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 Expert
Posts: 2128
  
| Excersises/drills/tweaks to fix this? I have since turned the second barrel twice while trotting, as well as exaggerated my turn on that barrel. Always looking to broaden my insight, share away. |
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| 90% of the time the problem is your approach into the barrel you are bowing off of. I would go back and look at where you are starting your turn. If your horse is turning too soon, drive your horse further up. If their front end is too close, they are going to push their hind end out to gain room. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2013
Location: Piedmont, OK | IMO: The second barrel is the hardest one for them to turn. it is a complete 360. The first and 3rd are not complete 360. It could be how your setting them up in the approach or it could be a soreness issue. I have a mare that if she is sore in her hocks does not have a good 2nd. |
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 Straight Shooter
Posts: 5725
Location: SW North Dakota | WrapN3MN - 2015-12-30 10:10 AM 90% of the time the problem is your approach into the barrel you are bowing off of. I would go back and look at where you are starting your turn. If your horse is turning too soon, drive your horse further up. If their front end is too close, they are going to push their hind end out to gain room.
Agree. Also wondering if it could be a throttle problem? Maybe not if you are slowing down and doubling your turn, but sometimes horses are so worried about going fast, they "forget" to finish their turns. When they dump on their shoulder and turn too close or too soon, it will cause some serious fading on the backside. JMHO. :) |
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 Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | Agree with the suggestions thus far.
Would you be able to post a video?
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Sounds like your horse is not rating the barrel. |
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Veteran
Posts: 285
| I'm not a trainer but when my mare started doing this On the second, I just put my outside leg on her and it helped. She's very touchy though and really works nice off leg pressure. |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| You are probably starting your turn too soon, getting flat on the backside and then the horse has to step out to finish the turn.
Two suggestions, don't go in too wide on your approach to the barrel, let the horse work and help the horse finish the turn. Also, look where you want to go. That means look up and look at the third barrel. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1526
Location: Texas | Stop them leaving the barrel it will fix your problem |
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| Forget working with a barrel .... start working your horse on basic circles and forward motion and decrease the size of the circle till it is tight ... unwind the circle back to a large one and do a figure 8 with flying lead change and do the same thing counter clockwise ...... ride two handed and he will re-learn to keep his feet up under himself ... do this for a month and STAY AWAY FROM THE BARRELS ...
Mean while ... push a wheelbarrow around the barrels keeping it 3 ft away from the barrel ... finish your pattern ... go look at the wheel tracks and your foot prints and decide where your turning spot should be on the 1,2,3rd barrels ... and this will tell you where your horses butt is in a turn ... and it will also make you shape up your pattern and move your horse towards the "spot" as you are coming off the previous barrel ...
Now push your wheelbarrow again and do this ... pick your spot 30-40 ft on the line running between 1-2 barrels to turn to go to the first barrel (first barrel is 1 1/4 turns) this shapes your horse up and shortens your turning radius; heading to 2nd move your wheelbarrow over to run to your spot and not the barrel... make your turn this is a 360 turn ... head for your spot to 3rd by moving over while coming to the barrel... make your turn .... this is a 360 turn but you can make it look like a 270 by how you approach the barrel and of course on this barrel you straighten out to head for home ...
Go look at your tracks again ... if you are confused and can't find your turning spot pushing a wheelbarrow ... both you and the horse are going to be lost in your turns when he gets his feet back up under himself ...
Compare this to learning how to keep pressure on a cow with a cutting horse or separating cattle in a pen ... if you have never done it on foot and know that you can move a step or two to move a cow at the right time... instead of rushing it .. the cow is going to go blowing by you ... same way running barrels ...
GOOD LUCK |
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Expert
Posts: 2128
| ND3canAddict - 2015-12-30 2:53 PM WrapN3MN - 2015-12-30 10:10 AM 90% of the time the problem is your approach into the barrel you are bowing off of. I would go back and look at where you are starting your turn. If your horse is turning too soon, drive your horse further up. If their front end is too close, they are going to push their hind end out to gain room. Agree. Also wondering if it could be a throttle problem? Maybe not if you are slowing down and doubling your turn, but sometimes horses are so worried about going fast, they "forget" to finish their turns. When they dump on their shoulder and turn too close or too soon, it will cause some serious fading on the backside. JMHO. :)
I do feel like this could be a big factor, after reading your comment. We have been adding lots of speed. He is hustling and strong, just has quit turning one jump too soon.
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Expert
Posts: 2128
| WrapN3MN - 2015-12-30 11:10 AM 90% of the time the problem is your approach into the barrel you are bowing off of. I would go back and look at where you are starting your turn. If your horse is turning too soon, drive your horse further up. If their front end is too close, they are going to push their hind end out to gain room.
Thanks.Im def going to look closely at my approach. Most often I pick a spot on the ground and make a B line to that point. My horse has sort of a turn back style so I push him up in there and he will pivot and come back. I think I need to maybe give him a little more room approaching, and maybe push him one extra jump into the pocket. |
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Expert
Posts: 2128
| Thank you all for your tips. |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | I would work on the squares exercise. Also think about where your horse's chest/shoulders is/are facing when he leaves the barrel. You'll want it facing the third. To control the shoulders you'll need to keep the weight off the front end and get it in the back end. Aka more rate. |
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 Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
| mollibtexan - 2015-12-30 11:51 PM
Stop them leaving the barrel it will fix your problem
Would you expand on this for me a bit? I need to know more. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 509
| How big of a pocket I've been trying a three foot pocket and going by the barrel till the hip is at it we have t started running yet |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 989
| I rode a horse last summer with this issue.. Second barrel on my finished horse, is my best barrel. The horse with issues was doing this: He was coming into second barrel and his long stride before he rated was too soon, his shoulder was too straight (not tucking in and up) that set him off balance for the turn as I was having to "pick him up" and push him one more stride. Fixed that.
Second issue was.. he needed one more stride to finish the barrel. He was planting his inside hind one stride too soon to be able to push off towards third barrel. So, when he planted too early and pushed off, it sent him straight, because second barrel was in the way. Got him to wait, plant that hind at the middle of the barrel instead of on the fence edge side of it.. it gave him the ability to push off towards third.
Third problem.. because he was mentally knowing he should be going towards third, but couldn't finish the turn to allow his body to go that direction properly, he would crank his head, or his rider would.. which would in turn bulge his shoulder, dis-engage his hind end.. and send him across the arena as he was so imbalanced. To fix that I made the outside rein 'fire' and my outside leg forward to bump his shoulder over. I did this off the pattern to respect the rein and my leg and got him snapping his front end around. I could eventually be loping, pick up my reins, have the outside rein brush on his neck, move my leg, and he would plant that inside leg and pretty much spin. Now when I leave the barrel.. the natural hand movement is to have your inside hand move up the horses neck towards third barrel, it will 'rub' on the outside of the horses neck, and do a counter bend to over turn the barrel, suck that shoulder in and continue.
The combination of starting the turn properly.. not trying to finish it too soon, and having that 'snap' of the outside rein to leave it.. that horse snaps and goes. He almost turns a turn and a half before going to third, but as long as you are looking where your going.. he is golden. |
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 To the Left
Posts: 1865
Location: Florida | It is simple, if you are blowing wide on the second then you are not finishing the first. If you come out of the first wide you are set up wrong for the second and will blow wide. Watch some videos, especially training videos. they will show what is going on. |
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 Ima Cool Kid
Posts: 3496
Location: TN | Just a thought, If I hang on my mares mouth she pulls against me. (getting behind in the run) which makes her blow out. |
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| horsingaround - 2016-01-04 8:32 PM Just a thought, If I hang on my mares mouth she pulls against me. (getting behind in the run) which makes her blow out.
exactly! I HATE to admit this, but it's true, so true. |
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Expert
Posts: 2122
Location: The Great Northwest | pepsi97 - 2015-12-30 6:19 PM I'm not a trainer but when my mare started doing this On the second, I just put my outside leg on her and it helped. She's very touchy though and really works nice off leg pressure.
You really are a trainer! If you spend any time with a horse, you can be training good to bad habits. |
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Expert
Posts: 1526
Location: Texas | classicpotatochip - 2016-01-01 6:31 AM
mollibtexan - 2015-12-30 11:51 PM
Stop them leaving the barrel it will fix your problem
Would you expand on this for me a bit? I need to know more.
There is no magic just in slow work or in an exb stop the horse when you leave the barrel. The horse is starting to run before he has finished his turn. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 602
| hammer_time - 2015-12-31 10:46 AM
I would work on the squares exercise. Also think about where your horse's chest/shoulders is/are facing when he leaves the barrel. You'll want it facing the third. To control the shoulders you'll need to keep the weight off the front end and get it in the back end. Aka more rate.
I agree. Square exercises are awesome. Google "Connie Combs, its hip to be square." |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 575
| I would have someone you consider a knowledgeable horseman watch your run (or a video) and give your their opinion.
I JUST made a run where my filly bowed off her second pretty bad. I came out and asked a friend of mine what she thought was up, and she said, "You're doing that weird thing where you start to lean on her again."  I fixed my posture and she made a great run the next time and snapped back around.
I also had a gelding consistently bow out around the back side. Slow work, work on myself, nothing. He still did it. I had someone recommend trying him in a hackamore (he was VERY broke so I was more than willing to try) and he came back around so much better. I ran him in a Little S hack until the day I sold him.
I place SO much value on the opinions of people who know me, my horses, and who are better than I am. They are the biggest blessing and the most help! |
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Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
| mollibtexan - 2016-03-08 10:52 PM
classicpotatochip - 2016-01-01 6:31 AM
mollibtexan - 2015-12-30 11:51 PM
Stop them leaving the barrel it will fix your problem
Would you expand on this for me a bit? I need to know more.
There is no magic just in slow work or in an exb stop the horse when you leave the barrel. The horse is starting to run before he has finished his turn.
Thank you Molli. I thought you might mean that, but wanted to clarify. |
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Bowing out when leaving the 2nd barrel..