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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1159
  
Location: Southeast Georgia | Just curious what everyone's thoughts are on this. Would you breed to a cryptorchid? That is if the horse had good conformation, breeding, etc? Thanks! |
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 Saint Stacey
 
| No. Being a cryptorcid is a defect so why would I knowingly breed to something that is bad? There are simply too many full packages out there for breeding with good testicals. Not to mention that cryptorcids tend to have fertility problems since the testical is too high up which causes the body heat to fry the sperm and kill it. |
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | SKM - 2014-09-11 7:27 AM No. Being a cryptorcid is a defect so why would I knowingly breed to something that is bad? There are simply too many full packages out there for breeding with good testicals. Not to mention that cryptorcids tend to have fertility problems since the testical is too high up which causes the body heat to fry the sperm and kill it.
Yep. |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | SKM - 2014-09-11 5:27 AM No. Being a cryptorcid is a defect so why would I knowingly breed to something that is bad? There are simply too many full packages out there for breeding with good testicals. Not to mention that cryptorcids tend to have fertility problems since the testical is too high up which causes the body heat to fry the sperm and kill it.
 it's really too bad the cutting/reined cowhorse world doesn't feel this way. |
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 Bulls Eye
Posts: 6443
Location: Oklahoma | There are a couple of well known thoroughbreds who are cryptorchid... and have sired numerous winners (A.P. Indy) |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | Nope. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| Nope. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1159
Location: Southeast Georgia | TwistedK - 2014-09-11 8:06 AM
There are a couple of well known thoroughbreds who are cryptorchid... and have sired numerous winners (A.P. Indy)
Yep. And Freedom Flyer was. James Ranch also stood Invitation Only & sold him for $2.35 million at the world sale & he was a crypt. |
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Saint Stacey
| soquinn - 2014-09-11 8:09 AM TwistedK - 2014-09-11 8:06 AMThere are a couple of well known thoroughbreds who are cryptorchid... and have sired numerous winners (A.P. Indy) Yep. And Freedom Flyer was. James Ranch also stood Invitation Only & sold him for $2.35 million at the world sale & he was a crypt.
Edited by SKM 2014-09-11 9:49 AM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 928
Location: Northern CA | Sure wouldn't. |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | SKM - 2014-09-11 9:45 AM
soquinn - 2014-09-11 8:09 AM TwistedK - 2014-09-11 8:06 AMThere are a couple of well known thoroughbreds who are cryptorchid... and have sired numerous winners (A.P. Indy) Yep. And Freedom Flyer was. James Ranch also stood Invitation Only & sold him for $2.35 million at the world sale & he was a crypt. JMHO but that still doesn't make it right to knowingly pass on a genetic defect. The whole purpose behind breeding is to improve the breed. Breeding a defect is not improving the breed. There was a time when you were not allowed to breed cryptorcids or parrot mouthed horses. Unfortunately AQHA was sued for that rule and lost.
Exactly. People do it, but it's not right. We should focus on reproductive success and performance, not just performance. Why knowingly pass on reproductive defects?? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1159
Location: Southeast Georgia | SKM - 2014-09-11 10:45 AM
soquinn - 2014-09-11 8:09 AM TwistedK - 2014-09-11 8:06 AMThere are a couple of well known thoroughbreds who are cryptorchid... and have sired numerous winners (A.P. Indy) Yep. And Freedom Flyer was. James Ranch also stood Invitation Only & sold him for $2.35 million at the world sale & he was a crypt. JMHO but that still doesn't make it right to knowingly pass on a genetic defect. The whole purpose behind breeding is to improve the breed. Breeding a defect is not improving the breed. There was a time when you were not allowed to breed cryptorcids or parrot mouthed horses. Unfortunately AQHA was sued for that rule and lost.
I'm not saying it's right, I was just stating the fact that those horses were. I bet there are a lot of studs standing right now who are crypt & that people breed to them & never know. With AI & shipped semen the standard these days it just make it's too easy.
I rode a crypt for a lady once & sold it for her. The buyer accidentally let him out with one of her mares before she could have the surgery done on him & after he bred the mare the other testicle dropped, stayed dropped, & they were able to geld him normally. She was lucky! Lol.
I've also heard that depending on the type of crypt that a vet can administer a muscle relaxer & sedative & it will allow the other one to drop. That just because a horse has one still up doesn't mean he's a true crypt. Anyone ever heard of this? |
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You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | It probably depends on how close it is to the inguinal canal and if its partially through the inguinal ring or if its truly still in the abdomen. I would think it may work on those who are aallllmmmooossttt dropped but not the truly abdominal ones. Testes start their descent right next to the kidneys, and they can get stopped at any part of the way down. |
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Saint Stacey
| There's two rings that the testicals drop through. When they don't drop through either, that's when it's a problem. We bought a 3 year old pony that was still intact. One was dropped and one was in the body cavity. The normal one was about the size of a golf ball. The raised one was slightly large than a large lima bean. If you can give drugs and they drop, that isn't a true crypt. There is no way Caesar's ever would have dropped. Hence why it was so small and sterile. |
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 Expert
Posts: 4625
Location: Desert Land | I would not breed to a true crypt (knowlingly). I know in the halter/pleasure world if they are a true crypt they do a plastic surgery implant to create the look of having both testicles - very wrong & decieving!!!
Now if it's a stallion that only has one testicle because of a situation like an inguinal hernia, that would not bother me. I have a friend who has a stallion that had that happen and he lost a testicle from the surgery. My weanling colt from this year just had this done 2 weeks ago. One of my colt's testicles was strangulated, so they had to remove it. I would have been OK with the vet gelding him but during an emergency surgery and we hadn't talked about it prior, he left the one in tact in case I was purposely keeping him a stallion. |
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| I guess if it was a super proven (produced a lot of good runners), had good conformation and attitude I would. I wouldn't on anything else. The stallion would have to be pretty much perfect for me to do it. The reason being is the baby has a high chance go being a crypt and I don't want the chance that the baby might need surgery before it even runs barrels. I think the odds are against breeding without problems, so why would I risk creating one for myself. |
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | Yep. If I liked the pedi it wouldnt bother me at all. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2161
Location: NW. Florida | I had a son of Freedom Flyer he was also a cryptorchid. He was a gelding when I bought him, but his vet records were in the file the owner gave me and there was a copy of bill from the surgery.
I would take another gelding in a heartbeat by Freedom Flyer.
There used to be a stud advertised on this site that was cryptorchid, luckily he's no longer on the site. It also was not disclosed he was cryptorchid. |
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 Northern Chocolate Queen
Posts: 16576
Location: ND | Nope |
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 Firecracker Dog Lover
Posts: 3175
| H-E- Double Hockey sticks no. It's a defect that is hereditary.
Edited by brlraceaddict 2014-09-11 2:38 PM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1094
Location: Florida | Nope! I believe in only breeding the best of the best which doesn't incude "defects" he may be nice but why risk it. |
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 The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | I wonder how many people that are against it are breeding their mares (via shipped semen) to a stallion they have never seen in person? How do these same people know they aren't (unknowingly) breeding to a crypt? To answer the original question, ABSOLUTELY NOT!! |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Nope. |
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Miracle in the Making
Posts: 4013
| no and he should be castrated it painfull for them |
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 Keep those crap slapping tails away!
Posts: 8871
Location: Around here somewhere... | No, I would not knowingly breed to one, and if I had one he'd be gelded no matter his breeding, etc. The ENTIRE purpose of being is to better the breed. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 898
Location: Mountains of VA | RacingQH - 2014-09-11 10:11 PM I wonder how many people that are against it are breeding their mares (via shipped semen) to a stallion they have never seen in person? How do these same people know they aren't (unknowingly) breeding to a crypt? To answer the original question, ABSOLUTELY NOT!!
I wouldn't breed to one either but with that said, how many people are breeding to stallions off of pictures when these pics can be "doctored" to hide conformation problems. Not to mention temperment, etc. Also, how many people are breeding mares with serious conformation/temperament problems that think these genetics faults are o.k. but being a crypt is a serious no-no? |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | How do I put this nicely......................EFF NO!!!!! |
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 BHW's Lance Armstrong 
Posts: 11134
Location: Somewhere between S@%&# stirrer and Saint | I had testicle cancer 25 years ago so I guess I could be considered a cryptorchid. LOL
Here is what I produced after wards. I would breed to a cryptorcid but I am biased.
 (4634_92110534742_827989742_1795158_2827019_n.jpg)
 (29499_1409552192693_1049128962_1231918_8249552_n[1].jpg)
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 4634_92110534742_827989742_1795158_2827019_n.jpg (40KB - 239 downloads)
29499_1409552192693_1049128962_1231918_8249552_n[1].jpg (56KB - 238 downloads)
29499_1409551952687_1049128962_1231917_1925660_n[1].jpg (73KB - 243 downloads)
IMG_5733.JPG (84KB - 217 downloads)
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 Queen Boobie 2
Posts: 7521
| Douglas J Gordon - 2014-09-12 12:53 PM I had testicle cancer 25 years ago so I guess I could be considered a cryptorchid. LOL
Here is what I produced after wards. I would breed to a cryptorcid but I am biased.
You're a 'mechanical crypt' not a genetic crypt LOL |
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BHW's Lance Armstrong
Posts: 11134
Location: Somewhere between S@%&# stirrer and Saint | bennie1 - 2014-09-12 12:54 PM Douglas J Gordon - 2014-09-12 12:53 PM I had testicle cancer 25 years ago so I guess I could be considered a cryptorchid. LOL
Here is what I produced after wards. I would breed to a cryptorcid but I am biased.
You're a 'mechanical crypt' not a genetic crypt LOL
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Expert
Posts: 4625
Location: Desert Land | RacingQH - 2014-09-11 8:11 PM I wonder how many people that are against it are breeding their mares (via shipped semen) to a stallion they have never seen in person? How do these same people know they aren't (unknowingly) breeding to a crypt? To answer the original question, ABSOLUTELY NOT!!
It is possible I have bred to a crypt and didn't know it. I have bred to and plan next year to breed to stallions I have not met in person. But I would not knowingly breed to one. |
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 Guys Just Wanna Have Fun
Posts: 5530
Location: OH | Not On Purpose. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | TheOldGrayMare - 2014-09-12 12:11 PM RacingQH - 2014-09-11 8:11 PM I wonder how many people that are against it are breeding their mares (via shipped semen) to a stallion they have never seen in person? How do these same people know they aren't (unknowingly) breeding to a crypt? To answer the original question, ABSOLUTELY NOT!! It is possible I have bred to a crypt and didn't know it. I have bred to and plan next year to breed to stallions I have not met in person. But I would not knowingly breed to one.
I would have to agree with this. If I knew, then no I would not breed to that stud, but there are a lot of things that AI can hide :/ |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
| I may be the odd man out here, but we stood a cryptorcid (Son of Special Effort) for years, who produced foals with proven track records. If you're considering breeding to a cryptorcid I would do my homework with that horse just like any other (what has the stud done, and what has he thrown). Remember 70% of your foal is your mare (or at least that's what they say)  |
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The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | hotpaints - 2014-09-12 10:23 AM RacingQH - 2014-09-11 10:11 PM I wonder how many people that are against it are breeding their mares (via shipped semen) to a stallion they have never seen in person? How do these same people know they aren't (unknowingly) breeding to a crypt? To answer the original question, ABSOLUTELY NOT!! I wouldn't breed to one either but with that said, how many people are breeding to stallions off of pictures when these pics can be "doctored" to hide conformation problems. Not to mention temperment, etc. Also, how many people are breeding mares with serious conformation/temperament problems that think these genetics faults are o.k. but being a crypt is a serious no-no?
Since you brought it up, I 1000% agree about breeding to a stallion based off of pictures. Especially "professional" pictures. I really wish photoshop had never been invented! That is one thing I like about some owners, sure, they may have professional pictures, but they also have "canded" pictures taken by themselves or employees, friends ect.. that they share on Fb or their website.
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