|
|
 Expert
Posts: 1612
  
Location: Cocoa, Florida | I feel like I've been a magnet for bleeders, I've tried so many different things and now my best horse is bleeding when I started really asking her for more.
Here's the problem....you cannot give her a shot. She freaks out, strikes at you, bites, kicks etc. I have to nose twitch her and stick her in the muscle as fast as I can. She is allergic to bug bites too and has thin skin so I'm guessing that's why it bothers her so much.
I have not found any product on the market that prevents a horse from Bleeding and I'm not willing to do much more trial and error as each time she bleeds in compromising her health and lung function.
Are there any universities or vets anyone knows of doing studies I can participate in? Or companies? I'm at my wits end.
What do the pros do? |
|
| |
|
 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 595
Location: North Dakota | What is your conditioning program like?
This is an interesting article ---> https://thoroedge.wordpress.com/2011/11/18/eiph-if-youre-not-breezin... |
|
| |
|
  Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
 
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | There is so much more then just medication for bleeders. Have you researched to find a vet that can assist in finding the right nutrition program etc? |
|
| |
|
 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
Location: Iowa | I believe I am a magnet for bleeders as well. A few things that have worked well for me:
-Tip top fitness condition before I even think about running.
-Pick and choose runs, if all the right conditions are there to make them bleed, draw out, it saves a sick horse later.
-Flair Nasal Strips
Supplements that have helped me get off the lasix are Bleeder Stop & Horse Power by Oxygen. Another one is Equine Science sells Mo Lung and SRS herbal blends at herbs4horses.com. Many people no longer use lasix and have improved their times.
Since there is no cure for it, at some point they will bleed again, my vet said to just be sure to give them time off and an antibiotic when they do. Have you tried giving lasix orally? I know some people who do and it seems to work for them. They just give more and a longer time period before they run.
Edited by Rausch_Jessica 2016-07-13 2:24 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | missroselee - 2016-07-13 12:01 PM
There is so much more then just medication for bleeders. Have you researched to find a vet that can assist in finding the right nutrition program etc?
I tried the holistic route for a while, I did the steam rolled oats, with cracked corn, beet pulp, DAC vitamins with vit K, coco soya oil with all the omega fatty acids and I do salt and electrolytes daily, that was my feed regumine for my last bleeder when I tried the all natural route - the ynaoun baio powder (spelling) and the holistic vets bleeding herbs, but he bled right through it.
So I wold be interested and open minded in hearing what other programs would work.
As far as my exercise program, I ride Sunday's (usually easy trail after shows on sat). I ride heavy Tuesday's (lots of long trotting and galloping). Thursday's same as wed, or if I ride in arena I do different drills but try to lope a lot. Friday's light riding if I have a show sat.
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Rausch_Jessica - 2016-07-13 2:22 PM
I believe I am a magnet for bleeders as well. A few things that have worked well for me:
-Tip top fitness condition before I even think about running.
-Pick and choose runs, if all the right conditions are there to make them bleed, draw out, it saves a sick horse later.
-Flair Nasal Strips
Supplements that have helped me get off the lasix are Bleeder Stop & Horse Power by Oxygen. Another one is Equine Science sells Mo Lung and SRS herbal blends at herbs4horses.com. Many people no longer use lasix and have improved their times.
Since there is no cure for it, at some point they will bleed again, my vet said to just be sure to give them time off and an antibiotic when they do. Have you tried giving lasix orally? I know some people who do and it seems to work for them. They just give more and a longer time period before they run.
I tried giving it orally, it worked a few times then she bled, I don't think I gave it long enough out, I hate doing that because it's so hot down here and I hate keeping water from her. I let her drink a little sometimes. I do let her eat hay after lasix. What herbs exactly do you use? |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
Location: Iowa | The "Mo Lung" and "SRS Blend" used in combination. |
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 68
| Everyone who has bleeders should also consider joining the EIPH Support Group on FB that was just created.
Edited by Reester 2016-07-13 2:40 PM
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
Location: Iowa | Reester - 2016-07-13 2:39 PM Everyone who has bleeders should also consider joining the EIPH Support Group on FB that was just created.
Awesome idea, thanks! |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Reester - 2016-07-13 2:39 PM
Everyone who has bleeders should also consider joining the EIPH Support Group on FB that was just created.
I can't find a group, but I did find a great article when I searched for it
https://thoroedge.wordpress.com/2011/11/18/eiph-if-youre-not-breezin... |
|
| |
|
 Duct Tape Can't Fix Stupid
Posts: 2749
Location: Warsaw,NY | Give the lasix IV works alot faster and not as traumatic as giving in the muscle. It sure hurts alot less if u can get to your horse to do that. |
|
| |
|
Location: Oklahoma | My mare is a severe bleeder (out both nostrils, mouth and blows back on her & me). August 1 last year she bled through the Lasix and extremely bad so we did the antibiotics, time off, etc. Because she is so bad and has had such a history with bleeding, my vet suggested we stem cell her lungs. While it's not proven to work yet, they are doing clinical trials on racehorses (mainly) as well as some barrel horses with good results.
Weekend before Thanksgiving we had the stem cells injected then gave her the 2 months off. By then it was winter so I started legging her up in early spring (when her allergies are bad). I sent her to swim for a few weeks and am very persistent about making sure she is in tip top shape! For example, I rode at 4:30 yesterday morning to make sure she got ridden!
June 12 was our first run back in almost a year. I did up her Lasix amount but she was more than ready! I was a nervous wreck and cried a cry of relief afterwards. I decided that every run I get is a blessing and if/when she bleeds again, she will be retired.
I am picky about where I enter because I would rather make 20 more runs than run her at a place not good for her and she be done. She does get 2 platinum lung supplements, air power before I run and the week leading up to running her, she gets a dose of ventipulmin every night as well as electrolytes.
Bleeders are hard work and I have learned a lot over the past 3 years. Don't give up hope! |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | larnerich - 2016-07-14 11:27 AM
My mare is a severe bleeder (out both nostrils, mouth and blows back on her & me). August 1 last year she bled through the Lasix and extremely bad so we did the antibiotics, time off, etc. Because she is so bad and has had such a history with bleeding, my vet suggested we stem cell her lungs. While it's not proven to work yet, they are doing clinical trials on racehorses (mainly) as well as some barrel horses with good results.
Weekend before Thanksgiving we had the stem cells injected then gave her the 2 months off. By then it was winter so I started legging her up in early spring (when her allergies are bad). I sent her to swim for a few weeks and am very persistent about making sure she is in tip top shape! For example, I rode at 4:30 yesterday morning to make sure she got ridden!
June 12 was our first run back in almost a year. I did up her Lasix amount but she was more than ready! I was a nervous wreck and cried a cry of relief afterwards. I decided that every run I get is a blessing and if/when she bleeds again, she will be retired.
I am picky about where I enter because I would rather make 20 more runs than run her at a place not good for her and she be done. She does get 2 platinum lung supplements, air power before I run and the week leading up to running her, she gets a dose of ventipulmin every night as well as electrolytes.
Bleeders are hard work and I have learned a lot over the past 3 years. Don't give up hope!
So after doing the stem cell thing you still gave her lasix? My problem is my mare doesn't do shots, I hate twitching her just to give her a shot and studies show the bad bleeders bleed through lasix anyway. My old eventing trainer wrote me up a riding schedule and exercise program I've started this week. She said the better shape they're in the less They will bleed with or without drugs.
Where can you get air power? I looked up T.H.E pulomez lung supplement and it's pretty expensive for 30 days $140. I've also looked up vitamin K and selenium products there's so many options it makes my head spin.
The holistic vet also has a bleeding formula powder. I don't know what to start with. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 418
| Rausch_Jessica - 2016-07-13 2:22 PM
I believe I am a magnet for bleeders as well. A few things that have worked well for me:
-Tip top fitness condition before I even think about running.
-Pick and choose runs, if all the right conditions are there to make them bleed, draw out, it saves a sick horse later.
-Flair Nasal Strips
Supplements that have helped me get off the lasix are Bleeder Stop & Horse Power by Oxygen. Another one is Equine Science sells Mo Lung and SRS herbal blends at herbs4horses.com. Many people no longer use lasix and have improved their times.
Since there is no cure for it, at some point they will bleed again, my vet said to just be sure to give them time off and an antibiotic when they do. Have you tried giving lasix orally? I know some people who do and it seems to work for them. They just give more and a longer time period before they run.
How much lasix and how far out when given orally? |
|
| |
|
| First and foremost. Heal the lung. 5 days Gentimycin Second order Lung Aid from Choice of Champions to heal that lung. Thirdly, if she is not a picky eater....herbs marshmallow root powder, Colts foot, cayenne pepper, hawthorn berry powder, slippery elm bark. Pre race give Wind Aid and or Cool Blast
You have to build and strengthen capillary system. I would swim her if at all possible. Cardiovascular strength is a must. |
|
| |
|
Location: Louisiana | I had a bad bleeder that was difficult to give shots to and I started her on Silver Lining Herbs NOLASIX. After several months on this supplement I weaned her off of the Lasix inj completely.
I did the nasal strips, lasix paste, ventipulmin, oxyhorse supplements and the only thing that worked was the Lasix inj until I started her on the NOLASIX of Silver Lining Herbs, I no longer use any other supplements on my mare or Lasix.
|
|
| |
|
 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| Jill - 2016-07-22 11:01 AM I had a bad bleeder that was difficult to give shots to and I started her on Silver Lining Herbs NOLASIX. After several months on this supplement I weaned her off of the Lasix inj completely.
I did the nasal strips, lasix paste, ventipulmin, oxyhorse supplements and the only thing that worked was the Lasix inj until I started her on the NOLASIX of Silver Lining Herbs, I no longer use any other supplements on my mare or Lasix.
Have you scoped after a run to see if bleeding or have not seen blood from nostril? |
|
| |
|
Location: Louisiana | She's bled out of both nostrils 5 different times until I got it under control. Vet was on site to witness the bleeding and didn't feel the need to scope cause of the obvious. |
|
| |
|
Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| Jill - 2016-07-22 11:40 AM She's bled out of both nostrils 5 different times until I got it under control. Vet was on site to witness the bleeding and didn't feel the need to scope cause of the obvious.
Thanks, I've tried all kinds of supplements too. Mine had minor bleeding out only one nostril though, did not bleed out on the supplements but was at a big race with vet on site so had the opportunity to scope right after a run and he had still bled :(. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | rodeomom3 - 2016-07-22 11:49 AM
Jill - 2016-07-22 11:40 AM She's bled out of both nostrils 5 different times until I got it under control. Vet was on site to witness the bleeding and didn't feel the need to scope cause of the obvious.
Thanks, I've tried all kinds of supplements too. Mine had minor bleeding out only one nostril though, did not bleed out on the supplements but was at a big race with vet on site so had the opportunity to scope right after a run and he had still bled :(.
Read through the link I posted above it talks about what's a major bleed and what's a minor bleed and what you can and shouldn't deal with, it's long but a great article.
I'm looking up the silver lining herbs. The T.H.E. Is a little pricy |
|
| |
|
Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| RnRJack - 2016-07-22 2:35 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-07-22 11:49 AM Jill - 2016-07-22 11:40 AM She's bled out of both nostrils 5 different times until I got it under control. Vet was on site to witness the bleeding and didn't feel the need to scope cause of the obvious. Thanks, I've tried all kinds of supplements too. Mine had minor bleeding out only one nostril though, did not bleed out on the supplements but was at a big race with vet on site so had the opportunity to scope right after a run and he had still bled :(. Read through the link I posted above it talks about what's a major bleed and what's a minor bleed and what you can and shouldn't deal with, it's long but a great article. I'm looking up the silver lining herbs. The T.H.E. Is a little pricy
Thanks, good read |
|
| |
The dreaded Bleeder post - Anyone doing studies?