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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | I know there are a lot of these threads out there, but figured I'd ask your opinions. I have a red roan ("Chica") mare by Boonlight Dancer X a Smart Little Lena Mare. She's 14.2, super catty on a cow, overall good conformation, temperment is all business, she's just a little lighter framed than I'd like. But given her family and her own athletic ability I think she's worth breeding. She's never been bred before.
To give a little background on her pedigree.. Boonlight Dancer, the mare's sire, is Pebtoboonsmall X Smart little lena mare (Boonlight Dancer was NCHA derby top 10, NRCHA snaffle bit futurity champion and producer of money earners of $1.5 million). Most of his offspring are cutting, reining and reined cow horse money earners, but he also sired an open futurity money earner in the barrels in Canada. In 2011 he was the #10 leading junior sire in both cutting, reined cow horses and #44 for reining.
Equi-stat lists Chica as the product of a #1 magic cross on Boonlight Dancer, since she is also out of a Smart Little Lena daughter. Her dam is the AQHA 2012 #38 leading six figure dam, was a NCHA money earner herself. Chica has not been shown herself simply due to time constraints.
So..who would you breed her to? I was thinking something to add a little size/bone and speed to her cow horse mix.
Edited by Texican 2013-11-13 10:01 PM
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 Member
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Location: Texas | In my personal opinion, without seeing a picture of her, I'd say Shawne Bug Leo |
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  The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
  
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | What would be your goal for the foal? Are you hoping for a barrel horse or bigger/thicker, and faster " cow horse"? |
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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | Barrel horse |
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The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | Honors a Bounding |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
 
Location: Gainesville, TX | SerenityOaks - 2013-11-13 9:36 PM
In my personal opinion, without seeing a picture of her, I'd say Shawne Bug Leo
ditto |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | I would be highly considering firewater ta fame. REALLY considering him. He crosses on running mares and cow bred mares. Shelly gets requests each year for a FWTF out of a cow bred mare. In fact the one I know of this year was sold before it was born. he's future fortunes and has some really nice winners out of limited crops. He has a 3 year old filly I just saw a video of this morning with Lance Graves that will run at the LG Pro classic in 2014…she is NICE.
The other horse I would consider is confederate leader. You should be able to get frozen semen. My confederate leader filly is HUGE. big boned and has excellent conformation.
My other favorite is Stoli. I don't know what your budget is but if you jump on it now you can probably get an early booking discount on Stoli. A fellow vet student at TAMU worked at the 6666s when Stoli was still there and she said by far her most favorite horses were the Stolis crossed on ranch mares. |
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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | Thank you so much for the input. Sbl, confederate leader and firewater ta fame are all just right up the road so they are definite considerations. Any thoughts on a streak of fling or one of his sons? Heard some of his goals are on the smaller side..not so worried about height as just substance. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 928
Location: Northern CA | OOOOO, I like her breeding. I personally think it would be a shame not to cross her with a cow horse stallion. Although, my opinion prbably doesn't count, cuz I am a cow horse gal all the way around. |
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 Thick and Wavy
Posts: 6102
Location: Nebraska | Perks Alive has crossed well on cow breds. I really like my cow cross on First Wrangler, but he's not a huge barrel sire. I'd breed my other cowbred mare to him. |
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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | I may cross her on a cow horse stud in the future but given her athleticism and temperament I think I have a shot at getting a heck of a barrel horse out of her too. I'm at least going to give it a try ;) |
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Member
Posts: 37
| Ive got a couple babies out of midnight corona. they are wonderful!!!!! so trainable and beyond fast and athletic |
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 That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| If I had her I would go with ASOF. I like the way ASOF crossed on cow looks, on paper and in the flesh. |
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 Heeler Hoarder
Posts: 2067
| I went with Honors Abounding for my cow mare |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1028
| Oh goodness, she sounds nice! If she were mine, Id consider Best Advice, ASOF, or Midnight Corona. |
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Blessed 
Location: Here | Firewater Finale
He is proven to add bone and size
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | You have a double bred Smart Little Lena. The absolute LAST horse I would breed her to is A Streak Of Fling. Smart Little Lena's are lighter framed and many are a bit long backed and weak in the loin. Smart Little Lena IS renowned for that. That is physically why they crossed so well with Peptoboonsmal who are typically and he himself is very short coupled heavier made horses. ASOF is long backed and weak over the loin and is known for passing that. That is why he crosses best with shorter coupled heavier made horses. You will have a extremily high probability of getting a light framed very long backed weak over the loin horse that resembles a dachshund. |
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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | Here is an older picture of her to give you guys an idea. Not the best picture but it'll work. If you click on my album you can see the pic. It's the only one in there.
Here's her all breed pedigree link
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/chiquita+boonana
Edited by Texican 2013-11-14 10:57 PM
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 Smitten Kitten
Posts: 5813
Location: Here And There |  |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| I would go with Woodbridge, or goodbye lane. |
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Posts: 47
| ThreeCorners - 2013-11-14 7:48 PM
You have a double bred Smart Little Lena. The absolute LAST horse I would breed her to is A Streak Of Fling. Smart Little Lena's are lighter framed and many are a bit long backed and weak in the loin. Smart Little Lena IS renowned for that. That is physically why they crossed so well with Peptoboonsmal who are typically and he himself is very short coupled heavier made horses. ASOF is long backed and weak over the loin and is known for passing that. That is why he crosses best with shorter coupled heavier made horses. You will have a extremily high probability of getting a light framed very long backed weak over the loin horse that resembles a dachshund.
That isn't true. They bred those two lines because they are 2 of the most dominant cutting lines out there. Just like all the people breeding DTF and FG. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1355
| Firewater ta fame
Holy Bart
Firewater Finale
Best Advice |
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | 3ToBurn - 2013-11-15 9:03 AM ThreeCorners - 2013-11-14 7:48 PM You have a double bred Smart Little Lena. The absolute LAST horse I would breed her to is A Streak Of Fling. Smart Little Lena's are lighter framed and many are a bit long backed and weak in the loin. Smart Little Lena IS renowned for that. That is physically why they crossed so well with Peptoboonsmal who are typically and he himself is very short coupled heavier made horses. ASOF is long backed and weak over the loin and is known for passing that. That is why he crosses best with shorter coupled heavier made horses. You will have a extremily high probability of getting a light framed very long backed weak over the loin horse that resembles a dachshund. That isn't true. They bred those two lines because they are 2 of the most dominant cutting lines out there. Just like all the people breeding DTF and FG.
Sorry, but your wrong. Those ARE the physical traits Smart Little Lena is known for passing and they ARE the physical traits A Streak Of Fling is also known for passing.
I would also like to point out, there are things called "Nicking" when breeding horses. Certain families have shown a high favorability when bred to other certain families. There is the "blood" ( genotype) favorability which also carries a favorability of what those families phenotype ( physical traits) bring to the table. You never want to bring the same weakness or faults top and bottom. |
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Regular
Posts: 78
Location: TX | So three corners-you clearly vote against ASOF. Who would you pick? Just curious. There is a young stud out there I saw in BHN stallion issue, he's young and unproven but a cross between DTF X Dash for Perks mare..any thoughts on that. My worry with that and some other race bred studs is that while it would add speed it may be too many crosses back to Dash for Cash, making the foal have multiple crosses to DFC on top and multiple crosses to Smart Little Lena on the bottom.
Also really liking some of the Corona Cartel studs, any favorites? |
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | I dont have anything against ASOF, but you have to breed to the correct horse for the mare you are breeding. No horse on the planet is going to work on any and every mare. There is alot more to factor in then just a name. Someone mentioned Woodbridge earlier. I'd sure look into him. Also, the few that I know that have colts by Best Advice are sure liking them.I like alot of the Corona Cartels also. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2097
Location: Deep South | Aren't a lot of the CC's on the smaller side? Or am I completely wrong on that? |
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 Expert
Posts: 1430
Location: Montana | BamaCanChaser - 2013-11-18 12:39 PM
Aren't a lot of the CC's on the smaller side? Or am I completely wrong on that?
You are not wrong. Corona Cartel himself is a very small horse - I was surprised by that when I saw him in person. I was also surprised that any horse could be that incredibly good looking. He is just flat out gorgeous! He made me want to find a son of his to breed to and we set about that. Didn't have good luck with the breeding manager on the first one we tried, but I'd still like to breed to a son of his. I'm going to try Cartels Feature someday - great dam, pretty, and a good owner so I won't have the trouble I had last time!
Although you'd probably be fine, I wouldn't go too big on that first foal if she's going to carry it. You don't want to risk foaling trouble. It's unusual, but when you have it, it's bad. I haven't ever bred to Shawne Bug Leo but the SB horses are famous for HUGE foals and if he's like his sire, I wouldn't pick him for my first foal out of a small mare. Second one, I think he might be a great option. He's sure gorgeous in his photos. And I absolutely LOVE SB horses - substance and speed and pretty. Hard to beat.
Perks Alive would probably be a really good choice. Joleen sends semen when you call for it too - gotta love that.
I like ASOF too but agree this isn't the mare I'd pick for him. Their other stud - the gray horse - might work really well. Heck, I forget his name but someone will not be having a senior moment and type it. |
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Regular
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Location: TX | Cs flashlight, yes I had considered him as well and have also been considering the fact that thus is her first foal so you are right- don't want to over do it the first time around. |
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 Expert
Posts: 4625
Location: Desert Land | ASOF has crossed very well on cowbred mares. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 413
| I wouldn't pick ASOF.
I'd buy one that you get to pick out conformationally, If you wanted asof. My Mom has one, out of a peppy San badger/doc bar mare and she is wonderful, nearly the perfect horse. You can do anything with her and she's beautiful. And is she has a wonderful attitude.
I have a Prime Talent gelding, crossed on a cowbred mare- dry doc, Jessie James,
And I would love a barn full. Smart, PERSONABLE, beautiful, athletic, and can FLY. Very ornery but I wouldn't trade him for the world. I've rode several horses and I've never sat on one that can run like he can, he can be standing still, take off and be at the other end of the arena before you have time to blink. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 109
Location: TX | We bred Shawne Bug Leo to a cowbred/JOH mare and the broodmare is maybe 14.1hands. I will guess that filly by him with that particular broodmare will be 14.2 or 14.3 when she gets done maturing. So if you bred him to a smaller mare you may get an in between colt. Most of his colts are inbetween 15 to 15.3 hands. They are normal size usually with nice hips and shoulders and VERY GOOD top lines.
I do have to say that we turned that yearling out with a weanling and that filly by SBL and out of the Cow/JOH mare is a cowy filly. She is extremely quick footed and will work or cow the other filly. We are excited to start working with her in the spring of next year. I would recommend SBL just because we obviously LOVE his colts and him because everyone of his colts have been WINNERS and BIG MONEY EARNERS that have been shown. We think that is pretty special! And they are all to different type mares.
There are many great stallions to choose from. We have a Woodbridge filly and they all seem to carry the same characteristics if you talk to the trainers. Some are notorious for just kicking out, being quirky, and somewhat of a bully BUT I can say that WE LOVE OURS with all her "issues" and all she will be a true contender when it finally hits her!!
I like BEST ADVICE too..Furyofthewind..Perks Firewater Flit...and also Dashin Dynamo by First Down Dash. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 302
| If I had a cow bred broodie like that I would give dashin dynamo a try, cheap stud fee, short coupled, and going to go somewhere... In my humble opinion |
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 Living on the edge of common sense
Posts: 24138
Location: Carpenter, WY | I'm going to brag a little on this little filly. I haven't had anything this willing and easy ever. She has been handled some, but not overdone. Maybe once a week haltered and led around a little. Had the farrier out early in the week for her first trim, and with only a rope around her neck had all 4 feet done, no sweat. The farrier who was out for the first time was as impressed as we were I don't know, but I'd sure consider the Tres Seis lines for your mare. This filly is Slim out of our Doc O Lena grandaughter
Edited by teehaha 2013-11-22 10:43 AM
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Regular
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Location: TX | Precious baby! So, another question. I think I have narrowed it down to Best Advice, Perks Alive or Firewater ta Fame this time around. If I end up going ahead and breeding her this year and then decide to sell the foal, will there be a market for it? I ask this because so many of the i demand prospects seem to be race/race or barrel/race etc. Just wanted some opinions on this from those of you that have done this before. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 475
Location: Durant, OK | I have a fly Jess fly out of a Peppy San Badger daughter, incredibly athletic mare, but has a temper and will dang sure buck. I haven't seen him crossed on a cow bred mare, but I really like Ivory James. |
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Veteran
Posts: 207
| Another horse you may want to consider is Sizzlin Cartel. |
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Member
Posts: 13
| I'm going to throw another stud out there for your consideration. Zippy Zevi
Dasher. We had an amazing cow bred mare that was barley 14 hands but was a barrel racing machine.!! We went to NBHA wold and stayed at synergy stables ( they have since sold him ) took one look at zippy and decided to breed our precious mare to him. We Wernt even considering breeding g her at the time. So as only god or fate whichever you prefer stepped in And the baby out of this combination is incredible!!!
At only 3 months of age our baby lost her mom to a broken leg and we were left with our hearts broken and this gift from her our little ried.
To make a long story short he put height , bone and a better temperament on this babe than her mom ever had. She is now an amazing barrel horse faster , stronger and smart. What our mare was in need of zippy gave her and I would breed to him again in a heartbeat.
Just my story of a cow bred mare and a son of dash ta came / grandson of zevi |
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The Expert Expert
Posts: 3455
Location: Western performance horse Hades | Captain Perk
Dash For Perks out of a Disco Jerry (TB) mare
He's crossing great on cow-bred mares. |
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Who would you breed her to? Cow Horse