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  Champ
Posts: 19623
   
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Does anyone know if they will be asking for mares to be tested in the future? Like 2 or 3 years down the road?  |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
 
Location: sunny california | I think one day if sire and dam don't have n/n across the board then they will hold the papers hostage on the foal. |
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 The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | kwanatha - 2014-01-03 4:21 PM
I think one day if sire and dam don't have n/n across the board then they will hold the papers hostage on the foal.
I don't think any of us will live long enough to see that happen. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | kwanatha - 2014-01-03 4:21 PM I think one day if sire and dam don't have n/n across the board then they will hold the papers hostage on the foal.
Haha someone will just threaten to take them to court and that will be over.  |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | OregonBR - 2014-01-03 9:16 PM kwanatha - 2014-01-03 4:21 PM I think one day if sire and dam don't have n/n across the board then they will hold the papers hostage on the foal. Haha someone will just threaten to take them to court and that will be over.
oh ya just sue them |
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Common Sense and then some
Location: So. California | I think it's in the 5 year plan. 2014 stallions breeding 25+ mares, 2015 all stallions and mares soon to follow... Why not require testing on the mares as well in the future? It's a pretty simple genetic test and they are not banning carriers/double positives (HYPP already has a rule). You have to DNA type the mare anyway if you are breeding. 
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 Always Off Topic
Posts: 6382
Location: ND | it's incredibly expensive and what's the point.....just another ridiculous test that has no real value to the big picture......they still won't get rid of N/H breeding horses, much less any of these others......i would like to know how much the AQHA gets from each one of these tests...... |
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Location: in the ozone | After purchasing a young horse & then having major issues with it & had it tested (Pssm+), I was VERY irate that breeders are not conscientious enough to be sure their breeding stock are N/N on everything that is known out there. JMO |
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 Expert
Posts: 1889
Location: Texas | I am glad that the testing is being required. It is expensive but prevents the expense/heartache of trying to manage a disease. I have been getting all of our breeding stock tested and won't breed to a stallion unless he is tested and n/n on the 5 panel. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | I agree with the testing of stallions. I ordered the test kit for HAB last Friday. I don't "have" to do it until 2015. But I want to. I also want to do my mares. When I ordered the test I asked if they had plans to test mares. He didn't know. I was just curious.  |
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The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | I haven't been able to find anything about testing mares being required. My guess is that they will eventually require mares to be done too. Maybe lime they did with the DNA. (Mares born on X date or after, then adding a year every year until they are all (or mostly all) done. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | dhdqhllc - 2014-01-04 6:39 PM it's incredibly expensive and what's the point.....just another ridiculous test that has no real value to the big picture......they still won't get rid of N/H breeding horses, much less any of these others......i would like to know how much the AQHA gets from each one of these tests......
More than likely they won't refuse to register or otherwise restrict positive horses. BUT they will share the results of the tests with people who call and ask. I specifically asked that. So if you are planning to breed to a stallion whose owners don't openly share his test results, call AQHA and ask. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | psaaat - 2014-01-04 7:23 PM I am glad that the testing is being required. It is expensive but prevents the expense/heartache of trying to manage a disease. I have been getting all of our breeding stock tested and won't breed to a stallion unless he is tested and n/n on the 5 panel.
Correct me if I'm wrong, don't you breed mostly race bred horses? How common is it to find a racebred stallion who has already been tested at this point? I'm looking around for a stallion to breed a couple of my older mares to. I haven't seen any advertising with the 5 panel results listed. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 292
Location: Northeast Nebraska | OregonBR - 2014-01-04 10:17 PM
dhdqhllc - 2014-01-04 6:39 PM it's incredibly expensive and what's the point.....just another ridiculous test that has no real value to the big picture......they still won't get rid of N/H breeding horses, much less any of these others......i would like to know how much the AQHA gets from each one of these tests......
More than likely they won't refuse to register or otherwise restrict positive horses. BUT they will share the results of the tests with people who call and ask. I specifically asked that. So if you are planning to breed to a stallion whose owners don't openly share his test results, call AQHA and ask.
I called and asked the results of a stallions 5 panel test and they refused to tell me. So if the results aren't public what good is is other than a revenue generator? |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | GoGaited - 2014-01-05 2:39 PM OregonBR - 2014-01-04 10:17 PM dhdqhllc - 2014-01-04 6:39 PM it's incredibly expensive and what's the point.....just another ridiculous test that has no real value to the big picture......they still won't get rid of N/H breeding horses, much less any of these others......i would like to know how much the AQHA gets from each one of these tests...... More than likely they won't refuse to register or otherwise restrict positive horses. BUT they will share the results of the tests with people who call and ask. I specifically asked that. So if you are planning to breed to a stallion whose owners don't openly share his test results, call AQHA and ask. I called and asked the results of a stallions 5 panel test and they refused to tell me. So if the results aren't public what good is is other than a revenue generator?
That's strange. I specifically asked him would they share the results with people. He said YES. |
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Expert
Posts: 3300
| Just more money in aqhas pocket.. |
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 Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | Like I said on another thread, the whole testing is somewhat stupid until they get a test for PSSM 2. There are going to be 1000's of breeders advertising their horses are neg on the 5 panel and then some poor sap is going to end up with a foal with PSSM 2 and be miffed all over again. Until they can get an easy affordable test for PSSM 2, forcing the 5 panel is a moot point. |
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| It is all about the money ....
AQHA spent all that money last year with a foreign IT bunch for a new Obamacare type computer software package and they got it stuck to them really bad ...
Again AQHA and the cloning guys went to court and AQHA is supposed to pay for their attorney fees etc etc and got it stuck to them again .... which they knew they would ...
BOTH OF THE ABOVE LOOK LIKE PAYBACK SHAMS TO ME ... AQHA KNOWS THEY CAN RAISE FEES ... WHICH THEY DID ... TO KEEP THEM AND THEIR BUDDIES ALL WITH COUNTRY CLUB MEMBERSHIPS ... AT MEMBERS EXPENSE ...
AQHA is like our government .... the same old frogs control what happens from behind closed doors and draw big salaries and go country clubbing like Obama does while they have a little old guy that kissed butt for 5-6 put up a façade as the president of the association ....
TIME TO CLEAN HOUSE AND LET THEM START THEIR OWN HALTER AND WESTERN PLEASURE GROUP ... and hire someone that will open the AQHA back up to arena and race horses ... and locate an office in Ft Worth instead of way out in Amarillo so no one can see what they are doing ...
JUST FOLLOW THE MONEY TRIAL ...
Take the 5 panel testing ..... WHERE ARE THE SUPPOSEDLY LONG LIST OF DEAD OR SICK HORSES ... PSSM IS THE CURRENT FAD DISEASE SO SKIP IT FOR RIGHT NOW ...
It is like the MAD COW DISEASE ... took a jillion dollars to find 5 cows that had been dead for 2-5 years ... yet they could trace these back to baby calves ... what a crock ... and guess who paid for this nonsense and still paying ... tax payers, cattlemen and any one that eats beef ....
If you are gullible and believe all that crap ... don't growl at me ... just ask ... How many horses had each of these problems over the past 5-10 years?? and show your facts with horses pedigree, date of death, state and vet name ......>>> not some youtube baloney ....
Headed to my bomb shelter.. >>>> |
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 Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | Barellhorse USA, once again your ignorance show through. $85 is far from being a money grab for anyone as AQHA might only see $5 or $10 from that money if even that, but they still have to pay salaries and such, so they really aren't making anything off of the 5 panel. Also, the rest of that money goes to UC Davis to pay for their equipment, facilities and personnel so that they can do these tests. Plus developing these tests is not cheap as well.
Next, as far as these genetic diseases killing horses, yep they do. Get a foal that is positive for GBED and it will be lucky to make it two weeks or you could end up with a mare having a late term abortion, and here you waited 10 to 11 months for a foal only to lose it because the mare aborted or lose it because it can't function properly.
Next, take a HERDA positive foal. They'll eventually have to be put down and here you may have spent $3000 on up on stud fees and mare care and shipping and such only to have a foal that you can't get the full value from later on in life.
Now, when it comes to the dominant genetic diseases, horses die all the time from these dominant genetic diseases. MH can cause a horse to overheat and just drop dead while breeding or out in the pasture. I've witnessed a foal dying because of HYPP, it isn't pretty and not something that I think any horse should have to go through. Then horses are euthanised because of PSSM because PSSM brought on other issues or they were treated incorrectly by a vet while having an attack or supposed "colic" or they got to the point that they could no longer be managed to where they were comfortable. Heck, some of these PSSM horses have become violent and have put their owners or friends or their owners into the hospital.
Personally, I'd be more then happy to put $5 or $10 into AQHA's pockets if it means that stallions and evetually mares will probably be tested just to raise awareness of genetic diseases, so that people will start to hopefully select away from many of these genetic diseases. |
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Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | Just like I had a friend who put her mare on a breed lease. The mare foaled out and the foal lived about 2 weeks and the vet said it sucumbed because its lungs weren't properly developed But the foal was also very sickly. Well last year she did the 5 panel on her mare only to discover that the mare was a GBED carrier. There is a very good chance that foal was born and was actually GBED positive. Of course the GBED test hadn't been developed when that foal was born.
I know of many stories about people's losses of PSSM positive horses and like I said, I witnessed a foal dying from HYPP. I'm more then happy to test and to know.
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 "Drank the Kool Aid"
Posts: 5496
Location: Iowa, LA | For those of you who think PSSM is stupid/fad/made up, please buy my PSSM positive horse or take a ride on my mare after she's been turned out on grass, or pay me back all those thousands I spent for unsuccessful "stifle" treatments/surgeries that didn't do a **** thing for her! LOL Go ahead! Put your money where your MOUTH is!
Yeah....didn't think so! |
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 Living on the edge of common sense
Posts: 24138
Location: Carpenter, WY | So maybe someone knows what to do about a deceased stallion. We have lots of semen and will breeding Slim babies for quite awhile down the road. Obviously, can't do a 5 panel. He does have a DNA case number on his papers though. Do they actually keep the sample or discard once they have the results?
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Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | Check with UC Davis as I do know that they keep the hair samples on file. I know that Animal Genetics keeps it for 5 years.
Also, I've been told that they can actually DNA the semen as well.
Check with AQHA too as I know that is going to be an issue with several stallions as I was just looking at an NRHA affiliate stallion auction and they were offering frozen from Hollywood Dun It and he has been dead for several years and even though he may not be breeding 25 mares a year now, if they have a bunch of frozen, they're going to have to get something done in order to register the foals. |
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The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | OregonBR - 2014-01-04 8:20 PM
psaaat - 2014-01-04 7:23 PM I am glad that the testing is being required. It is expensive but prevents the expense/heartache of trying to manage a disease. I have been getting all of our breeding stock tested and won't breed to a stallion unless he is tested and n/n on the 5 panel.
Correct me if I'm wrong, don't you breed mostly race bred horses? How common is it to find a racebred stallion who has already been tested at this point? I'm looking around for a stallion to breed a couple of my older mares to. I haven't seen any advertising with the 5 panel results listed.
6666 Ranch has each stallions results available on the stallions individual page. (There is a link to the actual results paper they got.) BRAVO to them for doing this. Many on the "performance/cow" bred studs are POS for something. (Other than HYPP. LOL) But the info is available to anyone that looks. Ptizer ranch (Obviously ot race horses.) also shows the status of most of their studs on the studs pages. They don't show the actual paperwork. But beings that they DO show those that are POS, the ones that are N/N across the board, I would believe that they are being honest. |
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Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | I would like to share part of this story on here since you gets folks like Barrelhorse USA that think that these things are made up and that people aren't really dealing with this stuff or that it is the latest fad:
Not quite 2 years ago I bought an APHA stallion. One that I thought would complement my mares on their flaws, putting time and thought in my decision. The PO did disclose that he had HYPP (NH) which I was ok with b/c I was only going to breed to NN mares. Also stating he was negative on all others. Told he was only symptomatic with food changes. Long story short, over the past month I have dealt with 7 horrific attacks, down on the ground for 2-3 hours. After talking with vets we decided that he also would be positive for one of the types of PSSM too. We went ahead and did a safe food change and started him on all the right supplements, trying to balance the 2 disorders. Every weather change we would have an attack, no matter what we did to prevent it, it still happened. I can’t explain the stress of day to day this guy brought on me, not knowing what I was gonna be dealing with. Last night I went to the barn, things seemed normal well I thought they were, he was starting to go into an attack. Now let me say b/c the attacks can be so similar you don’t know how to treat. I haltered him so I could administer his acetazolamide, within in 2 steps he hit the ground like he had been shot. Nothing new to me b/c this is normal for his attacks. But our temps here in Georgia were gonna dip into the single digits and he could not stay on the ground for 3 hours. So I made the hard decision of calling my vet to end the life of my 9 year old stallion b/c of complications of an HYPP and possible PSSM attack. If you have never walked in a day and life of one that shows these kinda attacks, you don’t know the pain and suffering they go through and it puts the owner through. Is breeding the unknown really worth taking the chances that you take producing something that might not see its 10th year of life. For me its not, has really opened my eyes to doing the right thing and that these disorders don’t need to be bred on.
I'm glad that 6666 Ranch is doing that as I had looked at their website about a month ago and hadn't seen any results posted. So glad as it makes my stallion propsect shopping so much easier.
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Always Off Topic
Posts: 6382
Location: ND | appycowgirl - 2014-01-08 3:38 PM I would like to share part of this story on here since you gets folks like Barrelhorse USA that think that these things are made up and that people aren't really dealing with this stuff or that it is the latest fad: Not quite 2 years ago I bought an APHA stallion. One that I thought would complement my mares on their flaws, putting time and thought in my decision. The PO did disclose that he had HYPP (NH) which I was ok with b/c I was only going to breed to NN mares. Also stating he was negative on all others. Told he was only symptomatic with food changes. Long story short, over the past month I have dealt with 7 horrific attacks, down on the ground for 2-3 hours. After talking with vets we decided that he also would be positive for one of the types of PSSM too. We went ahead and did a safe food change and started him on all the right supplements, trying to balance the 2 disorders. Every weather change we would have an attack, no matter what we did to prevent it, it still happened. I can’t explain the stress of day to day this guy brought on me, not knowing what I was gonna be dealing with. Last night I went to the barn, things seemed normal well I thought they were, he was starting to go into an attack. Now let me say b/c the attacks can be so similar you don’t know how to treat. I haltered him so I could administer his acetazolamide, within in 2 steps he hit the ground like he had been shot. Nothing new to me b/c this is normal for his attacks. But our temps here in Georgia were gonna dip into the single digits and he could not stay on the ground for 3 hours. So I made the hard decision of calling my vet to end the life of my 9 year old stallion b/c of complications of an HYPP and possible PSSM attack. If you have never walked in a day and life of one that shows these kinda attacks, you don’t know the pain and suffering they go through and it puts the owner through. Is breeding the unknown really worth taking the chances that you take producing something that might not see its 10th year of life. For me its not, has really opened my eyes to doing the right thing and that these disorders don’t need to be bred on. I'm glad that 6666 Ranch is doing that as I had looked at their website about a month ago and hadn't seen any results posted. So glad as it makes my stallion propsect shopping so much easier.
it ****es me off that aqha allows these **** genetic defects to be passed on and that people are ok breeding that stufff......we could get rid of hypp in one generation but nope........which is why all this genetic testing is bull****... |
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Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | thanks for posting that the 6666 Ranch has the results listed. I noticed that they even had them on deceased stallions too. Gives those of us who are looking for tested running bred horses, more to look through when looking for a stallion propsect. Big time Kudos to them for doing this and making sure that their test results are available. |
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Regular
Posts: 66
Location: Burns, WY | I agree, we could end this stuff in one generation but as long as people have the money to sue the pants off of folks, we're going to fight this stuff big time. Heck, look what is going on with cloning in the AQHA. AQHA said no as well as the majority of its members and yet we have the courts forcing us to accept it.
Its always a shame when people get people into believeing that things like HYPP and PSSM positive horses are no big deal and so many people fall into this trap because they haven't witnessed the worst of these genetic diseases. Then once they have to see the problem face to face, they have a change of heart like this lady did, but in the process another horse ends up suffering and having to be possibly put down or dying.
At least with the 5 panel being mandatory in the AQHA those of us who don't want to breed genetic diseases forward or certain ones will now be able to ask for paperwork and then we can walk away if we choose to do so. That is why I don't see it as BS because now I can hold someone's feet to the fire and request test results. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 213
Location: Oklahoma | We did our stallion last year when we heard that it was going to be required. Laico Ladiesman is N/N on all 5 . That is a good question about the deceased stallions, and frozen semen.
http://barrelhorseworld.com/horsedetail.asp?ID=93933
Edited by Hotcat 2014-01-08 4:32 PM
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5 Panel testing for AQHA