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 Georgia Peach
Posts: 8338
    
Location: Georgia |
Several weeks ago I breezed my mare through the pattern. This was technically her first "run" back since having a filly in the spring. Well the next day she came up a little sore in her hocks (older mare) so I buted her that night. The next afternoon I pull her out of the pasture, saddle her up and take her out to the arena for an easy workout. I warm her up, lope about 15 circles each direction and then get off only to notice that she is bleeding somewhat heavily out of one of her nostrils. I have had this mare for 8 years and she has never bled. However, this is the first time I have ever buted her and rode her the following day. Can someone tell me why this would happen?
* Note that I have always suspected this mare might be an internal bleeder. She has a small refusal issue at gate and always breaths heavy/rough after runs. I've just never taken the time to have her looked at.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1034
| In short, yes it can. | |
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Georgia Peach
Posts: 8338
Location: Georgia | HorseMommyFiveO - 2014-11-20 11:12 PM In short, yes it can.
Ok so what's the long answer? Why would this happen? | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 669
Location: Central Texas | Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM
Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed.
Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same.
I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet.
Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner"
I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers.
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 Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:26 PM ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same. I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet. Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner" I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers.
Edited by Herbie 2014-11-21 3:34 PM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Herbie - 2014-11-21 3:33 PM
cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:26 PM ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same. I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet. Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner" I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers.
Aspirin is a suppresses platelet aggregation therefore less clots are flowing around in the bloodstream. Nothing to do with thinning blood | |
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 Thick and Wavy
Posts: 6102
Location: Nebraska | cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:26 PM ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same. I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet. Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner" I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers.
bute inhibits both cox I and II, which is why it causes ulcers. Previcox, on the other hand, only works on Cox II which is why it doesn't cause ulcers. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 4121
Location: SE Louisiana | cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:59 PM
Herbie - 2014-11-21 3:33 PM
cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:26 PM ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same. I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet. Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner" I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers.
Aspirin is a suppresses platelet aggregation therefore less clots are flowing around in the bloodstream. Nothing to do with thinning blood
That must be what sassafras tea does.. | |
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Regular
Posts: 71
| Runninbay - 2014-11-21 1:04 PM
HorseMommyFiveO - 2014-11-20 11:12 PM In short, yes it can.
Ok so what's the long answer? Why would this happen?
Bute can make blood thin and increase your risk of a bleed on a horse with weak or thin blood vessels | |
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Too busy outside!
Posts: 5417
| cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 2:59 PM Herbie - 2014-11-21 3:33 PM cheryl makofka - 2014-11-21 3:26 PM ampratt - 2014-11-21 1:32 PM Yes it can. Basically, the same thing happened with my horse while on Bute and on Previcox. NSAID's will thin the blood, sometimes just enough to cause a bleed, from say a broken capillilary in the nostril etc. It has happened twice on my geldiing and the only thing different was that I gave him bute or he had been on Previcox for serveral days. He has allergies which caused some sinus issues, the NSAID thinned the blood and caused a bleed. If you suspect your mare is a bleeder then it is very possible the bute thinned the blood enough to cause an external bleed. Nothing thins blood. Blood is blood no one has thicker, no one has thinner, it is all the same. I have not read up on bute whether or not it can cause a horse to bleed into the lungs. This would be a question to discuss with your vet. Understand the clotting process, as it has to do with prostaglandins released to cause platelet aggregation, there are drugs that can suppress the prostaglandin from being releases, and there are drugs that suppress platelet aggregation. There are also drugs to cause blood to clot faster, but not to make blood "thinner" I do believe that bute also impacts mucosal production I believe it suppresses it somehow, and this is why bute can cause ulcers. Aspirin is a suppresses platelet aggregation therefore less clots are flowing around in the bloodstream. Nothing to do with thinning blood
eta: blood thinner = anticoagulant = supression of platelet aggregation. In the end the terms refer to the same thing, just using different terminology. :)
Edited by trickster j 2014-11-22 8:11 PM
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Too busy outside!
Posts: 5417
| To the OP- Thanks for this insight- I can't believe I never thought of the relation to bute and bleeding before- very interesting!  | |
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Expert
Posts: 1586
Location: west of East Texas | Could bute make one drool? I gave mine bute this morning and she drooled for about an hour afterward. I don't recall ever having one do this before. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1034
| Runninbay - 2014-11-21 1:04 PM
HorseMommyFiveO - 2014-11-20 11:12 PM In short, yes it can.
Ok so what's the long answer? Why would this happen?
Sorry, I was posting quickly while my baby was teetering on the evening cry. Lol! I'm not sure why. My friend just had to haul her horse to the vet and leave him there for a week. He had bled, and in the end the vet said it was from bute. I'd call the vet. | |
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Could bute make a horse bleed?