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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| I'm starting to look into starting a boarding / training facility. And since you are all quite knowledgeable in the business I thought I'd ask your input. So THANK YOU in advance.
I have found a facility I am interested in starting a business in. It's been vacant for quite sometime but it's in my opinion the perfect set up. I heard from others that the previous owner had passed while the place was still in business. I would need to come up with a business plan and apply for a business loan. This is something I really do not know a whole lot about.
FACILITY:
Main Barn:
24 large box Stalls
60'x200' indoor arena
Tack Room
Feed Room
Wash Stall
Bathroom
Laundry Room
Lunch Area
Large Office
Viewing Lounge
Apartment upstairs (2bedroom, 1 bathroom, kitchen, dining, fireplace, living room)
Additional Barn with 29 stalls
3 car garage
3br Rambler Home
40 Acres
Oval dirt Track
Multiple Pens with shelters
I am a graphic designer so I can do all my own advertisement.
Plans for income:
Boarding
Feed Sales
Horse Training
Open Riding
Lessons
Raindrop treatments
Clinics
Rent Home or Apartment
Your thoughts? Your experiences?
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
 
| Do not go into debt for this venture. If you can do it without borrowing it would probably work, but horse business rarely make enough to service their debt. |
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
 
Location: PNW | Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 1:55 PM
Do not go into debt for this venture. If you can do it without borrowing it would probably work, but horse business rarely make enough to service their debt.
Exactly this!!!
And start your prices higher than you think. It's much easier to lower your prices than raise them. |
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
Location: PNW | And work with a good attorney and a good CPA. They are worth the $$ when starting up a business |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 1:55 PM Do not go into debt for this venture. If you can do it without borrowing it would probably work, but horse business rarely make enough to service their debt.
There is a reason why FSA won't underwrite equine loans very often, if ever. They will loan for enterprises that utilize cattle, sheep, pigs, other livestock ....
If you are dead set on doing this ... You might want to write the loan as a housing loan and explore options on operating loans through a commercial bank to buy feed and improvements. It will still look good to develop a business plan and go in there (the bank) knowing exactly what you want/need. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| lindseylou2290 - 2015-03-05 2:19 PM Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 1:55 PM Do not go into debt for this venture. If you can do it without borrowing it would probably work, but horse business rarely make enough to service their debt. There is a reason why FSA won't underwrite equine loans very often, if ever. They will loan for enterprises that utilize cattle, sheep, pigs, other livestock ....
If you are dead set on doing this ... You might want to write the loan as a housing loan and explore options on operating loans through a commercial bank to buy feed and improvements. It will still look good to develop a business plan and go in there (the bank) knowing exactly what you want/need.
The business plan exercise is good for you regardless. But when people come in to see me about borrowing money. The first thing I want to know is if they have ran the numbers on paper so they could see if there actually is money in it. On the financial side of it, start with your ideal projections and then cut your income by half and double your expenses. That will get you pretty close to what most horses business really do. If it still cash flows...then you may really have something! |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| I guess not really borrowing money for the business itself. The property is listed at $283,000 I would live there. It's a little steep for my current income. Especially if I plan on quitting my job and running a barn full time. |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | Noooooooooooooooooo!
if you have to rely on boarders to make your mortgage payment, don't do it.
Eta: saying this because I've seen so many of my friends get stuck trying to get the non-payers off their property.
Not only that, dealing with boarders is no picnic.
Edited by barrelracr131 2015-03-05 3:05 PM
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| 3Kis**** - 2015-03-05 2:40 PM I guess not really borrowing money for the business itself. The property is listed at $283,000 I would live there. It's a little steep for my current income. Especially if I plan on quitting my job and running a barn full time. Where is this located?
It actually sounds like a pretty good price from my perspective.
Edited by Whiteboy 2015-03-05 3:23 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| Wisconsin |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| 3KissHit - 2015-03-05 3:13 PM
Wisconsin
Where in Wisconsin? Could you host events there? Is there a strong community for horse-related activities? |
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Expert
Posts: 2457
| Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 2:32 PM lindseylou2290 - 2015-03-05 2:19 PM Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 1:55 PM Do not go into debt for this venture. If you can do it without borrowing it would probably work, but horse business rarely make enough to service their debt. There is a reason why FSA won't underwrite equine loans very often, if ever. They will loan for enterprises that utilize cattle, sheep, pigs, other livestock ....
If you are dead set on doing this ... You might want to write the loan as a housing loan and explore options on operating loans through a commercial bank to buy feed and improvements. It will still look good to develop a business plan and go in there (the bank) knowing exactly what you want/need.
Right you are - The financial Projections and Enterprise Budgets are what will help you rationalize the make it or break it point for yourself ... Cash Flows are monthly projections based on Enterprise Budgets that break down the epenses and incomes for different parts of the business. You can get real darn close to determinging your break evens and if they are even rational. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| Centrally located. There is a large horse community in the area. Not many indoors around so it might be a hot spot for winter riding. It could host events. Not especially large ones but clinics, playdays, dog shows, ect. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| Are there any success stories out there? haha.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1119
| Is it a "pretty" enough setting that you could host weddings and events of that nature? |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| I don't think so. Its not all that pretty haha! |
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 Bulls Eye
Posts: 6443
Location: Oklahoma | I have managed large boarding facilities in California. You will be married to the property. Forget about having a life. I was up watering arenas at 5am and dragging arenas by 6am so when the barn opened at 7am there were fresh dragged arenas. Feed check at 7:30 as the horses started getting fed at 7. I did checks on the horses every hour. My phone rang off the hook day and night. I lived on the property and my pay was my housing which was a 1 bedroom apartment in the middle of the property. Only other income coming in was from holding horses for the vet/farrier, lunging and turnouts, riding, blanketing and feeding supplements. I have a business plan saved somewhere on my computer. |
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 Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | Is there a way of making other income on the side at the site besides equine related? We are targeting sheep but have space in the plans for horses as well. It's a lot easier to get financing if it's for other type of livestock, even if it's only a small number to start. I agree with boarders, I watched a friend of mine chase all over the area after her boarders. I do board (1 currently) but only ever a few at a time and don't depend on it, it's extra. |
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 Googly Goo
Posts: 7053
| Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 3:00 PM 3Kis**** - 2015-03-05 2:40 PM I guess not really borrowing money for the business itself. The property is listed at $283,000 I would live there. It's a little steep for my current income. Especially if I plan on quitting my job and running a barn full time. Where is this located?
It actually sounds like a pretty good price from my perspective.
It does to me also. If you could lease it, it would sound even better.
Does it currently have any earnings or would you be starting from scratch? |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| It wouldn't be an extremely large operation. At max 15 boarders I'd say. I'd mainly like to buy, train, sell and take in outside training horses but for extra income take in boarders since I have the space. I could also hold open arenas. People around here aren't picky. In the area that the place is located its about 70 miles from the cities Minneapolis / St Paul. People will board farther away because its cheaper. I was looking for boarding with an indoor a few years ago. The place had a 60x60 unheated indoor arena with rock hard ground. The fences were that white tape electric fencing and most were hanging and broken. They had one stall for sick or injured horses and the barn was a mess. They were booked with people waiting at $350 for outside boarding. They said none of their boarders lived within 30 miles of the facility. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| ndiehl - 2015-03-06 12:33 PM
Is there a way of making other income on the side at the site besides equine related? We are targeting sheep but have space in the plans for horses as well. It's a lot easier to get financing if it's for other type of livestock, even if it's only a small number to start. I agree with boarders, I watched a friend of mine chase all over the area after her boarders. I do board (1 currently) but only ever a few at a time and don't depend on it, it's extra.
I could have cattle. I'm also a graphic designer and have been interested in starting a print shop on the side. There could be room for that. Other then that train, lessons, buying and selling. Possibly renting out one of the living areas. The house or apartment. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| TXBO - 2015-03-06 12:36 PM
Whiteboy - 2015-03-05 3:00 PM 3Kis**** - 2015-03-05 2:40 PM I guess not really borrowing money for the business itself. The property is listed at $283,000 I would live there. It's a little steep for my current income. Especially if I plan on quitting my job and running a barn full time. Where is this located?
It actually sounds like a pretty good price from my perspective.
Does it currently have any earnings or would you be starting from scratch?
starting from scratch. I'm trying to contact the owners about leasing....leasing to buy ect. |
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Googly Goo
Posts: 7053
| 3KissHit - 2015-03-06 12:39 PM It wouldn't be an extremely large operation. At max 15 boarders I'd say. I'd mainly like to buy, train, sell and take in outside training horses but for extra income take in boarders since I have the space. I could also hold open arenas. People around here aren't picky. In the area that the place is located its about 70 miles from the cities Minneapolis / St Paul. People will board farther away because its cheaper. I was looking for boarding with an indoor a few years ago. The place had a 60x60 unheated indoor arena with rock hard ground. The fences were that white tape electric fencing and most were hanging and broken. They had one stall for sick or injured horses and the barn was a mess. They were booked with people waiting at $350 for outside boarding. They said none of their boarders lived within 30 miles of the facility.
I'd rethink that.
If the going rate for a inferior boarding facility is $350, I'd charge $400 and fill up those 53 stalls. That brings your monthly recurring revenue to $21,200. I like my fixed costs to be less than 20% of total revenue. At the asking price of this property, you could do that.
Next, I would not make it an open arena. If I have the nicest faculity and you want to ride here, board here. |
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Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| If it helps I board 40 miles from the twin cities. I pay $235 for pasture board which includes grain 2x daily and hay (roundbales in winter & alfalfa/grass mix 3 flakes am/pm). It has a small indoor, outdoor and miles of trails.
Stall board is $350. This is a smaller boarding facility and is beautiful. Something you would see in a magazine. They feed supplements and will assist with blankets as they can. No one abuses this but do what they can.
ETA... I know a lot of people look for indoors during the winter. Just be cautious with your space and time. As a boarder, I would get aggravated if the arena was always packed when I pay for the facility. For example, we don't allow open rides at mine as our indoor is fairly small and more than 5 horses and its not even worth riding.
Edited by stayceem 2015-03-07 12:51 AM
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | 3KissHit - 2015-03-05 2:40 PM I guess not really borrowing money for the business itself. The property is listed at $283,000 I would live there. It's a little steep for my current income. Especially if I plan on quitting my job and running a barn full time.
Holy sheetcake. Where on God's green earth IS that? Around here you can't find a nice home on a 1 acre lot for that. |
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I am a Freak
Posts: 3326
Location: Nowhere Special | You may want to run a "dummy add" on craigs list and make sure you get enough interest in it first.. |
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 Sorry I don't have any advice
Posts: 1975
Location: Sunnyland Florida |
Looks like you neeed a success story - I have one. I bought/financed a boarding stable with 2 homes, a 17-stall barn w/barn apartment, etc. I personally owned 3 horses, so I rented out 14 stalls and I made a LOT of money; I kept the business 9 years. The key to success is management and organization. Also essential is an iron-clad boarding agreement and a "covenant not to sue" in place with each boarder. Only once in 9 years did I have a problem with a boarder not paying, and then I enforced my "boarding agreement" which stated her horse would become mine as "collateral" for the debt due. She hired an attorney, who told her to pay the debt and there was nothing she could do. She was banned from the premises and her horse was to be sold in 30 days to cover the board, according to the agreement. She showed up at the 21-day mark with cash for past-due board and removed the horse. That is the ONLY problem I ever had in 9 years.
It is a mentally-taxing business due to "people", but the money far outweighed the aggravation at that time in my life. Just the barn alone made my mortgage payment and paid 100% of my bills (including 2 car payments), utilities, etc., with a lot left over for savings.
I purchased this place at the bottom of the market - which happens to be where we are right now in the U.S. since the "boom". We're at the bottom of the market again, so it's a great time to buy and grow your business. If you're tired of it in 5 years, worst case -- you will be able to sell it with a profit. I doubled my money in 9 years.
My main question for you would be - is there an ample boarding market in the area you are looking to purchase it? If not, you may need to go under contract with a trainer and let them fill your barn.
Good luck with your decision.
Edited by Runaway 2015-03-07 1:12 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 306
| Runaway - 2015-03-07 11:21 AM
Looks like you neeed a success story - I have one. I bought/financed a boarding stable with 2 homes, a 17-stall barn w/barn apartment, etc. I personally owned 3 horses, so I rented out 14 stalls and I made a LOT of money; I kept the business 9 years. The key to success is management and organization. Also essential is an iron-clad boarding agreement and a "covenant not to sue" in place with each boarder. Only once in 9 years did I have a problem with a boarder not paying, and then I enforced my "boarding agreement" which stated her horse would become mine as "collateral" for the debt due. She hired an attorney, who told her to pay the debt and there was nothing she could do. She was banned from the premises and her horse was to be sold in 30 days to cover the board, according to the agreement. She showed up at the 21-day mark with cash for past-due board and removed the horse. That is the ONLY problem I ever had in 9 years.
It is a mentally-taxing business due to "people", but the money far outweighed the aggravation at that time in my life. Just the barn alone made my mortgage payment and paid 100% of my bills (including 2 car payments), utilities, etc., with a lot left over for savings.
I purchased this place at the bottom of the market - which happens to be where we are right now in the U.S. since the "boom". We're at the bottom of the market again, so it's a great time to buy and grow your business. If you're tired of it in 5 years, worst case -- you will be able to sell it with a profit. I doubled my money in 9 years.
My main question for you would be - is there an ample boarding market in the area you are looking to purchase it? If not, you may need to go under contract with a trainer and let them fill your barn.
Good luck with your decision.
Awesome! Finally a success story. I think its a great opportunity. |
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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7264
| I would run screaming from that but I ran a boarding facility years ago and it was a nightmare. You will be married to the place, it will be a 24/7 job and the people you will deal with....
It just wasn't my cup of tea.
Good luck though and keep us posted! |
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 Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | There are books about doing this kind of business, believe it or not. I saw them when I was starting a tack shop and was looking for info. Like you, I posted on here and everyone was helpful. Try Amazon for the books.
When I see successful boarding businesses, like the one person said, they are run right. They are organized and it's a nice place. They are also very active. One around here has a little tack shop on the premises and he's always holding events, even through the winter. You'll have to make sure you have enough dough to run it right. If you cut corners, people won't stay. Or come to your events. One drawback is people who abandon their horses. What if they don't pay and the horse is not worth anything? This is why I personally could not do boarding. I'd be feeding everyone's abandoned old or lame horses because I could never bring them to the sale and there'd go all my profits!
Good luck though. I hope your business plan shows you that this is something viable and you do something you love. |
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Expert
Posts: 2678
Location: Mi | As someone else said you will be married to the property and to forget about having a life. We have an indoor arena, outdoor arena, roping practice, 12 stalls, some boarders, bale and sell our own hay and a feed store. Its very demanding. Thankfully we have great boarders who understand our busy life and know things won't always be perfect there. Their horses will ALWAYS be taken care of. We can be sitting in our house at noon on a Sunday and someone will call wanting to come get feed. We are lucky to have great people to help us and great customers otherwise I wouldn't do it! |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | With that many stalls Id want to see a round pen and maybe another riding arena. I can see it getting crowded. Sounds like a cool opportunity. Just run your numbers. And consider hiring someone to clean stalls if you get a large volume of boarders. It takes longer than you think which is great if you have the time. What about upped water costs? Equipment to work the arena? Permits to operate such business in specific neighborhood? Will price of hay drastically fluctuate? Who will cover for you while you're on vacation? Holidays? Just food for thought. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1229
Location: Royal J Performance Horses, AZ | Not trying to steal the thread or anything but $400! to board?!?! monthly? Holy smokes
The going rate in arizona that is an average price is $225. and thats hay included
Is it jsut more pricey up north?
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Thoughts and Experiences Starting an Equine Business.....