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 Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
   
Location: British Columbia | Just questions out of curiosity... I've noticed a lot of girls buying young studs. They have either great pedigrees but lack the conformation to warrant remaining a stud but that seems to be ignored or are grand babies to significant horses(ie a DTF grandson or DFP). Most of these young girls are not at a professional level never mind the top of the amateur group, and don't own broodmare's or have the facilities to house a stud let alone more than 2 acres. Is it just me or is AB a big culprit for spittin' out sub par studs? I've started going south of the border to look because of this. What is the idea behind all this? Why not just run a gelding or a mare, these studs won't financially benefit them or improve their standings?
Edited by TMEquine 2014-03-23 10:37 AM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| I wouldn't say Alberta has only sub par stallions. Alberta has many stallions that are proven on both sides of the border.
Blue is Rare, placed in futurities in Canada and US,
Fiesta Royale rodeo money earner, plus futurity and derby
Perfect Possibility, producer
Wild on Corona producer on the track
Root Beer Boots producer
Fire Sixes money earner
Los unleashed money earner and producer
Pleasure a Perkin rodeo money earner
There are so many more I cannot think of right now
What one may call sub par, others may say conformationaly correct. Some people like different builds, as it is not one size fits all.
Also CBHI super stakes is huge and now they have opened it up to all canadian stallions, there will be more to pick from.
Alberta also has a great selection of pedigrees for small square mileage.
We do live in a free country, it is our choice on what we want to do with your horses, if someone wants to breed for pedigree, conformation, color, it is their prerogative, I don't get my nickers in a knot.
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 9:54 AM
I wouldn't say Alberta has only sub par stallions. Alberta has many stallions that are proven on both sides of the border.
Blue is Rare, placed in futurities in Canada and US,
Fiesta Royale rodeo money earner, plus futurity and derby
Perfect Possibility, producer
Wild on Corona producer on the track
Root Beer Boots producer
Fire Sixes money earner
Los unleashed money earner and producer
Pleasure a Perkin rodeo money earner
There are so many more I cannot think of right now
What one may call sub par, others may say conformationaly correct. Some people like different builds, as it is not one size fits all.
Also CBHI super stakes is huge and now they have opened it up to all canadian stallions, there will be more to pick from.
Alberta also has a great selection of pedigrees for small square mileage.
We do live in a free country, it is our choice on what we want to do with your horses, if someone wants to breed for pedigree, conformation, color, it is their prerogative, I don't get my nickers in a knot.
I don't think we have only sub par stallions, but when I went through the CBHI auction I wasn't overly impressed.
I'm looking at horses that I have seen in person. They are owned by younger girls(early twenties) and are not being campaigned or run, they are only saddle broke. They will obviously not be the next Dinero, DFP, DTF, Royal Shake Em, Judge Cash, etc.
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 304
Location: Up and over to the right | What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run?
Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding. |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | ChasingCans04 - 2014-03-23 10:11 AM
What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run?
Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding.
I'm looking south of the border for foals. Prospects, not studs.
I just want to understand what the point to owning a stud is when it is not for the intent of making it your business. Running it, campaigning it, breeding. Why do these young girls buy them and then waste them or buy them for the pedigree but not conformation?
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| I live in the same vicinity as you and not sure which stallions you are looking at.
I have very strong pedigrees in my mares, and if I choose to breed one, I want a stallion that is a proven producer, or if they are too young I want them to be proven.
I don't look at unproven stallions anymore.
CBHI made the equistats this year for the money paid, with every stallion paid into CBHI there are 3 eligible foals each year to run for that superstakes pot.
Every stallion starts out as unproven, if someone wants the headache of keeping them a stallion all the power to them. If they don't pan out, they can always geld them, if they do win, congrats to them for sticking with it and winning.
Also you listed the "in bloodlines". Look at all the stallions that stand in the states each year, and look at how many you have listed, that is a very small percentage.
You also have to look at the money put behind those stallions, if they weren't from rich families, they may have never become such an important part of barrel and race history. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:22 AM
ChasingCans04 - 2014-03-23 10:11 AM
What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run?
Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding.
I'm looking south of the border for foals. Prospects, not studs.
I just want to understand what the point to owning a stud is when it is not for the intent of making it your business. Running it, campaigning it, breeding. Why do these young girls buy them and then waste them or buy them for the pedigree but not conformation?
If you buy south of the border, those horses are not eligible for CBHI. This is the one strong buying incentive.
Each person to their own.
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 10:27 AM
TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:22 AM
ChasingCans04 - 2014-03-23 10:11 AM
What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run?
Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding.
I'm looking south of the border for foals. Prospects, not studs.
I just want to understand what the point to owning a stud is when it is not for the intent of making it your business. Running it, campaigning it, breeding. Why do these young girls buy them and then waste them or buy them for the pedigree but not conformation?
If you buy south of the border, those horses are not eligible for CBHI. This is the one strong buying incentive.
Each person to their own.
Would you breed to say, an own son of Bully Bullion that had no track record, not futuritied and was only saddle broke? This is what I'm trying to understand.
If I went out, paid the money for the stud, the pedigree, everything, I would understand that I would have to invest the money to prove it. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:36 AM
cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 10:27 AM
TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:22 AM
ChasingCans04 - 2014-03-23 10:11 AM
What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run?
Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding.
I'm looking south of the border for foals. Prospects, not studs.
I just want to understand what the point to owning a stud is when it is not for the intent of making it your business. Running it, campaigning it, breeding. Why do these young girls buy them and then waste them or buy them for the pedigree but not conformation?
If you buy south of the border, those horses are not eligible for CBHI. This is the one strong buying incentive.
Each person to their own.
Would you breed to say, an own son of Bully Bullion that had no track record, not futuritied and was only saddle broke? This is what I'm trying to understand.
If I went out, paid the money for the stud, the pedigree, everything, I would understand that I would have to invest the money to prove it.
I am only one person, so it really doesn't matter if I would breed to it or if i buy one. It only matters that the owners are content.
I do know The Red Bull, never futuritied, but is just now producing futurity and rodeo money earners, someone had to take a chance, and it worked out for them.
I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing.
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  Northern Chocolate Queen
Posts: 16576
Location: ND | It doesn't matter to me what other people own. If they choose not to spend the money to train, promote & prove the stallion they won't be breeding many outside mares.
I've got a coming 2 year old colt in my barn that as of now I've decided not to geld. If I choose to keep him a stallion down the road I could care less if anyone else breeds to him as he'll be for my own use. Most here wouldn't give his pedigree a second glance as it's simply a nice mix of older cow/foundation lines with a little bit of run. I've rode a lot of horses by my colts sire & have loved them all, they are nice movers, cowy, athletic & intelligent. That stud passed away last year so there are no more coming from these lines. I like my colt, his pedigree, conformation, mind & trainability so for now he remains a stud (until I likely get crabby about him acting like a boy & geld him!!!). But it's my choice to deal with the extra work that a stallion requires & I honestly have no intentions of promoting him to the public. |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | SaraJean - 2014-03-23 10:48 AM
It doesn't matter to me what other people own. If they choose not to spend the money to train, promote & prove the stallion they won't be breeding many outside mares.
I've got a coming 2 year old colt in my barn that as of now I've decided not to geld. If I choose to keep him a stallion down the road I could care less if anyone else breeds to him as he'll be for my own use. Most here wouldn't give his pedigree a second glance as it's simply a nice mix of older cow/foundation lines with a little bit of run. I've rode a lot of horses by my colts sire & have loved them all, they are nice movers, cowy, athletic & intelligent. That stud passed away last year so there are no more coming from these lines. I like my colt, his pedigree, conformation, mind & trainability so for now he remains a stud (until I likely get crabby about him acting like a boy & geld him!!!). But it's my choice to deal with the extra work that a stallion requires & I honestly have no intentions of promoting him to the public.
Cheryl, I'm not slamming AB breeders. This is where I live, this is what I have noticed. Clearly there are a few that I have alot of respect for and buy horses from.
And Thank you Sara, that's more of the kind of answer I was looking for. I wanted a reason from someone who owns a stallion.  |
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 IMA No Hair Style Gal
Posts: 2594
| Everyone has a different opinion on breeding, I will tell you that!
We currently have a three year old stud. Will we breed him? No idea, I can tell you he will be gelded if he doesn't prove himself in the arena.
And by proving himself in the arena he better be a 1D horse.
I know some people around these parts that will breed at the age of two so that when the horse "proves" himself there are already foals on the ground. Personally for us-that is not something we believe in. Our guy minds his manners very well and handles everything in stride. As long as he is behaving and showing potential we are going to wait and see.
He is more my husbands horse-I would much rather prefer to have a gelding or a mare-then I can ride around and don't have to worry about other people so much! |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | i am glad the horseworld still has dreamers!
if it weren't for some of these gals that keep colts a stud but don't take that horse to the pro level as far as managing their stallion careers many people would not be able to afford decent genetics.
I can't afford the fashionable bloodlines from proven mare and stud pairs so I just have to hope the genetics come through and I get a decent horse for my limited funds |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | kwanatha - 2014-03-23 12:07 PM
i am glad the horseworld still has dreamers!
if it weren't for some of these gals that keep colts a stud but don't take that horse to the pro level as far as managing their stallion careers many people would not be able to afford decent genetics.
I can't afford the fashionable bloodlines from proven mare and stud pairs so I just have to hope the genetics come through and I get a decent horse for my limited funds
What do you define as affordable? Because there are girls who have sons of big name horses that have proven them and have $1000 stud fees. |
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 Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing.
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:17 AM kwanatha - 2014-03-23 12:07 PM i am glad the horseworld still has dreamers!
if it weren't for some of these gals that keep colts a stud but don't take that horse to the pro level as far as managing their stallion careers many people would not be able to afford decent genetics.
I can't afford the fashionable bloodlines from proven mare and stud pairs so I just have to hope the genetics come through and I get a decent horse for my limited funds What do you define as affordable? Because there are girls who have sons of big name horses that have proven them and have $1000 stud fees.
it is not the stud fee that is unaffordable. it is getting a prospect on the ground and getting them to age two that gets so expensive; at least for me. It is a lot cheaper to get a prospect from unproven studs/mares than to get one from fashionable bloodlines and proven parents. I have no chance bidding on them. |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | kwanatha - 2014-03-23 12:23 PM
TMEquine - 2014-03-23 11:17 AM kwanatha - 2014-03-23 12:07 PM i am glad the horseworld still has dreamers!
if it weren't for some of these gals that keep colts a stud but don't take that horse to the pro level as far as managing their stallion careers many people would not be able to afford decent genetics.
I can't afford the fashionable bloodlines from proven mare and stud pairs so I just have to hope the genetics come through and I get a decent horse for my limited funds What do you define as affordable? Because there are girls who have sons of big name horses that have proven them and have $1000 stud fees.
Ah OK I understand now, that makes sense! |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:18 PM
cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing.
Lol I really get under your skin don't I? We all have to start somewhere don't we? There is one thing I am confident in, I am a great rider and horse person. I will be running again in 2016 with my futurity filly. But happy to see your focus is still on attacking me personally. |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | TMEquine - 2014-03-23 1:40 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:18 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing. Lol I really get under your skin don't I? We all have to start somewhere don't we? There is one thing I am confident in, I am a great rider and horse person. I will be running again in 2016 with my futurity filly. But happy to see your focus is still on attacking me personally.
Hmmmm.........I just agreed with a previous poster....easier than typing out a comment....LOL....but if the shoe fits....don't let it get too tight! |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:59 PM
TMEquine - 2014-03-23 1:40 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:18 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing. Lol I really get under your skin don't I? We all have to start somewhere don't we? There is one thing I am confident in, I am a great rider and horse person. I will be running again in 2016 with my futurity filly. But happy to see your focus is still on attacking me personally.
You and Cheryl are both BHW bullies. Lol |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | TMEquine - 2014-03-23 2:05 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:59 PM TMEquine - 2014-03-23 1:40 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:18 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing. Lol I really get under your skin don't I? We all have to start somewhere don't we? There is one thing I am confident in, I am a great rider and horse person. I will be running again in 2016 with my futurity filly. But happy to see your focus is still on attacking me personally. You and Cheryl are both BHW bullies. Lol
How dare you try to BULLY me.....LOL.....In case you haven't heard, this is an open public forum and everybody, including yourself, are allowed to post their opinion....mine just "happened" to agree with Cheryl and disagreed with yours....My disagreement is....what others do is NONE of your business............IT is called FREEDOM of SPEECH for a reason....just because YOU don't like the answers that you get .....too bad.....so sad.... |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | NJJ - 2014-03-23 2:13 PM TMEquine - 2014-03-23 2:05 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:59 PM TMEquine - 2014-03-23 1:40 PM NJJ - 2014-03-23 12:18 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 11:48 AM I don't see why you felt the need to slam Alberta breeders when you yourself don't breed or have accomplishments in barrel racing. Lol I really get under your skin don't I? We all have to start somewhere don't we? There is one thing I am confident in, I am a great rider and horse person. I will be running again in 2016 with my futurity filly. But happy to see your focus is still on attacking me personally. You and Cheryl are both BHW bullies. Lol
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2014-03-23 2:38 PM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program.
When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either
I also seen you are looking for a Kilian Pacific bred horse, to me this isn't even on my top 20 list, this doesn't mean you or i are wrong, it just means that there is someone who doesn't like the same breeding as you, this is the joys of horses.
If you google mine, I have some horses that I have been honoured to train and compete on, I would love more of a proven pedigree for my horses and my name, I continually work on this.
What I am excited about is in the past three years the competition in Alberta is getting tough, I am excited about the super stakes, it is going to be an amazing horse race this year and years to come.
Alberta the stallion fees are higher in general because CBHI side incentives are offered through the year and the incentive doesnt cost anything to nominate a colt. If you have a horse who is by a CBHI stallion, you pay the side pot fee and are eligible, so more people are buying home grown, or marketing home grown. I also find this exciting too, I love watching people improve on their horses, I love seeing what crosses are working and which are not.
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 557
Location: Kansas and loving it | cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM
I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program.
When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either
I also seen you are looking for a Kilian Pacific bred horse, to me this isn't even on my top 20 list, this doesn't mean you or i are wrong, it just means that there is someone who doesn't like the same breeding as you, this is the joys of horses.
If you google mine, I have some horses that I have been honoured to train and compete on, I would love more of a proven pedigree for my horses and my name, I continually work on this.
What I am excited about is in the past three years the competition in Alberta is getting tough, I am excited about the super stakes, it is going to be an amazing horse race this year and years to come.
Alberta the stallion fees are higher in general because CBHI side incentives are offered through the year and the incentive doesnt cost anything to nominate a colt. If you have a horse who is by a CBHI stallion, you pay the side pot fee and are eligible, so more people are buying home grown, or marketing home grown. I also find this exciting too, I love watching people improve on their horses, I love seeing what crosses are working and which are not.
Hey Cheryl, have you heard of a stallion named Leo Hancock Dream? |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM
I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program.
When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either
Wayyy up in Canada? Your Canadian horses must be a solid 2 seconds off the texas competition... |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | So I understand your curiosity… there was a time on here when a post like this would get a ton of- yeah geld them all! type responses. Then there has been a new movement in the " its a free country, do what you want with your own horse" responses. I've been on here a long time and I do think its interesting how the threads have changed from the idea of, everyone needs to be gelding to its none of my business…
With that said, I happen to agree- what people do with their own horses, even if its owning stallions whose first "big name" is two or three or four generations back, it's their prerogative. It's not what I would do, and I wouldn't give them my business. But to each his own and they will figure it out in time, hopefully, that if they want to have a producing stallion in the barrel horse world it's going to have to be the whole package. I guess the biggest part is- they will learn it on their own over time if they pay attention to the market and see that great grand get and great great grand get of popular stallions aren't near as desirable as own get and grand babies. Theres planty of people who have stallions that are really only special to them… nothing remarkable on paper or performance that would make the whole barrel horse world say wow, but it brings them joy to have a few babies every year and see them go on to other people or stay with them for training later. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 473
| I own a yearling colt right now that I do not plan on cutting. I love stallions for the most part. I do plan on running him and campaigning him. Honestly, the only factor that will point me to cutting him is how he grows and his mind. If he wants to be a rude, obnoxious stallion. I have no desire to deal with that attitude. I bought him as a weanling specifically for the fact that I could raise him right and wasn't getting a colt that hadn't been handled for years. He has had manners from day one, and while he has his moments, they aren't bad.
He might not be the next DFC or anything like that, but it's a learning experience for me. I've dealt with many stallions but none that I've owned personally.
From a financial stand point, I don't feel the want to own a gelding. I have a hard time selling horses so for me, once they retire they are just another bill to me. Don't get me wrong, I have a 22 year old that I love and wouldn't trade him for the world. . . but he is a big expensive to just sit in my pasture.
If I have to geld this colt, chances are I might consider selling him, but he also has a bloodline behind him and right now, other than being a little long backed for a barrel horse (which some people like. . . ) I don't see any conformational reason he won't be a stallion.
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/high+life+streakin |
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 Veteran
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Location: Northeast Nebraska | ChasingCans04 - 2014-03-23 11:11 AM What do you mean you are looking? Looking for a stud? Something to buy to run? Some people own bulldogs, I never would but it doesn't mean they are wrong for owning them. I don't see the exact point that you are making other than you don't agree with stallion ownership w/o thinking of breeding.
Sorry, but it is wrong to own English Bulldogs. They suffer their entire lives due to being bred for insane characteristics. They can't breathe right, they can't get out of their own way, they have severe skin issues, their malformed jaws cause eating and digestive disorders. Hell, they can't even reproduce like a normal dog. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 302
| I, as a buyer of young prospects, really appreciate when someone puts the time in to prove their stud and campaign him, market etc. I have bought no name and broke them and have bought a higher price point prospect and broke and raced them. I have not had the privledge to race in the last few years but have been lucky enough to have some great colts and riding lessons with a very accomplished reining horse trainer. We both agree on one thing, when they are 'made to do it' as in a prospect out of proven, their not guarenteed to do well but it sure seems to come easier. I guess my point is I will pay the exta for a well bred prospect out of a well managed stud. It's my humble opinion that they In general attract better mares and therefore likely up the resale of my colts. So if you want to keep a backyard stud, good for you, but, I have a feeling they won't be very busy! In horses there is no easy money it's a labor of love so if you take the easy road with a stud.... |
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 Chasin my Dream
Posts: 13651
Location: Alberta | cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 3:48 PM What I am excited about is in the past three years the competition in Alberta is getting tough, I am excited about the super stakes, it is going to be an amazing horse race this year and years to come. Alberta the stallion fees are higher in general because CBHI side incentives are offered through the year and the incentive doesnt cost anything to nominate a colt. If you have a horse who is by a CBHI stallion, you pay the side pot fee and are eligible, so more people are buying home grown, or marketing home grown. I also find this exciting too, I love watching people improve on their horses, I love seeing what crosses are working and which are not. I am also excited!
TMequine ive seen many stallion around I don't view as stallion material (to me) but it isn't my money or time so doesn't affect me. The good thing is there are choices to suit everyone, no matter where you go.
I believe there are lots of hidden gems for stallions up here that do have many winners and producering winners and they did nothing themselves (Fast Moon Chic has no performance record, but the belief was there he could make something as a sire....as his pedigree speaks volumes)
Another stallion is Gasohol, he never barrel raced, did race and he has producered winners, daughters who producer winners and now even into grand get winners! I have a daughter who I will never get rid of because of the legacy Gasohol has left.
I have a 4 yr old off Fire Sixes, I had my eye on that stud as soon as he came into Canada (he was young and unproven but he had "it" factor to me) his pedigree is beyond proven and he now has proved he can perform and still is actually
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Edited by dream_chaser 2014-03-23 9:15 PM
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 How freakish is that?
Posts: 3927
Location: Oregon | Eh, it might not be a popular opinion on this board but I think there are way way too many poor quality stallions out there owned by people that don't have the knowledge or experience to be handling them. And if someone is inexperienced enough to own a stallion that really isn't stallion quality they probably are breeding mares that really aren't breeding quality also.
Been there, done that, got the tee shirt. |
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 Queen Boobie mascot
Posts: 706
Location: Mayerthorpe Alberta | Itsme - 2014-03-23 5:02 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program. When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either Wayyy up in Canada? Your Canadian horses must be a solid 2 seconds off the texas competition...
Itsme - Please tell me that you are indeed joking? |
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 Bulls Eye
Posts: 6443
Location: Oklahoma | I have a stud. He's now 6 and I have no intention of geldling him at this point. He's done everything I've thrown at him. I have not really promoted him or advertised him. He is nice enough that I will eventually buy a couple of my own mares to breed to him. I have kept him a stud due to his temperment, trainability, and mind... his color doesn't hurt... he's also conformationally correct. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 501
| lurker - 2014-03-24 7:17 AM Itsme - 2014-03-23 5:02 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program. When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either Wayyy up in Canada? Your Canadian horses must be a solid 2 seconds off the texas competition...
Of course they are two seconds off. Its hard to run barrels in an arena with two feet of snow.... |
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | Frenchie - 2014-03-24 8:06 AM
lurker - 2014-03-24 7:17 AM Itsme - 2014-03-23 5:02 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program. When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either Wayyy up in Canada? Your Canadian horses must be a solid 2 seconds off the texas competition...
LOL |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | O SNAP! Where's my popcorn?!?!?!  |
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| crapshooter - 2014-03-23 10:48 PM
Eh, it might not be a popular opinion on this board but I think there are way way too many poor quality stallions out there owned by people that don't have the knowledge or experience to be handling them. And if someone is inexperienced enough to own a stallion that really isn't stallion quality they probably are breeding mares that really aren't breeding quality also.
Been there, done that, got the tee shirt.
I 100% agree with everything you said here!!!!! |
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Veteran
Posts: 160
| I think there are a lot of factors in keeping a horse a stud that haven't been mentioned and are worthy of consideration. First and foremost for me is simply financial. I don't compete any longer instead i work 10-14 hours a day. I don't have time to start, pattern and campaign my own stallion so i would have to place him in someone else's hands to "prove him". Well that is going to cost $1000 per month X 3 years ($36,000) to start, pattern and futurity a stud. This is not including vet bills, farrier bills, entry fees etc. Now lets say my stallion becomes a superstar and wins every futurity in Alberta. He will win roughly $10-12,000. For me. a single female, this just doesn't add up financially.
You also have to consider injuries suffered as a young horse that doesn't allow them to compete. Does that mean they aren't worthy of given the opportunity to reproduce?
My stallions are well cared for, are producing desirable offspring that sell easily. They are great minded and time will tell what their offspring will do. One must think of all the great horses that wouldn't have existed if we only bred "proven stock". Proven in performance doesn't necessarily equal a great producer. Sometimes it is that way. other times your proven performer (both mares and studs) are reproductive flops. Breeding is still a crap shoot at best - there are never any guarantees.If we only bred proven to proven than many great studs would never have existed. Both Frenchmans Guy and Dash For Cash were out of unproven mares. If this isn't what you like no biggie. Don't breed to these studs. It doesn't hurt my feelings any. I don't care if I ever breed another outside mare although I'm breeding enough to keep me too busy. I like my boys, I like what they have been producing, I'm optimistic what their future holds once their offspring reach competition age. I always chuckle when I hear of an "unproven horse" siring a winning offspring. Suddenly that stallion who was overlooked before because of his unproven status is the next hottest boy of the moment. Why - good genetics will always rise to the top.
I'm just saying their are many other factors that may be the reason a stallion hasn't been campaigned that have nothing to do with their ability as a sire. Just a thought. |
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 Lady Di
Posts: 21556
Location: Oklahoma | This might be a little off topic, but it kinda goes along with kwanatha's comment....I buy a LOT of prospects and train them and later sell them and hope to make a little money along the way. That is how I finance my barrel racing, and it keeps me with a horse to ride most of the time. Usually, I cannot afford the big name bloodlines unless they have major issues, so I look for horses that have solid pedigrees....in other words, most of the horses on the papers are recognizable. Since I'm old and know most of the old bloodlines, that's easy for me to do, but one of the best 1D horses I ever owned had pretty much nothing on his papers other than Alydar in the 3rd generation on the bottom side, and Doc Bar way back on the top side. I bought him because he was cheap and a pretty color. I had no idea he would be crazy talented, too. He could run at the top of the 1D most anywhere I took him, and I sold him for a mid 5 figure sum as a 6 yr old. In fact, he was so nice that Jud Little went and bought his dam and put her in his broodmare band. So I appreciate those people who keep studs that will sire babies that I can afford, and maybe that's why those people own them....to breed to their own mares, and to make colts for people with pocketbooks like mine. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| lurker - 2014-03-24 7:17 AM
Itsme - 2014-03-23 5:02 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-03-23 4:48 PM I am not trying to bully you, but I like to know the qualifications of the person who is belittling the Alberta breeding program. When I googled your name, I could not find any money won, this doesn't mean you haven't, just not at any high stakes events that post in the web. I didn't find your name linked to any horses either Wayyy up in Canada? Your Canadian horses must be a solid 2 seconds off the texas competition...
Apparently you havent heard about the tough texas competition. You can take a 1D horse from the Montana area that is "winning everything" and if youre lucky he might be a 2D horse in texas but more than likely he will be placing in the 3D.
Its basically science being texas is the epicenter of all barrel racing the farther away you are the slower you are, plus you guys have the exchange ratio to take into consideration... |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 393
| crapshooter - 2014-03-23 9:48 PM
Eh, it might not be a popular opinion on this board but I think there are way way too many poor quality stallions out there owned by people that don't have the knowledge or experience to be handling them. And if someone is inexperienced enough to own a stallion that really isn't stallion quality they probably are breeding mares that really aren't breeding quality also.
Been there, done that, got the tee shirt.
This I have to agree with 100%! Seems like there are more and more stallions, esp this year I have noticed. And most of them should be gelded IMO. I don't understand why all these inexperienced people are buying stallions and have no idea what to do with them. Or they are way out in the middle of nowhere and don't ship, only live cover. I guess they will find out quick they won't be getting any mares, well good ones anyway! |
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Making A Stallion