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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | I have a horse that is Bully Buillon bred, been sent to trainer for 7 months, hauled and entered. He works for trainer, but not for us. Does not want to take right lead and when he does does not want to stay in it, wants to just quit. He is very laid back. He is bred and built to run barrels and can, but just seems to really have a hard time with myself and my daughter. I have been working on him and making him take the right lead, but boy is an effort. Trying not to get discouraged and am determined and will get him to work for me.
Anybody have any suggestions? |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
 
| I would take some lessons from the trainer. I used to take in a few outside horses (I am by no means a professional) but I always required the owners to come ride them a few times in their 30 days because the horses often work for me but not their owners. We all ride so differently, there could be the smallest detail you are missing which makes a world of difference.
With that said, some horses and people aren't compatible but hopefully yours is just a language thing. Speak the same language and hopefully it will work itself out.
Good luck |
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | Thank you, I am suppose to meet him this weekend and he is going to run him. But would also like to meet him and just ride and get some pointers, but it is hard to get with him. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2674
Location: Silver Lake, MN | I send my horses out too and I go ride once a week while they are in training so I can learn along with them since the horse I have now is complete opposite of what I had before. It's not easy but we are getting there! |
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | thank you for your encouragement, I know this horse is completely diffeent than what I am use to but sometimes get very frustrated. |
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 Horsezips Number One Fan
Posts: 3519
Location: on a horse | Have his hicks checked, may need injections |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 324
| I agree with what everyone else said, have the trainer try to help. See what he does different from you and try to replicate it. I am a believer that the horse's style shouldn't have to change to fit the rider, the rider's style should change to fit the horse.
With that being said, SOMETIMES there are horse/rider teams who are simply not meant to be. This has happened to me ONE time. I probably could've kept the mare and worked and worked, but together we would've been mediocre at best. I ended up selling her to give her a better chance to maximize her talent with someone who's riding style matched hers. I'd rather see a talented horse succeed with someone else than keep the horse and prevent it from meeting its full potential.
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | Love your name cowgirl up, that is what I keep telling myself to do. Had his teeth done again by a really super equine detinst and she said he had one sensitive tooth, I that did help at least he is not bracing anymore when I ask for the right lead, he just does not like doing it. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 477
Location: IA | I'm assuming that the trainer used a different saddle than you are currently riding in now. A horse that refuses to take a particular lead and behaves the way you said is being exceptionally kind if the saddle is hurting. I'd check saddle fit and then look at my pads.
If the horse worked good at the trainer, first thing I'd do is check saddles or even how I'm saddling him up.
I had a horse in that rode great for me, sent him home and he bucked like an eliminator. I went over to her place, put my saddle on him (hers was treeless) and set it where it was when I rode him....he walked off like a kitten and worked like a dream. Ended up having to sell my saddle to her, but they get along great now and he's never even shook under her once.
I'm glad that you are going back to the trainer for answers, I bet it's something pretty easy to fix, and shouldn't be a Vet issue. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 672
| If he is picking up the lead fine for your trainer but reluctant with you I would check saddle fit. Possibly is pinching him and making it uncomfortable. |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12842
| First of all, they will all try you. If they get away something once they will do it again. Mine do things with me that they would never dream of doing with my trainer. My paint horse got where he would whirl around rather than going down they alley. Trainer said whip his butt and make him go on. He stopped that fast. This horse is smart. I went to church barrel race. (Hate those). The horses that went before me threw a fit and riders almost did not get them in. I knew my horse was thinking hmm that looks like fun. He decided to have a little fit but when I whopped him with that over and under he WALKED right in. What I am saying is be more assertive.
On the leads, perhaps you are cueing the horse to pick up the lead differently than the trainer does and he does not understand what you are asking. |
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | I appreciate all of the advise and will try and follow up on it. I think you are right he does not take me seriously because I am old.
I am riding in a Debra Sibley and know he does not ride in one. I know the horse hated my daughters saddle. My friend put her sports saddle on him and that did not help. I think he prefers a hard saddle.
I will let you know after Thursday if things improve after he rides him. |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | I agree with the lessons from the trainer but I can also attest to sometimes it is just as simple of an answer as spending time on the ground with them and figure out what makes that horse tick. My mare CC I got as an unstarted 3 year old, the first 45 days were pretty good, then I started having issues with her at about the half hour mark. She'd be done learning and start to bolt, I"d grab her face and clamp with both legs and was 0 for 3 in the buck off department. Ended up sending her out for 30 days and got her over the breaking in two when life got to crazy for her but not the bolting, acting out, bi-polar stuff. It was really weird, on one hand she was the most broke of my 3, as long as a butterfly or leaf or whatever was her demons that day didn't happen by. Spent lots of miles and wet saddle blankets and lots of clinics and one race she'd do well, the next one you might as well have been on a 2 year old colt that had never seen the pattern, and I mean well into her 7 year old year. Very humbling, started to really chip away at my self confidence, I loved and hated her all at the same time. Then she fractured her patella in 2011. Spent the next 10 months on the ground with her, doctoring,cold hosing, massaging, hanging out praying at first. Then months of hand walking at first in straight lines out in the pasture, then over cavelettis, then up and down hills, then ponying her, and having to go back to hand walking her because she would bite the horse I ponied her off because they could not keep up with her.
BUT, I learned that horse inside out. Being on the ground with her taught me sooo much more about how she processed things, she would get scared and then be scared because she got scared and it just became a vicious circle. Once i got back to riding her that information was invaluable!!! And from 10 months of her needing me, really needing me she finally looked to me for help first. A few years later that shared respect for each other and knowing each other came into great use as we pulled her thru bladder stone surgery and her ongoing battle with kidney stones. I truly know that horse, know how to read her and she knows she can count on me. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1611
Location: bring on the heat, NV | So Ill give you something else to think on once you've made sure its not a physical ouchy issue or saddle fit. I have similar trouble with my big mare. Her right side is her stiff side and left hollow. Her left lead is fabulous. Her right she wants to brace and she'll drop a shoulder. It just so happens for what ever reason her right side is also my "weak side". I can ride a horse thats stiff to the left hollow to the right and have zero trouble. Before she got hurt i went to a centered riding instructor to learn what I could to help her out. Basically the biomechanics of my body and how to ride to help her. I do alot of suppling with her in warm up. I also bit her up every other day or so in a snaffle with bend on both sides and that helped alot. Ride inside leg to outside rein ;) Outside hand at wither height and my inside hand higher than her withers sit tall and not to forward. Feeling forward contact on the reins and when I feel her drop either half-halt or like sandy collier says "turn the key in the ignition" with your inside rein to bump him back up while helping when needed with my legs. You cant really hold them in all the time or they'll never learn to carry themselves you know. You could do alot of lope trot transitions to strengthen that side (dont forget the left lead too though!!) spiraling in and out til you find a happy spot and then building on that. Work out that weak leg of yours and ride with out stirrups too. We've had some hiccups health wise and while my last ride on her was fantastic and I had lovely trot extenstions etc... She hurt her hock and it took months off to heal. Then hubby went to using her and she took exception to the gelding next door and sprained the other hock plus a boute of strangles in my old geldings (super crazy quarantine lady here wouldnt ride or touch anyone) and we've not done any real training since august.... now im a wimpy rider who hates the cold.... It also wouldnt hurt to get on some other horses and see if you have the same trouble with them? Or at least feel if there is a difference? |
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 Cool As Ice
Posts: 4632
Location: Black Hills, South Dakota | A lot of the times it is the way a person rides. We all ride a little different. I had a cutting mare that just a few people could ride and when some people would get on she would grab the bit and just run. What helps to is video your trainer riding your horse. |
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 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | I would definitely talk to the trainer. I send mine out too and I have found a couple of things:
1) When my horses come back, I always take a lesson with the trainer, sometimes more than one lesson. Some styles of trainer's and I just don't click. While I try to not be set in my ways, I can't ride comfortably ride some trainer's horses.
2) When my horses have come back from the trainer (particularly green horses, or ones with their first 30 or 60 days) they like to test me to see if I'll let them get away with something. I don't let them get away with it, but I had a mare that wouldn't pickup her right lead. I call the trainer because I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong, and it just turned out I had to "make" her, she was just being a stinker. After that we did fine.
I do ride different than some trainers, and I realize that, so sometimes it is an adjustment period.
Edited by mtcanchazer 2016-12-28 4:02 PM
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| May I ask your experience level? How are you asking for the leads, are you setting them up for success?
I agree 100% with checking for soreness, being aware that saddle fit may have migrated into other issues due to compensation depending on how bad and how long it has been ill fitting.
I agree 100% with working with the trainer that he was sent to, but if this particular trainer is a ways away and hard to get lined up with, consider looking for someone closer to help you out.
When you say it's "work" to get him to take the right lead, how are to asking and how is he responding?
My SO ropes and once colts are broke and go to the box they don't spend a ton of time with the basics. I've been taking a couple that show promise and starting them on the pattern to add value. They tend to be very stuck on the left lead and going right feels like a whole new world. I have to spend a lot of time on overall balance, figure 8's, spirals, serpentines to get them trotting the same both ways with soft changes of direction. Then time my cues correctly so they can push off the outside hind/left leg and into the right lead.
It's possible he's testing you, it's possible he's sore, it's possible he's confused about what you're asking him to do. |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | run n rate - 2016-12-28 12:48 PM
I agree with the lessons from the trainer but I can also attest to sometimes it is just as simple of an answer as spending time on the ground with them and figure out what makes that horse tick. My mare CC I got as an unstarted 3 year old, the first 45 days were pretty good, then I started having issues with her at about the half hour mark. She'd be done learning and start to bolt, I"d grab her face and clamp with both legs and was 0 for 3 in the buck off department. Ended up sending her out for 30 days and got her over the breaking in two when life got to crazy for her but not the bolting, acting out, bi-polar stuff. It was really weird, on one hand she was the most broke of my 3, as long as a butterfly or leaf or whatever was her demons that day didn't happen by. Spent lots of miles and wet saddle blankets and lots of clinics and one race she'd do well, the next one you might as well have been on a 2 year old colt that had never seen the pattern, and I mean well into her 7 year old year. Very humbling, started to really chip away at my self confidence, I loved and hated her all at the same time. Then she fractured her patella in 2011. Spent the next 10 months on the ground with her, doctoring,cold hosing, massaging, hanging out praying at first. Then months of hand walking at first in straight lines out in the pasture, then over cavelettis, then up and down hills, then ponying her, and having to go back to hand walking her because she would bite the horse I ponied her off because they could not keep up with her.
BUT, I learned that horse inside out. Being on the ground with her taught me sooo much more about how she processed things, she would get scared and then be scared because she got scared and it just became a vicious circle. Once i got back to riding her that information was invaluable!!! And from 10 months of her needing me, really needing me she finally looked to me for help first. A few years later that shared respect for each other and knowing each other came into great use as we pulled her thru bladder stone surgery and her ongoing battle with kidney stones. I truly know that horse, know how to read her and she knows she can count on me.
And she loves you RNR  |
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Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | Its a mutual admiration society between the two of us, I know I can face whatever happens that day as long as I see that little funny blaze of her's hanging over her gate each morning. As long as they breath we stand a chance to fix whatever it is they are dealing with, as long as we don't quit them we both stand a chance. Sometimes the hard ones come into our lives to help us fix us. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | And sometimes horse and rider just dont click.  |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 929
| Ride with the trainer but also another thing might be your saddle. I have a colt right now that won't work for me because the bars of my saddle were too wide and pinching behind the wither. He literally would stop behind the barrel and not pick up the left lead because it hurt. All of the suggestions here are great. Hope you get it figured out...this can be sooooo frustrating! |
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Veteran
Posts: 220
Location: Conroe, TX 77304 | Things are going better, since I got his teeth redone and keep working with him to take the right lead. Actually he took it really good this weekend and we are able to go to the 1st barrel in the right lead after we circled to the right in the middle of the arena and came around the arena back to the 1st. He did that 3 times, so I quit and feel like I am getting somewhere.
Thank you all for your advise. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
|  It is always nice to hear a good update. |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas |  |
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Horse that is hard to deal with