LIVE2RUN - 2014-05-13 12:18 PM

He should walk away with this win, no problem!!!

komet. - 2014-05-13 11:35 AM


It depends on how he handles sharp turns... Honestly.. I call it 'The Look Of Eagles'... This is the 1st time I've seen it since 1973.. Yes he knows what he is..

LIVE2RUN - 2014-05-13 12:37 PM


He's yet to be really "challenged"! He has a lot more and we have yet to see it!! The Belmont, this will be his challenge!!

komet. - 2014-05-13 12:47 PM


2:24 flat is the time to beat.. I don't see that ever being done... I have tears running down my face remembering that race...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V18ui3Rtjz4
Nothing but a hand ride....

Herbie - 2014-05-13 12:57 PM

I so hope he gets it done, but I fear it won't happen.  I'm a huge fan of the connections and how this has played out....seeing regular Joe's have the success they have had who love the horse more than the money.  There will never be another Secretariat if for no other reason that today's trainers aren't preparing these horses to work and sustain like he was able to.  This is a different time and different mentality than was being used in the 70's I think.  

That being said, I will be wearing purple and green and cheering like a wild woman for CC to cross the wire first and go into the Belmont with at least a chance to obtain the final jewel of the Triple Crown. 

lindseylou2290 - 2014-05-13 1:05 PM I agree. Along the lines of trainers not pushing the horses like they used to, I find it interesting how the industry as a whole has been trending towards lighter made horses - I'm talking bone structure here - that don't hold up as well to the training push as the heavier built horses from 30 years ago. (just my observation - nothing scientific) And yes I will be cheering CC on too!!

TNcowgirl88 - 2014-05-13 12:18 PM

He is beautiful...

I also cant get over the way they can pull up to that ramp and not have to drop their ramp down.. he just walks straight off the trailer. pretty need and first class for a handsome guy.

barrelracin85 - 2014-05-13 2:33 PM Well as with all the good ones Chrome is a little quirky and actually doesn't just walk right off. They say he always has to be backed out of the trailers. I imagine this picture was taken right after he turned around. He refuses to walk out though lol.

Herbie - 2014-05-13 12:57 PM I so hope he gets it done, but I fear it won't happen.  I'm a huge fan of the connections and how this has played out....seeing regular Joe's have the success they have had who love the horse more than the money.  There will never be another Secretariat if for no other reason that today's trainers aren't preparing these horses to work and sustain like he was able to.  This is a different time and different mentality than was being used in the 70's I think.  



That being said, I will be wearing purple and green and cheering like a wild woman for CC to cross the wire first and go into the Belmont with at least a chance to obtain the final jewel of the Triple Crown. 

Herbie - 2014-05-13 1:15 PM


I will have to disagree with you on the lighter boned horses being weaker boned.  The diameter of bone doesn't determine density....in fact, smaller/lighter bone is stronger and more forgiving that big thick bone considering both are conditioned the same way.  Bone density is built, not bred.  That being said, in order for bone to be dense, these horses have to be conditioned to perform what they are being asked to to.  A finer boned horse equals a quicker turn of foot, requires less energy to exert the same motion as his big footed/heavy boned counterpart.  Smaller bones also have higher tensile strength than that of larger/thick boned horses.  Look at it this way....if you take a big thick tree limb and apply force to it, what happens when it does break......it shatters into a million pieces.  Now do the same with a branch about half the size....it will bend before it breaks, and typically will break clean in two.  Same goes for bone.....bone with smaller diameter will result in fewer catastrophic injuries than that of its larger, thicker, heavier counterpart.  The problem is, the large majority of trainers are putting these horses in bubble wrap and not preparing them structurally to perform the task at hand.  And what we have is a big, strong, beautiful horse that is literally running on toothpicks. 

coco~n~cash - 2014-05-13 1:42 PM You have to remember is trainer is from the '70's the man knows what he is doing...I can't wait to see the race Sat. My money is on CC 

Murphy - 2014-05-13 11:17 AM

I'm not looking for another Secretariat, and I'm sure CC's owners aren't either... they just want their boy to go all the way and win the Triple Crown!! I want to see it too!  

Herbie - 2014-05-13 2:00 PM

Please don't hear me saying that i'm not pulling for him, because I absolutely am.  I've been following Chrome since before the Santa Anita and his journey has motivated me and brought me to tears at times.  I'm hoping and praying for a safe trip for him, and all of the others #1, and secondly that he can withstand the grueling journey of the Triple Crown and comes out the other side victorious. 

I AM looking for another Secretariat!  It can be done, but we have to train them to do it!  

Here's another interesting exerpt from the blog I referenced in my post before....if you don't read this, you should take some time to.  Not only is it educational, but it makes perfect sense.  Take a human sprinter, place him in a closet and let him about about 30 minutes a day to do some exercise and see how long he lasts.  And he doesn't way 1000 pounds and bearing all of that weight on his middle finger....

 I love the horse, and the connections, but a final quarter in 26+ off a slow pace does not bode well for the 12F Belmont in five weeks’ time. He would have lost every Derby on a fast track in the 1960’s by multiple lengths. Hell, the final HALF was :52!! That was not California Chrome accelerating down the Churchill stretch, that was him decelerating slightly less than the other slowpokes.

Once more, I use Assault as the example of what a Triple Crown winner does in the mornings from May thru June:
MAY
3 – 4F in :48
4 – Won Kentucky Derby by 8 in 2:06 on sloppy track
5 – walked at CD
6 – shipped to Pimlico
8 – 3F in :40
9 – 8F in 1:45
11 – Won Preakness Stakes by a neck in 2:01 on fast track
12 – shipped to Belmont
16 – 4F in :52
18 – 3F in :40
20 – 4F in :48
22 – 8F in 1:44
24 – 3F in :35
25 – 1.25 miles in 2:05 (:50, 1:15, 1:40, 2:05)
28 – 4F in :50
29 – 1.5 miles in 2:32
JUNE
1 – Won Belmont Stakes by 3 in 2:31 on fast track
5 – 4F in :52
7 – 4F in :51
9 – 8F in 1:43
11 – 3F in :36
13 – 8F in 1:43 at Aqueduct
15 – Won Dwyer Stakes by 5 lengths in 2:07 on fast track
To summarize:
-With all those works, did he ever simply gallop? Does he need to?
-16 breezes in that 45 day window, averaging nearly 6F per effort, in 12-13 sec/f paces.
-A Triple Crown AND Dwyer win within those very same 6 weeks.
-Note the Preakness was run 1 week after the Derby and he still worked TWICE.
-Also note he worked the entire race distance of 1.5 miles 2 days before the Belmont. You gotta be kidding me. I feel like I am making this up.
How about War Admiral in 1937?
“”Between the Preakness and the June 5 Belmont Stakes, trainer George Conway poured it to the little Admiral. Working at three-day intervals, War Admiral breezed 11 furlongs in 2:22, 12 furlongs in 2:35.40, 12 furlongs in 2:34.60, and 12 furlongs again in 2:34.60, the last move coming just three days before the Belmont.”

Herbie - 2014-05-13 1:15 PM I will have to disagree with you on the lighter boned horses being weaker boned.  The diameter of bone doesn't determine density....in fact, smaller/lighter bone is stronger and more forgiving that big thick bone considering both are conditioned the same way.  Bone density is built, not bred.  That being said, in order for bone to be dense, these horses have to be conditioned to perform what they are being asked to to.  A finer boned horse equals a quicker turn of foot, requires less energy to exert the same motion as his big footed/heavy boned counterpart.  Smaller bones also have higher tensile strength than that of larger/thick boned horses.  Look at it this way....if you take a big thick tree limb and apply force to it, what happens when it does break......it shatters into a million pieces.  Now do the same with a branch about half the size....it will bend before it breaks, and typically will break clean in two.  Same goes for bone.....bone with smaller diameter will result in fewer catastrophic injuries than that of its larger, thicker, heavier counterpart.  The problem is, the large majority of trainers are putting these horses in bubble wrap and not preparing them structurally to perform the task at hand.  And what we have is a big, strong, beautiful horse that is literally running on toothpicks. 

sorrel horse ranch - 2014-05-13 2:30 PM


 I agree with the bone density description.
Thank you Komet for posting the picture.
CC is an absolutely beautiful boy with the Look Of Eagles.
 

Barnmom - 2014-05-13 2:17 PM The problem is all the advances in veterinary medicine over the last 20 years have lead to us breeding fast horses that are way more fragile than horses of 30 years ago.

Think about it this way. If you took all the horses that had to have joints cortisoned, PRP, stem cell treatments, ulcer meds, etc. to perform at the top level of thier game and removed them from the genetic pool, what would you have left?  A much smaller gene pool for sure, but a much stronger, hardier group of horses.  I don't think horses of today could handle the workload of the horses 30 years ago, JMHO.  

I sure hate to be second guessing CC's trainer considering the success he has had so far.  As an "unknown" trainer myself I sure hate it when I finally get a really nice horse (cause it doesn't happen as often with a small barn vs. 100 head operation) and I have to hear people say how much better that horse could be if it had a "real" trainer.  I hate it even worse when that horse gets moved to a big barn and I have to watch him struggle for the rest of his career.

I am going to go out on a limb and say that CC would not be the superstar he is had he been in a huge program from the start.  I am sure Art Sherman knows CC inside and out and is doing what he feels is best to keep him happy and healthy so he can be the best he can be. 
 

Herbie - 2014-05-13 2:54 PM I totally agree with you in most all of what you said with the exception of that today's horses are more fragile.  I think what has changed is the way we feed, the way we treat them as babies, etc.  This theory has been proven that horses can be improved through an exercise program that starts slow and short and gradually increases by 1/4 mile per week.....  As an owner, I know I was guilty of wanting to rush mine to get to the track, and I even know better.  It takes a long time to build a locomotive from the inside out, most owners aren't willing to invest the $$$$ in the time it would take to do it. 



I agree with you that Chrome would have been a lesser horse in another barn more than likely.  I don't think Sherman has done a poor job....but I don't think he's done anything extraordinarily different than anyone else who has one entered on Saturday.  There are people who are stepping out and training scientifically.  They are few and far between, but they are out there.....mostly in the thoroughbred world and in Europe.  If you read the blog I mentioned before, there have been more than one instance of a no name trainer purchasing a SOUND cheap claimer, taking the time to train them with science (heart monitors, intervals when the horse is physically ready (based on the HR and Vmax monitors) and there are several who have turned those cheap claimers into stakes horses. 



I'm a believer in results and was shocked when I strapped that HR monitor to my barrel horse.  Thinking he was fit for what I was asking him to do and then monitoring it scientifically quickly changed my mind. 





 

Herbie - 2014-05-13 3:25 PM That is a very good point, Barnmom and I tend to agree with you.  We don't know how many didn't make it because they were crippled along the way......we also don't know how many statistically did make it, or if the rate of injury was significantly lower.  Those things weren't recorded either.  Only way to know for sure would be for someone to be willing to try something different, and be patient enough to see it through to fruition.  That would be the tough part!



There's a college near me who has an equine program.  A very affluent lady who has run a few TB's along the way has donated two or three studs and several mares to their breeding program.  Now these aren't stakes winners, but there are a few who ran out a little bit of money or a really nicely bred a generation back.  They sell these colts as weanlings or yearlings after they've gone through the "colt handling" program at the college for $750.  My husband and I always joke about buying one of those colts and trying this method.  You have to admit it would be an interesting study!   

Herbie - 2014-05-13 12:54 PM

I totally agree with you in most all of what you said with the exception of that today's horses are more fragile.  I think what has changed is the way we feed, the way we treat them as babies, etc.  This theory has been proven that horses can be improved through an exercise program that starts slow and short and gradually increases by 1/4 mile per week.....  As an owner, I know I was guilty of wanting to rush mine to get to the track, and I even know better.  It takes a long time to build a locomotive from the inside out, most owners aren't willing to invest the $$$$ in the time it would take to do it. 

I agree with you that Chrome would have been a lesser horse in another barn more than likely, and I too am an unknown trainer, though not of race horses, however I do study and follow the racehorse business and and try to continue educating myself as to how to better my program.   I don't think Sherman has done a poor job....but I don't think he's done anything extraordinarily different than anyone else who has one entered on Saturday.  There are people who are stepping out and training scientifically.  They are few and far between, but they are out there.....mostly in the thoroughbred world and in Europe.  If you read the blog I mentioned before, there have been more than one instance of a no name trainer purchasing a SOUND cheap claimer, taking the time to train them with science using heart monitors, intervals when the horse is physically ready (based on the HR and Vmax monitors) and there are some who have turned those cheap claimers into stakes horses. 

I'm a believer in results and was shocked when I strapped that HR monitor to my barrel horse.  Thinking he was fit for what I was asking him to do and then monitoring it scientifically quickly changed my mind. 

That being said, I will be cheering Chrome on every step of the way.  If he gets it done, no one will cheer louder than me!  I think he's a special horse, it's been a special journey, and I can think of no way better to end it than with the sweet victory of the final two legs. 


 

Barnmom - 2014-05-13 3:45 PM You should do it!   

reditorun - 2014-05-13 3:59 PM In your opinion Herbie - which horses will Chrome be running against that have been trained the way they did 30 years ago and will be hardier and stronger? I'm just wondering if most of the trainers now days do the same.

CYA Ranch - 2014-05-14 6:18 AM My son graduates on Sunday and I know Saturday I'll be running around here like a chicken with my head cut off getting the barn ready for the reception.   I set the DVR but I'm sooooo hoping I can sneak to the house to watch.  What time is the actual race?  

komet. - 2014-05-13 12:47 PM


2:24 flat is the time to beat.. I don't see that ever being done... I have tears running down my face remembering that race...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V18ui3Rtjz4
Nothing but a hand ride....

TXBO - 2014-05-15 9:00 AM

I see that Commanding Curve is sitting this one out to prepare for the Belmont.  The way he closed at the Derby, I think he's got a good shot. 

GoGaited - 2014-05-14 6:49 PM


He goes back to Secretariat. Maybe, just maybe.....