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Location: Cocoa, Florida | What do all the big name winning horses have in common? I'd like to get at least the top 10, confirmation pictures and breeding and study them, what makes them so special since they're all so obviously different? Louie is huge and wide, Bling is smaller and slender, Stingray is short, BabyFlo and Movin seem like smaller horses while Worm seems huge like Louie. So what makes them all so Great since they're all so different? Obviously they all have a huge heart!
So what do you all see that stands out to make them winners? |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
 
| I went to a barrel clinic that Lynn Mckenzie put on a few years ago. She had a woman there who had traveled the world taking conformation shots of world champions in a wide variety of performance events, from dressage, racing, H/J, cutting, reining and barrel racing. What she had to say was not what a lot of us wanted to hear, but I think she was right. She has a website you can order her ebook. My own opinion is she is dead on, but too many people get their feelings hurt when she tells it like she sees it. I know mine were a little but when I stepped back and looked and thought with my brain instead of my heart, she was right. Her name is Judy Wardrope and her site is www.jwequin.com. |
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 Good Grief!
Posts: 6343
Location: Cap'n Joan Rotgut.....alberta | One thing they all have is smart ppl managing them and a good vet and solid support team backing them.......and those horse have a lot of try and want to..they have to too make that many solid runs.....thats my 2 cents.....lol.....m |
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 Miss Laundry Misshap
Posts: 5271
| mruggles - 2015-06-02 8:18 AM One thing they all have is smart ppl managing them and a good vet and solid support team backing them.......and those horse have a lot of try and want to..they have to too make that many solid runs.....thats my 2 cents.....lol.....m
Agreed. It's the people and the programs they run that make the difference. |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| Heart....bottom line
and an owner with enough money to gamble traveling up and down the road if the horse can't pay the bills
other things...they will run through aches, pains, bad ground, and will make their run with just a lil help from their rider |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I agree the horse has to be put in the right hands and has to have the right mind, but ya'll don't think conformation doesn't play into it? This lady has some really different ideas on conformation, not so much straightness of the legs but angles and lines were what she was emphasizing. She talks about how different disciplines require different angles and lines and musculature. It was very different than what I learned for horse judging in 4H which was what Texas A & M was teaching us. I haven't read anything like her in other conformation books either. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I agree on the big heart and lots of want to, the right owner that knows how this horse thinks, they have to be that perfect team to compliment one another. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| GLP - 2015-06-02 9:22 AM
I agree the horse has to be put in the right hands and has to have the right mind, but ya'll don't think conformation doesn't play into it? This lady has some really different ideas on conformation, not so much straightness of the legs but angles and lines were what she was emphasizing. She talks about how different disciplines require different angles and lines and musculature. It was very different than what I learned for horse judging in 4H which was what Texas A & M was teaching us. I haven't read anything like her in other conformation books either.
Conformation has some to do with it,
But over the years there have been horses who are not conformationally correct that still win.
Conformation flaws can mean the horse is more prone to injury, and arthritis.
As someone said these people have a bank roll and a great vet to keep these horses sound, or some of these horses get retired early due to injury.
Proper management also helps these people understand these horses only have so many runs to give, they are not wasting them at small jackpots, etc. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | I don't think there is any set formula to finding a champion, but I do think there are some consistent factors.
1. Heart. If they don't have the will to win they won't.
2. Conformation. While their conformations vary greatly, they have to be built to stay sound. If they really want it they can sometimes overcome a less-than-idea build but sometimes it gets the better of them and they can't hold up to the physical stress.
3. A good training/care/vet team behind them.
4. Mental toughness. These horses have to be able to hold up to going down the road and heavy competition without getting burned out or turning into nervous wrecks.
Edited by cavyrunsbarrels 2015-06-02 10:06 AM
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | GLP - 2015-06-02 9:22 AM
I agree the horse has to be put in the right hands and has to have the right mind, but ya'll don't think conformation doesn't play into it? This lady has some really different ideas on conformation, not so much straightness of the legs but angles and lines were what she was emphasizing. She talks about how different disciplines require different angles and lines and musculature. It was very different than what I learned for horse judging in 4H which was what Texas A & M was teaching us. I haven't read anything like her in other conformation books either.
That is absolutely correct. While conformation is not the end all, be all, it is important. And there is a different "ideal" conformation for every discipline. What is desired in a Grand Prix dressage horse is nothing like a NFR Caliber barrel horse, or an Endurance champion. I wasn't in 4h but what if learned from watching friends and family in 4h is everyone rides stock horses and arabs and thats all the leaders tend to know about as well. Just google Valegro, who is arguably the best dressage horse of our time, and stingray and compare. Very VERY different yet masters at their sports. |
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | I posted a thread on here with 3 pictures of the 3 horses I'm currently running I'm going to post them again and just from confirmation am curious to see which one you think is the fastest. Don't answer if you know me lol.
Why is Bling so fast? I think she carries herself to high (I look at the way a horse moves first). She kind of brings her knees high and doesn't stride out but she's so amazingly fast she can over run barrels and still win the race. So what makes her such an extraordinary horse ? |
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 Ms. Poutability
Posts: 2362
Location: In my own world | They all have excellent jockeys. The end |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| RnRJack - 2015-06-02 10:56 AM
I posted a thread on here with 3 pictures of the 3 horses I'm currently running I'm going to post them again and just from confirmation am curious to see which one you think is the fastest. Don't answer if you know me lol.
Why is Bling so fast? I think she carries herself to high (I look at the way a horse moves first). She kind of brings her knees high and doesn't stride out but she's so amazingly fast she can over run barrels and still win the race. So what makes her such an extraordinary horse ?
you can go to her website and she has instructions on how to take conformation shots to send to her and she will evaluate your horses. I don't know how much it was though. She has analyzed numerous winning pro rodeo barrel horses to find out what they had in common, not what their differences were. |
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 Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | livinonlove&horses - 2015-06-02 11:21 AM
They all have excellent jockeys. The end
And they are all WAY out of my price range... but I don't fall in the excellent jockey category either. |
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boon
Posts: 3
| Champions all have the same thing in common, Gods plan for them. Both the horse and riders have that will and want to succeed. If you notice when those horses are coming down the ally their not shying away they are ready to go and work. Everywhere they go they are willing to work. The riders only have so little control of these great horses, but the rider effects the way the horse runs by their emotions so both horse and rider contribute to their victories.... |
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 Swiffer PIcker Upper
Posts: 4015
Location: Four Corners Colorado | GLP - 2015-06-02 7:13 AM I went to a barrel clinic that Lynn Mckenzie put on a few years ago. She had a woman there who had traveled the world taking conformation shots of world champions in a wide variety of performance events, from dressage, racing, H/J, cutting, reining and barrel racing. What she had to say was not what a lot of us wanted to hear, but I think she was right. She has a website you can order her ebook. My own opinion is she is dead on, but too many people get their feelings hurt when she tells it like she sees it. I know mine were a little but when I stepped back and looked and thought with my brain instead of my heart, she was right. Her name is Judy Wardrope and her site is www.jwequin.com.
I missed that clinic! I wish they would do another one! |
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Okay so hEres mine, Which one would you pick out to be the fastest and most athletic just by confirmation, roan, red or brown?
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | Personally I do not think you can pick who is fastest in any ones horse or better by just looking at conformation but thats my opinion  |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | GLP, the link is jwequine.com I couldn't get your other one to work. Interesting lady. |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| oija - 2015-06-02 1:35 PM
GLP, the link is jwequine.com I couldn't get your other one to work. Interesting lady.
Their used to be a man that came around in the TB industry that had a machine he'd like measure your horse with. Maybe some on here can remember his name? He gained popularity with the QH trainers as well. There is some truth to it but bottom line is even with imperfections one that wants to will get the job done regardless of confirmation and he'd tell you that. |
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | I'm just interested to kno which one of mine is the most "correct" |
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Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | astreakinchic - 2015-06-02 12:48 PM
oija - 2015-06-02 1:35 PM
GLP, the link is jwequine.com I couldn't get your other one to work. Interesting lady.
Their used to be a man that came around in the TB industry that had a machine he'd like measure your horse with. Maybe some on here can remember his name? He gained popularity with the QH trainers as well. There is some truth to it but bottom line is even with imperfections one that wants to will get the job done regardless of confirmation and he'd tell you that.
I generally agree. Heart can help one outperform conformational issues but only for so long.
The one thing I've noticed all the NFR horses have in common is 4 legs. :P
Edited: because sometimes my fingers are faster than my brain.
Edited by oija 2015-06-02 1:13 PM
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| oija - 2015-06-02 12:35 PM
GLP, the link is jwequine.com I couldn't get your other one to work. Interesting lady.
She is. She is not saying if your horse fits this mold it will be a winner- just that the conformation is an advantage. My sister ran the ugliest little horse that some of the girls made fun of to her face until she kicked their butt. But he had a rough life and had some things that were hard to overcome. Bad owner/training from the girl who owned and trained him. Consequently he wasn't really consistent. Bottom line- he fit Judy's conformation for a winner, but the training and rider before my sister got him handicapped him. If he had been started right and had a top jockey, he would have had a chance to be something. I believe a jam up rodeo barrel horse needs all 3- good conformation, great rider/trainer and heart/desire.
Edited by GLP 2015-06-02 1:18 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| oija - 2015-06-02 2:13 PM
astreakinchic - 2015-06-02 12:48 PM
oija - 2015-06-02 1:35 PM
GLP, the link is jwequine.com I couldn't get your other one to work. Interesting lady.
Their used to be a man that came around in the TB industry that had a machine he'd like measure your horse with. Maybe some on here can remember his name? He gained popularity with the QH trainers as well. There is some truth to it but bottom line is even with imperfections one that wants to will get the job done regardless of confirmation and he'd tell you that.
I generally agree. Heart can help one outperform conformational issues but only for so long.
The one thing I've noticed all the NFR horses have in common is 4 legs. :P
Edited: because sometimes my fingers are faster than my brain.
Well getting there and staying there are two completely different things.
Its why we see a futurity colt win the juvenile and never be heard from again. Some jockeys can get a horse there but have a problem keeping them there.
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| Ok I want to know which of those three is the fastest lol |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| scwebster - 2015-06-02 4:24 PM
Ok I want to know which of those three is the fastest lol
Where?
Do you want to know who is fastest in the straights? Or on the turns?
Whose faster on slick or sticky ground? Large outdoor or small indoor?
It will be different for all of the above mentioned and thats what makes this game so hard...
Some horses can turn horrible barrels and take your money every day of the week because they can run a hole in the wind.
Some horses will beat you in the turns and won't be very fast on the straights.
One that does both is hard to find a jockey that can stay with them without slowing them down to get a qualified run.
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| I would say most have...
Top care from the time they hit the ground.
Great trainers that know how to get the most out of each individual horse.
Great jockey.
Lots of heart and try. |
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Expert
Posts: 1561
| RnRJack - 2015-06-02 10:56 AM
I posted a thread on here with 3 pictures of the 3 horses I'm currently running I'm going to post them again and just from confirmation am curious to see which one you think is the fastest. Don't answer if you know me lol.
Why is Bling so fast? I think she carries herself to high (I look at the way a horse moves first). She kind of brings her knees high and doesn't stride out but she's so amazingly fast she can over run barrels and still win the race. So what makes her such an extraordinary horse ?
1-Red
2-Roan
3-Brown |
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I Really Love Jeans
Posts: 3173
Location: North Dakota | Great care from the beginning! A great handler from the beginning! A great trainer from around 2 years of age! Then a rider that knows how to ride! I believe people like Sherry Cervi and other top riders could take a grade average horse and build it into something special! Horses need to be ridden daily and correctly to be great horses! |
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 That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Sworls...or are they Whorles...I can never remember. |
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Itsme - 2015-06-02 3:54 PM
RnRJack - 2015-06-02 10:56 AM
I posted a thread on here with 3 pictures of the 3 horses I'm currently running I'm going to post them again and just from confirmation am curious to see which one you think is the fastest. Don't answer if you know me lol.
Why is Bling so fast? I think she carries herself to high (I look at the way a horse moves first). She kind of brings her knees high and doesn't stride out but she's so amazingly fast she can over run barrels and still win the race. So what makes her such an extraordinary horse ?
1-Red
2-Roan
3-Brown
The Roan mare is actually the fastest (right now) she had a very smooth very nice roundy turn style, BUT she is an idiot sometimes, needs lots and lots of time OFF of the pattern, has to be ridden 5-6 days a week or she blows up, even just exercising her. My friend is getting her back where she needs to be, I was just her jockey before an abcess that lasted months. Now we're back to square one.
The brown horse is mr. Consistent, is the most honest out of all of them and by far the easiest. Has a bug smooth stride, he consistently clocks 1 second off everywhere I go, I've won almost 10k on him in the last 6 years.
The red mare is only 5, she's super catty and gritty and is just now learning to run, she (conformation wise) always holds up the best, when the chiropractor comes she's never out of Wack, she has excellent muscling, but she's a little on the lazy side. She's running bred top and bottom but you wouldn't know it, her lackadaisical moods stun me. I have just started to breeze her a couple times a week and we're picking up the pace at the shows, she's running right on the brown horses tail already. So we'll see.
I guess I just really like to look at study the horses that are winning, what they use to feed, supplement, training programs etc. I don't have as much money as them but I put as much as I can into mine to keep them happy, healthy and sound.
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Nice website on JWequine.com so can you just send this lady your pictures or is this something you have to pay for? I don't really understand it? |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12838
| Consistent riders |
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Regular
Posts: 93
| There all a gift from God............................ |
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 Veteran
Posts: 246
Location: Idaho | A special horse matching up with the right rider at the right time. Confirmation to me, is like bloodlines. It increases your chances of success but does not guarentee it. A comfirmationally incorrect horse with a ton of heart and a God given ability to win ( that "they shouldnt be able to but they do" ability) ridden by their perfectly matched rider, will beat a confirmationally correct horse with all of the ability with the wrong rider, everytime. I personally believe a confirmationally correct horse will last most likely last longer but they are arent immune to injuies either. The way a horse is managed, which has been mentioned, plays a part too. Bottomline: the right rider with the right horse at the right time. Think about Charmayne and Scamper. Would anyone else have given him the opportunity? He was a little broncy, but Charmayne was his perfect match, Right rider on the right horse at the right time.... :) |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | What they have in common- the ability to run the pattern to the best of their physical ability the most efficient way possible.
there's not one right way or right style of barrel horse, which is why horses of different shapes and sizes can do so well.
We have three 1D mares. Not NFR material or anything, but they have been the top 3 at jackpots before, or 2 out of the 3 with one hitting, etc... Conformationally, they are all built differently, but have good foundations with no glaring irregularities with their bone structure in their legs or frames. Their body length and height is variable, and their degree of muscling is as well. One thing they have in common is their hocks are all low and angled, and their fetlocks are not too short or too long with no drastic angles. They have sloping shoulders and necks that match their body length. Their back lengths vary... Bunny is a longer mare, Hope is short coupled, and Lucy is in the middle.
All three of those mares have DIFFERENT running styles and all of them clock. Bunny is FAST, in and out of her turns, and is fast enough to clock and place with one decent mistake. Hope is a push type, makes the same run every time, efficient. Lucy is bendy bendy bendy, wraps herself around the barrels, is very snappy but it doesn't look that way when watching her. She's very smooth. Can also clock/place with one bad barrel, but not nearly like how Bunny can.
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 I hate cooking and cleaning
Posts: 3310
Location: Jersey Girl | I believe they have heart, a solid training program, good jockeys and money to support them. |
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Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | casualdust07 - 2015-06-03 7:23 AM
What they have in common- the ability to run the pattern to the best of their physical ability the most efficient way possible.
there's not one right way or right style of barrel horse, which is why horses of different shapes and sizes can do so well.
We have three 1D mares. Not NFR material or anything, but they have been the top 3 at jackpots before, or 2 out of the 3 with one hitting, etc... Conformationally, they are all built differently, but have good foundations with no glaring irregularities with their bone structure in their legs or frames. Their body length and height is variable, and their degree of muscling is as well. One thing they have in common is their hocks are all low and angled, and their fetlocks are not too short or too long with no drastic angles. They have sloping shoulders and necks that match their body length. Their back lengths vary... Bunny is a longer mare, Hope is short coupled, and Lucy is in the middle.
All three of those mares have DIFFERENT running styles and all of them clock. Bunny is FAST, in and out of her turns, and is fast enough to clock and place with one decent mistake. Hope is a push type, makes the same run every time, efficient. Lucy is bendy bendy bendy, wraps herself around the barrels, is very snappy but it doesn't look that way when watching her. She's very smooth. Can also clock/place with one bad barrel, but not nearly like how Bunny can.
I purchased my little red mare because I really liked her hocks, and the angles, she's just slightly cow hocked in back and has great muscling. She has a very short neck so she's not super bendy and small feet but I liked everything else about her. I hope she lasts me a while and gets faster |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 591
| angelica - 2015-06-02 2:37 PM
Great care from the beginning! A great handler from the beginning! A great trainer from around 2 years of age! Then a rider that knows how to ride! I believe people like Sherry Cervi and other top riders could take a grade average horse and build it into something special! Horses need to be ridden daily and correctly to be great horses!
Top riders won't waste their time with an average horse and hope it becomes great. They start with one that should be great, give it a few tries and if it ends up not being what they need, they move on. Most of those girls go through a lot of horses that never get written about to find the next one that can take them to the NFR. |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| 3 To Go - 2015-06-03 1:53 PM
angelica - 2015-06-02 2:37 PM
Great care from the beginning! A great handler from the beginning! A great trainer from around 2 years of age! Then a rider that knows how to ride! I believe people like Sherry Cervi and other top riders could take a grade average horse and build it into something special! Horses need to be ridden daily and correctly to be great horses!
Top riders won't waste their time with an average horse and hope it becomes great. They start with one that should be great, give it a few tries and if it ends up not being what they need, they move on. Most of those girls go through a lot of horses that never get written about to find the next one that can take them to the NFR.
^^^ yupp yupp Cervi was quick to snatch up Atlas for a reason. They have a full scale breeding operation churning out babies daily and keeping some to be futuritied by other riders but when that opportunity popped up she grabbed. There aren't many true 1D horses that have the heart and talent to get the job done.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1056
| TALENT.............. just like michael jordan......he wasn't bred to be an athlete. it just happened. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2013
Location: Piedmont, OK | I say heart, grit, salty! |
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 Ima Cool Kid
Posts: 3496
Location: TN | My 2 Cents
Training, alethetic ability, & heart. with out all 3 you have an average horse |
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What do all the Winning NFR horses have in common?
