the investment.

Massage therapist post run after a heavy weekend

Chiro when needed

Good feed

GOOD ALFALFA AND HAY

I usually pick one supplement, right now I'm trying equithrive

GOOD FARRIER and lateral view x rays when needed, reset every 5 weeks not 6 weeks. 

Time off when needed (sucks, but gotta do right by the horse

Turn out every day, 24/7, stall as little as possible (not possible for everyone and every horse, but I take advantage of it). 

 

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fulltiltfilly
Reg. Dec 2008
Posted 2019-04-15 12:30 PM (#7427054 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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All I know is back in the day, I rode harder and longer (trail rode, gymkhana, team penned, judged trail rides etc) and the only thing I did was give my horse an  absorbine bath. Never had any issues. Maybe horses were built hardier then or maybe just ignorance was bliss.

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Racer4eva
Reg. Feb 2009
Posted 2019-04-15 1:11 PM (#7427057 - in reply to #7427054)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


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fulltiltfilly - 2019-04-15 1:30 PM


All I know is back in the day, I rode harder and longer (trail rode, gymkhana, team penned, judged trail rides etc) and the only thing I did was give my horse an  absorbine bath. Never had any issues. Maybe horses were built hardier then or maybe just ignorance was bliss.


 I agree with the ignorance is bliss statement. I was talking to an old friend yesterday whom i ran barrels with 15 years ago and she stopped soon after, and we were talking about saddles. How back then $600 for a saddle was expensive and there were no lameness vets (at least in our area and we were teenagers). Didnt know any better and there was not as much information that was public. Kids ran there horses in all gymkhana events and didnt care.

To the op: my horses get good grain/hay, the normal vet work (shots/teeth/coggins), occasionally hock boots while standing at the trailer and a benefab blanket that i won on a like/share fb contest. My one gelding gets stifles done because otherwise hell cross canter every barrel. The older one just gets an adequan series once a year.

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LIVE2RUN
Reg. Oct 2005
Posted 2019-04-15 3:55 PM (#7427070 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious



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I think it depends on what level you want to compete at. If you want to run with the big girls at the big shows then I think it takes a lot to maintain a horse for that level of competition. I do what i can for my mare and we aren't even in the 4d yet, lol!! I can't imagine what it takes to keep one sound for some tough competition. Horses are athletes and breakdown mentally and physically just like people! 

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Jazz's Girl
Reg. Apr 2013
Posted 2019-04-16 8:25 AM (#7427089 - in reply to #7426914)
Subject: RE: Just Curious


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Everyones take on what is "extra" will be different.

If you talked to my husband or best friend, or shoot any of the cowboys we are around, they would tell you I spoil my horse. I dont feel like I do though. I just feel as an athlete she deserves to be taken care of. 

It took well over a year and 3 different vets looking at her to finally figure out what was going on in her front feet. Since september we have given 1 osphos shot, injected coffin bones and bursas and she is now in corrective shoes for the time being. A good farrier can do amazing things. A bad farrier can ruin a good horse. We moved to the Dallas area in sept 2017 and Im on my 5th farrier. We started using her in December and I could not be more pleased. It took that long to find a good one that A- showed up on a schedule and B- did what the vet suggested, not whatever the hell they thought might work..... 

Back when I wasnt running hard and doing more playdays on my old mare, 2008-12 I think it was, I got some weird looks for what I did. I used her magnet blanket on her before, after and even between events.I pulled my saddle and let her cool down between events and after I would mud and wrap her legs. It was unheard of and I got alot of questions. I was also told that I spoiled that mare. No. I took care of her. And she took care of me. Shes 18 this year and still gets pampered, just not ran often anymore. And shes never been shod. Just kept her trimmed all these years. 
I make sure my saddle fits. Thats a tough one but so far I am lucky. 

I dont buy into the latest trend but what I do have for my girls. 

My magnet blankets I bought in 08 and still use. 
My BOT I bought in 2012 I think and use it.
I keep magnetic bell boots on my good horse at all times when its not muddy. 
The farrier is out on a strict 6 weeks schedule. 
I do some minor massage on a weekly basis but will see the chiro every few months. I KNOW how much he helps me and Id imagine its the same for them.
I keep liniment, mud and magic cushion on hand at all times. I am quick to use them too. 
I just purchased cloud boots for her and use them any time she steps on the trailer. 
I get her injected as needed and so far, its once a year.
They see the dentist every year.

I feed Renew Gold and Hayrite to my girls. Everyone looks good, no ulcer issues and overall they are healthy. 

No you dont need the latest and greatest therapy, but with what we are asking them to do, I think some help in that department goes a long way. And it also depends on what your doing. A weekend racer like me thats not putting alot of miles on one needs less than 1 thats going for the NFR and on the road for thousands of miles.

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