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 Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
   
Location: Louisiana | I'm working to get T-Bo back in shape and we've been doing a good bit of long trotting to burn off some fat. I was just wondering how far everyone goes? 2 miles, 5 miles, etc? What do you start at and what do you ultimately build up to? I have a large field and plenty of wooded trails now that we've moved. So were stuck in a small arena anymore.
Feel free to toss out any other routines y'all do to stay in shape!! Once he builds a little more muscle and wind I would like to start breezing him once or twice a month also. Right now we're focusing on the "beer belly" lol. He had a couple months off due to a hot hot hot summer and skin allergies.
Thanks!!! |
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 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6437
 
Location: Montana | My typical ride is about 2 miles, and I would say I trot about half of that, the other I lope or walk, and occasionally breeze. Sometimes I go longer, it just depends on how much time I have. I have done as much as 4 miles trotting, give or take, but feel that that is a little excessive. I'd say, JMO, 2 miles would be a good amount. I'd start out with less, maybe a half to 1 mile of long trotting, and build up from there. Again, JMO. |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | Thanks! I do a LOT of walking. I set my gps the other day and we went 4 miles during a 30 minute ride. He was psychotic that day and I ended up just letting him run off a little steam. So we went farther than normal bc we were going faster than normal lol.
A friend of mine trots hers about 4 miles. Not daily, but fairly often. And he is lean and has a huge stride.
I guess I feel like I can walk 3 miles like it's nothing. My horse has 4 legs and probably should go further than me. |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | 2 miles is really nothing for a horse to long trot. If yours is super fat and out of shape, that would maybe be the most I would go the first few times. I walk mine a bit and then pick up a trot, once they are feeling good and wanting to move out we go to the long trot and I just pick a trail and go and go. I usually go by my horse. If they are starting to puff or sweat quite a bit, I'll let them walk again or back down to a slow trot. |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | wyoming barrel racer - 2015-08-30 5:35 PM
2 miles is really nothing for a horse to long trot. If yours is super fat and out of shape, that would maybe be the most I would go the first few times. I walk mine a bit and then pick up a trot, once they are feeling good and wanting to move out we go to the long trot and I just pick a trail and go and go. I usually go by my horse. If they are starting to puff or sweat quite a bit, I'll let them walk again or back down to a slow trot.
I do believe the reason I'm not clocking is bc the top girls have horses in top shape. I'm a half second off and he has a gut and so do I. So we're gonna change that!!
I say we're a half second off... I've gained about 20 lbs and I can honestly say we're consistently .8- .9 off now. So apparently it matters!!
Thank you! |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | dashnlotti - 2015-08-30 4:53 PM wyoming barrel racer - 2015-08-30 5:35 PM 2 miles is really nothing for a horse to long trot. If yours is super fat and out of shape, that would maybe be the most I would go the first few times. I walk mine a bit and then pick up a trot, once they are feeling good and wanting to move out we go to the long trot and I just pick a trail and go and go. I usually go by my horse. If they are starting to puff or sweat quite a bit, I'll let them walk again or back down to a slow trot. I do believe the reason I'm not clocking is bc the top girls have horses in top shape. I'm a half second off and he has a gut and so do I. So we're gonna change that!! I say we're a half second off... I've gained about 20 lbs and I can honestly say we're consistently .8- .9 off now. So apparently it matters!! Thank you!
I'm with you! Totally agree. My horses have all been out for an injury of one sort or another. If I ever get one I can long trot on I will be in heaven lol. My gut needs the exercise as much as my fatties sitting in pasture do. |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| I walk for about 10 minutes- long trot to 3 or 4 songs- usually around 15 minutes, walk 10 minutes then repeat long trotting with a little loping, walk to cool down. It is usually around 6 miles and takes about an hour. I do this 3 times a week. |
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Miracle in the Making
Posts: 4013
| when i was able to ride we long troted about 1 or 2 miles of which i locked knees and balanced in the hot georgia sun coming back to work 5 day a week and a blow or breeze on thurs to pump air in them
i treated them like at the track only i long troted instead of galloped i personally think u can have to to much with no engery left for weekends
afterall we were barrel racing not endurance riding just my 02 |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1118
Location: The South | Perfect timing for this thread, I'm just starting to get mine back in shape too! It was just too dang hot this summer, I threw in the towel. |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | LindsayJordan84 - 2015-08-30 6:56 PM Perfect timing for this thread, I'm just starting to get mine back in shape too! It was just too dang hot this summer, I threw in the towel.
Well not only did the humidity make me wanna pass out, it was T-Bo's first time being out in it. He's always had a stall and a fan. He didn't do well. He dropped weight, was beat down, got a sunburn. It was terrible. We got him some shade and a fan and he started to pick back up. But during all that I didn't ride him for 6-8 weeks. I put him on Animal Element Detox about 10 days ago and I can already see a difference. He is shiny again!! I sent a funny pic of him to my friend just now and she commented how good he looked. Made me get the warm and fuzzies hahaha!
I definitely don't push them in this heat. If they tell me they're hot, we quit. But as long as they're breathing good and ready to go, we keep going. Bc one day it might be 85 but the humidity is so high you can't breath. Friday evening it was hot but the humidity wasn't bad so they were fine. They sweated a lot but weren't breathing too hard. Sweat is good when you're trying to lose weight lol.
Another 2 weeks and I'll switch it up to start building more muscle. I have a small log I can pull, hills to work, stuff like that.
I always like like to hear others' routines bc there are so many ways to approach fitness and be successful!
Thanks for all the input!! |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| rodeomom3 - 2015-08-30 6:50 PM
I walk for about 10 minutes- long trot to 3 or 4 songs- usually around 15 minutes, walk 10 minutes then repeat long trotting with a little loping, walk to cool down. It is usually around 6 miles and takes about an hour. I do this 3 times a week.
^^Something very similar to this. I never had any leg problems and had plenty of run for the rodeos.^^ |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | vjls - 2015-08-30 6:54 PM
when i was able to ride we long troted about 1 or 2 miles of which i locked knees and balanced in the hot georgia sun coming back to work 5 day a week and a blow or breeze on thurs to pump air in them
i treated them like at the track only i long troted instead of galloped i personally think u can have to to much with no engery left for weekends
afterall we were barrel racing not endurance riding just my 02
I appreciate different views!! I know sometimes I wonder what else I can do to get that burst of speed. But I do think at this point in my routine longer amounts of cardio are needed. To burn off the excess fat if nothing else. He is fat lol. Not obese, but needs to lose some.
I welcome all opinions!! Most things with my horses is a big hodge podge of techniques I've learned from various friends, trainers, pros, and of course BHW lol. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | dashnlotti - 2015-08-30 7:02 PM vjls - 2015-08-30 6:54 PM when i was able to ride we long troted about 1 or 2 miles of which i locked knees and balanced in the hot georgia sun coming back to work 5 day a week and a blow or breeze on thurs to pump air in them
i treated them like at the track only i long troted instead of galloped i personally think u can have to to much with no engery left for weekends
afterall we were barrel racing not endurance riding just my 02 I appreciate different views!! I know sometimes I wonder what else I can do to get that burst of speed. But I do think at this point in my routine longer amounts of cardio are needed. To burn off the excess fat if nothing else. He is fat lol. Not obese, but needs to lose some. I welcome all opinions!! Most things with my horses is a big hodge podge of techniques I've learned from various friends, trainers, pros, and of course BHW lol.
When I ran cross country in high school we would do stairs part of the week, sprints etc part and for our mid week runs we would go 4 miles plus. At our meets we only ran 3 miles so it was like an easy day. The longer runs during the week built us up, not tire us out. But you can over do it too, so I get what she was saying about being barrels not endurance. I just think it would take a lot to over do a horse. Our ranch horses can go all day and then some. They do 10 miles before lunch, usually a long trot gathering. Then stop for lunch and let them rest and drink and then trail cows home at a walk. I would bet they prefer the arena with me any day of the week |
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 Professional Amateur
Posts: 6750
Location: Oklahoma | I don't keep track of miles, but I keep track of my workout time (ETA - I ride for at least an hour per horse). I do a lot of walking / trotting and will throw in some loping all in an effort to build up stamina. I will also breeze in order to give them that sprint like they will feel during an actual competition run. The breezing also helped the Child Gone Wild to get a comfort of a horse actually running and get her over the fear of that run from the alley to the first barrel.
I don't base the "fat gut" on if they are in shape. I have some that just keep a gut and when I've had them in tip top shape and no gut - they don't clock. I'm not sure. But, a few of my "Oklahoma Fat Girls".. run tough a little chubby. They get the same exercise as the rest of the crew, but they LOVE their full figures.
Edited by Pocob 2015-08-31 12:44 PM
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 Go Your Own Way
Posts: 4947
Location: SE KS | good topic -
can you long trot to far?
Do you feel this affects their joints?
SOme vets believe only 1 1/2 is needed, after that, it is a stress on their joints?
what are the opinions out there? |
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 Leggs
Posts: 4680
Location: lexington KY | I have always used Marlene McRae's program and it has never failed me. I agree that 2 miles really isnt much for a horse. I like my horses to be in very good condition and a 30 minute program of continuous work doesnt take a lot of time, but this program gets the job done. I dont sprint that often but I do open my horse up a few times a month for a short distance.
http://www.horsechannel.com/horse-experts/western-horse-training-advice/faster-barrel-racing-time.aspx
Having a well-conditioned athlete is the first step to getting your horse to run to his maximum ability. I like to work my horse every day for the first eight weeks of training, and then decrease the training to four days a week. The distance I train and the pace I go are the secrets to a well-conditioned horse that has the ability to run faster during a barrel racing competition.
Condition your horse in long, straight lines whenever possible, as circles are physically hard on a horse. Here is my conditioning program broken down into each step:
• Trot one mile
• Lope one mile on one lead
• Lope one more mile on the opposite lead
• The fourth mile: Long trot the first half mile then slow trot the last half mile.
NOTE: Do not walk in between paces.
This totals four miles, which I feel is the optimum distance for building a well-conditioned equine athlete in barrel racing or any event. I want to keep the heart rate up and work it, then bring the heart rate slowly back down. Every third day, I sprint my horse after the third mile in a straight line for about 400 yards.
You will be impressed how your horse’s muscle tone will change with this type of conditioning program. Before long, you will find that your horse feels like running and will be quicker around the turns and faster in the straightaways. |
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Red Hot Cardinal Fan
Posts: 4122
| polorunner - 2015-08-31 2:36 PM I have always used Marlene McRae's program and it has never failed me. I agree that 2 miles really isnt much for a horse. I like my horses to be in very good condition and a 30 minute program of continuous work doesnt take a lot of time, but this program gets the job done. I dont sprint that often but I do open my horse up a few times a month for a short distance.
http://www.horsechannel.com/horse-experts/western-horse-training-advice/faster-barrel-racing-time.aspx
Having a well-conditioned athlete is the first step to getting your horse to run to his maximum ability. I like to work my horse every day for the first eight weeks of training, and then decrease the training to four days a week. The distance I train and the pace I go are the secrets to a well-conditioned horse that has the ability to run faster during a barrel racing competition.
Condition your horse in long, straight lines whenever possible, as circles are physically hard on a horse. Here is my conditioning program broken down into each step:
• Trot one mile
• Lope one mile on one lead
• Lope one more mile on the opposite lead
• The fourth mile: Long trot the first half mile then slow trot the last half mile.
NOTE: Do not walk in between paces.
This totals four miles, which I feel is the optimum distance for building a well-conditioned equine athlete in barrel racing or any event. I want to keep the heart rate up and work it, then bring the heart rate slowly back down. Every third day, I sprint my horse after the third mile in a straight line for about 400 yards.
You will be impressed how your horse’s muscle tone will change with this type of conditioning program. Before long, you will find that your horse feels like running and will be quicker around the turns and faster in the straightaways.
Thanks for posting this! Very informative.
Does anyone who is an Ed Wright junkie remember what he recommends for conditioning? I've been to a couple clinics and can't remember.
I will add that I work my horses very similar to this, but also a couple days a week I don't travel this far of a distance. When loping, I'll ask them to extend out and step it up a notch compared to a collected lope, but not fully breezing them out. Breezing depends on the horse I'm riding. One I breeze a couple times a week to get freed up, another doesn't need that. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 725
| Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good. |
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Professional Amateur
Posts: 6750
Location: Oklahoma | I won't breeze in a gravel road. I do it in a safe environment and one I won't stone bruise my horse.
IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 6:04 PM
Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 6:04 PM
Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
NO |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 5:04 PM Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
No good way to stone bruise, have one mis-step and fracture, road founder. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| I had a mare who had hurt her stifles and i had to mare sure that she was in shape to run and she could trot her a?? off. So every soring i would long trot her. But i had to mare sure i would lope her some otherwise she would get winded when she ran. More long trot but canter or lope some. |
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Leggs
Posts: 4680
Location: lexington KY | countrygirl2006 - 2015-08-31 3:54 PM polorunner - 2015-08-31 2:36 PM I have always used Marlene McRae's program and it has never failed me. I agree that 2 miles really isnt much for a horse. I like my horses to be in very good condition and a 30 minute program of continuous work doesnt take a lot of time, but this program gets the job done. I dont sprint that often but I do open my horse up a few times a month for a short distance.
http://www.horsechannel.com/horse-experts/western-horse-training-advice/faster-barrel-racing-time.aspx
Having a well-conditioned athlete is the first step to getting your horse to run to his maximum ability. I like to work my horse every day for the first eight weeks of training, and then decrease the training to four days a week. The distance I train and the pace I go are the secrets to a well-conditioned horse that has the ability to run faster during a barrel racing competition.
Condition your horse in long, straight lines whenever possible, as circles are physically hard on a horse. Here is my conditioning program broken down into each step:
• Trot one mile
• Lope one mile on one lead
• Lope one more mile on the opposite lead
• The fourth mile: Long trot the first half mile then slow trot the last half mile.
NOTE: Do not walk in between paces.
This totals four miles, which I feel is the optimum distance for building a well-conditioned equine athlete in barrel racing or any event. I want to keep the heart rate up and work it, then bring the heart rate slowly back down. Every third day, I sprint my horse after the third mile in a straight line for about 400 yards.
You will be impressed how your horse’s muscle tone will change with this type of conditioning program. Before long, you will find that your horse feels like running and will be quicker around the turns and faster in the straightaways.
Does anyone who is an Ed Wright junkie remember what he recommends for conditioning? I've been to a couple clinics and can't remember.
I will add that I work my horses very similar to this, but also a couple days a week I don't travel this far of a distance. When loping, I'll ask them to extend out and step it up a notch compared to a collected lope, but not fully breezing them out. Breezing depends on the horse I'm riding. One I breeze a couple times a week to get freed up, another doesn't need that.
You're welcome! I have tried other programs but always come back to this one. My horses perform on this program. |
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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | I will try to get Aceinthehole to give a recap of her recent discussion with a new vet. It was interesting to say the least.
Compared to the rest of these posts- I can say I am a minimalist. I have been using the EquiTrack app since day one so I do find it helpful. But when I worked at the track- they never went miles and miles per day even on the TBs. So I dont know what is the right thing?
I ride nearly every single day but it averages 3 miles per day with warm up, trot, lope and fast work and cool down.
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | TurnLane - 2015-09-01 4:12 PM
I will try to get Aceinthehole to give a recap of her recent discussion with a new vet. It was interesting to say the least.
Compared to the rest of these posts- I can say I am a minimalist. I have been using the EquiTrack app since day one so I do find it helpful. But when I worked at the track- they never went miles and miles per day even on the TBs. So I dont know what is the right thing?
I ride nearly every single day but it averages 3 miles per day with warm up, trot, lope and fast work and cool down.
Yep, I tracked our mileage yesterday and today and we went about 3 miles both ways. Yesterday we rode trails and long trotted on the good ground, about a mile and a half total. Today I just rode around the field with a half mile walk, mile and a half trot/ long trot, then about three quarters of a mile loping. We didn't lope at all yesterday.
Both days they were blowing pretty good but not just wiped out/over exerted. They still felt good when we stopped.
Edited by dashnlotti 2015-09-01 9:43 PM
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 Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | TurnLane - 2015-09-01 4:12 PM I will try to get Aceinthehole to give a recap of her recent discussion with a new vet. It was interesting to say the least.
Compared to the rest of these posts- I can say I am a minimalist. I have been using the EquiTrack app since day one so I do find it helpful. But when I worked at the track- they never went miles and miles per day even on the TBs. So I dont know what is the right thing?
I ride nearly every single day but it averages 3 miles per day with warm up, trot, lope and fast work and cool down.
While talking to Dr. Nichols at Marietta Vet in Marietta, OK.. He said you should never long trot your horses. First off, he says "what part of the barrel pattern do you trot?". Second he says in order to get your horses long term fiber muscles to fire off, you need to lope with bursts of speed, even if short distances, if you trot to warm your horse up, you get the short acting muscle fibers to fire and your horse will run slower. He says "like begets like". Third thing is he says trotting your horses is the worst possible exercise on their bodies, not only is it extrememly hard on joints, but it is just as hard on their muscles. Jog trotting here to there, he says is fine, but there is really no reason to ever long trott distances, just causes too much damage to the body.
So while having this conversation with him, I asked about soft tissue rehab, how they tell you to trott for so long (be it minutes or miles) and work your way up to loping. He said to just lope, it will do the same for the tissue and is easier on the rest of the body.
Also he said to talk to race horse trainers.. see how much "trotting" they do.... little to none. They train with loping and adding bursts of speed, then back to a slower pace, with bursts of speed, and back down.. but not really any significant trotting.
Edited by ACEINTHEHOLE 2015-09-02 9:38 AM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 364
| Here's an excerpt from an article I found, written by Lisa Lockhart...
'...I do a lot of long trotting. I wouldn't say that I keep track of the miles or anything like that, but I try to judge what my horses need by the experience of being an athlete myself. I start out slow and then long trot a lot, and then graduate to loping. In order to make sure their wind is built up, I think you need to lope your horses. Now with that said, it is a proven fact that long trotting exercises more muscles in the horse's body than just loping.
I try to do a lot of riding at both the long trot and the lope. Depending on how rushed I am, I would say that from the time I leave the barn to the time I come back is somewhere between 25 and 45 minutes. Of course, that allows time to warm up just walking and then time for the horse to cool down. You don't want to jump out and start on a stringent exercise program that is too much for your horse. You need to build up to the maximum workout times. Just make sure you incorporate all gaits in your workout.
I also really like to turn my horses out and allow them to have enough pasture time to keep them happy. Turn-out time helps them relax...
...If you're wondering if your horse is in good shape, you need to assess how winded he gets when working out. If you can lope a horse to build their stamina and then, every once in a while, go maybe a quarter of a mile at a faster lope, you are covering your bases. You have to gauge your horse and see how long you have to ride to get him to sweat or get their breathing labored....' |
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BHW's Simon Cowell
Location: The Saudia Arabia of Wind Energy, Western Oklahoma | None. I was always told by some very good vets that the trot is the hardest gait on a horse. Walk or lope for me. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 669
Location: Central Texas | polorunner - 2015-08-31 2:36 PM
I have always used Marlene McRae's program and it has never failed me. I agree that 2 miles really isnt much for a horse. I like my horses to be in very good condition and a 30 minute program of continuous work doesnt take a lot of time, but this program gets the job done. I dont sprint that often but I do open my horse up a few times a month for a short distance.
http://www.horsechannel.com/horse-experts/western-horse-training-advice/faster-barrel-racing-time.aspx
Having a well-conditioned athlete is the first step to getting your horse to run to his maximum ability. I like to work my horse every day for the first eight weeks of training, and then decrease the training to four days a week. The distance I train and the pace I go are the secrets to a well-conditioned horse that has the ability to run faster during a barrel racing competition. Condition your horse in long, straight lines whenever possible, as circles are physically hard on a horse. Here is my conditioning program broken down into each step: • Trot one mile • Lope one mile on one lead • Lope one more mile on the opposite lead • The fourth mile: Long trot the first half mile then slow trot the last half mile. NOTE: Do not walk in between paces. This totals four miles, which I feel is the optimum distance for building a well-conditioned equine athlete in barrel racing or any event. I want to keep the heart rate up and work it, then bring the heart rate slowly back down. Every third day, I sprint my horse after the third mile in a straight line for about 400 yards. You will be impressed how your horse’s muscle tone will change with this type of conditioning program. Before long, you will find that your horse feels like running and will be quicker around the turns and faster in the straightaways.
This is what I was looking for to post. I have it on my fridge and it seems like a really good conditioning program. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| If trotting is so bad then why do endurance horses last so long in their sport? I realize it's comparing apples to oranges, but these vets make it sound like trotting is bad for all horses if done for more than a minute or two. How do you strengthen their bones and ligaments/tendons? Trotting has always been an important step in getting my horses in shape. Once I feel that I have done my long slow distance conditioning, then I progress to a more event specific conditioning program with more loping and less trotting, but still do some trotting. I have had no major leg issues going this but I am always open to new techniques/knowledge. |
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Miracle in the Making
Posts: 4013
| TurnLane - 2015-09-01 5:12 PM I will try to get Aceinthehole to give a recap of her recent discussion with a new vet. It was interesting to say the least.
Compared to the rest of these posts- I can say I am a minimalist. I have been using the EquiTrack app since day one so I do find it helpful. But when I worked at the track- they never went miles and miles per day even on the TBs. So I dont know what is the right thing?
I ride nearly every single day but it averages 3 miles per day with warm up, trot, lope and fast work and cool down.
i am with you i rgalloped quarters at in calif for the best trainerin the country we long troted to wire galloped around the track pulled up on backside long trot back
walked past gates
they were fit i treated my barrel horses same tey went friday night 1 run rodeo saturday depending where 3 runs and possible sunday too
they were sound winning and placing
course now i sdit on m,y butt bored out o my gourd
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 462
Location: Louisiana | I too am working on getting one in condition. Recently while at Dr. Cliff Honnas in Bryan, Texas he told me work up to 20 minutes of long trotting. |
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Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | GLP - 2015-09-02 1:09 PM If trotting is so bad then why do endurance horses last so long in their sport? I realize it's comparing apples to oranges, but these vets make it sound like trotting is bad for all horses if done for more than a minute or two. How do you strengthen their bones and ligaments/tendons? Trotting has always been an important step in getting my horses in shape. Once I feel that I have done my long slow distance conditioning, then I progress to a more event specific conditioning program with more loping and less trotting, but still do some trotting. I have had no major leg issues going this but I am always open to new techniques/knowledge. Very much comparing apples to oranges. In endurance for horses to be successful, they must have good oxygen use .. meaning they can recover and reoxygenate their bodies much more efficent than your normal QH or TB, they also must have a type of muscling that allows them to cover ground low and quick.. so more muscled towards the slow twitch muscles that can function aerobically. If you have fast twitch muscle horse such as the QH or TB they won't be successful at endurance and will be left in the lurch and tiring as the distance increases (this inablility to recover will also lead to injury). This is why Arabians are the main horse for edurnance.. they have great use of oxygen to the muscles and they get rid of metobolic waste through the liver efficiently, which is also important for muscle health. But they also have to go through a soundness check every so many miles and LOTS of them are eliminated from races for soundness issues as well. But the better the body can recover will help, no matter what gait, to maintain soundness... QH and TB just aren't capable of this efficiently.
Edited by ACEINTHEHOLE 2015-09-02 2:06 PM
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| So, when you are just getting a horse in shape, say he has been out on pasture and hasn't been ridden in several months, what do you do to get those tendon/ligaments and bones in shape? If I decide I don't need to do a lot of trotting in the beginning, it sure would help these aging joints of mine! I just worry about making sure the tendons and ligaments are as strong as they can be before I start stressing them with smaller circles/turns. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | I think you can talk to 10 vets and 5 will tell you one thing and 5 will tell you another. I will say that in 35 yrs of having horses and mostly long trotting them-even as a kid. We have never had a lameness or injury that was caused by riding. I have had plenty of wire cuts and pasture injuries. These ranch horses are not in good shape in the spring when we start to calve. Ours sit most of the winter getting fat and lazy. We start off long trotting on day 1 and it takes a good 2 hrs to see the whole pasture. They start off every day feeling fresh and in about 5 days are in pretty darn good shape. They are starting to muscle up and have excellent wind. In 2 weeks they are as hard as any race horse. I'll stick with what works and what keeps my horses injury free. Lisa Lockhart is a rancher so I imagine that same type of program is why she also agrees with long trrotting.
Let them try and cripple themselves out in pasture on their own. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | Just a thought too. I have talked to many that are in the raising of race horses and they say that a small % of the race horses (QH's) are in actually good enough shape to be in a race. They say that is why you see so many injuries. We would like to think because they are tucked up that they are in shape. But the muscle tone says it all. I'm betting your big stakes horses are in top form, hence why they are winning the stakes. But that is such a small % of the horses that are racing nationwide. |
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Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | GLP - 2015-09-02 2:18 PM So, when you are just getting a horse in shape, say he has been out on pasture and hasn't been ridden in several months, what do you do to get those tendon/ligaments and bones in shape? If I decide I don't need to do a lot of trotting in the beginning, it sure would help these aging joints of mine! I just worry about making sure the tendons and ligaments are as strong as they can be before I start stressing them with smaller circles/turns.
I would start out walking 10-15 min then loping 5 minutes for 6 days a week, then up the lope to 10 minutes. I would also start out in long straight lines, if possible, only working circles once the horse was in better shape. Circles are also harder on them than straight lines. You can trot if you like, I would for sure not trot for miles though. And any vet worth their salt will tell you, on a horse that has any arthritis or any front end lameness, NOT to trot at all.. it is very hard on them! Also to get the soft tissue and bones in shape.. lope for a few minutes then burst your speed for a short distance, then back to a lope for a few minutes, then burst your speed. Ask any race trainer.. they train with speed burts to help densify the bones to prevent shin bucks and also the short periods of stress will strengthen the soft tissues as well. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-02 2:27 PM
GLP - 2015-09-02 2:18 PM So, when you are just getting a horse in shape, say he has been out on pasture and hasn't been ridden in several months, what do you do to get those tendon/ligaments and bones in shape? If I decide I don't need to do a lot of trotting in the beginning, it sure would help these aging joints of mine! I just worry about making sure the tendons and ligaments are as strong as they can be before I start stressing them with smaller circles/turns.
I would start out walking 10-15 min then loping 5 minutes for 6 days a week, then up the lope to 10 minutes. I would also start out in long straight lines, if possible, only working circles once the horse was in better shape. Circles are also harder on them than straight lines. You can trot if you like, I would for sure not trot for miles though. And any vet worth their salt will tell you, on a horse that has any arthritis or any front end lameness, NOT to trot at all.. it is very hard on them! Also to get the soft tissue and bones in shape.. lope for a few minutes then burst your speed for a short distance, then back to a lope for a few minutes, then burst your speed. Ask any race trainer.. they train with speed burts to help densify the bones to prevent shin bucks and also the short periods of stress will strengthen the soft tissues as well.
Thank you, I will definitely think hard about this. I have been out of barrel racing for many years and so much has changed and so much knowledge has been gained since I have been out. Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions.  |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-02 2:27 PM GLP - 2015-09-02 2:18 PM So, when you are just getting a horse in shape, say he has been out on pasture and hasn't been ridden in several months, what do you do to get those tendon/ligaments and bones in shape? If I decide I don't need to do a lot of trotting in the beginning, it sure would help these aging joints of mine! I just worry about making sure the tendons and ligaments are as strong as they can be before I start stressing them with smaller circles/turns. I would start out walking 10-15 min then loping 5 minutes for 6 days a week, then up the lope to 10 minutes. I would also start out in long straight lines, if possible, only working circles once the horse was in better shape. Circles are also harder on them than straight lines. You can trot if you like, I would for sure not trot for miles though. And any vet worth their salt will tell you, on a horse that has any arthritis or any front end lameness, NOT to trot at all.. it is very hard on them! Also to get the soft tissue and bones in shape.. lope for a few minutes then burst your speed for a short distance, then back to a lope for a few minutes, then burst your speed. Ask any race trainer.. they train with speed burts to help densify the bones to prevent shin bucks and also the short periods of stress will strengthen the soft tissues as well.
Ok, you have my attention. After a week of long trotting 1.5-2 miles 3 days and very minimal loping, my horse did not perform this morning. He was reluctant to even pick up his left lead warming up. Which worries me bc he has issues on his right front. I had his coffin and pastern injected for the second time in May. So I want to preserve that as long as possible. Could you elaborate on the issues long trotting can cause? Or point me in the direction of some research? Thank you!! |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-02 9:35 AM
TurnLane - 2015-09-01 4:12 PM I will try to get Aceinthehole to give a recap of her recent discussion with a new vet. It was interesting to say the least.
Compared to the rest of these posts- I can say I am a minimalist. I have been using the EquiTrack app since day one so I do find it helpful. But when I worked at the track- they never went miles and miles per day even on the TBs. So I dont know what is the right thing?
I ride nearly every single day but it averages 3 miles per day with warm up, trot, lope and fast work and cool down.
While talking to Dr. Nichols at Marietta Vet in Marietta, OK.. He said you should never long trot your horses. First off, he says "what part of the barrel pattern do you trot?". Second he says in order to get your horses long term fiber muscles to fire off, you need to lope with bursts of speed, even if short distances, if you trot to warm your horse up, you get the short acting muscle fibers to fire and your horse will run slower. He says "like begets like". Third thing is he says trotting your horses is the worst possible exercise on their bodies, not only is it extrememly hard on joints, but it is just as hard on their muscles. Jog trotting here to there, he says is fine, but there is really no reason to ever long trott distances, just causes too much damage to the body.
So while having this conversation with him, I asked about soft tissue rehab, how they tell you to trott for so long (be it minutes or miles) and work your way up to loping. He said to just lope, it will do the same for the tissue and is easier on the rest of the body.
Also he said to talk to race horse trainers.. see how much "trotting" they do.... little to none. They train with loping and adding bursts of speed, then back to a slower pace, with bursts of speed, and back down.. but not really any significant trotting.
I would want to ask this vet about fractures and bone density.
There have been research articles published regarding exercise regimes on thoroughbreds and fractures.
Results of the studies show if loping or trotting alone these horses have less bone density and are more prone to fractures then the horses who did both loping and trotting.
I would also question what he says about warmup, as if you just start loping your horse without warmup, their tendons and ligaments will be damaged.
Also stifles if you have a loose stifle, long trotting is the rehab, so what does he say about this?
I would like I see the evidence based research he is getting his information from
Edited by cheryl makofka 2015-09-06 10:57 AM
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 Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4553
Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | I had my two geldings turned out in a rather large pasture, something like a thousand acres. When they were thirsty they would long trot from the farthest corner of the pasture all the way to the water tank. I don't think long trotting should be left out of any conditioning program. They can cover a lot of ground with a good long trot. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | cow pie - 2015-09-06 8:06 PM I had my two geldings turned out in a rather large pasture, something like a thousand acres. When they were thirsty they would long trot from the farthest corner of the pasture all the way to the water tank. I don't think long trotting should be left out of any conditioning program. They can cover a lot of ground with a good long trot.
I agree. Just watched my mares and foals do it yesterday. I think the flies bother them so they hurry down and get a drink and hurry back to their hill where they stand and let the breeze blow. |
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
Location: PNW | I try to do everything in moderation. Little bit of trotting, little bit of loping, little bit of walking. Nothing eliminated is good, neither is anything in excess.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 669
Location: Central Texas | ACEINTHEHOLE - 2015-09-02 2:27 PM
GLP - 2015-09-02 2:18 PM So, when you are just getting a horse in shape, say he has been out on pasture and hasn't been ridden in several months, what do you do to get those tendon/ligaments and bones in shape? If I decide I don't need to do a lot of trotting in the beginning, it sure would help these aging joints of mine! I just worry about making sure the tendons and ligaments are as strong as they can be before I start stressing them with smaller circles/turns.
I would start out walking 10-15 min then loping 5 minutes for 6 days a week, then up the lope to 10 minutes. I would also start out in long straight lines, if possible, only working circles once the horse was in better shape. Circles are also harder on them than straight lines. You can trot if you like, I would for sure not trot for miles though. And any vet worth their salt will tell you, on a horse that has any arthritis or any front end lameness, NOT to trot at all.. it is very hard on them! Also to get the soft tissue and bones in shape.. lope for a few minutes then burst your speed for a short distance, then back to a lope for a few minutes, then burst your speed. Ask any race trainer.. they train with speed burts to help densify the bones to prevent shin bucks and also the short periods of stress will strengthen the soft tissues as well.
My very good lameness vet told me this as well. Both my horses had some front end issues and I was told trot some but not much. Get them loose and warm with a trot then move on to the lope. The pounding of the trot is very hard on a horse especially one that already has issues. I do trot some but I lope more. |
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 Regular
Posts: 67
| I recently purchased a gelding with 'weak stifles'. He gets them injected once a year. The previous owner long trotted him 3x a week for about 3 or 4 miles. I only do a mile of long trotting. I know circles are not a great idea and I live on very flat land so there are no hills to be found. Is 1 mile enough and what else should I be doing with him? |
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 Peecans
| Our ranch horse can really get out and long trot, they can really cover ground, but when fit I dont think it "works" them. Meaning they are just as fresh when we get there and when we left, and not at all winded. I long trot a lot when I need to get some where quickly but not wear my horse out.
I walk and long trot in warm up and cool down, i think its great for them to really stretch and loosen up, but I dont think it "fits" then that much if they are in dicent shape.
Just my personal experience with our own horses. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 672
| della - 2015-09-08 11:26 AM
Our ranch horse can really get out and long trot, they can really cover ground, but when fit I dont think it "works" them. Meaning they are just as fresh when we get there and when we left, and not at all winded. I long trot a lot when I need to get some where quickly but not wear my horse out.
I walk and long trot in warm up and cool down, i think its great for them to really stretch and loosen up, but I dont think it "fits" then that much if they are in dicent shape.
Just my personal experience with our own horses.
Same here. It's what they are conditioned for. I've had horses that could long trot all day checking cows. Lope for a mile & a half and they were completely winded.
I think long trotting has a place in getting your horse conditioned, but when you are competing in a certain event, you need to condition your horses's muscles with exercises that mimic what they will be doing in the arena (or wherever). |
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Peecans
| veintiocho - 2015-09-08 10:42 AM
della - 2015-09-08 11:26 AM
Our ranch horse can really get out and long trot, they can really cover ground, but when fit I dont think it "works" them. Meaning they are just as fresh when we get there and when we left, and not at all winded. I long trot a lot when I need to get some where quickly but not wear my horse out.
I walk and long trot in warm up and cool down, i think its great for them to really stretch and loosen up, but I dont think it "fits" then that much if they are in dicent shape.
Just my personal experience with our own horses.
Same here. It's what they are conditioned for. I've had horses that could long trot all day checking cows. Lope for a mile & a half and they were completely winded.
I think long trotting has a place in getting your horse conditioned, but when you are competing in a certain event, you need to condition your horses's muscles with exercises that mimic what they will be doing in the arena (or wherever ).
Yes you worded it so much better than me!
I use it as a warm up and cool down in my barrel horse, its great to stretch her out, but it dosent condition her for a race at all. |
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Hungarian Midget Woman
Location: Midwest | IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 6:04 PM Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
no, never. Actually, some less than scrupulous arab and morgan people I knew used to ride their horses up and down gravel roads specifically to sore them to get more action (this was years ago).
I would never, ever trot or gallop on gravel and consider that safe.
I personally do not trot much past warming up. I will throw in some trots here and there. I have some back issues though and prefer loping (since it is easier on me not to have to post). |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | barrelracr131 - 2015-09-08 1:02 PM
IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 6:04 PM Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
no, never. Actually, some less than scrupulous arab and morgan people I knew used to ride their horses up and down gravel roads specifically to sore them to get more action (this was years ago).
I would never, ever trot or gallop on gravel and consider that safe.
I personally do not trot much past warming up. I will throw in some trots here and there. I have some back issues though and prefer loping (since it is easier on me not to have to post).
Trotting isn't easy on my back, but lolim is actually worse. I woke up this morning super sore from the good bit of loping I did yesterday. My lower back is so tight it's hard for me to move naturally with my horse. Then I end up hurting more from tensing up. I'm too young for this lol, only 25. I inherited my mom's back and shoulders. It's annoying when you can't make your own body do what you want!! My horse was traveling flexed to the right, I realized it was bc I was riding that way, ugh. |
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 Brains Behind the Operation...
Posts: 4543
Location: Arizona | I am on my phone & have not read thru this entire thread, so forgive me if this has already been said. I used to spend a lot of time long trotting my horses when I was younger, because it was what everyone recommended as a mainstay of any conditioning program. Now that I've spent enough years gaining trial & error experience, observations, etc. my program has changed and I don't spend much time long trotting at all. Maybe 1/4 to 1/2 mile as a warmup and then the rest of my miles are at either what I call a "long lope" or a steady (not speedy) gallop. The total mileage varies depending on the horse, but generally when the horse comes back to me and starts to slow its pace on its own I will back down to a trot for another 1/4 to 1/2 mile then finish cooling out. It's not unusual for an in shape horse to gallop 2 to 4 miles before backing off on their own. This works wonders for keeping a horse mentally refreshed as well as in shape.The main reason I stopped long trotting so much is because most of my horses are in the 12 to 20 year age range, and the concussion was just plain hard on them. Often they would be ouchy and stiff the next day. Long loping & galloping keeps them looser.Also, many horses are not traveling properly when they are trotting mile after mile. Heads go up, backs hollow, front legs begin pounding down instead of striding forward, back legs start trailing instead of reaching beneath. Whether it's from the horse tiring or not knowing how to carry themselves or the rider losing position (many riders are not capable of riding a long trot for an extended time without losing form, it's more work than it seems), traveling mile after mile in bad form doesn't benefit anybody.There is a place for long trotting, but I usually reserve it for winding down a chargy youngster nowadays rather than a conditioning staple. Especially if I have a nice sandy stretch of ground. But other than that, the majority of my trot work is done in the arena or on circle work, where I can take the time to concentrate on both mine & the horse's body position. |
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boon
Posts: 1
| Well, this depends upon the fitness of the horse, the breed and the terrain not to mention other factors like health and age. Despite all the ‘horses are meant for riding’ crap, they’re not. They have no collarbones, no bones to support their back. Only tendons, muscles and tissues hold their spine up. Horses can only be ridden for about 20 minutes at a time before they start to get a sore back. So the question is, are you going to ride a horse at a trot for more than despite their pain, to see when they’ll collapse? source quora.com source myhorsenames.com |
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 Ms. Marine
Posts: 4627
Location: Texas | IowaCanChaser - 2015-08-31 4:04 PM Would you guys breeze on a gravel road? I've always been scared the footing wouldn't be very good.
That's going to be a solid no. Breezing on gravel is just asking for problems. I long trot my mare for about 4 miles and then bring her back down to lower her heart rate and cool her down. |
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 Zeal Queen
Posts: 3826
Location: TEXAS | Considering a barrel run takes only seconds, I think anything over a mile is over doing it. I also think it's too much on their joints. I want to save those. I ran track in college and I apply the same strategies. Sprinters only over trained by running quarters. Milers over trained by running multiple miles. Just my opinion |
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 Half-Eaten Cookies
Posts: 2075
Location: Fort Worth / Springtown | polorunner - 2015-08-31 2:36 PM I have always used Marlene McRae's program and it has never failed me. I agree that 2 miles really isnt much for a horse. I like my horses to be in very good condition and a 30 minute program of continuous work doesnt take a lot of time, but this program gets the job done. I dont sprint that often but I do open my horse up a few times a month for a short distance.
http://www.horsechannel.com/horse-experts/western-horse-training-advice/faster-barrel-racing-time.aspx
Having a well-conditioned athlete is the first step to getting your horse to run to his maximum ability. I like to work my horse every day for the first eight weeks of training, and then decrease the training to four days a week. The distance I train and the pace I go are the secrets to a well-conditioned horse that has the ability to run faster during a barrel racing competition.
Condition your horse in long, straight lines whenever possible, as circles are physically hard on a horse. Here is my conditioning program broken down into each step:
• Trot one mile
• Lope one mile on one lead
• Lope one more mile on the opposite lead
• The fourth mile: Long trot the first half mile then slow trot the last half mile.
NOTE: Do not walk in between paces.
This totals four miles, which I feel is the optimum distance for building a well-conditioned equine athlete in barrel racing or any event. I want to keep the heart rate up and work it, then bring the heart rate slowly back down. Every third day, I sprint my horse after the third mile in a straight line for about 400 yards.
You will be impressed how your horse’s muscle tone will change with this type of conditioning program. Before long, you will find that your horse feels like running and will be quicker around the turns and faster in the straightaways.
I remember seeing this in her pole bending DVD.....this was her warm up.....before she started working on the pole pattern. I just found reference to it in another book of hers....and she referred to it as her warm up. Interesting. |
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Brains Behind the Operation...
Posts: 4543
Location: Arizona | Link to another trotting discussion we had here last year: Who doesn't trot their horses? |
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How far do you long trot?