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Location: Never in one place long | http://news.yahoo.com/vegetarian-diets-lower-blood-pressure-best-13... I thought the above was an interesting article.... About 8 mos ago I decided to change my diet to about 98% vegetarian (never have really cared for meat) for many reasons and I have to say I've never felt better. ( I have also been exercising more as I'm sure that is a factor as well). I do eat meat occasionaly but just wonder sometimes if it people eat it too much and how healthy it really is as it seems research has shown that it's not always the healthiest option. I suppose it depends on the type of meat you eat as well... just wondered if anyone has made the switch or switched to grass fed, vegetarian fed meat etc. I know many people think you need meat for protein but I've found that there are so many other protein rich foods out there that aren't as fattening. | |
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"Heck's Coming With Me"
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Location: Kansas | Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat.   | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM
Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat.
It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution.
If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat.
If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools.
I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough.
For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development | |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 596
Location: Somewhere in the middle of nowhere | Frodo - 2014-02-25 12:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat.
Not to change the subject, but I know of some women with those same characteristics.... | |
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 Thread Killer
Posts: 7545
| cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
^Agreed.
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
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 Expert
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Location: Gainesville, TX | Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
Mmmm depends on locality. Those living in colder climates (including ice age type) have always had to rely much more heavily on a meat diet, as much as 97%. | |
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Location: Never in one place long | Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM
cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
^^^^^^AGREE 100%, it's ok to eat some meat and dairy but I think you are very right, it should be eaten VERY moderatly if at all. | |
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Thread Killer
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| oija - 2014-02-25 4:04 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
I was speaking in today's terms in first world countries. Obviously in the past when life was hard, and in very cold climates (ice age conditions lol) it is/was probably smart to get as much protien/fat as possible.
I was mostly talking about those darn chubby 'Mericans. | |
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Location: Never in one place long | Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM
Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat.
I think many people eat it because they like it but it's not necessarily good for you... at least not in the high proportions that it is eaten in. I understand some cultures who live in extreme conditions eat high amounts of meat but most people have the option not to. I also enjoyed watching forks over knives.... interesting documentary. | |
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| Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:08 PM
oija - 2014-02-25 4:04 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
I was mostly talking about those darn chubby 'Mericans.
Alaska, your on, north west territories, all in North America, all in first world countries, still depend on hunting moreso in the winter as fruits and veggies very expensive to get up there | |
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Thread Killer
Posts: 7545
| cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 4:13 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:08 PM oija - 2014-02-25 4:04 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
I was mostly talking about those darn chubby 'Mericans. Alaska, your on, north west territories, all in North America, all in first world countries, still depend on hunting moreso in the winter as fruits and veggies very expensive to get up there
I get it.
How about this: Many people eat far more meat than they should. Many people eat way more than they need to, period. There are exceptions, of course. In harsher climates with where veggies can be scarce, meat is probably the best option.
I am not anti-meat. Seriously...I'm one of the chubbies.  | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1028
| I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ). | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:22 PM
cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 4:13 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:08 PM oija - 2014-02-25 4:04 PM Just Plain Lucky - 2014-02-25 3:03 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-02-25 3:18 PM Frodo - 2014-02-25 1:52 PM Had an interesting conversation just this morning with a lady who is very green vegetable oriented. She said humans were never meant to eat meat.....if they had been they'd have claws and fangs like lions and wolves. When you think about we're more the rabbits, sheep and cows.....meant to eat plants.
Made great sense but I'm still eating meat. It all depends if you believe in god or theory of evolution. If you believe in god, one can argue he did not design people with claws or fangs but gave them the tools to hunt and gather meat to eat. If you believe in the theory of evolution, humans once may have had claws and/or fangs then as we evolved we didn't need those tools to hunt and gather meat as we made our own tools. I believe that there is a lot of merit in fruits and vegetables as most people don't eat enough. For completely vegetarian I have to disagree with when it comes to children as it has been proven children under 3 need the whole milk,vet the fat iis needed for brain development
I do not think that humans were not meant to eat meat. We do, however, eat WAY more than we should. From what I have read, seen, and experienced, meat is supposed to be more of an "accent" to our diet. What I mean is that it is not supposed to be the main course. In American culture, we worship meat. LOL. It's the main dish when it should be more of a side.
I was mostly talking about those darn chubby 'Mericans. Alaska, your on, north west territories, all in North America, all in first world countries, still depend on hunting moreso in the winter as fruits and veggies very expensive to get up there
How about this: Many people eat far more meat than they should. Many people eat way more than they need to, period. There are exceptions, of course. In harsher climates with where veggies can be scarce, meat is probably the best option.
I am not anti-meat. Seriously...I'm one of the chubbies.
Lol not trying to start anything
A daily intake should be 2-3 servings of meat and alternatives per day, the serving size should be 75 grams, 30 grams to an ounce, so less then 3 ounces per serving. | |
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 Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | I agree that many over indulge in meat. Half of your meal should be fruit and/or veggies and only a quarter meat. Veggies should be the main portion of the dish instead of the side which is what we have turned them into. But I do know very unhealthy vegetarians that eat lots of pasta and soy products. I am not an advocate for a lot of soy and I cannot stand tofu! My husband came from a vegetarian family and was raised vegetarian. He didn't start eating meat until he met me. He now loves a nice medium-rare steak...lol. He was pretty small when I met him. He was never meant to be a big guy but he has put on quite a bit of weight (in a good way) since I have been the one feeding him. hahaha! His mom would make comments that he is putting weight on and getting fat. I would get so angry with her because I thought he was looking amazing and fit but she thought he was putting on too much weight. To me he finally looked healthy and fed! He was turning into a man and not a little boy anymore! hahaha He has one brother that is still vegetarian and he is so skinny and looks almost sickly and weak. Then his other brother eats a paleo diet for his health. He has ulcerative colitis and cannot eat gluten, dairy or sugar. So he is on a strict meat, veggies, and fruit diet.
We don't have meat with every meal. We eat lots of veggies with every meal and we love to try out vegetarian dishes but we do like to have meat a few times a week. We just try to keep it in moderation.
Edited by Just Bring It 2014-02-25 6:07 PM
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Expert
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Location: Never in one place long | Just Bring It - 2014-02-25 6:00 PM
I agree that many over indulge in meat. Half of your meal should be fruit and/or veggies and only a quarter meat. Veggies should be the main portion of the dish instead of the side which is what we have turned them into. But I do know very unhealthy vegetarians that eat lots of pasta and soy products. I am not an advocate for a lot of soy and I cannot stand tofu! My husband came from a vegetarian family and was raised vegetarian. He didn't start eating meat until he met me. He now loves a nice medium-rare steak...lol. He was pretty small when I met him. He was never meant to be a big guy but he has put on quite a bit of weight (in a good way) since I have been the one feeding him. hahaha! His mom would make comments that he is putting weight on and getting fat. I would get so angry with her because I thought he was looking amazing and fit but she thought he was putting on too much weight. To me he finally looked healthy and fed! He was turning into a man and not a little boy anymore! hahaha He has one brother that is still vegetarian and he is so skinny and looks almost sickly and weak. Then his other brother eats a paleo diet for his health. He has ulcerative colitis and cannot eat gluten, dairy or sugar. So he is on a strict meat, veggies, and fruit diet.
We don't have meat with every meal. We eat lots of veggies with every meal and we love to try out vegetarian dishes but we do like to have meat a few times a week. We just try to keep it in moderation.
I think it's all how you do it, I don't eat hardly any soy or pastas but LOTS of veggies and fruits and whole grains. I know many vegetarians who look perfectly fit and not sickly at all. You have to do it right like was said before this post. AND there are LOTS of very unhealthy foods that aren't meat so just because you eat vegetarian doesn't mean you'll be healthy. :) Most people I've talked to that made the switch feel and look great. | |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| I've been watching what I eat lately with the exercise program I've adopted.
I believe a healthy diet does involve meat as a protein/amino acid source - its really tough to keep it balanced as a vegetarian. My sister is vegetarian, and healthy, but she has to work at it to get everything she needs, and supplement on top of it.
That being said, meat makes up a pretty small portion of my diet. Actually on a typical day only 1 meal contains meat for sure, that's dinner. Lunch is usually a crap shoot - if I cooked an extra steak the night before, I have meat. If not, I usually toss some beans on my salad.
In our house 75%+ of the meat we consume if venison of some sort. The steaks are for the most part smaller than the size of my hand, so when I say I have a steak, I'm not referring to a behemoth porterhouse.
I have noticed though since my workouts have kicked up in intensity I'm getting hungry more often. Going to have to start feeding the beast better. | |
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 I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| Will never happen in my house as long as hubby and I have anything to say about it!!
First of all, we humans have the teeth of OMNIVORES not those of strictly herbivores or omnivores. Secondly, everyone metabolizes their food differently. I was told y my naturopath that I need animal protein, that I don't do well on plant protein and my blood sugar levels agree with him. I do carry a few extra pounds (more due my sweet tooth than my meat intake for sure) and hubby is one of those skinny guys who can eat whatever he wants and never gain a pound. But I will put my health "numbers" (except weight lol) up against anybody's.
That being said I would never judge anyone else's dietary choices, ESPECIALLY if it makes them feel better.
As in anything else, moderation is the key, unless one has specific conditions that require or preclude a particular thing. | |
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Holy Fruit Loops!
Posts: 1708
Location: Colorado | bowersk - 2014-02-25 4:07 PM I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ).
There is a hugh differance between vegetarian and vegan.
karen | |
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 Chasin my Dream
Posts: 13651
Location: Alberta | Everyone has to find what works for their body, and 99% of the time we don't listen to it...
When it comes to what to eat or not, it all depends on what set of media your read that will tell you their way is the best.....sure for some but not all.
I am gluten free & follow many Paleo recipes, I can only handle fish and chicken, lots of red meat makes me bloated and I rarely eat dairy. | |
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10D Crack Champion
| bowersk - 2014-02-25 4:07 PM
I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ).
When you made the change, did you cut back on calories, sugar, processed foods, etc & just generally eat healthier? If we eat healthier and cut calories, we usually lose weight whether vegetarian, vegan, or neither. I need to cut back on sugar and sodapop for sure....and a few calories. LOL | |
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Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | OhMax - 2014-02-25 7:21 PM
I've been watching what I eat lately with the exercise program I've adopted.
I believe a healthy diet does involve meat as a protein/amino acid source - its really tough to keep it balanced as a vegetarian. My sister is vegetarian, and healthy, but she has to work at it to get everything she needs, and supplement on top of it.
That being said, meat makes up a pretty small portion of my diet. Actually on a typical day only 1 meal contains meat for sure, that's dinner. Lunch is usually a crap shoot - if I cooked an extra steak the night before, I have meat. If not, I usually toss some beans on my salad.
In our house 75%+ of the meat we consume if venison of some sort. The steaks are for the most part smaller than the size of my hand, so when I say I have a steak, I'm not referring to a behemoth porterhouse.
I have noticed though since my workouts have kicked up in intensity I'm getting hungry more often. Going to have to start feeding the beast better.
Good for you! My husband still eats meat just not a lot and not very often, we try to buy the really good quality stuff for him and since it's expensive he just eats it a few meals a week and it works well. he feels healthier also. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | sodapop - 2014-02-25 10:48 PM
bowersk - 2014-02-25 4:07 PM
I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ). When you made the change, did you cut back on calories, sugar, processed foods, etc & just generally eat healthier? If we eat healthier and cut calories, we usually lose weight whether vegetarian, vegan, or neither. I need to cut back on sugar and sodapop for sure....and a few calories. LOL
I agree with this but I cut that stuff out a LONG time ago, felt better but now seem to feel even better switching to almost no meats. You are very rigth though in saying that quitting all these things make you feel MUCH better. Soda, candy, processed foods etc. make you feel TERRIBLE! So SO SO bad for you! | |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 399
| I tried being a vegetarian at one time in my life. After a year and a half i became very tired and my hair became dry and dull. A thorough work up from my doctor revealed that i was anemic and extremely iron deficient. It was explained to me by a nutritional doctor that each body absorbs different types of protein at various intervals in the digestive process. So with that being said, meat protein has a different molecular weight than a legume. My body was lacking the protein absorbed by the meat I stopped eating. The choice at that time was to take supplements or eat responsibly the meat my body was poorly doing without. Went back to consuming different types of meat and slowly recovered. I still take a couple days a week to eat vegetarian and thus far am doing very well. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1028
| Stitch4k9 - 2014-02-25 10:26 PM bowersk - 2014-02-25 4:07 PM I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ).
karen
As a vegan of 9 years, I know there is a big difference between veganism and vegetarianism. Since the OP was talking about being vegetarian, I was trying to relate  | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1028
| sodapop - 2014-02-25 10:48 PM bowersk - 2014-02-25 4:07 PM I catch heck for it daily, (especially being the daughter of an OK beef cattle rancher) but I am vegan. No, not the PETA, rodeo protesting, chain-myself-to-the-testing-facility vegan. I like to call myself a dietary vegan. I made the switch for my health. And yes, I have to make sure that I am getting enough calcium, and contrary to popular belief, there are many other options besides meat to get your protein that are delicious and good for you. I shop better than I used to, had to get more creative with my cooking, have lost 20 lbs (no other changes, like increased exercise), and have WAY more energy than I used to. If it is well-planned, a vegetarian/vegan diet can be very beneficial. In contrast, if it is NOT well thought out, it can be just as bad for you as eating a ton of red meat (remember, cheetos and oreos are vegetarian ). When you made the change, did you cut back on calories, sugar, processed foods, etc & just generally eat healthier? If we eat healthier and cut calories, we usually lose weight whether vegetarian, vegan, or neither. I need to cut back on sugar and sodapop for sure....and a few calories. LOL
I have never been big on processed food or soda, so that wasn't much of a change. I eat smaller meals more often and I'd bet that I consume about the same amount of calories; I am just putting better fuel in my body! People just need to be more aware of what they are putting in their bodies, regardless if they eat meat or not. I know a lot of extremely healthy vegans and a lot of healthy meat-eaters, and the common denominator is that they plan their meals according to their particular health needs. I am definitely no expert and will never judge a person for what they choose to eat or not eat (or for any other reason for that matter). I just know what works for me personally  | |
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | rodeoveteran - 2014-02-25 7:37 PM Will never happen in my house as long as hubby and I have anything to say about it!! First of all, we humans have the teeth of OMNIVORES not those of strictly herbivores or omnivores. Secondly, everyone metabolizes their food differently. I was told y my naturopath that I need animal protein, that I don't do well on plant protein and my blood sugar levels agree with him. I do carry a few extra pounds (more due my sweet tooth than my meat intake for sure) and hubby is one of those skinny guys who can eat whatever he wants and never gain a pound. But I will put my health "numbers" (except weight lol) up against anybody's. That being said I would never judge anyone else's dietary choices, ESPECIALLY if it makes them feel better. As in anything else, moderation is the key, unless one has specific conditions that require or preclude a particular thing.
My son is a reactive hypoglycemic, which means sugar or even a diet too heavy in "healthier" carbs will spike his sugar then crash it. He has to have balance of protein, fat, fiber, and carbs everytime he puts food in his mouth. The only way to get enough fat and protein in him is to have meat and dairy in his diet. He is a SPD picky eater which limits our food choices. (Won't eat peanutbutter or beans, for example). We are about to start food aversion therapy, meanwhile he eats small servings of meat 3 or 4 times a day. | |
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Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | DLV - 2014-02-25 7:00 PM Just Bring It - 2014-02-25 6:00 PM I agree that many over indulge in meat. Half of your meal should be fruit and/or veggies and only a quarter meat. Veggies should be the main portion of the dish instead of the side which is what we have turned them into. But I do know very unhealthy vegetarians that eat lots of pasta and soy products. I am not an advocate for a lot of soy and I cannot stand tofu! My husband came from a vegetarian family and was raised vegetarian. He didn't start eating meat until he met me. He now loves a nice medium-rare steak...lol. He was pretty small when I met him. He was never meant to be a big guy but he has put on quite a bit of weight (in a good way) since I have been the one feeding him. hahaha! His mom would make comments that he is putting weight on and getting fat. I would get so angry with her because I thought he was looking amazing and fit but she thought he was putting on too much weight. To me he finally looked healthy and fed! He was turning into a man and not a little boy anymore! hahaha He has one brother that is still vegetarian and he is so skinny and looks almost sickly and weak. Then his other brother eats a paleo diet for his health. He has ulcerative colitis and cannot eat gluten, dairy or sugar. So he is on a strict meat, veggies, and fruit diet.
We don't have meat with every meal. We eat lots of veggies with every meal and we love to try out vegetarian dishes but we do like to have meat a few times a week. We just try to keep it in moderation. I think it's all how you do it, I don't eat hardly any soy or pastas but LOTS of veggies and fruits and whole grains. I know many vegetarians who look perfectly fit and not sickly at all. You have to do it right like was said before this post. AND there are LOTS of very unhealthy foods that aren't meat so just because you eat vegetarian doesn't mean you'll be healthy. : ) Most people I've talked to that made the switch feel and look great.
Oh yeah I know quite a few very fit and healthy (looking anyways since I don't know there numbers...lol) vegetarians. My husband was raised Adventist and a healthy diet is a huge part of their religion. Many if not most Adventists are vegetarian so I know many. Quite a few of them are even cattle ranchers. lol | |
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 Go go girl
| I find it hilarious when people blame meat for making people over weight or unhealthy. And I also find it funny that people claim humans were not designed to eat meat. We do have the teeth that make us able to eat meat (canines!) And we also are able to digest it and utilize the protein, minerals, vitamins that are in meat. The key to being healthy is balance! Balance of everything in our lives. | |
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10D Crack Champion
| MrsHound - 2014-02-26 12:22 PMI find it hilarious when people blame meat for making people over weight or unhealthy. And I also find it funny that people claim humans were not designed to eat meat. We do have the teeth that make us able to eat meat (canines!) And we also are able to digest it and utilize the protein, minerals, vitamins that are in meat. The key to being healthy is balance! Balance of everything in our lives. Wonder if we didn't trim our toenails and fingernails and we used them like animals do if we would have claws too? LOL
Edited by sodapop 2014-02-26 7:14 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | dk66 - 2014-02-26 8:35 AM
I tried being a vegetarian at one time in my life. After a year and a half i became very tired and my hair became dry and dull. A thorough work up from my doctor revealed that i was anemic and extremely iron deficient. It was explained to me by a nutritional doctor that each body absorbs different types of protein at various intervals in the digestive process. So with that being said, meat protein has a different molecular weight than a legume. My body was lacking the protein absorbed by the meat I stopped eating. The choice at that time was to take supplements or eat responsibly the meat my body was poorly doing without. Went back to consuming different types of meat and slowly recovered. I still take a couple days a week to eat vegetarian and thus far am doing very well.
Hmm, I've heard of this from a few people but know many who have been vegetarians their whole lives who look and feel GREAT! :) I wonder what people are doing differently or if it depends on a persons body... I don't get it. I guess it works for me but maybe not for everyone? I think it makes a difference if you eat High quality meat vs total corn fed cheap meat. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 116
| I've been vegan for about 4 years now. Easiest decision I ever made, and never looked back!
I never liked meat or dairy as a kid.. And just chose to become vegan for both ethical and health reasons.
I lost about 15-20lbs without trying, and still eat about 2k calories a day. I eat mostly fruit, vegetables, and beans. I make smoothies every morning with rice protein powder, kale, bananas and fruit. DELICIOUS!
You can eat pretty much anything while vegan that you can when not. And it's much yummier! I still will eat chocolate(dark), certain sour candies, and special vegan marshmallows! Soooo good
Chocolate almond milk is absolutely delicious as well. Ever since going vegan, I actually notice labels on food. Whereas before I would eat whatever without a care. It's scary what goes into some food :s
With that being said.. This was my decision for my life and I have absolutely nothing against other people's individual diet choices. :) | |
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I'll Be Your Huckleberry
Posts: 1488
Location: Arizona | Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle. | |
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I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM
Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle.
^^^^^
This the political pressure behind the push towards vegetarianism. This how they will guilt the children into it, combined with movies that humanize animals.. (I can hear it now, "No, Daddy, you can't kill Ratatouille!").
Please notice that I did not say those who make the choice for health reasons. I would never insist that someone should eat meat if it made them feel worse. Actually I would never insist that anyone eat meat....leaves more for me!
The best I have ever felt was when I went on a severely restricted carbohydrate, high protein, high fat, and veggies "diet". Lost 15 pounds in the first week and a half eating anything I wanted...as long as it wasn't carbs (not including the carbs in veggies obliviously) and I felt great! It is a very hard to stay with this plan long term, I lasted about 9 months. And the reason I went on it was NOT weight related.
Everyone is different. If you haven't walked in my shoes, don't presume to tell me that I will do better without animal protein.... I won't, it's been proven. I have been incoherent, one step from a coma with blood sugar issues more than once, and the ONLY thing that would set me straight was a steak not cooked more than medium, not well done, not roast, not chicken and certainly not beans! And I won't tell you that you WILL do better on meat
Edited by rodeoveteran 2014-02-27 12:27 PM
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle.
Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health. | |
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I Don't Brag
Posts: 6960
| Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:22 PM
MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle.
Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health.
Also to take this line of "logic" further, how about all the grain wasted feeding our horses? And the land tied up growing hay that supposedly could grow veggies for the unfed masses to eat? Not to mention resources "wasted" feeding the rest of our pets? | |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | rodeoveteran - 2014-02-27 1:39 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:22 PM MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle. Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health. Also to take this line of "logic" further, how about all the grain wasted feeding our horses? And the land tied up growing hay that supposedly could grow veggies for the unfed masses to eat? Not to mention resources "wasted" feeding the rest of our pets?
Who is going to harvest all those veggies anyway? And who is going to pay for them to be produced? Because that much extra supply will drive prices below cost of production. We have the fattest poor people in the world here. And the places where people are actually starving, it's a distribution problem, not a supply problem. There are not any easy answers here. | |
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 Dr. Ruth
Posts: 9891
Location: Blissfully happy Giants fan!!! | Wait a minute, I am confused...I thought all of the nasty monsanto bred genetics of row crops were causing the cancer everywhere? Yes that is sarcasm.
Also, you do know that like 99% of the so-called hormones you are talking about in beef are naturally produced by the cow, right? And that grass fed beef can still technically be put into a feeder for 2 months? In fact that is how a lot of cows are brought to market. A lot of misconceptions on how food is raised, particularly meat.
For the record, I am closer to a carnivore than an herbivore. I love meat. I can be convinced that wheat and gluten is bad for me but never meat. I love me every type of meat on the planet. If that is all I was allowed to live off of, I would do it.
Also, I don't eat fruits for the most part. But I do eat a lot of veggies!!! | |
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Go go girl
| sassy&tessa - 2014-02-27 1:14 PM Wait a minute, I am confused...I thought all of the nasty monsanto bred genetics of row crops were causing the cancer everywhere? Yes that is sarcasm.
Also, you do know that like 99% of the so-called hormones you are talking about in beef are naturally produced by the cow, right? And that grass fed beef can still technically be put into a feeder for 2 months? In fact that is how a lot of cows are brought to market. A lot of misconceptions on how food is raised, particularly meat.
For the record, I am closer to a carnivore than an herbivore. I love meat. I can be convinced that wheat and gluten is bad for me but never meat. I love me every type of meat on the planet. If that is all I was allowed to live off of, I would do it.
Also, I don't eat fruits for the most part. But I do eat a lot of veggies!!!
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I'll Be Your Huckleberry
Posts: 1488
Location: Arizona | Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:45 PM
rodeoveteran - 2014-02-27 1:39 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:22 PM MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle. Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health. Also to take this line of "logic" further, how about all the grain wasted feeding our horses? And the land tied up growing hay that supposedly could grow veggies for the unfed masses to eat? Not to mention resources "wasted" feeding the rest of our pets?
My "logic" relies almost completely on the fact that eating meat has been linked to cancers, heart disease, etc. I won't get into the whole argument about it not being feasible to distribute the extra produce we would be feeding cattle, hogs, etc to 3rd world countries who actually need it because that would be pointless. The OP was asking opinions on whether or not a vegetarian diet would be beneficial for her and I stated my opinion. I have done enough research and have seen the results for myself by eliminating certain things from my life. Not to mention my religious beliefs actually touch on this issue. No one is ever going to convince me that eating a diet rich in meats and dairy is ever going to be healthier for me than a diet full of fresh veggies, fruit, and grains. I don't care if 99% of the hormones are naturally produced it is the artificial hormones, excessive use of antibiotics, artificial dyes, etc etc. that I don't want to put in my body or that of my family if I can help it.
I am not a big meat eater anyway, I love venison and chicken but not beef so this lifestyle is very easy for me. So to the OP more power to you and good luck on your decision.
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I'll Be Your Huckleberry
Posts: 1488
Location: Arizona | rodeoveteran - 2014-02-27 12:25 PM
MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM
Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle.
^^^^^
This the political pressure behind the push towards vegetarianism. This how they will guilt the children into it, combined with movies that humanize animals.. (I can hear it now, "No, Daddy, you can't kill Ratatouille!" ).
Please notice that I did not say those who make the choice for health reasons. I would never insist that someone should eat meat if it made them feel worse. Actually I would never insist that anyone eat meat....leaves more for me!
The best I have ever felt was when I went on a severely restricted carbohydrate, high protein, high fat, and veggies "diet". Lost 15 pounds in the first week and a half eating anything I wanted...as long as it wasn't carbs (not including the carbs in veggies obliviously ) and I felt great! It is a very hard to stay with this plan long term, I lasted about 9 months. And the reason I went on it was NOT weight related.
Everyone is different. If you haven't walked in my shoes, don't presume to tell me that I will do better without animal protein.... I won't, it's been proven. I have been incoherent, one step from a coma with blood sugar issues more than once, and the ONLY thing that would set me straight was a steak not cooked more than medium, not well done, not roast, not chicken and certainly not beans! And I won't tell you that you WILL do better on meat
Oh woah woah, please do not assume me to be anyone who is "blindly" following what the government is telling me. My thought process on raising less meat being better for most people's bodies has nothing to do with that. My family hunts, my children know where their food comes from and they certainly understand that we have righteous dominion over the animals and that they should give thanks to Heavenly Father and the animal that his given it's life so that we may eat it. Not that they have equal rights and it is cruel to harvest them humanely. I am glad that you have found something that works for you and your body. Everyone is different and I would never tell someone not to eat meat if it was genuinely beneficial for them just as you wouldn't tell someone to eat meat if they do better without. | |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-27 3:20 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:45 PM rodeoveteran - 2014-02-27 1:39 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:22 PM MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle. Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health. Also to take this line of "logic" further, how about all the grain wasted feeding our horses? And the land tied up growing hay that supposedly could grow veggies for the unfed masses to eat? Not to mention resources "wasted" feeding the rest of our pets? My "logic" relies almost completely on the fact that eating meat has been linked to cancers, heart disease, etc. I won't get into the whole argument about it not being feasible to distribute the extra produce we would be feeding cattle, hogs, etc to 3rd world countries who actually need it because that would be pointless. The OP was asking opinions on whether or not a vegetarian diet would be beneficial for her and I stated my opinion. I have done enough research and have seen the results for myself by eliminating certain things from my life. Not to mention my religious beliefs actually touch on this issue. No one is ever going to convince me that eating a diet rich in meats and dairy is ever going to be healthier for me than a diet full of fresh veggies, fruit, and grains. I don't care if 99% of the hormones are naturally produced it is the artificial hormones, excessive use of antibiotics, artificial dyes, etc etc. that I don't want to put in my body or that of my family if I can help it. I am not a big meat eater anyway, I love venison and chicken but not beef so this lifestyle is very easy for me. So to the OP more power to you and good luck on your decision.
I'm good with those who don't eat meat as long as they don't try to prevent others from doing so. I'm not a big meat eater myself, but I adore eggs and cheese.  The problem with trying to feed people in 3rd world countries is it's next to impossible to actually get the food where it needs to go. A lot of those governments had rather stockpile it and let it rot than see their people fed, not to mention the logistics of transporting it in a timely manner. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | You are right on the hormones for cows, they do naturally produce them but I differ in opinion on the monsanto crops.... many reputable organizations are publishing articles about the effects of monsanto on the environment. They are actually noticing that you have to apply MORE pesticides to the crops that are genetically modified and the fertilizer is running into our waterways which eventually most end up in the gulf of Mexico which has wreaked havoc on waters there. You are also right about people claming animals are "grass fed" but then fattening them out with corn, you have to do your research to know the truth.
I believe high rates of cancer are caused from many things not JUSt monsanto... it could be all the cleaning products that are used, vaccinations, pollution, food, lack of exercise... I'm sure it's many things but I truly believe what we eat is a huge part of it. I guess with time we'll see more effects of it. | |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | DLV - 2014-02-27 4:11 PM You are right on the hormones for cows, they do naturally produce them but I differ in opinion on the monsanto crops.... many reputable organizations are publishing articles about the effects of monsanto on the environment. They are actually noticing that you have to apply MORE pesticides to the crops that are genetically modified and the fertilizer is running into our waterways which eventually most end up in the gulf of Mexico which has wreaked havoc on waters there. You are also right about people claming animals are "grass fed" but then fattening them out with corn, you have to do your research to know the truth. I believe high rates of cancer are caused from many things not JUSt monsanto... it could be all the cleaning products that are used, vaccinations, pollution, food, lack of exercise... I'm sure it's many things but I truly believe what we eat is a huge part of it. I guess with time we'll see more effects of it.
I can't speak for other parts of the country, but we are part of the Discovery Farm project, which measures run-off where "good" conservation practices are being used. In our case, specifically in cotton because it's the most input intensive crop we grow here. Our Nitrogen run-off is measuring at no more than .5%--that's half a percent-- and Phosphorus run off is under 5%. Those are awesome numbers. Also, I assure you, that for the most part, genetically engineered crops do allow for lower use of pesticides. The lone exception here would be some of the guys that let roundup resistant pigweed get out of control in some of their fields. There was blatant mis-use of the technology and hopefully people learned their lesson about rotating crops and chemistries. We do still have to spray for plant bugs and occasionally other things in Bt cotton, but Bt was never meant to control those. It does a great job of controlling boll and bud worms, which means we don't have to use the heavy duty insecticides that are super toxic. | |
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I'll Be Your Huckleberry
Posts: 1488
Location: Arizona | Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 4:01 PM
MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-27 3:20 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:45 PM rodeoveteran - 2014-02-27 1:39 PM Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 1:22 PM MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle. Logic does not compute. Do you really want to eat a lot of field corn and soybeans? Higher demand equals higher prices to buy acres, equals higher production barring weather disaster, equals over production equals lower prices, equals lowered production. Weather disaster during a time of high demand equals even higher prices and demand destruction, which then bites recovering producers in the butt. It's a cycle and 99% of the time, supply is not the problem. Right now, corn is one of the more economical grains for livestock because of the energy per $. We cut our acres by 2/3 from last year. The only reason we're growing it at all is for rotation purposes...weed control and soil health. Also to take this line of "logic" further, how about all the grain wasted feeding our horses? And the land tied up growing hay that supposedly could grow veggies for the unfed masses to eat? Not to mention resources "wasted" feeding the rest of our pets? My "logic" relies almost completely on the fact that eating meat has been linked to cancers, heart disease, etc. I won't get into the whole argument about it not being feasible to distribute the extra produce we would be feeding cattle, hogs, etc to 3rd world countries who actually need it because that would be pointless. The OP was asking opinions on whether or not a vegetarian diet would be beneficial for her and I stated my opinion. I have done enough research and have seen the results for myself by eliminating certain things from my life. Not to mention my religious beliefs actually touch on this issue. No one is ever going to convince me that eating a diet rich in meats and dairy is ever going to be healthier for me than a diet full of fresh veggies, fruit, and grains. I don't care if 99% of the hormones are naturally produced it is the artificial hormones, excessive use of antibiotics, artificial dyes, etc etc. that I don't want to put in my body or that of my family if I can help it. I am not a big meat eater anyway, I love venison and chicken but not beef so this lifestyle is very easy for me. So to the OP more power to you and good luck on your decision.
Agree completely. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | Thanks for sharing this, intersting for sure. I'm glad to hear that you are having success with keeping pollutants into waterways down. That is a good thing. It's ok here but Iowa and Nebraska are contributing to a lot of pollutants in the water from pesticides, maybe they will solve this in the future. | |
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Dr. Ruth
Posts: 9891
Location: Blissfully happy Giants fan!!! | Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-27 4:21 PM DLV - 2014-02-27 4:11 PM You are right on the hormones for cows, they do naturally produce them but I differ in opinion on the monsanto crops.... many reputable organizations are publishing articles about the effects of monsanto on the environment. They are actually noticing that you have to apply MORE pesticides to the crops that are genetically modified and the fertilizer is running into our waterways which eventually most end up in the gulf of Mexico which has wreaked havoc on waters there. You are also right about people claming animals are "grass fed" but then fattening them out with corn, you have to do your research to know the truth. I believe high rates of cancer are caused from many things not JUSt monsanto... it could be all the cleaning products that are used, vaccinations, pollution, food, lack of exercise... I'm sure it's many things but I truly believe what we eat is a huge part of it. I guess with time we'll see more effects of it. I can't speak for other parts of the country, but we are part of the Discovery Farm project, which measures run-off where "good" conservation practices are being used. In our case, specifically in cotton because it's the most input intensive crop we grow here. Our Nitrogen run-off is measuring at no more than .5%--that's half a percent-- and Phosphorus run off is under 5%. Those are awesome numbers. Also, I assure you, that for the most part, genetically engineered crops do allow for lower use of pesticides. The lone exception here would be some of the guys that let roundup resistant pigweed get out of control in some of their fields. There was blatant mis-use of the technology and hopefully people learned their lesson about rotating crops and chemistries. We do still have to spray for plant bugs and occasionally other things in Bt cotton, but Bt was never meant to control those. It does a great job of controlling boll and bud worms, which means we don't have to use the heavy duty insecticides that are super toxic.
I was being sarcastic about the monsanto deal. Actually, I just read a fact on farming that said most research is lumping pesticides, chemicals, insecticides, etc all in one and not differing on their research. Turns out, PESTICIDES have actually been lowered and insecticides have been stagnant. Plus, research wasn't fully comprehended way back when. We farm more crops on less ground. I haven't seen any research that takes the movement of agriculture into effect.
Also, I follow Monsanto on twitter. The COO just posted an article on there that said they recognize the stigma they have in American and are planning to release more of their studies and try an educate consumers on what they are doing. I think that will be interesting.
For the record, I don't believe in organic. Mostly because of the actual definition by the USDA and the lack of monitoring of organic farms. NOT TO SAY that someone who grows a garden can't be organic. I just don't think what is in the grocery store is as organic as most people assume. I do, however, believe in sustainable agriculture and I think the vast majority of farmers are trying to be as sustainable as possible. They do need to pass that farm on to future generations, after all. | |
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Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | My husband grew up farming organic and there are some strict guidelines to follow and they do check up on your farm now and then. I can't talk for every organic farm or for every form of organic farming but my husband grew up on and helped manage an organic grain farm and they don't allow just anything to pass as organic. Switching farmland from conventional to organic takes years and organic farming is not an easy business. Trying to keep the weeds at bay and get a high enough yield to make any money without chemicals is not an easy task. There are less input costs due to no chemical or applicating expenses but your yields are usually far less than that of conventional.
I also want to mention that weeds are becoming resistant to herbicides which is causing farmers to have to put down almost double the chemical as they needed a few years ago. | |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | Just Bring It - 2014-02-28 9:55 AM
My husband grew up farming organic and there are some strict guidelines to follow and they do check up on your farm now and then. I can't talk for every organic farm or for every form of organic farming but my husband grew up on and helped manage an organic grain farm and they don't allow just anything to pass as organic. Switching farmland from conventional to organic takes years and organic farming is not an easy business. Trying to keep the weeds at bay and get a high enough yield to make any money without chemicals is not an easy task. There are less input costs due to no chemical or applicating expenses but your yields are usually far less than that of conventional.
I also want to mention that weeds are becoming resistant to herbicides which is causing farmers to have to put down almost double the chemical as they needed a few years ago.
We're not using higher rates to combat resistance, we're rotating crops and chemistries. And if that fails, we hire people to chop weeds with hoes like the old days. As a teenager, my most dreaded punishment was chopping cotton! | |
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Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | Three 4 Luck - 2014-02-28 10:08 AM Just Bring It - 2014-02-28 9:55 AM My husband grew up farming organic and there are some strict guidelines to follow and they do check up on your farm now and then. I can't talk for every organic farm or for every form of organic farming but my husband grew up on and helped manage an organic grain farm and they don't allow just anything to pass as organic. Switching farmland from conventional to organic takes years and organic farming is not an easy business. Trying to keep the weeds at bay and get a high enough yield to make any money without chemicals is not an easy task. There are less input costs due to no chemical or applicating expenses but your yields are usually far less than that of conventional.
I also want to mention that weeds are becoming resistant to herbicides which is causing farmers to have to put down almost double the chemical as they needed a few years ago. We're not using higher rates to combat resistance, we're rotating crops and chemistries. And if that fails, we hire people to chop weeds with hoes like the old days. As a teenager, my most dreaded punishment was chopping cotton!
That is smart farming. You don't see much of that around here. You hardly see crop rotation anymore even. It is becoming scary. It is becoming corn after corn after corn with maybe a year of soybeans in there. Some farmers do still rotate between corn and soybeans but many are just sticking to corn. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| MsDuchessGoTe - 2014-02-26 11:29 PM
Meat IMO should only be eaten sparingly and in times of hardship. I was vegan for about 1 year but fell off the wagon and am now "mostly vegetarian". There have been numerous studies linking meats to all kinds of cancers and other health issues. Now, I'm not sure this applies to the organic grass fed type or venison. It's hard to know whether it's the meat itself, the antibiotics, hormones, etc that are fed to them or the amount of meat we eat. Americans eat way too much of it, it's ridiculous. Imagine how many people we could feed with the grains that go to feed cattle.
If there is no market for cattle, then people will stop raising cattle. With what is happening in the USA right now a lot of fields/orchards/crops will be destroyed due to harsh climates too much or too little rain.
So when all the fields are burnt there is no fruits/veggies/grains to feed the entire population as what happened in dirty thirties, what are people supposed to eat since there are no cattle?
Sadly people will have to eat horse to survive | |
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Any vegetarians out there.. or semi-vegetarians??