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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
    
Location: Kansas | I'm in a very heated debate with someone....and would like others opinions on this as well. Would you breed to a Great grandson of a big name sire, when the studs sire himself has no LTE...nor is he proven in the pen. He was basically bred to just be a stallion. Now this person who wants to keep this colt a stud....wants to make him "proven" then stand him at stud.
I'm in complete disagreement, I don't see how keeping a great gs would even be marketable, especially since big names would fall off the offspring papers. He tends to think that all the big name sires will eventually die, and wants to have this horse prove himself and start a new "trend".....I once again disagree.
What are your opinions? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 915
Location: SE KS | If the Great Grandson proves himself, then yes, I would breed to him, mostly because he has proven himself & does come from a proven line of horses. (Although, once proven I probably would not be able to afford to breed to him!!! lol) |
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| I think that breeding is tough tough even if your stallion is an own son of one of those great sires. There are plenty of sons of DTF and FG that don't get any outside mares because there are better options.
I also wanted to add that "Proven" is different for a lot of people. Some want to see earnings of $10k other expect to see $100K. And on top of that they want to see what the stallion produces. I honestly believe it takes 8-15 years to actually prove a stallion.
Edited by Whiteboy 2015-02-19 1:44 PM
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Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | Whiteboy - 2015-02-19 1:35 PM I think that breeding is tough tough even if your stallion is an own son of one of those great sires. There are plenty of sons of DTF and FG that don't get any outside mares because there are better options.
that is what I said. Also that most people would chose an own son, versus grandson/great grandson. |
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | Whiteboy - 2015-02-19 2:35 PM I think that breeding is tough tough even if your stallion is an own son of one of those great sires. There are plenty of sons of DTF and FG that don't get any outside mares because there are better options.
Agreed. |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | If that's his only claim to fame and he doesn't "prove" himself, no way in the world I would breed a mare to him because he's a great grandson of something that was a great sire. I look at the total pedigree of any horse I'm going to breed (including mares). If they have a great bottom side as well as a proven sire, I might give them a chance without being proven themselves. Full and half siblings count for them if they are proven as well. But without pedigree and proven parents (or themselves) it's tough to want to go there. But that's just my criteria. I don't breed to the neighbors stud just cause he's got a nice disposition or he's a pretty color. |
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Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9991
Location: Kansas | OregonBR - 2015-02-19 1:41 PM If that's his only claim to fame and he doesn't "prove" himself, no way in the world I would breed a mare to him because he's a great grandson of something that was a great sire. I look at the total pedigree of any horse I'm going to breed (including mares). If they have a great bottom side as well as a proven sire, I might give them a chance without being proven themselves. Full and half siblings count for them if they are proven as well. But without pedigree and proven parents (or themselves) it's tough to want to go there. But that's just my criteria. I don't breed to the neighbors stud just cause he's got a nice disposition or he's a pretty color.
thank you, I completely agree 100%! |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 964
Location: Alberta, Canada | We have a stud in our neck of the woods who is a grandson of a great. The sire is unproven with a weak maternal line and the dam is nothing special. His intro stud fee is ridiculous -- higher than some sons of great. I have a hard time digesting everytime I see his picture lol. |
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 Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | I wouldn't breed to him...
Especially if all they talked about was what the great grandsire or grandsire's record was. I could care less what they did, if anything. I look at the Sire, and the Dam. If neither one was great, I keep looking.
Raising foals is expensive. I would rather raise one that people would recognize His or Her OWN Sire and grandsire, rather than be like well your foal only had a good great great grandsire and great great great grandsire. And let's not forget the Mare. She's gotta be of good lineage as well. If the greats start falling off papers with babies... I'm out. That applies to buying a horse as well. If i have to look way back for something "good" I'm out. You want $750-2500 for the horse then yes I will consider buying it. But asking 10,000 for a great great of a great of a whatever?? Nope. I'm out. |
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Member
Posts: 18
| Depends on the dam side. To be a unproven grandson you better a have awesome dam side |
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 Night Chat Leader
Posts: 13150
Location: Home....Smiling M Farms | I would be tempted to be sneaky with scissors and blame it on a rogue donkey..... |
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 Namesless in BHW
Posts: 10368
Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | Whiteboy - 2015-02-19 1:35 PM I think that breeding is tough tough even if your stallion is an own son of one of those great sires. There are plenty of sons of DTF and FG that don't get any outside mares because there are better options.
I also wanted to add that "Proven" is different for a lot of people. Some want to see earnings of $10k other expect to see $100K. And on top of that they want to see what the stallion produces. I honestly believe it takes 8-15 years to actually prove a stallion.
^^^THIS |
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Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | Leo - 2015-02-19 3:30 PM I would be tempted to be sneaky with scissors and blame it on a rogue donkey.....
Bahaha Rogue Donkey LOL   |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1131
| Until such time that DTF and FG aren't still producing foals, then grand and great grand are basically pointless. The money will be in the own sons. They are so far back by Great Grand that they barely even count anymore. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2128
| jschipper - 2015-02-19 2:30 PM We have a stud in our neck of the woods who is a grandson of a great. The sire is unproven with a weak maternal line and the dam is nothing special. His intro stud fee is ridiculous -- higher than some sons of great. I have a hard time digesting everytime I see his picture lol.
I imagine so! There is a similar such case in my neck of the woods as well.  LOL |
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Great grandson stallion