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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 897
  
Location: East Tennessee | I have a new mare. She is 6. Great on the pattern in competition. Problem: Every day riding is a constant fight. We can't walk without trying to trot. Can't trot without trying to lope. Can't lope without trying to run full speed. I try to stay as relaxed as possible in the saddle but it's a constant fight and I am always holding her back. What can I do? I really like this horse but how can I get her to unwind and relax? |
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  More bootie than waist!
Posts: 18425
  
Location: Riding Crackhead. | Crackhead is like that. I don't let it bother me. Its so nice to have a free running horse instead of something that you have to tire yourself out to get them to run that I just deal with it. In fact I'm heading out right now to take her for a spin.  |
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | Some of them are just like that...like the mare I'm selling. It gets on my nerves, but speaking from experience, you're not going to change them. What you can do is come up with coping strategies to take their mind off forward so you're not constantly bumping them back. And ride a lot of miles, letting them wear themselves out. I had one that was a really nice horse if you did at least one 10-12 mile ride, trotting and loping the whole way, and rode him 3-4 a day the rest of the week. I sold him when I started a family because I couldn't keep him ridden enough. I haven't even tried riding this mare that much--don't have time. Of course, some people like horses like that...I'm just not one of them. |
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 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | My mare is like that on the trails...very push style in the arena, but just in the seasoning process so I'm not worried. I try to do sidepassing, serpentines, something to take her mind off of going forward. She's a really nice horse otherwise, and if I trail ride with someone else she is okay with just walking, but by herself she is like that. She can go all day too. |
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 Sexy Bee Yacht
Posts: 5849
Location: WA | Make her busy. Don't let her go down the rail all the way without doing a gait change, a small perfect circle, two tracking, stopping, half halting, Stop, pivot on the hind end and depart at a slower gait. Serpentines. Keep her mind busy. It really settled my TB down doing this. She likes to run and is going to be real fun to barrel race on since my other mare is SO push style. When we were at our worst, I would go down the rail and count one front leg taking 10 strides. Then we would switch gaits. It got her softened up in the bridle AND got her to where she would listen and I wouldn't have to hold her back all the time. I would go between walk and jog, then jog and trot, then lope and walk (although that one can amp them up a little). I put her on Magnesium Oxide as well, helped to focus her better. |
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Veteran
Posts: 100
| My new mare is this exactly!!! She's a dream when competing and actually an angel at a barrel race but to ride her at home is a NIGHTMARE!!!! She won't walk, or trot OR lope, it's this crazy in place dressage looking lope/run sideways thing. She gets so worked up I worry she will have a heat stroke or heart attack! I've tried Reserpine, calming supplements, low starch feed, she's turned out all the time, ulcer treatment, blood work etc. I've tried ponying her, lunging her and even using a four wheeler to work her but those aren't working to keep her in shape. I don't know what else to do. |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | My horse is terrible about this when I need him to walk when we cool down--he always jigs. I just let him jig, and he eventually starts jogging.....I just let him pick his pace until he realizes I won't stop riding until he walks. He eventually settles into a walk.
One thing I picked up from Ed Wright, is if your horse is going the speed you want, give him free rein. If he's going too fast, apply pressure until he's going the speed you want, and then give him his head. Pretty basic horsemanship but he was talking about this and the confusion horses experience when a rider checks too soon and then gives their head back and then checks again...anyways. Something to consider. He also likes to lift UP instead of pulling back to show a horse down. Really worked for mine. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 133
| I have one like this too. Some days are better than others. On the days I am able to keep her calm I have done only walk or trot work and then treated her just like I did the "colt." I noticed riding the colt that she would get upset if I got too far away from her comfort zone. So I would ride her to that place (like in bigger and bigger circles) and when she became even a little upset I would let her go back to the comfort place. I just allowed this to happen over and over again. No hurry no worry. Eventually way out there on the cirle away from her comfort zone eventually became her comfort zone. Of course, the next day we start all over again. But over time she gets more confident. Well when I would ride my seasoned horse, and she would act so crazed and silly, I decided to ride her like I would the colt. So I kept coming back to the location where she would calm down (back to the other horses where they were grazing) and she did calm down and we walked away from that practice session with her head low. Now sometimes it just doesn't work that way, and it is frustrating. Very frustrating. But she is very talented and loves running the barrels, so it is worth it. I just try to remember that there is a place that she calms down, but am I willing to take the time to let her go there during our session that day. It also helps if I make a pact with myself to not get upset no matter what she does. Once I start feeling pissy, I know I better take a break or ride her back to the comfort zone place. It's challenging! |
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 Ditch the Stirrups
Posts: 5369
Location: Sorrow Not! Defending against workplace bullies | My gelding is like this. I do not have an arena but have lots of hills and trails. However there are also lots of sage rat holes so I can't just let him go wherever he wants. One day I decided to wear him out and he actually ran so hard it scared me and would have kept running too. That night he would not eat and I was worried about colic. He will actually run himself sick!
With the recent heat wave I have been getting up early before work and taking him out at least 30 minotes and longer on weekends. I think consistency is very important with these types of horses. If I get him out every day for a week he seems to calm down some. Also this is a no brainer but no grain or alfalfa!
I actually really like riding him. It only bothers me because I do not want him to get hurt. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1035
Location: TN | My boy is like this! When I ride in the field during the week it's a constant battle to keep him at a long trot. I've pretty much given up on a slow lope (it always ends up being a fast lope or run if I'm in the field doing straight lines). If I'm riding in a straight line he's the worst. Circles are better because he realizes he can't take off anywhere because we're just going in circles. When he starts pushing and getting chargey if he won't slow down to whatever speed I want I'll stop him, back him up, and then start again on a loose rein. Eventually he'll get tired of stopping and will start listening and long trotting. If he's really fresh and full of himself lol I'll try to tire him out in circles before trying to ride the perimeter of the field again. |
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 pressure dripper
Posts: 8699
Location: the end of the rainbow | My old mare was like this. I liked to keep it simple with her. If I asked her to walk and she sped up I stopped her, made her settle for a second then usually changed direction and walked off again. Did the same at other speeds when she was hot or pushy. Not an instant fix but it was a quick way to teach her speeding up without me asking was not acceptable, especially since she was the kind of horse that picking at just ticked her off and made it worse. |
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 Three in a Bikini
Posts: 2035
| hammer_time - 2014-07-13 3:19 PM
My horse is terrible about this when I need him to walk when we cool down--he always jigs. I just let him jig, and he eventually starts jogging.....I just let him pick his pace until he realizes I won't stop riding until he walks. He eventually settles into a walk.
One thing I picked up from Ed Wright, is if your horse is going the speed you want, give him free rein. If he's going too fast, apply pressure until he's going the speed you want, and then give him his head. Pretty basic horsemanship but he was talking about this and the confusion horses experience when a rider checks too soon and then gives their head back and then checks again...anyways. Something to consider. He also likes to lift UP instead of pulling back to show a horse down. Really worked for mine.
THIS EXACTLY.
I had similar troubles until I attended one of Ed's clinics. It was all about hand positioning.
Also, small circles and having a routine helped as well. |
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 Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | 900 mph you say??? I think I might want her :) |
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I Need a Xanax!
Posts: 2774
| I had one like this that I tried to get to slow down for 5 years.....did not change a thing! I did all the Clinton Anderson techniques to slow one down till I was blue in the face. The mare was gentle as a kitten and absolutely lazy on the ground and in the pasture but when riding her she was always wanting to overwork and GO, GO, GO! She was very enthusiastic and happy about working HARD. She was a Doc O'lena grandaughter and loved to work....too much...for me, at least. All that jigging and jarring killed my back so I sold her to a teenager. My advice is to love her for what she is or sell her to someone who will because I don't think that kind ever changes. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1432
Location: Never in one place long | Lisantwist - 2014-07-13 12:29 PM
Make her busy. Don't let her go down the rail all the way without doing a gait change, a small perfect circle, two tracking, stopping, half halting, Stop, pivot on the hind end and depart at a slower gait. Serpentines. Keep her mind busy. It really settled my TB down doing this. She likes to run and is going to be real fun to barrel race on since my other mare is SO push style. When we were at our worst, I would go down the rail and count one front leg taking 10 strides. Then we would switch gaits. It got her softened up in the bridle AND got her to where she would listen and I wouldn't have to hold her back all the time. I would go between walk and jog, then jog and trot, then lope and walk (although that one can amp them up a little). I put her on Magnesium Oxide as well, helped to focus her better.
Agreed! switch it up a lot! Stop, lope, trot, back, bend...etc etc... my mare is exactly like this... people are right in saying she wont' change but you can "cope" with her. If you don't like this kinda horse or think you can deal with her... might want to get another. :( some people like them, some can't stand em. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330
| Any horse that is ignoring you and refuses to do simple things like walk or trot without jigging or loping in place needs to go back to the basics of riding. Slow work on the flat, regularly. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 570
Location: NM | I have found the best approach with these types of horses is to say, "okay if you don't want to stay at the speed I ask, that's fine, but you're going to have to work a whole lot more and be a lot more uncomfortable." For example, if I ask the horse to walk in a straight line and he wants to trot, then we trot...with his head to my kneed in tiny little circles about 4-5 circles in both directions. At this point they are usually walking and we go forward again, on a loose rein. Repeat as necessary. If I'm loping and the horse wants to run I just pick a point, set it up like I would turn a barrel and turn the horse in several 6 ft circles. Pretty soon (like a week or two) they figure out that it's too much work to go fast. An added bonus of the loping exercise is that you are building more responsiveness that will carry over to the pattern. I really love to take my horses out in my front pasture where there are tons of 2ft tall mesquites and trot through, randomly pick out a bush, sit down, pick up the reins and ask them to turn. They never know which one is next, all they know is that when I sit down and pick up the reins it's time to turn. |
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 I Chore in Chucks
Posts: 2882
Location: MD | I got some really great advice last year and it was just do a serpentine and continue, if your horse continues then do another. make them smaller and smaller until she slows. my horse realized he was
doing much more work going faster than I wanted vs just taking a chill pill and relaxing for a second.
key for me was to never escalate myself or the way I was riding. I basically had to pretend what happened a minute ago never happened and to stay very even tempered. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 138
Location: MS | My horse is like this. She's 18 now & she is not going to change. The previous owner bought her at two and said she has been this way all her life. A few years ago she (the previous owner) went back to the basics, started her completely over from ground work up. Didn't change a thing. I was told she did mellow some after she had a colt but that was before I bought her.
The more basics I try to do with her the more worked up she gets. It's just not worth the fight anymore. She is a dream on the pattern - automatic, solid, & consistent. Rarely hits a barrel & when she does it's usually my fault. So, I just deal with it & usually pony her to keep her in shape. |
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 Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | Red can have days like that. He's calmed down the longer I have had him, but the first year I owned him it was horrible. I also bought him when he was 6 years old.
Miles, miles, miles, and miles out on the trail. I usually ride Red a minimum of 4 miles out on the trails. Some days we go 7 miles, and all of it is at a trot or lope (minus his warm up and cool down). He has the energy for it, so he gets long rides. It seems to help a lot. He gets ridden almost every day as well.
In high school, I bought a very, very well-trained gelding that was SO in tune to the ride ... he kinda forgot to just relax and enjoy the ride. It was months before he was walking on a loose rein, and I had to be very careful not to shift my weight or he'd "snap back" into it and realize he was forgetting to pay attention to me. Good horse, but I felt so bad for him that he had such a hard time learning to relax.
Long story short --> Lots of miles and wet saddle blankets are good for those types of horses.
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Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | I wouldnt hesitate to do 2-a-days with this type of horse, or even saddle up in the morning and ride at night. Routine is good as well, but I hate that about these horses. Whenever I ride mine in the field, he will instantly start walking And being good when I take a certain path with the trees and water because that's how I normally cool down. I just hate that if I have to deviate from that for some reason, I have a hot, jiggy mess. On this type if horse as well, I don't feed grain. If I must, I feed something with very low sugar content. I'd they have enough energy to jig, then they don't need any extra sugar!!!! I noticed a big difference when I switched my horse over to RG. Much more calm. But my horse isn't with me at the moment so he's off of that..... |
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pressure dripper
Posts: 8699
Location: the end of the rainbow | I double dog dare any of you that say "make em worker harder" to come ride my 24 yr old crippled mare. I'd bet money that either you or the horse is going to drop dead before you get the result you want. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 330
| willrodeo4food - 2014-07-14 12:51 PM
I double dog dare any of you that say "make em worker harder" to come ride my 24 yr old crippled mare. I'd bet money that either you or the horse is going to drop dead before you get the result you want.
I don't think the answer is to work them harder, I think it's to work them smarter. Just sitting up there while the horse moves its feet isn't the answer. You have to be asking them to do something that's engaging not just their body, but their brains. For those horses who think they have to go go go, you need to break it back down to the basics. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 173
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow | Three 4 Luck - 2014-07-13 12:10 PM
Some of them are just like that...like the mare I'm selling. It gets on my nerves, but speaking from experience, you're not going to change them. What you can do is come up with coping strategies to take their mind off forward so you're not constantly bumping them back. And ride a lot of miles, letting them wear themselves out. I had one that was a really nice horse if you did at least one 10-12 mile ride, trotting and loping the whole way, and rode him 3-4 a day the rest of the week. I sold him when I started a family because I couldn't keep him ridden enough. I haven't even tried riding this mare that much--don't have time. Of course, some people like horses like that...I'm just not one of them.
I actually do like horsees like that. Maybe we need to trade. Mine is too laid back and easy going and it drives me nuts. I wish I could appreciate him more. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 814
Location: California | My mare is a go, go, go type of horse, too. I have had her for almost 10 years and have learned to just keep her happy, which in return, keeps me happy. I tried for years to get her to slow lope and it just won't happen. It always turned into a fight. Now, I will take her out in the orchards and just long trot for miles. This keeps us from fighting each other while still giving her a work out.
She has always been on point on the pattern so I seldomly do arena work. The arena is where she gets herself worked up. IF we need to do any pattern work, I can accomplish everything I need to accomplish at a walk and trot.
I have learned to work with her quirks and not turn things into a battle. Like I said, I keep her happy, which keeps me happy. |
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 Texas Lone Star
Posts: 5318
Location: where ever my L/Q trl is parked | If she's great on the pattern and doesn't really need any help there... why not just gip her in a large round pen like 70' or larger. That's what I did for my mare for her excercise... made my round pen larger and let her work herself in all the gaits, when she would, for 30 to 60 minutes. What ever gait she wanted to go I would just stand in the middle and make she she changed direction every 5 minutes. Work one direction you have to work the other.
Don't want to high jack this thread but how many of you work your horses both direction in all gaits?
Why is it when I go to a race in the warm up area everyone always wants to go to the right- but never wants to change directions?   |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 897
Location: East Tennessee | LRQHS - 2014-07-14 7:07 AM
900 mph you say??? I think I might want her :)
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 897
Location: East Tennessee | I can handle letting her do her thing at home I suppose but when at a race in the warm up pen people pull over and get out of the way because she sounds like a freight train running up behind them lol. |
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I Need a Xanax!
Posts: 2774
| willrodeo4food - 2014-07-14 11:51 AM
I double dog dare any of you that say "make em worker harder" to come ride my 24 yr old crippled mare. I'd bet money that either you or the horse is going to drop dead before you get the result you want.
I agree 100%. When I read the "ride them harder" response on here it immediately lets me know the poster hasn't truly had one of these types of horses. The harder you work them the hotter and faster they get. No amount of "riding them down" does anything but make them worse. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1131
| My mare does this at the trot, and I haul her butt in the ground and back triple the amount of steps she took at the wrong speed. Then immediately pick up the trot again, and keep doing it until she listens. I refuse to have a stupid horse that won't follow my lead, if I don't want you loping, you are not loping. She is a super push style horse in the arena though, with a awesome stop on her. haha |
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 Peecans
| Used2B - 2014-07-15 8:15 AM
willrodeo4food - 2014-07-14 11:51 AM
I double dog dare any of you that say "make em worker harder" to come ride my 24 yr old crippled mare. I'd bet money that either you or the horse is going to drop dead before you get the result you want.
I agree 100%. When I read the "ride them harder" response on here it immediately lets me know the poster hasn't truly had one of these types of horses. The harder you work them the hotter and faster they get. No amount of "riding them down" does anything but make them worse.
I do agree with you.
Its not so much ride them harder and WORK them better. But 99% of people are not in a spot to give a horse a JOB and make them work daily. We have a couple hot horses and hat days on the farm is what has made them great managible horses. Cattle work goes along way, and I dont mean team pening gehawing around. Work thats back and forth, processing, dragging sleds of mineral and salt to the range cows. But most people dont have access to that.
Thinking back to one horse inperticular, he was acatualy my favroite gathering horse but he'd get so hot, hed jig alive the place espicaly if the cattle got a little westren. With him as soon as his feet would move like that his brain shut off. To get his brain back you had to get his feet quite, I would do alot of flexing and calm circles and his feet slows his brain would come back. It was A LOT of back and forth with him.
The hardest thing with these horses is to not let the shannagins get to you, just let it out and stay calm and relaxed. I tend to have a quiter energy though and get along quite well with hotter horses. But i do see some at races and have tryed some out that you couldent pay me to have.
I might get shot for this but there is a difference between a horse thats just hot and a horse thats been fame on and made hot. Dont much care for the latter of the two, a lot less can be done with them. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Aqhaczy - 2014-07-14 4:00 PM
If she's great on the pattern and doesn't really need any help there... why not just gip her in a large round pen like 70' or larger. That's what I did for my mare for her excercise... made my round pen larger and let her work herself in all the gaits, when she would, for 30 to 60 minutes. What ever gait she wanted to go I would just stand in the middle and make she she changed direction every 5 minutes. Work one direction you have to work the other.
Don't want to high jack this thread but how many of you work your horses both direction in all gaits?
Why is it when I go to a race in the warm up area everyone always wants to go to the right- but never wants to change directions?
I do work my horses equally on both sides, even when I am doing straight work, I always choose the lead they start out in and make sure equal amount is spent on the opposite.
As for the op, I don't have much advice as my hot horse who likes to run, will probably be the death of me.
Mine is starting to settle down but is not running barrels yet, the first 1/4 mile I do make her walk, if she doesn't walk we do a 360 with emphasis on her hind leg sticking in the ground, as soon as she starts trotting, we do another circle the opposite way and so on till the 1/4 mile is done. I do this as I don't want her to immediately go any faster before her tendons have had a change to warm up.
After the 1/4 mile I will let her trot if she breaks into a lope I will do larger circles and break her down, I do this both ways and will reverse arc both ways, again I don't like her going any faster as I want to make sure the tendons ligaments and muscles are warm.
After the trotting I will lope her, if she starts going too fast I will slow her down to the speed I want and lope a few smaller circles, reverse arc some circles then I will allow her to lope off again in the opposite lead, when she gets going faster I repeat the same, by this time I have travelled 1 mile not counting all the circles. At this time I will allow her to sprint 1/2 mile. After that I will break her down to a trot if she keeps wanting to increase her speed, I work on circles both directions reverse arcing, I do this 1/4 mile, then make her walk a 1/4 mile. The last 1/4 mile I will stop back up 360 if she breaks faster and repeat till we get home.
It took me about 3 rides before she came around, i do anticipate more hot problems when she starts working barrels faster, but repetition and patience is key.
It takes a lot longer to break a bad habit then it does to create a habit. Mine luckily is young, so the habits have not formed. |
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 Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | Please excuse the language.... but if horses could talk... I would expect to hear something like this...
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=741791099186092&fref=nf |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| We bought one exactly like this, he was horrible riding at home. We sent him to Jan, our trainer for a month and he came back a different horse. She said if he would not listen she would work him then tie him up with the saddle on. If he was listening, he was unsaddled and put up. She said he spent a couple of nights tied up with the saddle on before he started to catch on. When we got him back she gave my daughter instructions that if would not stand still, or stay in a trot to lightly spin him both directions then offer him again what you were asking him to do. She emphasized to not pull or jerk on him, just make him work harder than what you were asking. My daughter had to do that twice than he was great. |
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 The Purple Princess
Posts: 2226
Location: Charlestown, IN | DLV - 2014-07-14 9:40 AM Lisantwist - 2014-07-13 12:29 PM Make her busy. Don't let her go down the rail all the way without doing a gait change, a small perfect circle, two tracking, stopping, half halting, Stop, pivot on the hind end and depart at a slower gait. Serpentines. Keep her mind busy. It really settled my TB down doing this. She likes to run and is going to be real fun to barrel race on since my other mare is SO push style. When we were at our worst, I would go down the rail and count one front leg taking 10 strides. Then we would switch gaits. It got her softened up in the bridle AND got her to where she would listen and I wouldn't have to hold her back all the time. I would go between walk and jog, then jog and trot, then lope and walk (although that one can amp them up a little). I put her on Magnesium Oxide as well, helped to focus her better. Agreed! switch it up a lot! Stop, lope, trot, back, bend...etc etc... my mare is exactly like this... people are right in saying she wont' change but you can "cope" with her. If you don't like this kinda horse or think you can deal with her... might want to get another. : ( some people like them, some can't stand em.
I agree with the above. I have a prancy gelding. My dad always told me that if he didn't walk, then make him work. I turn him around, make him side pass, back him, etc. It usually helps him chill out. I rode a mare similar last year, that was not a barrel horse, but what I did with her was LOTS of trail riding. It seemed to help her relax more. And I did lots of walking in the arena instead of asking for more. I think it made her like to walk. I have a 3 year old now that thinks he needs to go and have been doing lots of walking on him as well. When he tries to trot when not asked, I stop, back, stand, then walk, walk, and walk some more before I ask him to do anything else. Will also make him side pass etc. All slow slow slow work. It seems to be helping him. |
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| I have found that consistent riding, daily, helped my nervous horses better than trying to ride them down every few days. Also, doing circles at different places, maybe set up obstacles, vary the routine that makes them think helps. I had a horse that would get nervous in the warm up pen and I just warmed him up elsewhere. You can usually, not always, find somewhere off the beaten path to warm them up if the pen makes them nervous. |
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | I double dog dare any of you that say "make em worker harder" to come ride my 24 yr old crippled mare. I'd bet money that either you or the horse is going to drop dead before you get the result you want.
I have one exactly like this - I tried everything when she was younger, but finally realized as long as she does her job, then let her be. I just pony her and sometimes can ride her (if it is at a barrel race arena she is accustomed to) to warm her up. She is now 24 and has won a lot of money for me and my daughter. Just learned how to cope with her, becuase she is never going to change.
When I first got her I sent her to a cutting horse trainer who got her to work, but he told me unless I rode her twice a day everyday she was going to revert back and she did.
If they are good enough then accept them and cope. |
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Veteran
Posts: 227
Location: Heart of Texas | Sometimes hot horses don't need to be worked harder but need to learn to relax. They're hot b/c they're likely nervous and full of anxious energy. I have a TB that is like a fine tuned corvette and doesn't need much coaxing for anything. He's also a stall walker and walks himself ALL DAY LONG. (talk about energy). Some days we condition hard and other days we just walk. I'll pick a spot and make him stand there till he's relaxed, walk to another spot and stand there. He stays tied while I work my other horse. Relaxation is key with hot horses. And make them pay attention while you are in the saddle. If I feel he's starting to get away from me we'll work on whoa and back up. If he's too busy listening to me, he doesn't have a chance to think GO. We barrel racers are chastized for having hot/nervous horses, and too be honest I think there's a lot of evidence to back that up. You shouldn't dread riding inbetween races cuz your horse can't act properly. What good does that do you?? |
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Horse always wanting to go 900 mph