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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
 
Location: Usually on my horse | I didn’t post this at the end of July when this happened because I was just going to “suck it up”. But I can’t hold it in anymore because I am still raging mad about it, especially when I see these cheats continue to sell horses on BHW on a regular basis.
I purchased a horse named Thunderdog on this site from a person in who sells a lot of horses on here. At the time, I thought that this person was trustworthy, based on the amount of horses I saw from the ads with this person’s name and phone number on them and they sold quite quickly.
Thunderdog was advertised as sound and no vices. It was also advertised as having no quirks and really easy to run, fast, would go all day, former ranch horse, blah, blah, blah. This person did have a video of Thunderdog slowly going through a pattern. This person claimed in the ad, the reason Thunderdog was going slow was because, “the arena was wet and they didn’t want the horse to slip”.( I know better than that now) In the video Thunderdog came off the third barrel rather oddly, (like he wasn’t going to finish the barrel) and the video faded off and went to another video of him slowly going through a pattern. I questioned this person about that. This person stated to me, it was “because they were holding him back”. (I now am pretty sure that he froze up and would not finish the pattern, because that is what he does, so they cut the video) Thunderdog was advertised as a 2D horse in the NBHA. I had several conversations with this liar and this person assured me that everything that was stated in the ad was true and accurate. I believed this person. This person went so far as to tell me that if he didn’t work out I could get a different horse from them, because I questioned this person as to “what if he isn’t what you say he is”. That was actually the selling point. Again I believed this person.
Well SHAME ON ME!!!! The ad and this person were a total fraud!
I purchased this horse in good faith, believing what this person told me and what the ad indicated. This person flat out lied to me about this horse, in our conversations and in the ad that was written. It makes me angry and sick to see people like them able to lie and cheat others out of their money and just not think twice about it. No conscience and not an ounce of regret. How do people like this sleep at night? They (this person and another person) just keep selling horses on this site. Although I do not see this person riding the horses anymore, this person’s phone number is still listed as the contact.
Obviously, some of the horses they sell must be what they advertised them to be or they could not possibly keep selling horses. But if they were any kind of decent business people or had any morals at all, they would make situation right. Lying and cheating even one person out of their hard earned money is one too many.
I am so angry about this. And this poor horse was 150 lbs underweight upon arrival, shoes on front feet 2 sizes to small, very sad and totally broken spirit. I contacted this person within 4 days of getting this horse and this person would not reply to my texts or my voice mails or return my calls. At that point, in my mind, this person more or less admitted they were a liar and dishonest about this horse, without even saying it.
I contacted a lawyer and he talked to this person. This person admits no wrong doing and because they had a video of Thunderdog going through a barrel pattern in an arena, stating the video proves he is a barrel horse. This person also told the lawyer that I must have caused the horse to do this, going so far as to tell him I probably don’t know how to ride. This person also told him that they never told me “if Thunderdog didn’t work out they would trade me for another horse”.
I am a 15 year veteran of barrel with national titles to back up my riding ability.
After the fact, I did some homework on Thunderdog and found a former owner. It turns out that this former owner sold Thunderdog horse in 2012 as UNSOUND and UNABLE TO BE BARREL RACED. In fact the first question asked by the former owner was, “What did you purchase this horse as ?”. They described to me what happened when they tried to barrel race Thunderdog. (it was the same thing that he did to me, running to the fence, freezing up and acting like he was going to blow up, and never completed a pattern)
Former owner bought Thunderdog from another dishonest horse trader in PA not knowing he had stifle, back and hock problem (as he was also sold to them as sound) and for 5 months and many $$$ vet bills later, tried to get him sound. This trader eventually did take buy (trade) him back with full disclosure from the owners of the problems that Thunderdog had, but this former owner told me it did not end well. Obviously this lying horse trader in PA failed to disclose to the next buyer the problems that Thunderdog had.
Thunderdog has been passed around and sold and re-sold and getting dumbed on whoever was unsuspecting and got sucked into these liars’s web. I found out as of last April, he was in the possession of the same horse trader in PA and now it is obvious how he got in possession of the person I bought him from. Apparently these lying horse traders must all stick together.
Lying, cheating people that use animals for profit, while stealing from others, in my opinion, have a special place in hell. I hope karma turns around and bites them hard!!!
In the mean time I am out of my money, have a crippled horse with a broken spirit who is NOT a barrel horse and these rotten cheaters continue on doing what they do. Hopefully sooner than later, this will all catch up with them and justice will be served!
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
  
Location: Kansas | I'm so sorry that happened to you. I had a gal message me just about a week ago wanting to trade her "2D" gelding for my started colt....she told me the gelding was sound. I did a little research and found out he had stifle and hock issues. People are disgusting.
Did you not do a prepurchase exam?
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 Expert
Posts: 5293
| This is why I will only buy a horse I have ridden, had a vet check on ( depends on price and age of horse for how detailed vet check i do) and I pull blood myself. I also have seller sign a contract that if blood work comes back as showing any medications they had not disclosed then no sale. Any seller who refuses this knowingly is trying to cover up something. I don't care if it's 500 hour drive or flight to see the horse. There are just so many dishonest people these days. Sorry you had to go through that. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | So sorry that this happen to you, there is so many dishonest people out there....I have gotton where I dont trust hardley anyone.. |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| Sorry this happened to you... I assume you bought site unseen? I got burned doing that once too. Mine was a prospect but who was advertised as ready to ride when he didnt even tie... Did you get a pre-puchase/vet check done? |
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 Expert
Posts: 4625
Location: Desert Land | I'm sorry this happened to you and hopefully these sellers will get what they have coming to them.
I assume you didn't have a vet check done and/or a good contract in place? I have bought/sold lots of sight unseen horses. I make sure the contract is very detailed and I prefer to do my correspondence when selling via e-mail so I have proof of everything thre buyer asked and how I answered. It just keeps the honest people honest.
Also, sounds like you did a lot of detective work AFTER the issues arose. I don't understand why people don't do that BEFORE purchasing? |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| I don't understand how some people live with themselves. I vet check everything and do extensive research. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 326
| I bet I know these two. Put them on: RIPOFFREPORT.COM. That's what I did. These two are the most disgusting humans you will ever meet. I had to put the horse down I got from them, he was so crippled. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1898
| TheOldGrayMare - 2016-01-05 11:30 AM
I'm sorry this happened to you and hopefully these sellers will get what they have coming to them.
I assume you didn't have a vet check done and/or a good contract in place? I have bought/sold lots of sight unseen horses. I make sure the contract is very detailed and I prefer to do my correspondence when selling via e-mail so I have proof of everything thre buyer asked and how I answered. It just keeps the honest people honest.
Also, sounds like you did a lot of detective work AFTER the issues arose. I don't understand why people don't do that BEFORE purchasing?
That sucks. I am sorry for you and the horse.
Hind sight is always 20/20 but I agree with The Old Gray Mare! All of my correspondence is ALWAYS done through some for of text, either email or regular text for this very reason. As a buyer especially but also as a seller. I want to be able to see what was said and if I forgot to ask any questions as the buyer and as the seller I want to make sure I disclosed everything and answered all the questions a potential buyer has. Having everything in text is especially good when dates are involved, such as when and where a horse ran, injuries, or illness the horse suffered.
It is nothing personal against the seller/buyer, I know a lot of people prefer actual conversation but there is nothing to fall back on in instances like this. He said-She said holds no legal value. Plus I have a super bad short term memory problem and find if it is not in text I ask the same questions over and over. |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| LP22654 - 2016-01-05 11:47 AM
I bet I know these two. Put them on: RIPOFFREPORT.COM. That's what I did. These two are the most disgusting humans you will ever meet. I had to put the horse down I got from them, he was so crippled.
omg |
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 Expert
Posts: 1392
Location: Central Texas | So sorry. I feel your pain and anger because I have been in your shoes. I also bought from someone on here that I thought was honest. I learned a lot of lessons on that deal. I had to dang near give that horse away. BUT I was honest and told any prospective buyers that I was scared of him and would never get on him again and it was try at your own risk. I really need to start horse shopping again since my other horse is now 23 and it's getting harder to maintain his arthritis but I don't trust anyone which makes horse shopping very very hard. |
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  Friendly horse swapper
Posts: 4122
Location: Buffalo, TX | I'm so sorry you had to go through this...It's all about the money...there are liars and cheaters in every occupation, car dealers, trailer dealers, horse sellers, scammers who will take your life savings and never shed a tear, etc...
I think most of us have learned the hard way that at the very least, you need to ask here for PMs on sellers in a certain state before purchase and then reveal the details in the PM for answers...and also make sure you get the registered name of the horse and do an AQHA check for previous owners and call them about the horse...lastly, vet check if you are spending an amount of money that you can't comfortably lose if all goes wrong...sad, but true, you almost have to assume the worst until you verify, verify, verify everything they say, or go look in person and ride the horse, or in the case of a 2D horse, ask if they will take it to a jackpot so you can watch, and if they won't, pass them up. There are a lot of horses out there for sale...I found the nicest one I've had in 10 years right in my backyard...look at it as a learning experience and you will never have to go through this again... |
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 Maine-iac
Posts: 3334
Location: Got Lobsta? | When you typed "Shame on Me". No...you are a good, honest person who believes that people are good in the world. I'm so sorry this has happen to you. Its not fair and it's heart breaking to hear stories like this. |
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 Loves to compete
Posts: 5760
Location: Oakdale, CA | TheOldGrayMare - 2016-01-05 9:30 AM I'm sorry this happened to you and hopefully these sellers will get what they have coming to them.
I assume you didn't have a vet check done and/or a good contract in place? I have bought/sold lots of sight unseen horses. I make sure the contract is very detailed and I prefer to do my correspondence when selling via e-mail so I have proof of everything thre buyer asked and how I answered. It just keeps the honest people honest.
Also, sounds like you did a lot of detective work AFTER the issues arose. I don't understand why people don't do that BEFORE purchasing?
I'm a firm believer its the buyers responsibility as much as the sellers responsiibility anymore.....
this subject has been talked about over and over and over.....................
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
Location: Usually on my horse | I wish I would have been smarter and done homework before as well. But I did not have time. This person pressured me and basically told me they were going to sell him that day(because someone else came and rode him after I told her I wanted him and said they wanted him too)(probably another lie), unless I had a check in the mail. This person knew exactly what they were doing. I have all the texts of our conversations on that. Hindsight...... |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 512
| I also think I know who you are referring to. I beleive they have been discussed on here before. They always advertise as sound with no vices in every horse-pretty much impossible!
Sorry they burned you :( |
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 I hate cooking and cleaning
Posts: 3314
Location: Jersey Girl | Is the sellers first name Olivia? She is a PA seller that screwed me on the horse in my avatar. |
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 Voice of Reason
Location: NOT at Wal Mart | Can you PM me the name as I think I know who you're referring to. I purchased a horse from "them" a while back. Put $$ down, did research with AQHA, papers were flagged, horse was listed in a law suit, called previous owner, horse was a bucker she ran thru a sale in ND. Needless to say I refused to continue with the sale. I did manage to get my disposit back, although it took a fight. Sorry this happened to you. |
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 Hawty & Nawty
Posts: 20424
| I just buy backyard mutt horses that can't outrun the neighbor's cat. But even then I RUN LIKE HELL when sellers tell me I have to buy that day. I'm so sorry you got burned but lessons learned and maybe you can restore this one horse's heart and make him into a good trail horse for someone. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | I'm sorry this happened, but in the end you are responsible for doing your homework ahead of time as well as having the horse vet checked and riding them yourself. Without doing those things you are always taking a risk. Unfortunately the fact of the matter is you really can't trust anyone. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | That poor horse, I feel really sorry for him, will he make a trail riding horse? |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | I googled some of this stuff and found out that you are not alone in the problems you have had with this seller. |
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Voice of Reason
Location: NOT at Wal Mart | Thank you for your PM, yup same POS, I hope their reading this thread. |
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Loves to compete
Posts: 5760
Location: Oakdale, CA | I just went and looked at that ripoff.com site and the interesting thing is I think the person making the report should have to give their info too!
we have been in the customer service business since 1963 and believe me some people you just can't make happy no matter what whether our fault or not. Those people are always the ones that yelp bad stuff about us or gripe the most..............................................
so I don't believe they should have to hide behind their report their names should be given also........... |
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Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | now I'm curious who it is |
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 Expert
Posts: 1857
| hoofs_in_motion - 2016-01-05 1:06 PM
now I'm curious who it is
Same here! |
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 Witty Enough
Posts: 2954
Location: CTX | FlyingJT - 2016-01-05 1:10 PM hoofs_in_motion - 2016-01-05 1:06 PM now I'm curious who it is Same here!
count me in.... |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 557
Location: Kansas and loving it | cranky B4 10am - 2016-01-05 1:12 PM
FlyingJT - 2016-01-05 1:10 PM hoofs_in_motion - 2016-01-05 1:06 PM now I'm curious who it is Same here!
Please PM me as well. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I have been in this mess befor too so I feel for the OP, just have to be more carefull in what we do are buy.. |
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 Professional Amateur
Posts: 6750
Location: Oklahoma | Now I am curious. What a mess. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
Location: Usually on my horse | Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good look at themselves and wish they had lived their life as better people.
Edited by haulin4cash 2016-01-05 1:47 PM
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | haulin4cash - 2016-01-05 1:45 PM Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good at themselves look and wish they had lived there life as better people.
And hoping one day they will cross the wrong people that will kick their butts.  |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-05 1:48 PM
haulin4cash - 2016-01-05 1:45 PM Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good at themselves look and wish they had lived there life as better people.
And hoping one day they will cross the wrong people that will kick their butts.
thats what I'm thinking. This is all fun and games until someone shows up at their house ready to get their $ back. What goes around comes around. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2335
Location: IL | haulin4cash - 2016-01-05 1:45 PM Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good look at themselves and wish they had lived their life as better people.
Can you pm me the names? I'm currently looking for a horse and I don't want to make the same mistake. thanks |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | RoaniePonie11 - 2016-01-05 2:21 PM Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-05 1:48 PM haulin4cash - 2016-01-05 1:45 PM Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good at themselves look and wish they had lived there life as better people. And hoping one day they will cross the wrong people that will kick their butts. thats what I'm thinking. This is all fun and games until someone shows up at their house ready to get their $ back. What goes around comes around.
 One day they will regret being what they are now.. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
Location: Home on the Range | haulin4cash - 2016-01-05 2:45 PM Anybody who wants to know who these people are can PM me.(if you don't know already) I will be happy to share that information. Also, I guess I am one of the last to know that these people are true POS. I have had a ton of PM's stating they have dealt with them or known somebody that has dealt with them and been ripped off. These people are shameful and empty. They have no concern for other humans or the horses they sell. Greedy, low life and only out to make money. I guess I can only pray that some day they take a good look at themselves and wish they had lived their life as better people.
Doesn't take much detective work to figure out who you are talking about. You could have just said KENTUCKY in your post and took all the guess work out. However, I do know several folks that Have purchased from them and were Very Happy with their purchases! Heck, I was even interested in a few over the years, but missed out on both. At the VERY LOW Affordable prices they sell at, it's no wonder so many people will buy without making the trip. I have never seen any of the horses Not priced at a super deal, so with that said, I am assuming you did not pay very much. With the $ you were saving & Vet exams being cheap enough, wouldn't it have made sense to get one, cause at the very least could have prevented your unfortunate situation.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
Location: Usually on my horse | I mentioned in my original post that I am sure not all the horses they sell are bad deals. But, in my case it was and I have proof with what happened after I got him from them and from a former owner that this horse should not have been sold as a barrel horse. And these lying horse traders had no interest in making this good. They were given the chance. They denied they did anything wrong.
I don't care if they sell 100 good horses. If they sell one bad one, that they fraudulently lie about it and rip someone out of hard earned money, that is one too many. That is just bad business practice.....period. And yes, I also said I should have done my homework before, not after. It doesn't matter at this point anymore. The people are not trust worthy and furthermore they don't care if they are not trust worthy. They have no morals and don't have a clue about anything having to do with honesty. They use people and animals for profit and their bottom line profit is all that matters to them no matter who they take down in the process. |
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Expert
Posts: 4625
Location: Desert Land | Ah-ha...now I know who they are. I had looked at their ad for the Woodbridge daughter listed for $2,200 about a week ago - I thought that was awfully cheap for that mare and then saw how many videos of different horses they have on their youtube page and it was apparent they are big time horse traders. The mare sold in like a day, I think with the cheap prices people feel like they aren't out much and just take a chance.
Edited by TheOldGrayMare 2016-01-05 3:30 PM
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Voice of Reason
Location: NOT at Wal Mart | Yes they sell a lot of horses, priced low. (Should be a red flag) The one I concidered getting was at their higher range. I am so glad I did research and was not one of the people getting stuck with a lemon. You might want to get with the others who have had a problem and do something legally, can't hurt. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | This is a good thread that was brought up, maybe the OP just saved a few others from being riped off by these people, it should open up some eyes that are looking to buy. If looking at any horses that these people or anybody else that has horses for sale,,,, NOW we all know to look deeper and do more homework on the horses that we are looking at.
Thanks haulin4cash you may have helped somebody else from not getting riped off
Edit cause I forgot a word, 
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2016-01-05 4:00 PM
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 Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-05 3:55 PM This is a good thread that was brought up, maybe the OP just saved a few others from being riped off by these people, it should open up some eyes that are looking to buy. If looking at any horses that these people or anybody else that has horses for sale,,,, NOW we all know to look deeper and do more homework on the horses that we are looking at.
Thanks haulin4cash you may have helped somebody else from not getting riped off
Edit cause I forgot a word,
^^^^ THIS....I think what can be learned from EVERY thread about dishonest sellers is that a person needs to do their homework and ask around before getting sucked in by a lowball price. The barrel horse world is very big YET VERY SMALL, at times, because dishonest sellers (traders) are usually well known! |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1176
Location: Nor Cal | Please PM me as I am helping a friend look for a horse. Thanks! |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i hope the mods will look into this as these people have done this several times and maybe ban these guys. |
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 Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | It's happened to most of us at some point. There's a pair like that in every state. Get the word out as best you can. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
Location: Usually on my horse | One more thing, if anybody else has been ripped off by these jerks, please PM me. I have a lawyer in KY that is very interested in helping us. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 326
| If anyone would like to pm me I can tell you of another crooked horse seller on here. Big time liar! |
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 The BHW Book Worm
Posts: 1768
| CanCan - 2016-01-05 8:09 PM
It's happened to most of us at some point. There's a pair like that in every state. Get the word out as best you can.
Totally agree with this it's sad though that even when you post solid hard proof it's deleted!!! There are many that know my story and everyone is more than welcome to PM so I can give you the cold hard evidence, the name of the snake, and a list of people who were in the same boat as I. Last time I posted her name on here it lasted 2 days so instead of being a rebel and just posting it to get deleted I'll just let you know she is in Utah and recently had her well known stud die that was sired by Frenchmans guy. |
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Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| I was glad I asked as I had interest in a few they've listed. However, I have a hard time buying from any horse trader which was the main reason I didnt pursue these folks. Even the traders who dont intentionally screw you over, they dont keep the horses long enough or evaluate them enough to really advertise them properly. They may not include something because they flip them in a few days or a week. They may be sound or sane in those couple days. I am in no way making excuses because there is always the intentional misinformation but sometimes they just dont know heads or tails of that partciular horse and make claims they cant stand behind. Which is why I am skeptical about any traders. |
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 Barrel Horse World News
Posts: 64
| I might add that BHW is looking into various rating systems or into creating a new one for this site. Any of your ideas would be welcome at this time.
If you have ideas or simply your input or experience with a bad seller, send them!! That would help a lot.
You can send to me: steve@barrelhorseworld.com
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Steve BHWNews - 2016-01-08 3:56 PM I might add that BHW is looking into various rating systems or into creating a new one for this site. Any of your ideas would be welcome at this time.
If you have ideas or simply your input or experience with a bad seller, send them!! That would help a lot.
You can send to me: steve@barrelhorseworld.com
Wow now this would be so COOL, it sure would stop alot of bad sales happening.
So maybe like a star rating system? |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 434
Location: Northwest Florida | I think a seller rating, something similar to eBay's or Amazon's would be very beneficial. That would be a way to see if the sellers have happy or unhappy customers, and decide if you can trust them enough to make a purchase, especially for someone purchasing sight unseen. Just a simple 1-5 stars and a detailed review.
it could be viewed, just like when you click "see sellers other horses" there could be a link for "see seller reviews"
Edited by BigStarBound 2016-01-08 4:12 PM
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | BigStarBound - 2016-01-08 4:11 PM I think a seller rating, something similar to eBay's or Amazon's would be very beneficial. That would be a way to see if the sellers have happy or unhappy customers, and decide if you can trust them enough to make a purchase, especially for someone purchasing sight unseen. Just a simple 1-5 stars and a detailed review.
Now that would be a dandy way of weeding out the bad sellers. On E-bay I always would check out the sellers ratings befor I bought anything. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 614
Location: Usually on my horse | I am all for that. |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-08 4:13 PM BigStarBound - 2016-01-08 4:11 PM I think a seller rating, something similar to eBay's or Amazon's would be very beneficial. That would be a way to see if the sellers have happy or unhappy customers, and decide if you can trust them enough to make a purchase, especially for someone purchasing sight unseen. Just a simple 1-5 stars and a detailed review. Now that would be a dandy way of weeding out the bad sellers. On E-bay I always would check out the sellers ratings befor I bought anything.
I did too....However, I would think that "legally" you would have to also allow the seller the opportunity to write a rebuttal.......Not ALL sales are bad due to the "seller".......but uneducated buyers......... |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 434
Location: Northwest Florida | NJJ - 2016-01-08 4:24 PM
Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-08 4:13 PM BigStarBound - 2016-01-08 4:11 PM I think a seller rating, something similar to eBay's or Amazon's would be very beneficial. That would be a way to see if the sellers have happy or unhappy customers, and decide if you can trust them enough to make a purchase, especially for someone purchasing sight unseen. Just a simple 1-5 stars and a detailed review. Now that would be a dandy way of weeding out the bad sellers. On E-bay I always would check out the sellers ratings befor I bought anything.
eBay allows for a rebuttal, I wouldn't see a problem with that on here either.
Personally, I do a LOT of selling on eBay and the whole rating system is a huge motivation to keep the buyer happy (I mean morals work, too... But obviously they aren't for everyone!)
I just think it holds sellers more accountable. If they want to continue selling horses they need to ensure their customers are happy, just as any business would. There are countless sights for rating businesses out there but I've yet to see a horse advertising site that allows you to see a profile with ratings on the seller. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | NJJ - 2016-01-08 4:24 PM Southtxponygirl - 2016-01-08 4:13 PM BigStarBound - 2016-01-08 4:11 PM I think a seller rating, something similar to eBay's or Amazon's would be very beneficial. That would be a way to see if the sellers have happy or unhappy customers, and decide if you can trust them enough to make a purchase, especially for someone purchasing sight unseen. Just a simple 1-5 stars and a detailed review. Now that would be a dandy way of weeding out the bad sellers. On E-bay I always would check out the sellers ratings befor I bought anything.
Yep theres just as many bad buyers out there as well as the sellers but we still would have to do some homework befor buying/selling. I still think its a pretty cool ideal. Maybe at least give it a time period and see how it works out.  |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 678
Location: Canada | I would love to see a rating system. I bought a horse listed on this site from someone who regularly sells on here. They lied, fabricated results, and must have known the vet I paid the vet check for. I'd Love to leave a review as I know several others on here who had very similar negative experiences with that business. |
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Mrs. Troy
Location: western Nebraska | I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt.
I can see your point in this |
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Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | Good idea. It works in other venues such as eBay and Vrbo houses. Way more dishonest sellers than buyers.
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 "Hottie"
Posts: 1373
Location: Okemah,OK | It may have changed but eBay had gone to a system where sellers couldn't rate buyers. They really shut them out for pointing out shady buyers. I can't remember if a seller can still do a rebuttal but they became extremely buyer oriented. Not sure which way would be better for a site like this??? |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 331
Location: Loma Linda, CA | It's because of stuff like this that I am absolutely TERRIFIED of buying any horses outside of where I am.
So far, I have been very lucky with my horses. I have bought 3 fillies in the last few months with no issues from very reputable people. I bought 2 from Tomas Garcilazo (he's the guy that rides the palomino with the gorgeous long mane at the NFR) and a now 2 year old from a local reining trainer here and most recently the paint in my profile picture from another barrel racer.
I'm one of those that doesn't normally vet check (shame on me, but so far no issues lol). I think if I were buying a finished horse that was 1-2D I probably would vet check with x-rays, but so far none of them have been too huge of an investment minus my paint. She is the most expensive horse I own lol.
It really absolutely sucks that people do this.
Most recently I was selling a filly, I didn't immediately disclose her issues in my ad, but always disclosed when contacted. Eventually, I did put it in the ad because people were thinking the worst of me. I ended up selling my filly to a 19 year old girl who loves her and has done all the vet work - turned out to be cellulitis  Super easy fix. She got a nice prospect for a good price lol.
I really don't understand people. |
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I AM being nice
Posts: 4396
Location: MD | doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM
I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt.
I'm with doglady on this. I am very honest when selling horses. I'll give you every piece of information there is regarding a horse's history, be it health, performance, quirks, etc... Years ago, we had a very nice gelding who was Top 3 in the Nation in the Hunter Hack a couple of years in a row. He was sold to a very high end H/J program. Obviously, this horse commanded a substantial purchase price and the barn that he sold into was very successful and well respected. They were given very detailed information with regards to feeding, his turnout program, frequency and length of rides, all of it. Of course, the H/J folks like a horse far heavier than the stock breed folks do.
About 2.5 or 3 months after the sale, we received a phone call, saying that the horse all of a sudden had turned into a nasty bronc. In all of the years that he had been in our program, this horse had never so much as had a knot in his back. Myself and another assistant headed up there a couple of days later to check out the situation. Upon seeing the horse in his stall, we both gasped. In the short time that he had been there, the horse had gained right about 250 lbs. His hay rack was filled with some of the most beautiful alfalfa that I had ever seen. When asked what they had done to put so much weight on him so quickly, we found out that his feed intake had been increased drastically. He was eating 1.5 times the amount of grain that he had been, the protein levels were significantly higher and he was receiving 20 or so lbs of alfalfa a day, in addition to his orchard grass. To top it off, he was only being ridden three days a week and for twenty or 30 minutes, at best. I couldn't help but to shrug my shoulders and ask them why they were so surprised that the horse was bucking what with the major increase of food, decrease in riding and almost total elimination of turnout.
A few years back now, I sold a 5 year old locally. Nice mare, very quiet, push style, only going to go as fast as you ask her, to the point that if you just went into the alley and dropped your hand a bit, she would no more than lope through the pattern. At the time that I had sold her, the mare was quite consistently placing in the 2D and would slip into the 1D in the Youth every now and then. When the buyer came to try the mare, we tacked her up with the person's saddle and I got on to show the horse. The buyer's saddle was a flex tree and didn't set super well on the mare, but didn't seem tragic. I walked and trotted around, but the instant that I picked up the lope, I could feel the saddle flexing and bottoming out on the mare's back. Good girl that she was, the mare did not react, but I stopped and explained the fit issue. We swapped to one of my saddles on her, I proceeded to take her through the pattern and then, the buyer rode her. The mare sold that day and before leaving, the buyer and I were discussing saddle options.
A few months later, we ran into the mare's new owner at a barrel race. She said that the mare had been acting like she wanted to buck during open arena. I had a string of horses to exhibition, but told her to bring the mare up and I would get on her as soon as I was done. Sure enough, still that same saddle. I didn't even get on her. I sent her to my trailer, had her put one of mine on and the mare was great. I again emphasized how poorly the saddle fitted the mare and that she was going to cripple her if she continued to ride in it. Eleven months after the sale, I received an irate message, informing me that I had knowingly sold a horse who had kissing spine. I called and discovered that the horse hadn't been diagnosed with kissing spine, at all. It had been brought up as a possibility, but no x rays had been taken. The poor mare's back was a wreck. Here I was, almost a year after the sale of a horse who had never belonged to me, being screamed at by a woman who had caused the damage to said horse. She demanded that I buy the mare back, or trade her for something else. When I refused, she called the previous owners who told her much the same. For years now, she will still tell people that I knowingly sold her a cripple.
I'm not adverse to the idea of some sort of way of providing information about sellers, but I think that a rating system is far too easily skewed. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i have bought many horses over a phone call or internet. never got something that was cripple. some have managable problems if it is a vet problem fix it, if it is a saddle problem, change saddles. i see people on here buying saddles after saddles for there horse i wonder some time they think the back soreness that could come from hock,stifles and other thing being thought as saddle problems. i know people who have 10 pair of boots for them will not inject hocks on there horse. i see videos on here every day with horses not working on there rear proballby needs maintaince. thats the difference between people who win and people who dont. after while a horse that is sore is either not gonna run enough to make himself hurt, not gonna go thru gate, or sling there but so they dont have to hurt. buying horses off this site if you are not an experianced let someone look at the video maybe they can spot a lameness or notice something wrong. if you are paying a good amount of money get a vet check.
Edited by daisycake123 2016-01-09 6:01 AM
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 Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | when we train our horses we always put the working students on them to make sure the horse is adaptable.. we also when perspective buyers come match up the right pair. we take a few days and give lessons on a few horses that are compatible. we give all information and levels and where the horse might top off at.. Amatuar or professional levels.when people spend the amount of money on our horses we want them to be solid..and what they are wanting..but the horse must be the right fit ..
we try not to overmount the buyers because in the end the horses suffer..
most matches do well.. some come back in a few months needing tuned up.. of course meaning... buyer messed horse up or for whatver reason.. we certainly dont place blame and most buyers dont either.. and we expect for issues the horse could come back if buyer overmounts and we spend a lil time reteaching or will try to find other alternatives ..we certainly dont want horse or rider unhappy.. but 9 times out of 10 its the buyer..I to agree with doglady , at some point the buyers must realize its not always the sellers.. of course there are exceptions.. lots.... but when we send out a horse its solid .. and when it comes back totally frazzled we know something isnt right with the horses situation at home.. what im saying is do homework , follow advice , listen to horse and the sellers and ask lots of questions and ride the horse few times .. make sure its the program you want.. and your goals are attainable with that horse.. or its not to much horse for you.
Edited by Bibliafarm 2016-01-09 7:58 AM
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Barrel Horse World News
Posts: 64
| Thanks for everyone's input.
One of the things that make BHW classifieds unique is this forum. Valuable information is exchanged, either publicly or in private messages to help sort out the "bad" sellers.
One of the most immediate solutions might be right here . . . allowing more of you the opportunity to review and report your experiences, both good and bad in our forums. |
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Mrs. Troy
Location: western Nebraska | doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt.
I hesitated to even say anything but buying a horse isn't like buying a saddle or lamp on eBay. A horse is your next partner and it takes two to dance. I see the ads you all are talking about and they have some very good bred, good looking horses at cheap prices. You get what you pay for generally. If it looks too good to be true it usually is. Good, solid horses cost a lot to make them that way. If you don't want to spend the time on one then you are going to pay someone else for doing it and their horse won't be cheap. Yes there are a few bargins out there if you know how to find them or you are good at fixing but most people aren't. So many barrel racers are buying the dream without realizing what it takes to keep that top horse at the level they bought. If you aren't knowledgeable enough to know what you need and can ride then pay someone you trust to help you find the perfect partner you can dance with. When you are looking to buy out of your area read the results to see names of people you can call about a horse. But call several to make sure you are getting a fair assessment of a horse and a seller. And one more thing. When you are vetting a horse I hear all the time about NOT taking a horse to the regular vet. Why would you not want to go to the vet that has been taking of that horse and doing the maintence on him so you can continue? My vet is the greatest guy. I have X-rays and regular Chiro and maintence records that I would release on my horses to make sure you can keep them at the level they are at when you buy them. Am I the only one that feels like this?
Edited by doglady 2016-01-09 10:09 AM
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 I Am Always Right
Posts: 4264
Location: stray dump capital of the world | doglady - 2016-01-09 10:08 AM doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt. I hesitated to even say anything but buying a horse isn't like buying a saddle or lamp on eBay. A horse is your next partner and it takes two to dance. I see the ads you all are talking about and they have some very good bred, good looking horses at cheap prices. You get what you pay for generally. If it looks too good to be true it usually is. Good, solid horses cost a lot to make them that way. If you don't want to spend the time on one then you are going to pay someone else for doing it and their horse won't be cheap. Yes there are a few bargins out there if you know how to find them or you are good at fixing but most people aren't. So many barrel racers are buying the dream without realizing what it takes to keep that top horse at the level they bought. If you aren't knowledgeable enough to know what you need and can ride then pay someone you trust to help you find the perfect partner you can dance with. When you are looking to buy out of your area read the results to see names of people you can call about a horse. But call several to make sure you are getting a fair assessment of a horse and a seller. And one more thing. When you are vetting a horse I hear all the time about NOT taking a horse to the regular vet. Why would you not want to go to the vet that has been taking of that horse and doing the maintence on him so you can continue? My vet is the greatest guy. I have X-rays and regular Chiro and maintence records that I would release on my horses to make sure you can keep them at the level they are at when you buy them. Am I the only one that feels like this?
I have to agree with this. My last 2 purchases, I went with the vet on record. Both clinics were very open, forwarded all X-rays and info back to my vet before I paid. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 326
| I like this idea. A honest seller has nothing to worry about. I don't think anyone should wait 2 or 3 months to give a rating. That's to long. I have bought other horses off BHW and the other sellers were 100% honest. I just think BHW needs a way to weed out bad sellers. The rating should be done within a week. When you receive a horse you know within that time or before whether you were lied to or not. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i bought on here last year, it was represented fairly and is tirning out nicely. horse was very athethletic and nice ground manners are wonderful.honestly mare was a tad bit greener than i expected, but is way quiet, like when i saddle just drop the rope and ground hold her. acks on the ground like a 20 year old horse. she was also advertised as 15 hand she is 15.1 and 1300 lb. butn i am sure i can practice running barrels like 6 times everyday for a month while feeding her 4 pads alfalfa and 3 pads hay and no turn out. but on this mare i dont think you can blow her up. to tell you how truly amazing this horse is. last summer about july i started working the barrelpattern all i had is hard ground and grass. worked her about 4 or 5 weeks ground hard enough cant lope. went to a show and exhibitioned her she ran like a 22. changed her bit and put a soft rope nosband on her she dropped 2 seconds and lkoope thru and turned looked like a barrel horse. two week latter went a an indoor and she loped thru like she had been doing for a while. fast fwd didnot get her out anymore and about 1 month later i get a sinus infectiin and keep all winter and about a month ago i got back on her and she is still the same, needs a little refresher course on a couple of things. cant wait to start again. be3st 3500.00 i ever spent. dolly corona i love you. she is waiting by the gait every dsy for me. she is a 1300 lb dog. i would put any child on her, she will not take advantiage.
Edited by daisycake123 2016-04-29 8:39 PM
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Cold hands and Warm Heart
Location: oklahoma | doglady - 2016-01-09 10:08 AM doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt. I hesitated to even say anything but buying a horse isn't like buying a saddle or lamp on eBay. A horse is your next partner and it takes two to dance. I see the ads you all are talking about and they have some very good bred, good looking horses at cheap prices. You get what you pay for generally. If it looks too good to be true it usually is. Good, solid horses cost a lot to make them that way. If you don't want to spend the time on one then you are going to pay someone else for doing it and their horse won't be cheap. Yes there are a few bargins out there if you know how to find them or you are good at fixing but most people aren't. So many barrel racers are buying the dream without realizing what it takes to keep that top horse at the level they bought. If you aren't knowledgeable enough to know what you need and can ride then pay someone you trust to help you find the perfect partner you can dance with. When you are looking to buy out of your area read the results to see names of people you can call about a horse. But call several to make sure you are getting a fair assessment of a horse and a seller. And one more thing. When you are vetting a horse I hear all the time about NOT taking a horse to the regular vet. Why would you not want to go to the vet that has been taking of that horse and doing the maintence on him so you can continue? My vet is the greatest guy. I have X-rays and regular Chiro and maintence records that I would release on my horses to make sure you can keep them at the level they are at when you buy them. Am I the only one that feels like this?
I agree with you. Besides, what I like and can handle isn't on someone else's level or interest. Hard to rate someone from such different perspectives.
A few years ago, I bought a jack of all trades from bhw, sight unseen. I watched a few videos and talked to the seller but I think most importantly, I sent pms and researched the seller. I hate that this happened to you, op and am not blaming you one bit. Hoping that these threads like yours helps all of us as we bounce ideas and experiences off of each other. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 509
| i recently bought a horse which i love who the owner really thought was broke there style of riding is cowboy one and run hard set hard and pull around the barrels. I don't ride this way i like them turning with fingertip control and i have the patience and time i am in no hurry.i do my best to educate one. This horse had been broke and trained to run barrels all in one year, so he had a few things lacking in his basics the previous owners have been very offended that i restarted there horse i just can't ride that way and i love the horse. They are very offended. Sometimes people have different ideas of broke some can jockey an unbroke horse and make it look good, i can't!! He turned on his front end that drives me crazy. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| CurlyQ - 2016-01-09 7:41 PM
doglady - 2016-01-09 10:08 AM doglady - 2016-01-08 7:33 PM I think this is going to be a nightmare. I see people that buy horses that they can't ride or don't keep the everything the same as the person that was winning on the horse. So then they blame the seller when the horse probably was not missrepresented as much as the buyer buying above their level. I agree there are some sellers that are very dishonest but how to keep this from becoming a witch hunt. I hesitated to even say anything but buying a horse isn't like buying a saddle or lamp on eBay. A horse is your next partner and it takes two to dance. I see the ads you all are talking about and they have some very good bred, good looking horses at cheap prices. You get what you pay for generally. If it looks too good to be true it usually is. Good, solid horses cost a lot to make them that way. If you don't want to spend the time on one then you are going to pay someone else for doing it and their horse won't be cheap. Yes there are a few bargins out there if you know how to find them or you are good at fixing but most people aren't. So many barrel racers are buying the dream without realizing what it takes to keep that top horse at the level they bought. If you aren't knowledgeable enough to know what you need and can ride then pay someone you trust to help you find the perfect partner you can dance with. When you are looking to buy out of your area read the results to see names of people you can call about a horse. But call several to make sure you are getting a fair assessment of a horse and a seller. And one more thing. When you are vetting a horse I hear all the time about NOT taking a horse to the regular vet. Why would you not want to go to the vet that has been taking of that horse and doing the maintence on him so you can continue? My vet is the greatest guy. I have X-rays and regular Chiro and maintence records that I would release on my horses to make sure you can keep them at the level they are at when you buy them. Am I the only one that feels like this?
A few years ago, I bought a jack of all trades from bhw, sight unseen. I watched a few videos and talked to the seller but I think most importantly, I sent pms and researched the seller. I hate that this happened to you, op and am not blaming you one bit. Hoping that these threads like yours helps all of us as we bounce ideas and experiences off of each other.
It is a slippery slope, especially for barrel horses. If the horse is competitive, even 2/3D, and it's advertised at a very good price and it says 'no vices/completely sound', run. I don't think there is one out there that has no vices and is completely sound. I have bought so much crap over the years, I started to finally look in the mirror to see if I had 'sucker' printed on my forehead. And I think about the poor horses, unsound, in pain most likely, and going to someone unaware of what to look for or what to do.
I finally started to vet check beyond just a trot up and down at the vet. Spent a ton of money on extensive vet checks on horses that I didn't buy. Got burned on one that I bought out of state and found the 'best leg vet in the country' to vet check close to the seller. Found a few manageable leg issues, only problem was he didn't catch the back issue....guess he only did legs.
Best good horse I think I ever had came site unseen in a straight across trade that my trainer arranged for me, no vet check but she knew the horse and the vet that treated him. Own son of Bully Bullion, looked just like his dad. Awesome on the road and in the barrel pen, however, the vice list was: tries to kill other horses and is a cribbing machine. My granddaughter has him, he's 21, looks and runs like he's 15, clocks in the 1D/2D locally.....and I think he's pulled off most of the top wood rails on my daughter's fences!
I've come to think the good ones always have some quirk or the other...so I guess we should look for the ad that says: 1D horse, pricey, relatively sound, needs maintenance, less than 5 vices. Then you'd know you had an honest seller!
And thanks to all the honest sellers who tell you what is wrong, and offer to help you, like wrap snap. If only there were more of you.
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I was looking at a horse too, and then remember about the KY sellers I could not remember their names so had to look this thread up, I like that mare too {The Woodbridge}, thought I knew her from somewhere...
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2016-04-22 2:17 PM
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 Veteran
Posts: 173
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow | Looks like this thread may have done some good, at least on this site. I don't see any horses currently listed.
I did purchase a horse from them last year. The horse was not broke as the description stated. Other than that, I was lucky. She was in great shape and sound etc...I got lucky though and I would never do that again. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 929
| There is a local seller in my area that does this. She sells a lot of horses but I figure if you can't keep from cheating on your SO...then you will certainly cheat me in buying a horse! I won't be purchasing one from her. If you are of loose moral character in one area, you are likely to be the same in others, IMO. |
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 IMA No Hair Style Gal
Posts: 2594
| I am not far....never hesitate to pm me for info on the horses!!!! I have one from them...but was an indirect sell, he went through 5 people before I got him in one years time. Has taken 2 years to get him right. But before I bought him for $500 bucks I did my homework and contacted the breeders. Pieced together his story, and the homes he went through. I knew going into it I was either getting something crazy or unsound....turns out it was none of the above just a terrified horse who had been through lord only knows what. He will live out his days in my barn. I will make sure this horse never goes through whatever it was he went through again. When you realize someone is a horse trader just know that you HAVE to do your homework. It is a shame that people do these things to others, if you are spending money that is a large amount to you, you must always protect your investment and do your homework. I hate that people continue to get jipped, but I also feel so sorry for the horses. :-( They suffer the most. |
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 Wishing I were a Wildcat
Location: 'Hawk Country | Not just in performance horse world. A friend bought a team of draft horses from an online ad. The ad and pictures were of black Clydesdales. What got off the truck were starved Belgins. I can't believe they survived the trip, they were so thin.
Same story, wouldn't answer phone or texts. I told him to get his lawyer and get them. His lawyer doesn't know what to do, especially across several state lines. My friend is just living with it. I told him he needed to get a lawyer who knew what he was doing otherwise these people would just keep doing it to others.
They answered the phone when he borrowed someone else's but hung up as soon as they realized who,it was. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i sold a 4 year old on her through a friend of mine her son got him running barrels, he was really quiet a real dead head. the lady that bought him i never met but she was not a good rider. she got him home about 6 weeks later i get a call from a screaming lady that my horse no her horse bucked her off. that horse never buck from day i got him, i saddled in as a 2 yo put in round pen no buck acked like he had been riden, i have a very bad back, so i sent off to a guy for almost 90 days, he kept him in a stall the whole time and also feed alfalfa, horse came back great looking he said he never bucker, also the guy who trained him on barrels no buck the alsways had kides at there house and they would let them ride him. but i think the lady who was heavy bounced on his back and hurt him or either they kept him in a stall and over fed him, or either run him 5 or 6 times to learn how to ride him and he acted out. but nobody who had ridden him ever seen him and acted out. accept the lady who bought him. never thought she could have been riding him in a saddle that pinched him and or a bit or some gear that hurt him. i think her being heavy and maybe had a malfitting saddle and too much practise.
Edited by daisycake123 2016-04-23 6:24 AM
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| There is another one on here too. Burned me on a unsound horse from North Carolina |
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Veteran
Posts: 264
| I feel your pain!!! Was trying out horses last year, drove 7 hours to test ride and fell in love put $1k cash down and headed home to get the trailer. Seller disappeared with horse and my money.  Lesson unfortunately learned. |
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Cat Collector
Posts: 1430
| Just so you are aware, if you have the messages that this person guaranteed the horse sound there IS something you can do, even if you didn't get a vet check. People always say " well you didn't get a vet check that is your fault" well it sure the heck isn't. I am so tired of shady sellers, It just depends how far you want to take this. I say to stand up for what is right and go after what you were promised. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Karlaw - 2016-04-25 1:11 PM
Just so you are aware, if you have the messages that this person guaranteed the horse sound there IS something you can do, even if you didn't get a vet check. People always say " well you didn't get a vet check that is your fault" well it sure the heck isn't. I am so tired of shady sellers, It just depends how far you want to take this. I say to stand up for what is right and go after what you were promised.
Sound is such a subjective term. I do believe it is the buyers responsibility to evaluate the horse before buying. As the seller May truely believe their horse is sound, the horse may have never went to a vet clinic, or the vet they use doesn't have good enough equipment or the knowledge base to assess or diagnose a horse properly.
Not all equipment or vets are created equal
My old barrel horse I lent out when he was 18 diagnosed with OA when he was 6 injected throughout his career. The people who borrowed him took him to their vet flex tested him and he passed with flying colours. Never did X-rays if he did he would have seen joints pretty much bone on bone. I don't consider him sound, but the vet passed him as sound.
I have this argument with a family member all the time, her definition of sound is they are not head bobbin lame. My definition of sound is there is no physical issues to cause pain. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 494
| It is so risky these days. I bought one sight unseen off of an add. I jewed the lady down a little so I knew I could at least get my money back if something happened. I always write up contracts if it comes to putting money down, or even getting a vet check. Too much risk these days |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | cheryl makofka - 2016-04-25 11:57 AM Karlaw - 2016-04-25 1:11 PM Just so you are aware, if you have the messages that this person guaranteed the horse sound there IS something you can do, even if you didn't get a vet check. People always say " well you didn't get a vet check that is your fault" well it sure the heck isn't. I am so tired of shady sellers, It just depends how far you want to take this. I say to stand up for what is right and go after what you were promised. Sound is such a subjective term. I do believe it is the buyers responsibility to evaluate the horse before buying. As the seller May truely believe their horse is sound, the horse may have never went to a vet clinic, or the vet they use doesn't have good enough equipment or the knowledge base to assess or diagnose a horse properly. Not all equipment or vets are created equal My old barrel horse I lent out when he was 18 diagnosed with OA when he was 6 injected throughout his career. The people who borrowed him took him to their vet flex tested him and he passed with flying colours. Never did X-rays if he did he would have seen joints pretty much bone on bone. I don't consider him sound, but the vet passed him as sound. I have this argument with a family member all the time, her definition of sound is they are not head bobbin lame. My definition of sound is there is no physical issues to cause pain.
yes yes yes... I have always heard and used the terms serviceably sound and performance sound |
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 A very grounded girl
Posts: 5052
Location: Moving soon..... | It's a shame that these kind of people continue to do this over and over. KARMA! This happend to me two times and it wasn't that the horses I purchased were not sound, it was the issues that they had. Both times I was told "they never did that with me." I have learned who to contact when looking to purchase. |
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Cat Collector
Posts: 1430
| cheryl makofka - 2016-04-25 12:57 PM
Karlaw - 2016-04-25 1:11 PM
Just so you are aware, if you have the messages that this person guaranteed the horse sound there IS something you can do, even if you didn't get a vet check. People always say " well you didn't get a vet check that is your fault" well it sure the heck isn't. I am so tired of shady sellers, It just depends how far you want to take this. I say to stand up for what is right and go after what you were promised.
Sound is such a subjective term. I do believe it is the buyers responsibility to evaluate the horse before buying. As the seller May truely believe their horse is sound, the horse may have never went to a vet clinic, or the vet they use doesn't have good enough equipment or the knowledge base to assess or diagnose a horse properly.
Not all equipment or vets are created equal
My old barrel horse I lent out when he was 18 diagnosed with OA when he was 6 injected throughout his career. The people who borrowed him took him to their vet flex tested him and he passed with flying colours. Never did X-rays if he did he would have seen joints pretty much bone on bone. I don't consider him sound, but the vet passed him as sound.
I have this argument with a family member all the time, her definition of sound is they are not head bobbin lame. My definition of sound is there is no physical issues to cause pain.
I am talking about selling a horse and knowing very well that it is not sound. It may be the buyers responsibility but it is also the sellers responsibility to be honest. I don't care what way you try and spin it too many people are dishonest when it comes to selling their horses and enough is enough. Thank god there are still honest people out there who come forward with information about these horses when its needed. |
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| i had a young lady come by my office as a friend sent her to me for some advise. she did not like it but i told her the truth. she was anout 19 or 20 years old she has taken her western pleasue horse at some backyard show and statred running barrels, she did go to a nbha show and was 5-d time. she want a barrel horse. she starts spitting out it had to be at least 16.2 cause she was tall she was 5.8 and wears 34 inseam. can be over 10.. i told her she needed to fi d a good horse to teach her the right way.. just cause you ran barrels 7 or 8 times at a back yard show does not make you a trainer. after i spend an hour with this chick showing her some nice horses for the money 4 to 8k she then ask me if they take payments. i told her get her money then go looking as i will not take payments on a horse. the she post on facebook. she saw a weaning on bhw for 4 or 5k she said that expensive. i told her barrel horses win money and people like barrel racing and in anytime not hard to see a good barrel horse and there not cheap either. they are not like a western pleasure horse that unless you are a trainer or in with the click you cant sell a western pleasure horse. a good barrel horse is a good barrel horse. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| kwanatha - 2016-04-25 5:58 PM
cheryl makofka - 2016-04-25 11:57 AM Karlaw - 2016-04-25 1:11 PM Just so you are aware, if you have the messages that this person guaranteed the horse sound there IS something you can do, even if you didn't get a vet check. People always say " well you didn't get a vet check that is your fault" well it sure the heck isn't. I am so tired of shady sellers, It just depends how far you want to take this. I say to stand up for what is right and go after what you were promised. Sound is such a subjective term. I do believe it is the buyers responsibility to evaluate the horse before buying. As the seller May truely believe their horse is sound, the horse may have never went to a vet clinic, or the vet they use doesn't have good enough equipment or the knowledge base to assess or diagnose a horse properly. Not all equipment or vets are created equal My old barrel horse I lent out when he was 18 diagnosed with OA when he was 6 injected throughout his career. The people who borrowed him took him to their vet flex tested him and he passed with flying colours. Never did X-rays if he did he would have seen joints pretty much bone on bone. I don't consider him sound, but the vet passed him as sound. I have this argument with a family member all the time, her definition of sound is they are not head bobbin lame. My definition of sound is there is no physical issues to cause pain.
Yep, performance sound. I looked at a gelding a year or so ago when I was deciding do I fix what I got, or get something else.
So word of mouth through a relative I find a Streakin Six gelding, very reasonable. Lady was older, and had health issues and owner wanted to find him a decent home from folks they knew. Drove 3 hours to ride him. Seemed nice, rode nice, good temperment but didn't get in the ground. I'm thinking, this could be fixable, maybe he needs is a little TLC. Since he wasn't head bobbin' lame, he'd probably never been to the vet, owner was older, sort of loped around the pattern and babysat her, so she was fine with him as he was. Get the vet check......he was sound on like one leg. Didn't go to the next step of x-rays etc. too many possible issues.
I guess moral of the story, folks aren't always meaning to mislead. Sometimes it's just no one's ever looked deep enough to find an issue that makes the horse not Performance Sound.
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Location: Illinois | So sorry that happened. It SUCKS.
Happened twice to me but the one I was more hurt about was a mare I bought from a girl that lived in Indiana who was going for "Miss Rodeo USA". My fault I didn't get a vet check. Brought her home and found out 1. She was a cribber and 2. Had bone chips in both front legs.
Not saying a cribber is a no-go but to know would of been nice but again, my fault I didn't even check her teeth. I was in the stage of being too excited. So yea, my fault but it still sucks because the text messages/emails/videos/reasons for selling were different/ and even seeing the mare in person wasn't enough. She even lowered the price because she had a great feeling about me and this mare ran the WPRA Circuit which would have me getting my "card" in no time. BS. BS. BS. BS!!!!!!
Shame on me. It's just sad how many people you think you can trust you can't. At least it's a LESSON LEARNED. That happened a few years ago but heck it's made me a million times wiser. My friend always said you aren't truly in the horse world until you've been screwed. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 807
Location: New Mexico | Really sorry to hear about what happened to you. Here's a really humorous blog about buying barrel horses:
http://www.heritagebrand.com/jess-blog.html |
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 Duct Tape Can't Fix Stupid
Posts: 2749
Location: Warsaw,NY | can someone fill me in as to who these people are? |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 434
Location: Northwest Florida | hezasmashnsixcess - 2016-04-29 5:11 AM
can someone fill me in as to who these people are?
I'm curious as well. I purchased a horse from some people in KY a few years ago. Found out he was a terrible cribber and had a horrible, dangerous alley issue it took me forever to work through. When I called them they basically said "sorry about your luck". I'm wondering if they are the same people. I still see the girl advertising horses on facebook all the time.
Edited by BigStarBound 2016-04-29 3:41 PM
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Dishonest sellers make me sick-vent(long)