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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| A trainer around here enters all of her horses at barrel races as Horse 1, Horse 2, Horse 3, Horse 4... etc... and I notice her good horse is always coincidentally running at the top of the ground. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that she is not naming her horses on the entries in order to get the position in a drag that best suits each of her horses... not just at small town jackpots either, I'm talking at barrel bashes and big added money barrel races. I just think that is pretty lame, and why are there not rules to handle stuff like this? Especially at bigger barrel races? Surely she is not the first one to figure out how to work the system this way. Just curious if there are rules anywhere that outline this or if this is just something everyone brushes aside and is not worth making a big deal out of? |
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 Midget Lover
    
Location: Kentucky | Not a big deal to me. If she doesn't care that the horse is not getting the winnings documented, then she is just doing what gets her paid. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| If it really bothered me, I would say something to her, but I'm really just curious if there are rules in place for that kind of thing? It blows my mind that that is legal... but then again my rodeo schedule does not allow me to go to very many barrel races so I am out of the loop anyway. |
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 I Chore in Chucks
Posts: 2882
Location: MD | I wouldn't care enough to say something to get her "in trouble". But, nobody else gets to decide when they get to run... why does she? |
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Ot oh- did you get permission to use the words "barrel bashes"? |
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Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | CheckItOut - 2014-08-14 11:56 AM
If it really bothered me, I would say something to her, but I'm really just curious if there are rules in place for that kind of thing? It blows my mind that that is legal... but then again my rodeo schedule does not allow me to go to very many barrel races so I am out of the loop anyway.
It's probably not illegal. Just maybe frowned upon. Like sandbagging. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 11:03 AM
Ot oh- did you get permission to use the words "barrel bashes"?
What? |
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 Cute Little Imp
Posts: 2747
Location: N Texas | It would definitely irk me, but I'm a rule follower and get annoyed when people "work the system". 
Like Murphy said, she can't prove which horse is "Horse 1", so winnings can't be verified for that horse in the event it comes up for sale. So while she may benefit from choosing which horse runs when, if "Horse 1" wins the 1D, I don't think she'd be able to prove it in the future. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2154
Location: USA | I used to run against a guy who did that. He used to enter his horses as horse1, horse 2, joe, bob, etc... He kept bringing the same horses every time and entered them with the same names,. Then if he knew horse 1 ran better on top ground, he would change horse2 (who had top ground) for horse 1. Enough complaints and then he was watched several times by directors and eventually was suspended by the district. He then ran another district and did the same thing. He eventually was told that if he did it again he would have a lifetime NBHA suspension as they said it was cheating. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| CheckItOut - 2014-08-14 11:06 AM Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 11:03 AM Ot oh- did you get permission to use the words "barrel bashes"? What?
Haha there once was a bb on here that forbid anybody to use that combination of words without express written permission. She indicated that she had it trademarked! |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | IMO it's cheating. Enough complaints and the powers that be will put a stop to it. In rodeo it's different. The earnings are tracked by rider. But I still like to know what horse they ran, just because I'm always studying breeding combinations that work.  |
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 Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | I thought that you had to enter each horse by its registered name (for EquiStat purposes) and then run that horse when that particular horse got put in the draw?
I don't see how they would even let you enter a horse named "Horse #1"??
At least around here at our local jackpots and NBHAs, every one enters a horse/rider combination and then that is what gets put in the draw.
You could bring it to the attention of the show committee. Then they could decide if there were any rules against what she is doing. Leave it in their hands.
Edited by r_beau 2014-08-14 12:04 PM
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 Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 11:59 AM CheckItOut - 2014-08-14 11:06 AM Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 11:03 AM Ot oh- did you get permission to use the words "barrel bashes"? What?
She probably means that this person is running at Renea's Barrel Bashes.....LOL
and yes, it SHOULD be considered cheating! |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 684
Location: Oklahoma | r_beau - 2014-08-14 12:03 PM I thought that you had to enter each horse by its registered name (for EquiStat purposes) and then run that horse when that particular horse got put in the draw?
I don't see how they would even let you enter a horse named "Horse #1"??
At least around here at our local jackpots and NBHAs, every one enters a horse/rider combination and then that is what gets put in the draw.
You could bring it to the attention of the show committee. Then they could decide if there were any rules against what she is doing. Leave it in their hands.
Entering them with their registered names helps track their earnings. However, a lot of people run grade horses, so you're gonna get a lot of those, as well as some people who don't care about tracking their earnings on a horse and just enter it by their barn name.
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Agree, cheating. |
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"Heck's Coming With Me"
Posts: 10797
Location: Kansas | It's cheating plain and simple. If you have one good horse only and draw the bottom of the ground, you had no opportunity to put your best horse on the top of the drag. People who pull the numbering horse BS are manipulating for the best ground for their 1D horse because it's highly unlikely they're all 1D horses. You don't need a college degree to figure this scam out and producers shouldn't let it happen.
Edited by Frodo 2014-08-14 12:40 PM
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 Ms. Marine
Posts: 4641
Location: Texas | It should be considered cheating. |
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 The Worst Seller Ever
Posts: 4138
Location: Oklahoma | It honestly doesn't matter to me one bit. If a person thinks that bottom vs top of the ground will make that much difference at a barrel race (rodeos are different) then they are crazy. The only time top of the ground has an advantage is if you have a really little horse, or you run the opposite way as everyone else in the drag. I have a lefty and it does suck running after 4 or 9 right handed horses an you run against the tracks at 3.
If you have a list of horses, and they need to be ran in a certain order meds, buddy sour, warm up time, ect then a person should be allowed to each horse its best chance to make a good run. Some producers and random draws do not take that into consideration. |
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 Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | The races that operate on draws should require registered names or barn names followed by (NR). If the rider wants to use horse 1 ... they should have to pay a fine. Say $10 per horse. That would stop it. That happens a lot around here. I've even done it myself just because I can. |
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 Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | Like NJJ said yes it is cheating. I have seen it done numerous times...really too many to mention. But I finally decided to quit worring about it and let them have at it. It amazes me that people that win like that (if they do win) can hold their heads up. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1182
Location: Do I hear Banjos? | Sounds like stacking the deck and not very good sportsmanship. But...if there is no rule against the practice...well...not much can be said. But...I'd probably not go have a beer with that rider any time soon. |
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | clover girl - 2014-08-14 12:59 PM It honestly doesn't matter to me one bit. If a person thinks that bottom vs top of the ground will make that much difference at a barrel race (rodeos are different) then they are crazy. The only time top of the ground has an advantage is if you have a really little horse, or you run the opposite way as everyone else in the drag. I have a lefty and it does suck running after 4 or 9 right handed horses an you run against the tracks at 3.
If you have a list of horses, and they need to be ran in a certain order meds, buddy sour, warm up time, ect then a person should be allowed to each horse its best chance to make a good run. Some producers and random draws do not take that into consideration.
Everyone is assuming that people do it to get better ground. I've done it myself but not for that reason--it was when I needed my horses to be in a certain order, but the random draw of a particular producer didn't allow for placing them in order. I haven't entered multiple horses in a decade, but it was common practice then, Equistat wasn't an issue, and no one thought anything of it. If there isn't a rule against it, it's not cheating. |
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Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | osu_barrelracer - 2014-08-14 12:34 PM r_beau - 2014-08-14 12:03 PM I thought that you had to enter each horse by its registered name (for EquiStat purposes) and then run that horse when that particular horse got put in the draw?
I don't see how they would even let you enter a horse named "Horse #1"??
At least around here at our local jackpots and NBHAs, every one enters a horse/rider combination and then that is what gets put in the draw.
You could bring it to the attention of the show committee. Then they could decide if there were any rules against what she is doing. Leave it in their hands.
Entering them with their registered names helps track their earnings. However, a lot of people run grade horses, so you're gonna get a lot of those, as well as some people who don't care about tracking their earnings on a horse and just enter it by their barn name.
But still, if you've got a grade horse named "Larry" you are going to write that down when you enter.
.... Not "Horse 1".
That's not a barn name.
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 Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | r_beau - 2014-08-14 1:34 PM osu_barrelracer - 2014-08-14 12:34 PM r_beau - 2014-08-14 12:03 PM I thought that you had to enter each horse by its registered name (for EquiStat purposes) and then run that horse when that particular horse got put in the draw?
I don't see how they would even let you enter a horse named "Horse #1"??
At least around here at our local jackpots and NBHAs, every one enters a horse/rider combination and then that is what gets put in the draw.
You could bring it to the attention of the show committee. Then they could decide if there were any rules against what she is doing. Leave it in their hands.
Entering them with their registered names helps track their earnings. However, a lot of people run grade horses, so you're gonna get a lot of those, as well as some people who don't care about tracking their earnings on a horse and just enter it by their barn name.
.... Not "Horse 1".
That's not a barn name.
You don't run around with many ropers do you? LOL. With some of them, you're lucky if a horse has any name besides Bay, Sorrel, Gray, or Paint.
I do agree that you should be able to stipulate which horse runs first if you're running more than one, but I also think each horse should be entered by his or her name, be that a barn name or a registered name. They draw up where they draw up and you make the best of it. I've had rodeo secretaries tell me my draw position and act sorry about it if its 13, 14, 15 so bottom of the ground, but I tell them that I'm gonna run when they call my name and try to be as fast as I can. Worrying about my spot on the ground is pointless because I can't do anything about it. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| Being a devils advocate here ...
It is not cheating if there are no specific rules against it. Just because I know how to work the system to the best of my advantage, whatever the reason, doesn't mean I'm a cheater.
No, it is not particularly nice when people take advantage of it, but mount up and run. I came, I paid my fees, lets compete.
MHO. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 161
Location: Oklahoma or who knows maybe trucking ? | Yes that is cheating, but that is the only way some people can win. Lol. And still that can't win first. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 359
Location: MS | I have seen this done numerous times. There is one girl in particular who does it that sells horses for a living. I saw her run a certain horse at a barrel race then she put him up for sale. She used one of the other horses times to use as this horses time. She was advertising it as a 1/2d horse, but really its a 4d horse. It really stinks, because she ran one horse one day then swapped the next. Its not fair at all. |
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 Dog Resuce Agent
Posts: 3459
Location: southeast Texas | If its not in the rules, not cheating. |
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
Location: PNW | amberturner4 - 2014-08-14 3:30 PM
I have seen this done numerous times. There is one girl in particular who does it that sells horses for a living. I saw her run a certain horse at a barrel race then she put him up for sale. She used one of the other horses times to use as this horses time. She was advertising it as a 1/2d horse, but really its a 4d horse. It really stinks, because she ran one horse one day then swapped the next. Its not fair at all.
That's WAY more dishonest/shady/wrong than doing it just to move horse order around. I don't really like the moving around horses either, but reordering is just playing to your advantage. Swapping times is just flat wrong. |
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Location: stumbling around BHW | It is also done when someone is training multiple horses and does not know which two or three they may be taking with them for one reason or another...horse hurt, horse coming along at home better than another....orders may need to be run in certain orders because of tack changes, warm ups, help getting horse in alley....its a multitude of things that could actually play into a decision to do that. It may very well be that a rider rides the push horse first and the free runner last for their comfort or vise versa...
edited to say: its no big deal to me, we all run on the same pattern and run against the same horse, does not matter where they run....I have seen horses win at jackpots and rodeos on the top and the bottom of the ground...The best horse that day is gonna win no matter where they run..just go make YOUR best run and HAVE FUN.
Edited by msrockinrhard 2014-08-14 3:44 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1114
Location: Mo. | It's only cheating if it's stated in the rules that you have to name the horse. Otherwise... I'd call it staking the odds in her favor.
I'd say something to the person running the race (if they have a comment box---comment---have your friends comment) In the meantime
you will have to be gracious with someone who knows how to work the system. |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | Frodo - 2014-08-14 10:35 AM It's cheating plain and simple. If you have one good horse only and draw the bottom of the ground, you had no opportunity to put your best horse on the top of the drag. People who pull the numbering horse BS are manipulating for the best ground for their 1D horse because it's highly unlikely they're all 1D horses. You don't need a college degree to figure this scam out and producers shouldn't let it happen.
Wholeheartedly agree. Well said. |
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Location: stumbling around BHW | svincent - 2014-08-14 3:37 PM
amberturner4 - 2014-08-14 3:30 PM
I have seen this done numerous times. There is one girl in particular who does it that sells horses for a living. I saw her run a certain horse at a barrel race then she put him up for sale. She used one of the other horses times to use as this horses time. She was advertising it as a 1/2d horse, but really its a 4d horse. It really stinks, because she ran one horse one day then swapped the next. Its not fair at all.
That's WAY more dishonest/shady/wrong than doing it just to move horse order around. I don't really like the moving around horses either, but reordering is just playing to your advantage. Swapping times is just flat wrong.
THIS GARBAGE IS TOTAL BULL, and should not happen, maybe when a person gets there they should have to add horse's name goes for horse 1 , horse 2 ect. That would resolve that part of the problem
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| roxieannie - 2014-08-14 3:34 PM If its not in the rules, not cheating.
If you dont get caught it isn't stealing either, right? |
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 Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | CheckItOut - 2014-08-14 8:49 AM
A trainer around here enters all of her horses at barrel races as Horse 1, Horse 2, Horse 3, Horse 4... etc... and I notice her good horse is always coincidentally running at the top of the ground. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that she is not naming her horses on the entries in order to get the position in a drag that best suits each of her horses... not just at small town jackpots either, I'm talking at barrel bashes and big added money barrel races. I just think that is pretty lame, and why are there not rules to handle stuff like this? Especially at bigger barrel races? Surely she is not the first one to figure out how to work the system this way. Just curious if there are rules anywhere that outline this or if this is just something everyone brushes aside and is not worth making a big deal out of?
This kind of thing ticks me off! |
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 Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | I don't find it to be cheating at all. If there isn't a rule then how is it cheating? Also I am there to do my best no matter who is there and on what horse or in what position of the draw they run. What someone else does at a jackpot does not effect my run.
I also know it is nice to know which horse you will be on first and by putting Horse 1, Horse 2, etc you get to decide who to run and when. That way tack changes, warm up plans, etc are much easier. I know around here most producers allow the riders to say which horse they want to draw up on first but some are not quite so nice about it. If I have 4 horses to run I want to know which ones need to be saddled and warmed up right away and sometimes the draw is not posted/announced enough in advance.
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Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 3:46 PM roxieannie - 2014-08-14 3:34 PM If its not in the rules, not cheating. If you dont get caught it isn't stealing either, right?
Ummm that doesn't even make sense. You are still taking something that is not yours and there are laws against that. Putting your horse's name as Horse 1 is not cheating if there is not a rule against it. It is just a way of making things simpler on the rider. |
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 Expert
Posts: 5293
| Its an OPEN barrel race. It is NOT cheating in my opinion. WHat if she enters 4 and all of them are at the bottom of a particular drag? She can't move them anywhere can she? |
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Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | msrockinrhard - 2014-08-14 1:41 PM
It is also done when someone is training multiple horses and does not know which two or three they may be taking with them for one reason or another...horse hurt, horse coming along at home better than another....orders may need to be run in certain orders because of tack changes, warm ups, help getting horse in alley....its a multitude of things that could actually play into a decision to do that. It may very well be that a rider rides the push horse first and the free runner last for their comfort or vise versa...
edited to say: its no big deal to me, we all run on the same pattern and run against the same horse, does not matter where they run....I have seen horses win at jackpots and rodeos on the top and the bottom of the ground...The best horse that day is gonna win no matter where they run..just go make YOUR best run and HAVE FUN.
I'm fine with that as long as the switch is designated before the actual race starts. I've entered one and then had to switch before but at least I wrote a name down. |
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Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | msrockinrhard - 2014-08-14 1:46 PM
svincent - 2014-08-14 3:37 PM
amberturner4 - 2014-08-14 3:30 PM
I have seen this done numerous times. There is one girl in particular who does it that sells horses for a living. I saw her run a certain horse at a barrel race then she put him up for sale. She used one of the other horses times to use as this horses time. She was advertising it as a 1/2d horse, but really its a 4d horse. It really stinks, because she ran one horse one day then swapped the next. Its not fair at all.
That's WAY more dishonest/shady/wrong than doing it just to move horse order around. I don't really like the moving around horses either, but reordering is just playing to your advantage. Swapping times is just flat wrong.
THIS GARBAGE IS TOTAL BULL, and should not happen, maybe when a person gets there they should have to add horse's name goes for horse 1 , horse 2 ect. That would resolve that part of the problem
I think they should get fined/DQ for that. This totally irks me! |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Unethical, if not cheating. I thought that was luck of the draw? I wouldn't do it and if I was looking for a horse and I knew someone did this I wouldn't look at their horses because I couldn't trust the times they said the horse ran. I am usually to busy taking care of my horse to know who runs what so I rely on sellers using the horse's name not a number for identification of winnings. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Just Bring It - 2014-08-14 3:58 PM Whiteboy - 2014-08-14 3:46 PM roxieannie - 2014-08-14 3:34 PM If its not in the rules, not cheating. If you dont get caught it isn't stealing either, right?
Let me rephrase it for you: Just becasue it is legal doesn't mean it is right. This comes down to a moral issue, if in fact the rider is switching horses based on the draw, then it is wrong even if it isn't against the written rules. Loose interpretation of the rules (for personal gain) is what has taken our country to the mess we are in now. |
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 Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4557
Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | Most running who want the top of the ground will pay their entry fee at the last barrel to gaurantee to be in the first ten. You can argue that the first fifty get the best deal if you want. If your first or last if you can't run with the big dogs you need up your game. Train your horse. Feed your horse. And be able to ride and run against the best. The ground doesn't have anything do with winning. It's how you make your run.  |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | cow pie - 2014-08-14 5:27 PM Most running who want the top of the ground will pay their entry fee at the last barrel to gaurantee to be in the first ten. You can argue that the first fifty get the best deal if you want. If your first or last if you can't run with the big dogs you need up your game. Train your horse. Feed your horse. And be able to ride and run against the best. The ground doesn't have anything do with winning. It's how you make your run.
Additionally, if the entries are to be run by "random" draw, whether or not it is "specifically" stated in the rules, it is cheating to CHANGE that draw.......Why do you suppose they ask for the horse's name? Why do you suppose they HAVE a "random draw"? To make it fair for EVERYONE ????? Not just the one's who consider themselves "special" ????
Edited by NJJ 2014-08-14 5:46 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 448
Location: lone star state | I don't feel its cheating. At the really big jackpots the ground is not an issue any more. The producers in my area have gone to great lengths to ensure a fair playing field for everyone who enters. I agree that people who sell horses may use the system to misrepresent horses but as a competitor i don't see it as cheating and agree with the many different reasons already mentioned as why a competitor would enter and not put a horses name. |
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Husband Spoiler
Posts: 4151
Location: North Dakota | I guess I am just too busy worrying about myself to care when someone runs. I guess if I was tired of getting my butt handed to me by this same person over and over I would find some excuse for why they are beating me...lol. But honestly if this person was some no name from down the road that brought 5 backyard pets that all were lucky to even place in the bottom of the 4D would you notice? Or care? There is a lady around here that runs a few horses in the exact same order at every run and because most of our local runs aren't very big she is ALWAYS in the first drag (she is usually first or 2nd out) on one certain horse. Do I care? Nope! Not one bit. It doesn't effect me any. I am there to do MY best and not care when someone else runs. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| Yikes... like I said if it really bothered me I would have said something a long time ago... Was just curious if there are rules like that out there because it seems like there would be. And if there is not, well I know how to enter my horses next time. Haha!
And for the record, I have congratulated this person I am talking about in the past about some results I had seen that showed her young/green horse as winning the barrel race and she laughed it off and said oh no that was my good horse I ran in his spot. I don't think she thinks much of it, but seems a little off to me for results to be posted incorrectly like that. |
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Location: stumbling around BHW | NJJ - 2014-08-14 5:44 PM
cow pie - 2014-08-14 5:27 PM Most running who want the top of the ground will pay their entry fee at the last barrel to gaurantee to be in the first ten. You can argue that the first fifty get the best deal if you want. If your first or last if you can't run with the big dogs you need up your game. Train your horse. Feed your horse. And be able to ride and run against the best. The ground doesn't have anything do with winning. It's how you make your run.
Additionally, if the entries are to be run by "random" draw, whether or not it is "specifically" stated in the rules, it is cheating to CHANGE that draw.......Why do you suppose they ask for the horse's name? Why do you suppose they HAVE a "random draw"? To make it fair for EVERYONE ????? Not just the one's who consider themselves "special" ????
but everyone is running on the hard pan, the deep dirt, the mud. They do not swap arena conditions. after the first 50 or so, its all deep anyway..I have sat through 700 horses running to think I was gonna draw a check and have the last horse come in and move it and win it and put me out of the money in one of the lower Ds....It was joe be jammin in Shelbyville TN about 15 years ago...those other 700 horses did not mean squat...HE WON IT...lets face it...there are days when your just out horsed...get over it, go home and ride more and harder..I am more hacked off, when I am the reason my horse gets outrun...not when someone outruns me...lol..
Edited by msrockinrhard 2014-08-14 7:56 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1226
| I have seen this at local jackpot but never at big races. Most of the producers make you put a horses name down. But I guess that doesn't mean just cause a horses name is down you can just swap them out. Especially if you don't use registered names |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| heidiinaz - 2014-08-14 8:24 PM
I have seen this at local jackpot but never at big races. Most of the producers make you put a horses name down. But I guess that doesn't mean just cause a horses name is down you can just swap them out. Especially if you don't use registered names
They can and they do. |
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Just Bring It - 2014-08-14 5:47 PM
I guess I am just too busy worrying about myself to care when someone runs. I guess if I was tired of getting my butt handed to me by this same person over and over I would find some excuse for why they are beating me...lol. But honestly if this person was some no name from down the road that brought 5 backyard pets that all were lucky to even place in the bottom of the 4D would you notice? Or care? There is a lady around here that runs a few horses in the exact same order at every run and because most of our local runs aren't very big she is ALWAYS in the first drag (she is usually first or 2nd out) on one certain horse. Do I care? Nope! Not one bit. It doesn't effect me any. I am there to do MY best and not care when someone else runs.
^Exactly..... I'm way too busy getting ready for my run to give a rip what anyone else does. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| Ground was to hard, ground was to soft.... |
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 Expert
Posts: 1440
Location: Texas | Get over it. There are more serious things in The world to be worried about! Sorry having a BAD day and this whole topic seemed juvenile |
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 Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | I really could care less if someone swaps their horse. I think a horse that is running/turning hard enough to win isn't going to be that bothered by being 5th on the dirt. It's kinda whatever. Honestly, I don't look at what everyone writes as their horse's name... 9 times out of 10 I write T-Bo, not "Flamboyant Flit". Not to cheat equistat...I really don't care about equistat, I don't know if producers even use it around here, and I will never sell T-Bo anyway.
But for argument sake I looked up the flier of the last barrel race I entered. Here's what it had to say about the matter, "MULTIPLE HORSE RIDERS MUST RIDE THE HORSES IN THE ORDER AS LISTED ON ENTRY FORM & POSTED IN THE DRAW OR YOU WILL BE DISQUALIFIED." This sounds like if you list 2 horses, they will put your runs in that order. Problem solved.
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | msrockinrhard - 2014-08-14 7:55 PM NJJ - 2014-08-14 5:44 PM cow pie - 2014-08-14 5:27 PM Most running who want the top of the ground will pay their entry fee at the last barrel to gaurantee to be in the first ten. You can argue that the first fifty get the best deal if you want. If your first or last if you can't run with the big dogs you need up your game. Train your horse. Feed your horse. And be able to ride and run against the best. The ground doesn't have anything do with winning. It's how you make your run.
Additionally, if the entries are to be run by "random" draw, whether or not it is "specifically" stated in the rules, it is cheating to CHANGE that draw.......Why do you suppose they ask for the horse's name? Why do you suppose they HAVE a "random draw"? To make it fair for EVERYONE ????? Not just the one's who consider themselves "special" ???? but everyone is running on the hard pan, the deep dirt, the mud. They do not swap arena conditions. after the first 50 or so, its all deep anyway..I have sat through 700 horses running to think I was gonna draw a check and have the last horse come in and move it and win it and put me out of the money in one of the lower Ds....It was joe be jammin in Shelbyville TN about 15 years ago...those other 700 horses did not mean squat...HE WON IT...lets face it.. .there are days when your just out horsed...get over it, go home and ride more and harder..I am more hacked off, when I am the reason my horse gets outrun...not when someone outruns me...lol..
All of this but mainly the highlighted part!! My feelings exactly. |
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 Queen Boobie mascot
Posts: 706
Location: Mayerthorpe Alberta | Just pondering what happens at the big races where there is a short go or two runs making an average. How do you know the correct horse is running in the short go, or places correctly in an average?
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | lurker - 2014-08-15 8:28 AM Just pondering what happens at the big races where there is a short go or two runs making an average. How do you know the correct horse is running in the short go, or places correctly in an average?
They put hip numbers on them before you run. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| barrelbasher - 2014-08-14 10:55 PM
Get over it. There are more serious things in The world to be worried about! Sorry having a BAD day and this whole topic seemed juvenile
Then maybe you didn't need to post and could have kept your negative comments to yourself?
Asking about the rules of a barrel race on a barrel racing forum seems pretty legit to me.
Hope you have a better day. |
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 Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | I haven't read through all the responses. Is it cheating? Maybe, maybe not. I want to run two horses this weekend. But if I do I HAVE to run one horse first, then the other horse second. However, I did not pre enter the first horse. So both horses will be add ons. And I don't think I would be allowed to demand that they put a certain horse before the other, and I refuse to enter as horse 1 and horse 2. So I am only running one horse. I can't run the other horse first because he needs special attention afterwards, and i get frazzled over it.
But rather then blame the rider, blame the producer as well. They are the ones allowing it. NBHA won't allow it on the east coast. Even at our local shows (east coast shows), if you didn't name your horse on the entry they won't put you in the draw until you do. At least if you are running multiples. But at the local shows I have usually been able to ask for my second horse to be put on the very end. Just don't want to ask that at a big show. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes. |
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The Worst Seller Ever
Posts: 4138
Location: Oklahoma | CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes.
Although that is not how I viewed the OP, it is a valid question. No one is jumping on you. There is no reason to get upset or hurt over it.
ON the internet no one can read how the question would come from your mouth, so you ahve to read between the lines and interrput. You were given reasons and our thoughts.. |
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Expert
Posts: 2457
| CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM
It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes.
welcome to the internet darling :) everyone has an opinion!
Chin up, it is a legit question and a fairly interesting one in my opinion to see what everyone said. It's Friday and you have a fabulous weekend stretched in front of ya! Please don't let the opinions of some ruin your day. There will always be people on here that are crabby and post negative things. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 415
| clover girl - 2014-08-15 2:14 PM
CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes.
Although that is not how I viewed the OP, it is a valid question. No one is jumping on you. There is no reason to get upset or hurt over it.
ON the internet no one can read how the question would come from your mouth, so you ahve to read between the lines and interrput. You were given reasons and our thoughts..
Yep, I get it. Some posts were a little cray cray in my opinion, though, so I just wanted to make my point a little more clear. 
...and I just figured out how to get to more than just the 9 emoji deals that show up on my screen, so something useful came from this. LOL... jk, I found many posts to be very informative, and the rest to be rather interesting. |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas |  |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:21 PM
clover girl - 2014-08-15 2:14 PM
CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes.
Although that is not how I viewed the OP, it is a valid question. No one is jumping on you. There is no reason to get upset or hurt over it.
ON the internet no one can read how the question would come from your mouth, so you ahve to read between the lines and interrput. You were given reasons and our thoughts..
Yep, I get it. Some posts were a little cray cray in my opinion, though, so I just wanted to make my point a little more clear.
...and I just figured out how to get to more than just the 9 emoji deals that show up on my screen, so something useful came from this. LOL... jk, I found many posts to be very informative, and the rest to be rather interesting.
WARNING:
On the radio this morning I heard they added the word "cray" to the Oxford English Dictionary as an abbreviated word of crazy. It is in the dictionary now.
Carry on. |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | oija - 2014-08-15 2:44 PM CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:21 PM clover girl - 2014-08-15 2:14 PM CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes. Although that is not how I viewed the OP, it is a valid question. No one is jumping on you. There is no reason to get upset or hurt over it.
ON the internet no one can read how the question would come from your mouth, so you ahve to read between the lines and interrput. You were given reasons and our thoughts.. Yep, I get it. Some posts were a little cray cray in my opinion, though, so I just wanted to make my point a little more clear. ...and I just figured out how to get to more than just the 9 emoji deals that show up on my screen, so something useful came from this. LOL... jk, I found many posts to be very informative, and the rest to be rather interesting. WARNING: On the radio this morning I heard they added the word "cray" to the Oxford English Dictionary as an abbreviated word of crazy. It is in the dictionary now. Carry on.
Nuh uh! What is up with them adding all these made up slang words? Most of them don't stay in use more than 2-3 years. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | When I was running NBHA years ago, if someone was running more then one horse, when entering they would pick what horse was running when, and had to run in that order that they enter their horses, if they ran them out of order for some reason then there was a problem. I cant remember what was done about it, but it was our Dist. rule at the time, I'm sure its all been changed by now.
I could care less on what horse was ran when, I just do my own thing and stay out of others business. |
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Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | Three 4 Luck - 2014-08-15 2:46 PM
oija - 2014-08-15 2:44 PM CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:21 PM clover girl - 2014-08-15 2:14 PM CheckItOut - 2014-08-15 2:10 PM It is certainly interesting to hear everyone's opinions. However, let me just be clear that I was purely asking if there are rules against this or not, because I do not know, but it seems like there would be, and in turn would make it "cheating"... and if there are rules(which it seems like maybe there are some places, and maybe there are not at others) are they really ever enforced? Or is it "no big deal". Thanks again for the useful responses to my question. This was a post about RULES AT BARREL RACES... and I think it was a relevant question. Of course I am more concerned about my run and my horses, but I did have a question on the RULES and this seemed like a good place to ask, but maybe I was wrong on that part! Yikes. Although that is not how I viewed the OP, it is a valid question. No one is jumping on you. There is no reason to get upset or hurt over it.
ON the internet no one can read how the question would come from your mouth, so you ahve to read between the lines and interrput. You were given reasons and our thoughts.. Yep, I get it. Some posts were a little cray cray in my opinion, though, so I just wanted to make my point a little more clear. ...and I just figured out how to get to more than just the 9 emoji deals that show up on my screen, so something useful came from this. LOL... jk, I found many posts to be very informative, and the rest to be rather interesting. WARNING: On the radio this morning I heard they added the word "cray" to the Oxford English Dictionary as an abbreviated word of crazy. It is in the dictionary now. Carry on.
Three4Luck, the OED is a 'descriptive' dictionary, meaning its more focused on tracking the use of any word that has meaning at some point in the history of the English language, even if for only a short time. 'Prescriptive' dictionaries are usually more concerned with telling us how we should use things and do not have slang. However, because of the OED's approach in 100 years if someone were to look at the this discussion they would be able to still look up the meaning of that word and know what it meant (if context didn't tell them). Darn useful if you think ahead. |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | Wow, learn something new every day. I had no idea there were different types of dictionaries. |
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Angel in a Sorrel Coat
Posts: 16030
Location: In a happy place | Oh mylanta!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Hmm...Cheating? Or no big deal?: