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Location: Laramie, WY | I am looking for an alternate bit to try on my 5 year old that has more leverage and whoa, yet one to maintain rate with speed.
Has anyone tried the long gag 3 piece twisted wire/dog bone Merrill bit or Sherri Cervi twisted wire dog bone or plain twisted wire long shank? Would you recommend any others? Give me your input. Thanks.
I've been using a twisted wire short shank and its ok...just could use a little something different. He is very broke...and knows his job...Any Suggestions would be appreciated and helpful. Thanks.
Edited by WyodivaSS 2015-05-05 11:44 PM
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 Jr. Detective
   
Location: Beggs, OK | I would go with an Ed Wright Pretzel. They work well on broke horses and give you plenty of rate. |
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 Living within my means
Posts: 5128
Location: Randolph, Utah | rachellyn80 - 2015-05-05 11:28 AM
I would go with an Ed Wright Pretzel. They work well on broke horses and give you plenty of rate.
Love my pretzel but make sure to use soft hands. I really did not like the sherry cervi bits. Love the look of the Merrill bit but I haven't tried them. |
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Member
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Location: Laramie, WY | Thanks, I think I am going to try one of the Ed Wright Bits...I have the Cervi bit in a short shank and its not quite enough. Haven't tried the Merrill's but have gotten some feed back on Facebook. |
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 Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | rachellyn80 - 2015-05-05 12:28 PM I would go with an Ed Wright Pretzel. They work well on broke horses and give you plenty of rate.
Be careful with the pretzel bit. Some horses really don't like them at all. Ed put one on my horse, I used it for about 8 months. He ran good for a while but then went straight to SH*T! It ended up locking him up from the poll to the shoulder, and I couldn't get any flex or shape to him at all. Then he started shaking his head. 3 years later, I still at times, deal with the aftermath of that bit. I have tried to use it only to work on stopping (doing straight line work, no barrels or flex at all), when I put that bit in his mouth, you can literally feel him start to shake. I have had several reputable trainers tell me the pretzel bit is good at locking one up and making them stiff. Some do love it, don't get me wrong, just pay attention and don't use it, if your horse has ANY adverse effects. Don't do what I did and almost ruin an awesome horse. |
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Regular
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| i may try brittany pozzi's long shank lifter bit or molly powells rate and turn its very similar to ed wrights pretzel bit but you can get it with a chain to help with flexsion |
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Regular
Posts: 98
| i would also try molly powells long run with the long shank. its one of my favorite bits. you can get a lot of woah out of it. |
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | Bits get blamed for lots of physical issues as well though. If I was wearing my favorite earrings while carrying one of the babies around it wouldn't be accurate to say that the earrings had to be what made my neck sore. Especially if you didn't know that I had an underlying hip, knee, or soft tissue injury that I hadn't told you about.
If the Pretzel bit is used for what she is asking for, then it shouldn't be a problem. The problems come with heavy hands, too much tuning, and not listening to your horse when their telling you that they're hurting and you keep hammering on them. |
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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | People can put way too much value in a bit rather than in what fits their hands.
Many can use several bits and many can only ever use one.
There are several knock offs of the pretzel, like the Molly Powell rate and turn and Charmayne makes one (Charmayne has GOLDEN HANDS IMO) so I see there is nation wide value in the bit. I have seen local "trainers" almost literally flip their horse over using one. Tell -tell sign they dont really have any feel what so ever. So try it and see.
My husband is a true horseman and laughs at the delima of a barrel racers bit obsession but he bought one, he likes it so much, so we have two. But yes, it is not for everyone, nor is any bit.
Troy Flaharty is making a cool new bit that Latrica is touting on fb, you might look for it.
I have a Kathy James by L&W that has lots of leverage that I like, you might consider it as well.
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Member
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Location: Laramie, WY | I actually have a pretzel bit, however...he didn't really care too much for it. He threw his head up and didn't work well in it. I will look into the other bits suggested as well. Thanks. |
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Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | rachellyn80 - 2015-05-06 9:51 AM Bits get blamed for lots of physical issues as well though. If I was wearing my favorite earrings while carrying one of the babies around it wouldn't be accurate to say that the earrings had to be what made my neck sore. Especially if you didn't know that I had an underlying hip, knee, or soft tissue injury that I hadn't told you about.
If the Pretzel bit is used for what she is asking for, then it shouldn't be a problem. The problems come with heavy hands, too much tuning, and not listening to your horse when their telling you that they're hurting and you keep hammering on them. Well I try real hard to have very soft hands (not perfect all the time, but it is the most common thing on my mind at all times). And the fact that, in one ride with a different bit, he was a different horse (and not just with me, but the lady that trained him.. I sent him back to her to figure out what the issue was). She called me in one day, said he was fixed. When I dropped him off, I left him and my bit, per her request. She got on him with my bit (pretzel) and he was locked up from the poll to the shoulder, she could get no flex or bend out of him at all. She was only on him 5 minutes.. got off, put the bit she trained him in back on and he immediately relaxed, and within a couple of steps wash flexing and bending like normal. And the fact that if you put the pretzel bit back on him today, before you even ask him to move, he starts to shake and gets very nervous. Pretty sure it's the bit, not my earrings or my bad hip, knee or other ailment.
I do understand what you are saying and agree. But I know for sure it was the bit in this case, and just wanted to let them know to look for signs that I missed and as a result created some really bad, tough to break habbits. That is all.
Edited to add: I used the pretzel for the same reason, rate. And actually not so much for at the barrels, but to stop when coming out of the arena after the run home.
Edited by ACEINTHEHOLE 2015-05-06 10:45 AM
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Location: Laramie, WY | rachellyn80 - 2015-05-06 9:51 AM
Bits get blamed for lots of physical issues as well though. If I was wearing my favorite earrings while carrying one of the babies around it wouldn't be accurate to say that the earrings had to be what made my neck sore. Especially if you didn't know that I had an underlying hip, knee, or soft tissue injury that I hadn't told you about.
If the Pretzel bit is used for what she is asking for, then it shouldn't be a problem. The problems come with heavy hands, too much tuning, and not listening to your horse when their telling you that they're hurting and you keep hammering on them.
Thank you Rachellyn80, your right...and I am kind of a heavy handed rider...so I have to be careful what I use sometimes. |
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Location: Laramie, WY | Have any of you tried The MOLLY POWELL "FIRST BARREL" - LONG SHANK COMBINATION, 7/16" TWISTED SWEET IRON SNAFFLE?
7/16" Twisted Sweet Iron Snaffle. 10" Cheeks, 5½" Mouth. DESIGNED BY MOLLY POWELL. This is my favorite bit to run a horse that has a tendency to overrun the first barrel. This bit is unique as it has enough control to help you get tight barrel turns, and it is very well accepted by horses that may not be used to so much control. There is lots of "give" to this bit with the curved mouthpiece and the gag effect on the shanks. The first time, adjust the curb chain a little looser, then tighthen it accordingly for more control.
The first barrel has been my issue because he runs hard to first. Wondering if this bit may help more me...with riding him to first and getting our turns til I at least get with him better...? |
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Regular
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| Go take a look at the Fred Hunter bits. They are on www.thetackstop.com
He has 5 bits in his collection. I like the "Show to Win" bit. Every horse i have put it on loves it. :) |
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Location: Laramie, WY | trulyaroyaljem13 - 2015-05-06 10:57 AM
Go take a look at the Fred Hunter bits. They are on www.thetackstop.com
He has 5 bits in his collection. I like the "Show to Win" bit. Every horse i have put it on loves it. :)
I have the Show to Win bit too. Not sure its for my guy though. Will look at others. |
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Veteran
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Location: Heart of Texas | WyodivaSS - 2015-05-06 10:49 AM
Have any of you tried The MOLLY POWELL "FIRST BARREL" - LONG SHANK COMBINATION, 7/16" TWISTED SWEET IRON SNAFFLE?
7/16" Twisted Sweet Iron Snaffle. 10" Cheeks, 5½" Mouth. DESIGNED BY MOLLY POWELL. This is my favorite bit to run a horse that has a tendency to overrun the first barrel. This bit is unique as it has enough control to help you get tight barrel turns, and it is very well accepted by horses that may not be used to so much control. There is lots of "give" to this bit with the curved mouthpiece and the gag effect on the shanks. The first time, adjust the curb chain a little looser, then tighthen it accordingly for more control.
The first barrel has been my issue because he runs hard to first. Wondering if this bit may help more me...with riding him to first and getting our turns til I at least get with him better...?
I'm in the same boat as you. And i was going back and forth between the Molly Powell or the million dollar bit by Martha Josey? I wonder if anyone uses that one as well? |
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| WyodivaSS - 2015-05-06 10:49 AM
Have any of you tried The MOLLY POWELL "FIRST BARREL" - LONG SHANK COMBINATION, 7/16" TWISTED SWEET IRON SNAFFLE?
7/16" Twisted Sweet Iron Snaffle. 10" Cheeks, 5½" Mouth. DESIGNED BY MOLLY POWELL. This is my favorite bit to run a horse that has a tendency to overrun the first barrel. This bit is unique as it has enough control to help you get tight barrel turns, and it is very well accepted by horses that may not be used to so much control. There is lots of "give" to this bit with the curved mouthpiece and the gag effect on the shanks. The first time, adjust the curb chain a little looser, then tighthen it accordingly for more control.
The first barrel has been my issue because he runs hard to first. Wondering if this bit may help more me...with riding him to first and getting our turns til I at least get with him better...?
This bit has A LOT of leverage. If you are using a short shank twisted wire and it's ok but not great, I would think that this would be WAY to much bit, especially since you said you have a tendency to be a little heavy handed.
I love Carol Goosetree's line of bits. Especially the double gags. Depending on how much I need I use them with a leather curb or if I need a little more a chain curb.
You may also want to look into a jr cow horse bit.
Charmayne Jame's Leverage series is great too. I have a strong off the track gelding that really likes these.
ETA: You can get the Jr Cow Horse or something like it in several different shank lengths.
What ever you decide, keep in mind, the shorter the purchase and the longer the shank the more leverage you have. As your purchase gets longer and more even with the shank, the leverage starts to dissipate.
I find Greg Elliot's page a great reference for bit action and what each shank design should transfer to your horse.
http://www.elliottbitandspur.com/judy_myllymaki_bits.html
Edited by cyount2009 2015-05-06 11:40 AM
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Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | WyodivaSS - 2015-05-06 10:38 AM rachellyn80 - 2015-05-06 9:51 AM Bits get blamed for lots of physical issues as well though. If I was wearing my favorite earrings while carrying one of the babies around it wouldn't be accurate to say that the earrings had to be what made my neck sore. Especially if you didn't know that I had an underlying hip, knee, or soft tissue injury that I hadn't told you about.
If the Pretzel bit is used for what she is asking for, then it shouldn't be a problem. The problems come with heavy hands, too much tuning, and not listening to your horse when their telling you that they're hurting and you keep hammering on them. Thank you Rachellyn80, your right...and I am kind of a heavy handed rider...so I have to be careful what I use sometimes.
If that's the case, then skip the Pretzel. It's great to know what fits your hands! I have never been able to run a horse in an o-ring. I like hackamores on most of mine, but my daughter likes to have a little more bit than she needs just so that she can pick them up quickly if she has to. Everyone is different.
The Pretzel is not an everyday bit. We use it on my husbands roping horses and my daughter will use it on her mares some. It's just a great reminder for horses that want to get pushy, but if the rider has hands like a butcher then a horse is going to get numb in anything they put them in. |
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 Good Grief!
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Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | More bit isn't always the answer...try riding him in a snaffle.......it may helpM |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | mruggles - 2015-05-06 11:55 AM More bit isn't always the answer...try riding him in a snaffle.......it may helpM
I agree. That is the quandry. I used to only ride o-ring or sidepulls. Or very short shanked bits. I am light handed although not quick to release one. So I moved up to liking the feel of more bit so I could do less work on rate and shape. Now I just have to improve releasing my horse on the backside sometimes. |
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Duct Tape Bikini Girl
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| If a SS isn't enough, try the medium shank dog bone. It's a keeper. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 356
| TurnLane - 2015-05-06 12:04 PM
mruggles - 2015-05-06 11:55 AM More bit isn't always the answer...try riding him in a snaffle.......it may helpM
I agree. That is the quandry. I used to only ride o-ring or sidepulls. Or very short shanked bits. I am light handed although not quick to release one. So I moved up to liking the feel of more bit so I could do less work on rate and shape. Now I just have to improve releasing my horse on the backside sometimes.
I was at a clinic a couple weeks ago, and an interesting point was raised. Not all the time, but in certain situations, riding in a snaffle the majority of the time can create a habit of heavy handedness and/or pulling for the rider. I hadn't ever thought about it in those terms, but it makes a lot of sense to me. I will go back to a snaffle for certain exercises, but knowing my horse and myself, I could very well train myself to be a puller if I used a snaffle all the time! |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| k.maddocks24 - 2015-05-06 4:29 PM
TurnLane - 2015-05-06 12:04 PM
mruggles - 2015-05-06 11:55 AM More bit isn't always the answer...try riding him in a snaffle.......it may helpM
I agree. That is the quandry. I used to only ride o-ring or sidepulls. Or very short shanked bits. I am light handed although not quick to release one. So I moved up to liking the feel of more bit so I could do less work on rate and shape. Now I just have to improve releasing my horse on the backside sometimes.
I was at a clinic a couple weeks ago, and an interesting point was raised. Not all the time, but in certain situations, riding in a snaffle the majority of the time can create a habit of heavy handedness and/or pulling for the rider. I hadn't ever thought about it in those terms, but it makes a lot of sense to me. I will go back to a snaffle for certain exercises, but knowing my horse and myself, I could very well train myself to be a puller if I used a snaffle all the time!
I think the point she was making originally is that if you lighten up on one bit wise sometimes they will do better, even though everything is telling you the complete opposite. I've seen one being ridden in 329 Combination Steel Nose from L&w often called the Alpo bit or the bit of shame, but we've hung a large smooth o-ring on them and sometimes they will turn the tops outta them. |
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 I"m Jealous!
Posts: 1737
Location: Benton City, WA | WyodivaSS - 2015-05-05 9:40 PM Thanks, I think I am going to try one of the Ed Wright Bits...I have the Cervi bit in a short shank and its not quite enough. Haven't tried the Merrill's but have gotten some feed back on Facebook.
If you and he like the short shank SC bit, why don't you try the long shank Sherry Cervi? Once of my good horses runs in that bit with the twisted wire dog bone mouthpiece. Works great for us. I do have light hands in a run, its a lot of bit.
I think it all just depends on your hands, and the horse. My other good horse runs in an o ring snaffle, so I'll try just about anything as long as there's a reason for it. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | astreakinchic - 2015-05-06 3:36 PM k.maddocks24 - 2015-05-06 4:29 PM TurnLane - 2015-05-06 12:04 PM mruggles - 2015-05-06 11:55 AM More bit isn't always the answer...try riding him in a snaffle.......it may helpM I agree. That is the quandry. I used to only ride o-ring or sidepulls. Or very short shanked bits. I am light handed although not quick to release one. So I moved up to liking the feel of more bit so I could do less work on rate and shape. Now I just have to improve releasing my horse on the backside sometimes. I was at a clinic a couple weeks ago, and an interesting point was raised. Not all the time, but in certain situations, riding in a snaffle the majority of the time can create a habit of heavy handedness and/or pulling for the rider. I hadn't ever thought about it in those terms, but it makes a lot of sense to me. I will go back to a snaffle for certain exercises, but knowing my horse and myself, I could very well train myself to be a puller if I used a snaffle all the time! I think the point she was making originally is that if you lighten up on one bit wise sometimes they will do better, even though everything is telling you the complete opposite. I've seen one being ridden in 329 Combination Steel Nose from L&w often called the Alpo bit or the bit of shame, but we've hung a large smooth o-ring on them and sometimes they will turn the tops outta them.
I agree. I was just saying how it is so strange how the oppisite can be true. There are no absolutes, that is what keeps our sport interesting, IMO> |
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Location: Laramie, WY | barrel_racing_angel - 2015-05-06 3:56 PM
WyodivaSS - 2015-05-05 9:40 PM Thanks, I think I am going to try one of the Ed Wright Bits...I have the Cervi bit in a short shank and its not quite enough. Haven't tried the Merrill's but have gotten some feed back on Facebook.
If you and he like the short shank SC bit, why don't you try the long shank Sherry Cervi? Once of my good horses runs in that bit with the twisted wire dog bone mouthpiece. Works great for us. I do have light hands in a run, its a lot of bit.
I think it all just depends on your hands, and the horse. My other good horse runs in an o ring snaffle, so I'll try just about anything as long as there's a reason for it.
Yes, I'm going to try the Long shank twisted wire. I think since he likes the reg twisted wire short shank...the long shank with provide us with enough leverage.
I also would like to try this one...
MOLLY POWELL "SMOOTH RUN" - 7/16" TWISTED SWEET IRON SNAFFLE.
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Location: Laramie, WY | trulyaroyaljem13 - 2015-05-06 10:57 AM
Go take a look at the Fred Hunter bits. They are on www.thetackstop.com
He has 5 bits in his collection. I like the "Show to Win" bit. Every horse i have put it on loves it. :)
Didn't get to try him in the "Show to Win" bit yet, but I do have it. I did look at the other bits and see the Fuzz Bit with twisted wire is what I think I would try...he likes the twisted wire short shank gag bit Im using now and I think the longer shank will give us just what we need. Debating between The Fred Hunter one or the Sherri Cervi. |
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 Elite Veteran
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Location: TN | I went to a Molly Powell clinic recently and she put my horse in a long shank solid run bit (the chain mouth). He is super respectful of it. I've got plenty of bend, lift, and whoa and I can use light hands. Before that I had tried a short shank dog bone Cervi (I had to pull more in a run than I like) and an L&W combo bit with a tie down. Now I'm just using the solid run bit with no tie down and he's running much smoother. |
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 Extreme Veteran
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| Have you talked to Whitney about what to use on him? Call her and see what she has to say before spending the money on a bit that you aren't sure is going to work or not. |
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Member
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Location: Laramie, WY | WyodivaSS - 2015-05-08 6:34 AM
trulyaroyaljem13 - 2015-05-06 10:57 AM
Go take a look at the Fred Hunter bits. They are on www.thetackstop.com
He has 5 bits in his collection. I like the "Show to Win" bit. Every horse i have put it on loves it. :)
Didn't get to try him in the "Show to Win" bit yet, but I do have it. I did look at the other bits and see the Fuzz Bit with twisted wire is what I think I would try...he likes the twisted wire short shank gag bit Im using now and I think the longer shank will give us just what we need. Debating between The Fred Hunter one or the Sherri Cervi.
Yes, I finally did call her. We got it figured out and I'm going to try a combination bit with the chain mouthpiece and a bonnet with possibly using a tiedown. He's been working great, I just need a little bit more whoa and Control at the barrel turn. Especially at first barrel. I'll still a learning experience when running a five-year-old. Especially for me. Lol. |
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Barrel Bits recommended for more leverage/whoa/rate in a run