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 Can You Hear Me Now?
  
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | Has anyone seen a pic of his front end head on? I keep thinking his legs are not straight or he toes out a lot... but haven't really seen a shot of his front without wraps. The ones without the wraps I have seen aren't straight on. I'm hoping I'm seeing things ... |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 417
Location: CA | His right front is so crooked it tore his mommas uterus on the way out. She spent quite awhile in the hospital on Iv's. you can see it quite well, even in some of his racing pics. |
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Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | I thought something looked off, but haven't really looked into it a lot. Thanks. Some pics look ok and some I'm like eeek. |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
 
Location: Kansas | can someone post a picture? I can't find a good one to really see how crooked it is |
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 Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | Me either, I'm really curious now... couldn't find anything on google. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 417
Location: CA | http://m.si.com/4163991/california-chrome-the-accidental-favorite/
This article talks about it and the picture shows it well. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 503
| Doesn't look super crooked to me. Even with the wraps.
 (Screen Shot 2014-05-21 at 3.49.40 PM.jpg)
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 Screen Shot 2014-05-21 at 3.49.40 PM.jpg (82KB - 186 downloads)
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Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | Not stealing the thread....but here he is as a baby back in 2011!!!
http://archives.harrisfarms.com/foals11/lovethechase.htm |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 503
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What a cutie! Now there it looks like his left front is crooked.. Not his right as stated above. Still doesn't look too horrible - I've seen much worse. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 138
Location: MS | Here's some pictures I found.
Edited by DashNSpeckles 2014-05-21 4:48 PM
 (california chrome.jpg)
 (CaliforniaChrome51BelmontArrivalRS298.jpg)
 (California-Chrome-Monday.jpg)
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california chrome.jpg (60KB - 194 downloads)
CaliforniaChrome51BelmontArrivalRS298.jpg (54KB - 196 downloads)
California-Chrome-Monday.jpg (62KB - 193 downloads)
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | He looks pretty toed out to me |
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Location: California | It's true. He will never win a halter class. He travels funny too. But what the heck. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 417
Location: CA | Crooked or not, it hasn't slowed him down much! |
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Veteran
Posts: 138
Location: MS | I noticed after the Preakness, I think, when they are walking beside him interviewing Victor Espinoza, his back right leg twists when he goes to push off of it. There are probably lots of horses that do the same thing but it was just really noticeable and looked funny. But I agree it doesn't really matter - he can run! I hope he pulls it off and wins the Triple Crown. |
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Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | NonaY - 2014-05-21 4:54 PM
It's true. He will never win a halter class. He travels funny too. But what the heck.
I love the story behind him and am with everyone on the Crown band wagon. I hadn't seen much besides him running and the few pictures posted on Facebook by Bloodhorse.
Zipping my Flame suit: I am scared if he is still a stud (and I believe I read he still is) and wins the crown how many will breed to him though   . I think with all the attention he's getting people are going to breed to him too. |
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  Rebel Without a Cause
Posts: 2758
Location: Adopt a homeless pet - www.petfinder.com! | He's a gelding. |
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Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | Calangelo - 2014-05-21 5:14 PM
He's a gelding.
Thanks for clarifying. I read on Facebook someone posted 3 year old stallion... went to Equibase and they still had colt; I'd always thought they switched it to gelding. My bad.
As I said I hadn't looked into him too much but have been hopeful for a triple crown winner. |
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Location: California | California Chrome is a colt. I just got that from Curly's exercise rider who is there at Belmont and next to Chrome. |
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 Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | Funny Cide's front legs look even worse......
I swear sometimes crooked legs makes them run faster...... |
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Blessed 
Location: Here | DashNSpeckles - 2014-05-21 5:06 PM I noticed after the Preakness, I think, when they are walking beside him interviewing Victor Espinoza, his back right leg twists when he goes to push off of it. There are probably lots of horses that do the same thing but it was just really noticeable and looked funny. But I agree it doesn't really matter - he can run! I hope he pulls it off and wins the Triple Crown.
I have seen lots of nice barrel horses do that twist the back leg thing.  |
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Location: California | Have been told by many trainers it's a sign of weak stifles. |
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Seattle Slew came to mind right away when I saw how crooked CC is. Maybe that's what it takes to be a Triple Crown Winner. I remember everyone talking about his terrible crooked leg and he was a cheap colt. |
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Location: California | So it will be interesting to see what stud fee they come up with given his conformation faults. Some breeders may be hesitant to pass that along. |
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 Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | We had a stallion that has many babies in the higher level show ring dressage and Jumpers.... it hasnt hindered them one bit..of course not all toe out but some of his offspring. and clients didnt seem to mind at all. and yes some are as bad as he is. |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | NonaY - 2014-05-21 5:57 PM So it will be interesting to see what stud fee they come up with given his conformation faults. Some breeders may be hesitant to pass that along.
Did it stop many from breeding to Seattle Slew?
Do you think that in these times people are more aware of breeding for good conformation etc. then they have in years gone by?
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Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | Nevertooold - 2014-05-21 6:08 PM
NonaY - 2014-05-21 5:57 PM So it will be interesting to see what stud fee they come up with given his conformation faults. Some breeders may be hesitant to pass that along.
Did it stop many from breeding to Seattle Slew?
Do you think that in these times people are more aware of breeding for good conformation etc. then they have in years gone by?
I don't know about if he is a triple crown winner. He has certainly proven himself.
I have to wonder how in todays horse market it will affect the prices at sales for his foals though. I don't follow sales enough to know how much conformational defects affect the prices of yearlings. It's got to play a factor.
But then again A.P Indy was a crypt I believe, and I am sure more stallions are faulted.
Edited by ndiehl 2014-05-21 6:22 PM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1035
Location: TN | DashNSpeckles - 2014-05-21 5:06 PM I noticed after the Preakness, I think, when they are walking beside him interviewing Victor Espinoza, his back right leg twists when he goes to push off of it. There are probably lots of horses that do the same thing but it was just really noticeable and looked funny. But I agree it doesn't really matter - he can run! I hope he pulls it off and wins the Triple Crown.
I noticed that too! It looks like all that twisting would eventually cause a soundness issue. Oh well, I still hope he wins the Belmont and the triple crown! |
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Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | NonaY - 2014-05-21 6:57 PM So it will be interesting to see what stud fee they come up with given his conformation faults. Some breeders may be hesitant to pass that along.
If it ever stopped them in the past, then we wouldn't still have all these horses with crooked legs. |
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 More bootie than waist!
Posts: 18425
Location: Riding Crackhead. | He sure can run though. |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | SG. - 2014-05-21 5:46 PM
DashNSpeckles - 2014-05-21 5:06 PM I noticed after the Preakness, I think, when they are walking beside him interviewing Victor Espinoza, his back right leg twists when he goes to push off of it. There are probably lots of horses that do the same thing but it was just really noticeable and looked funny. But I agree it doesn't really matter - he can run! I hope he pulls it off and wins the Triple Crown.
I have seen lots of nice barrel horses do that twist the back leg thing.
Yep, do not watch two of mine walk from behind LOL.
One of mine will rotate her back legs when she steps off. I was at the ANHA shootout one year and a friend of mine was like, is THAT normal? I said yes, just don't look... The other looks like she waddles in the back. Both are 1D horses with big records…probably the two most proven horses we own! |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 399
| A very wise trainer once told me that you can go to a sale buy the best yearling with the best conformation but as a 2yr. old it doesn't make a bit of difference if the horse you turned your nose up at that sale beats you at the wire. There are 2 horses that come to mind when you think of exceptional individuals that were crooked as they come Exterminator and Seabiscuit. The one thing that I think is so hard to breed for unless you just know in your soul is heart and try, without these 2 things it makes it all very difficult. California Chrome is an individual that loves his job, trusts the people around him, and has the heart and determination to be the exceptional individual he is. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 667
| I am confused... and I have wanted to ask before. Is he a gelding or a stud? I have heard both and its been posted here that he is both..
Clarification? Sorry :( |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| SG. - 2014-05-21 5:46 PM
DashNSpeckles - 2014-05-21 5:06 PM I noticed after the Preakness, I think, when they are walking beside him interviewing Victor Espinoza, his back right leg twists when he goes to push off of it. There are probably lots of horses that do the same thing but it was just really noticeable and looked funny. But I agree it doesn't really matter - he can run! I hope he pulls it off and wins the Triple Crown.
I have seen lots of nice barrel horses do that twist the back leg thing.
me too!! I have one She just needs a little more attention and so far so good with her. |
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 Hugs to You
Posts: 7550
Location: In The Land of Cotton | Calangelo - 2014-05-21 6:14 PM He's a gelding.
Look at his pictures from yesterday arriving at the track. You can clearly see he is a colt. |
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Veteran
Posts: 138
Location: MS | 3canstorun - 2014-05-22 9:01 AM
Calangelo - 2014-05-21 6:14 PM He's a gelding.
Look at his pictures from yesterday arriving at the track. You can clearly see he is a colt.
Here's a picture that clearly shows he's a colt.
 (california chrome.jpg)
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california chrome.jpg (87KB - 193 downloads)
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Mrs. Txdad
Posts: 14084
Location: the fantasy txdad married | TNcowgirl88 - 2014-05-22 7:41 AM I am confused... and I have wanted to ask before. Is he a gelding or a stud? I have heard both and its been posted here that he is both.. Clarification? Sorry :(
He is a stallion. |
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 Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | I don't see it mentioned here, but wasn't Storm Cat commanding a $500,000 no guarantee stud fee and I have been told by many that he was either crooked himself or sired crooked babies. I have noticed myself in the TB world that it doesn't matter what color, what disposition or what conformation faults they have...if they can run that is ALL that matters.
I like how they think for breeding (natural) but I am glad that (most) in the QH racing world still strive for conformation and disposition as well as athletic ability. It is true, you CAN have it all.
But I am not knocking California Chrome. He's a super nice horse, kind of like Scamper. I thought he was uglier than a mud fence but he won...and now you can breed to his clone. At least California Chrome is very eye appealing. I would rather him toe out than some of the other faults that are out there. |
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | I had never noticed it.....but my sister noticed it first thing at the Kentucky Derby. I was going like "what?" but sis was right AGAIN! Oh well it doesn't bother me I hope he wins the Triple Crown. |
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 I'm not opinionated
Posts: 4597
Location: Online | If Chrome's owners and trainer had the attitude that most people have about conformation, he never would have run.
Yes, I agree it makes a difference in soundness, but it also depends on where the crooked leg starts, is it from the shoulder or the knee? I've seen horses toe out or toe in that stay sound for 20 years, but they started at the shoulder and you could draw a straight line all the way down. It's when the turn out starts at the knee is when there could be a problem.
Is that going to stop people from breeding to him? I doubt it. A horse doesn't always pass on crooked legs. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | rodeomom13 - 2014-05-22 8:48 AM If Chrome's owners and trainer had the attitude that most people have about conformation, he never would have run.
Yes, I agree it makes a difference in soundness, but it also depends on where the crooked leg starts, is it from the shoulder or the knee? I've seen horses toe out or toe in that stay sound for 20 years, but they started at the shoulder and you could draw a straight line all the way down. It's when the turn out starts at the knee is when there could be a problem.
Is that going to stop people from breeding to him? I doubt it. A horse doesn't always pass on crooked legs.
I agree with all of this. My jumping prospect that I bought sight unseen does toe out. I had a really great sports med vet check him out and he isn't a bit worried even with jumping being my goal. Mine is very slight though, enough that they could mask it with a fresh trim job in the pictures. If I keep him trimmed up nice it is something most people wouldn't see.
As for California Chrome, if he isn't sore after running the first 2 races of the Triple Crown and the conditioning that goes before and during it, I don't see him having issues ever. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 550
| I know one that is a nice barrel horse, fantastic lines. If he was a mare you would want him for your broodmare band based on his papers. He has a crooked front leg. I've seen full siblings & 3/4 siblings of his that are broodmares with fantastic conformation, that have thrown babies with fantastic conformation. |
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Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | Donnie competed successfully until he was 24 grand prix dressage then carried on some freestyles until he was 28.... NO soundness issues ...he was laid to rest few months ago at 33. so I disagree with everyone that says it will cause issues.. but With proper care and a great knowledgable farrier ..its not a fact.. |
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Expert
Posts: 2457
| Bibliafarm - 2014-05-22 10:26 AM
Donnie competed successfully until he was 24 grand prix dressage then carried on some freestyles until he was 28.... NO soundness issues ...he was laid to rest few months ago at 33. so I disagree with everyone that says it will cause issues.. but With proper care and a great knowledgable farrier ..its not a fact..
precisely.  |
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More bootie than waist!
Posts: 18425
Location: Riding Crackhead. | TNcowgirl88 - 2014-05-22 8:41 AM I am confused... and I have wanted to ask before. Is he a gelding or a stud? I have heard both and its been posted here that he is both.. Clarification? Sorry :(
Colt...as in stallion.  |
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Location: California | Chrome is Curly's neighbor. Bryan, who is the exercise rider for Curly, says Chrome is a colt. He sees Chrome everyday so end of story. Colt and has balls. |
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 Dog Rescue Hero
Posts: 1660
Location: Oklahoma City OK | dk66 - 2014-05-22 7:50 AM A very wise trainer once told me that you can go to a sale buy the best yearling with the best conformation but as a 2yr. old it doesn't make a bit of difference if the horse you turned your nose up at that sale beats you at the wire. There are 2 horses that come to mind when you think of exceptional individuals that were crooked as they come Exterminator and Seabiscuit. The one thing that I think is so hard to breed for unless you just know in your soul is heart and try, without these 2 things it makes it all very difficult. California Chrome is an individual that loves his job, trusts the people around him, and has the heart and determination to be the exceptional individual he is.
Good answer! |
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Expert
Posts: 2121
Location: The Great Northwest | It is good to know that CC toes out. There is a difference in the demands in exercise for racing as for the tracks and barrel racing. I would feel that the turns, so much circle work would take a toll. |
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 Dr. Ruth
Posts: 9891
Location: Blissfully happy Giants fan!!! | I have a 14.2 (on a tall day) full TB and she swims BADLY on her front left. Always has and she was old enough that we couldn't fix it when I got her. She had gotten used to it. She has maintenance for sure but I just brought her back the first weekend of April and that mare has already won me $1k. Granted on bad runs but that money still spends the same as if she won it!
I do take her to the left but that is more because of her recent surgery than anything.
I will say I agree with the more maintenance comment from someone. My mare is a conformational disaster and I don't care how much she has won me she will NEVER be bred. BUT, with that said, I will keep up on her maintenance and will continue to run her unless she has pain. Then we won't. |
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Expert
Posts: 4652
| When he is in CA I see him every weekend when I go to Santa Anita and Los Al and he is a colt. He has been on Muscle Mass since the day he came to the track to compete so I see him when I go on Sundays to deliver products and talk with trainers.
Edited by Bob 2014-05-22 3:30 PM
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Mouhahaha
Posts: 1786
Location: British Columbia | Just out of curiosity, I read an article about what kind of stud fee CC will command if he does not win the Belmont, which was around 25K. Now if he doesn't, his earnings are still over 3million dollars.
How is Corona Cartel's stud fee 10K higher than CC's if he wins two legs of the triple crown? Should it not be considerably higher? |
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Location: California | Even if he doesn't win the Belmont I think his initial stud fee will be $125,000.
It will go up once he produces winners. AP Indy was $150,000, Storm Cat was $500,000 and Northern Dancer was $1,000,000.
Edited by NonaY 2014-05-22 5:48 PM
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Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | TMEquine - 2014-05-22 5:32 PM
Just out of curiosity, I read an article about what kind of stud fee CC will command if he does not win the Belmont, which was around 25K. Now if he doesn't, his earnings are still over 3million dollars.
How is Corona Cartel's stud fee 10K higher than CC's if he wins two legs of the triple crown? Should it not be considerably higher?
Corona Cartel didn't start off that high. He proved himself as a producer. $25000 as a start off fee is average for this I believe. Look at Curlin he's proving himself and has had multiple winners and it's $25000. |
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Location: Big Blue Skies | My good vet always says look at how they are traveling if the legs are crooked. He runs straight and that's what matters. |
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Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | Bibliafarm - 2014-05-22 10:26 AM
Donnie competed successfully until he was 24 grand prix dressage then carried on some freestyles until he was 28.... NO soundness issues ...he was laid to rest few months ago at 33. so I disagree with everyone that says it will cause issues.. but With proper care and a great knowledgable farrier ..its not a fact..
Yes. Exactly. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 989
| If that is a pic of CC on the first page as a weanling... how did his facial markings change so much? Or am I being blond and completely missing something here... I would call that not the right weanling...? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 989
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This link... |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1008
| I've been looking for my next prospect and just an observation I've noticed...it seems to me of what I have looked at the ones that are by tb mares or have a lot of tb in them have all toed out in the front. I won't buy one like that so it's making my task very difficult! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 669
Location: Central Texas | I've had both toed out and toed in (not bad but still a conformational fault), never had an issues with either and they both could move and scoot. Have had one that was perfect in every way, couldn't hold up to running barrels at all and moved like a tank. So, I guess I will take the horse that can get the job done over the beauty queen if I have to. Would love the complete package of course. Also, crooked legs are not always genetics, could be the way they developed in the womb for some reason other than genetics. |
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 I"m Jealous!
Posts: 1737
Location: Benton City, WA | I think its whats inside a horse that makes them a winner and their legs are however God made them. No one told California Chrome he couldn't run. If you don't like it, don't breed to him. |
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I AM being nice
Posts: 4396
Location: MD | One being crooked doesn't bother me a ton, so long as the hoof lands squarely... |
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I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | We have noticed so many horses lately have benched knees.
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