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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
  
| Picked him up from the trainers the evening on August 3rd, nostrils flaring, breathing hard, respiration was 65, improved at night but was high again the next day. My regular vet was out of town, saw another at the clinic, scoped clean, no cough, no discharge, sweating good. Diagnosed with summer pasture COPD, allergic to grass, keep him up, dex for 5 days, took 3 days for breathing to to improve. Follow up with regular vet 5 days later, doesn't think COPD, clear lungs, sweating, etc. Said turn him out, go back to normal routine, he has been great til today. Rode him Sunday, full sweat, no problems, left them out all day today, I usually put under fans in the afternoon but has not been as hot, brought him in at 4:30 to feed and respiration is over 100, temp of 103.9, hosed him down, per vet gave banamine and albuterol, 3 hours later normal resp and temp. He doesn't wheeze, does not cough, no discharge. Vet is puzzled as to what is causing this. Thanks | |
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  Independent Cuss
Posts: 3978
  
Location: Dearing, GA | Sounds like there is something he's allergic to. New fly spray brand? Shavings? Feed or hay?
Does he have bumps/hives anywhere? | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| The first episode no bumps that I could find. Today there were a few on one side of his back and a few bug bites in other places. Nothing different in his environment. I am thinking he is having a reaction to some type of bite/sting. I had his stall open and his feed in there when I called him up, he came running and wolfed down his feed. I think I need an epi pen for horses. | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| rodeomom3 - 2016-08-30 8:32 PM
Picked him up from the trainers the evening on August 3rd, nostrils flaring, breathing hard, respiration was 65, improved at night but was high again the next day. My regular vet was out of town, saw another at the clinic, scoped clean, no cough, no discharge, sweating good. Diagnosed with summer pasture COPD, allergic to grass, keep him up, dex for 5 days, took 3 days for breathing to to improve. Follow up with regular vet 5 days later, doesn't think COPD, clear lungs, sweating, etc. Said turn him out, go back to normal routine, he has been great til today. Rode him Sunday, full sweat, no problems, left them out all day today, I usually put under fans in the afternoon but has not been as hot, brought him in at 4:30 to feed and respiration is over 100, temp of 103.9, hosed him down, per vet gave banamine and albuterol, 3 hours later normal resp and temp. He doesn't wheeze, does not cough, no discharge. Vet is puzzled as to what is causing this. Thanks
This probably won't be helpful, but when I have allergies and asthma, I don't wheeze or cough, just tight chest and hugely difficult to breathe. My allergies show as sinus infections and nasal polyps. Might have the vet check his guteral pouch(?) and sinuses. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| rodeomom3 - 2016-08-30 8:32 PM
Picked him up from the trainers the evening on August 3rd, nostrils flaring, breathing hard, respiration was 65, improved at night but was high again the next day. My regular vet was out of town, saw another at the clinic, scoped clean, no cough, no discharge, sweating good. Diagnosed with summer pasture COPD, allergic to grass, keep him up, dex for 5 days, took 3 days for breathing to to improve. Follow up with regular vet 5 days later, doesn't think COPD, clear lungs, sweating, etc. Said turn him out, go back to normal routine, he has been great til today. Rode him Sunday, full sweat, no problems, left them out all day today, I usually put under fans in the afternoon but has not been as hot, brought him in at 4:30 to feed and respiration is over 100, temp of 103.9, hosed him down, per vet gave banamine and albuterol, 3 hours later normal resp and temp. He doesn't wheeze, does not cough, no discharge. Vet is puzzled as to what is causing this. Thanks
Did you pull blood?
What is the white blood cell count?
A horse with stomach issues such as colic can have the exact same symptoms of what you state. Mine had the same symptoms, first set of blood work normal, left her at the vet as wel both agreed something was brewing, got a call 3 days later saying she had a massive gi bleed and probably won't make it. Surprising she did but with major complications. | |
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 Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
Location: Florida.. | I could ditto to that.. stomach issues and impaction can cause high respiration.. and sometimes its psuedo obstructions so meaning not impacted but partially or slow motility..off and on... a GI issue.. | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| GLP - 2016-08-30 9:12 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-08-30 8:32 PM Picked him up from the trainers the evening on August 3rd, nostrils flaring, breathing hard, respiration was 65, improved at night but was high again the next day. My regular vet was out of town, saw another at the clinic, scoped clean, no cough, no discharge, sweating good. Diagnosed with summer pasture COPD, allergic to grass, keep him up, dex for 5 days, took 3 days for breathing to to improve. Follow up with regular vet 5 days later, doesn't think COPD, clear lungs, sweating, etc. Said turn him out, go back to normal routine, he has been great til today. Rode him Sunday, full sweat, no problems, left them out all day today, I usually put under fans in the afternoon but has not been as hot, brought him in at 4:30 to feed and respiration is over 100, temp of 103.9, hosed him down, per vet gave banamine and albuterol, 3 hours later normal resp and temp. He doesn't wheeze, does not cough, no discharge. Vet is puzzled as to what is causing this. Thanks This probably won't be helpful, but when I have allergies and asthma, I don't wheeze or cough, just tight chest and hugely difficult to breathe. My allergies show as sinus infections and nasal polyps. Might have the vet check his guteral pouch (? ) and sinuses.
Thanks, that is helpful. I have never had allergies or asthma so I always think coughing or wheezing goes with it. | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| cheryl makofka - 2016-08-30 9:16 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-08-30 8:32 PM Picked him up from the trainers the evening on August 3rd, nostrils flaring, breathing hard, respiration was 65, improved at night but was high again the next day. My regular vet was out of town, saw another at the clinic, scoped clean, no cough, no discharge, sweating good. Diagnosed with summer pasture COPD, allergic to grass, keep him up, dex for 5 days, took 3 days for breathing to to improve. Follow up with regular vet 5 days later, doesn't think COPD, clear lungs, sweating, etc. Said turn him out, go back to normal routine, he has been great til today. Rode him Sunday, full sweat, no problems, left them out all day today, I usually put under fans in the afternoon but has not been as hot, brought him in at 4:30 to feed and respiration is over 100, temp of 103.9, hosed him down, per vet gave banamine and albuterol, 3 hours later normal resp and temp. He doesn't wheeze, does not cough, no discharge. Vet is puzzled as to what is causing this. Thanks Did you pull blood? What is the white blood cell count? A horse with stomach issues such as colic can have the exact same symptoms of what you state. Mine had the same symptoms, first set of blood work normal, left her at the vet as wel both agreed something was brewing, got a call 3 days later saying she had a massive gi bleed and probably won't make it. Surprising she did but with major complications.
Edited by rodeomom3 2016-08-30 9:50 PM
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | And wondering too since we are having so much rain could there be a new weed thats growing and that he could be allergic to?!! Or maybe your hay guy is doing something different, maybe a new fertilizer? Just throwing my thoughts around... | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| My allergist told me that many allergies are acquired over time. My allergies didn't show up until I was 9 or 10. Same with my kids. We are allergic to pollens, molds, dust mites, blah, blah blah.  | |
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Boot Detective
Posts: 1900
| That sounds strange. I have no idea but I would also monitor his gums to help determine if he is getting in distress since a couple people indicated it could be GI issues. | |
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| What does your trainer say??
Sounds like he is having a drug withdrawl problems or a case of the heaves derived from being trained hard the last 5-6 days to make up for all the days he got no training ...
Simple heat exhaustion maybe the answer ... OR busted capillaries in the process of healing or forming scars in his lungs due to the above training schedule or over working ...
If he gets diagnosed with a disease only goldfish have ... ignore it and go on a 3 month turnout and add a good iron supplement like Red Cell and a good loose mineral like ADM GroStrong .. just throw a handful in his feed every other day ... and a $5 mineral salt block in his turnout area ...
Keep in mind a blood panel only shows what is happening at the exact time it is taken ... no long term data ... ask for red and white cell counts not the generic answer of red is higher than white or white is higher than normal blah blah blah .. a lot of things can cause either and no infection has been detected ..
If he belonged to me with no decent diagnosis .... I would do the 3 month program above which would give any lung bleeding to heal and revamp his red blood cells ... I would add a worming with Quest and go to a 5day on 5day off and 5 day on of 20cc's of a common wide range antibiotic like G-PEN ...
Vets and especially universities vets will never give you any simple diagnosis' or recovery advice ... because there is no money in it. A life time patient is a nice thing to have ..
The current fad sicknesses are allergies ... before every horse needed their stifles or hocks injected and then there was west nile and EPM or one of the 5 diseases AQHA makes millions on but has no data or number of cases they can base any claims on... try to find a picture of any of the 5 diseases that are recent and validated by number of cases ..
Try the KISS system that I find works for me because time is my best friend when it comes to doctoring on horses or myself. I remind myself all the time what KISS stands for .... Keep It Simple Stupid ... lol
GOOD LUCK!!
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Sock Snob
Posts: 3021
| keep a check on his temp that will give the roadmap of what to do next, | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| Definitely not withdrawal from drugs, he was only there 2 days and he did the exact same thing at my house. First visit vet gave him a shot of atropine, it lowered his respiration by half, given copd diagnosis-allergic to grass,resp back up when wore off. Took 5 days of dex for resp to return to normal, he was bright eyed and playful. 2nd vet thought could have been over heated but if that was/is the case I don't understand resp going back up once he is cooled off over night. Yesterday was low 90's, good breeze, lots of shade, was not worked, nothing extreme. Normal resp this morning, nice dirty stall, bright eyed and alert. Seems to be a reaction to something but whatever it is, it is unique to him, other 5 horses are fine. My vet is fantastic, does not charge me near what he could, gives me every discount he can and most often charges nothing if does not work on them and never a charge for a recheck.
Edited by rodeomom3 2016-08-31 6:14 AM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 448
Location: lone star state | Following
I've had 2 horses with similar issues this summer. I treated as overheating both times and saw immediate improvement after hosing off with cool water and fan/shade. The humidity in east Texas has been really hard on our animals this year :( Very curious if there is a diagnosis or if this is simply overheating due to temps/humidity.
Edited by firewaterfuelsme 2016-08-31 9:18 AM
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | Nancy the next thing I would do is go ahead and get a BAL and see if the cytology they get supports some sort of inflammatory or allergic condition going on. They can also put an ultrasound on his lungs and look for changes on the lung surface. There's always some minor changes but if there's a lot or something obvious that would help. He may need to be nebulized with an albuterol type product for a fairly regular basis and then tapered off.
Colic and Chest pain look similar because horses don't really know how to localize their pain well. Honestly, more often people mistake lung/chest pain FOR colic, not the other way around. But like I said... horses really just show pain a few ways and they can mimic each other very well, so kudos for y'all picking up on that and realizing that. | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| casualdust07 - 2016-08-31 9:27 AM Nancy the next thing I would do is go ahead and get a BAL and see if the cytology they get supports some sort of inflammatory or allergic condition going on. They can also put an ultrasound on his lungs and look for changes on the lung surface. There's always some minor changes but if there's a lot or something obvious that would help. He may need to be nebulized with an albuterol type product for a fairly regular basis and then tapered off. Colic and Chest pain look similar because horses don't really know how to localize their pain well. Honestly, more often people mistake lung/chest pain FOR colic, not the other way around. But like I said... horses really just show pain a few ways and they can mimic each other very well, so kudos for y'all picking up on that and realizing that.
Thanks Lauren | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| firewaterfuelsme - 2016-08-31 9:17 AM Following I've had 2 horses with similar issues this summer. I treated as overheating both times and saw immediate improvement after hosing off with cool water and fan/shade. The humidity in east Texas has been really hard on our animals this year :( Very curious if there is a diagnosis or if this is simply overheating due to temps/humidity.
I am in Sealy west of Houston, it is like he is mimicking anhydrosis but he is sweating. He had a hard workout last week, dripping sweat, blowing hard, recovered in minutes though. I wonder though if too hot for too long triggers this but it was not that hot yesterday but it was humid. I've checked on him every 2 hours today, do far so good. I don't want to stress him but yet I want to figure out what the trigger is. | |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | rodeomom3 - 2016-08-31 12:46 PM firewaterfuelsme - 2016-08-31 9:17 AM Following I've had 2 horses with similar issues this summer. I treated as overheating both times and saw immediate improvement after hosing off with cool water and fan/shade. The humidity in east Texas has been really hard on our animals this year :( Very curious if there is a diagnosis or if this is simply overheating due to temps/humidity. I am in Sealy west of Houston, it is like he is mimicking anhydrosis but he is sweating. He had a hard workout last week, dripping sweat, blowing hard, recovered in minutes though. I wonder though if too hot for too long triggers this but it was not that hot yesterday but it was humid. I've checked on him every 2 hours today, do far so good. I don't want to stress him but yet I want to figure out what the trigger is.
I bet the humidty and heat are causing this, i have had to hose off one of my horses a few times this month and he was not even rode just coming in from pasture. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 915
Location: SE KS | Heat exhaustion can be cumulative(sp) in people, might affect horses the same way?  | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| Southtxponygirl - 2016-08-31 1:24 PM rodeomom3 - 2016-08-31 12:46 PM firewaterfuelsme - 2016-08-31 9:17 AM Following I've had 2 horses with similar issues this summer. I treated as overheating both times and saw immediate improvement after hosing off with cool water and fan/shade. The humidity in east Texas has been really hard on our animals this year :( Very curious if there is a diagnosis or if this is simply overheating due to temps/humidity. I am in Sealy west of Houston, it is like he is mimicking anhydrosis but he is sweating. He had a hard workout last week, dripping sweat, blowing hard, recovered in minutes though. I wonder though if too hot for too long triggers this but it was not that hot yesterday but it was humid. I've checked on him every 2 hours today, do far so good. I don't want to stress him but yet I want to figure out what the trigger is.
Edited by rodeomom3 2016-08-31 4:50 PM
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 Mature beyond Years
Posts: 10780
Location: North of the 49th Parallel | I'd do a BAL. | |
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| I've had a couple of horses do this (high respiration rate and running a temp) and it most defiantly had something to do with heat and being on pasture. I've suspected it was linked to high sugar in the grass. | |
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 Worst.Housekeeper.EVER.
Location: Missouri | My mare has done this all summer. So frustrating! I have noticed that it has to do with the heat AND humidity combined. Hot days are okay as long as it's not too humid, but some magic combination of the two and she stops sweating effectively and starts panting, then her temp soars.
I fed One AC but not sure it actually helped. Otherwise, just managed the episodes with cold hosing, fans, etc. | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| just4fun - 2016-09-01 8:53 AM My mare has done this all summer. So frustrating! I have noticed that it has to do with the heat AND humidity combined. Hot days are okay as long as it's not too humid, but some magic combination of the two and she stops sweating effectively and starts panting, then her temp soars.
I fed One AC but not sure it actually helped. Otherwise, just managed the episodes with cold hosing, fans, etc.
Mine continues to sweat so that is not the issue or trigger with him. I am pretty sure he had heat stroke the first time and once that happens they are more susceptible to the heat and humidity for a while. He is very picky about his water so it is a pretty safe guess he was not drinking good there. I have brought him home from there before and he has gone straight to the water trough. He was ridden that morning, hosed off but instead of tied under a tree to dry which is the normal routine he was put up wet in the hot stall and he could not cool off, that combined with not drinking he got in distress. | |
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 Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | Could it be something with his heart? | |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| SmokinBandits - 2016-09-14 11:06 PM Could it be something with his heart?
Vet checked it, all good | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 787
Location: NE Pa-Gods Country | has he been tested for PSSM | |
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Wierd episodes with horse, any ideas??