|
|
 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
 
Location: Saskatchewan | I know this horse has the natural ability to get there, and I've trained her from scratch this far.... I just need a little help getting *there*.
The first season I started to run her, our best runs landed us at the top of the 2D (2nd or 3rd, usually only a handful of girls were clocking 1D at the jackpots I was going to. One time, our 2nd in the 2D was the 5th fastest time of the day), and when I really screwed up, we would end up winning the 3D or something in that area.
She's a grade horse I picked up for free as a yearling and have done every single thing with her myself. When I decided to get her on barrels, it was the first time I really tried to run barrels. I was a team roper through and through, so I literally had no idea what to do when actually running a barrel horse.
She runs in a smooth dogbone jr. cowhorse but I want to try to run her in a ring snaffle this year, she does better when I stay away from her face.
So, what advice do you have for me to get this horse clocking a little bit faster? As I just said, I really had no idea how to ride a barrel horse (in a run) before I started to run this horse, so most of the problems are my fault 100%.
Here are a few videos of our best runs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ON-0G4hfW6s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_L4mrvHOQo4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZcXd-vrwdg
Breezing through with a snaffle:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-5hHtTCNVo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-i0CUrvzhg
See, the horse has a lot of ability, it's just me that's the problem!
Edited by QHriderKE 2017-06-05 9:19 AM
|
|
| |
|
 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
  
| I suggest you go to a clinic. You would be amazed how much that will help. Go and try to absorb everything.
You are losing a lot of time in your turns and leaving the barrel. Also the horse looks like mine---a fat sausage. Get the horse trimmed down so it is not having to haul around so much weight. |
|
| |
|
 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| You have done a good job. I would find a good trainer to send her to fine tune the details, tighter turns, straighter lines, not starting your turn to soon. Then they can teach you how to ride her and keep her there. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | streakysox - 2017-04-19 12:13 PM
I suggest you go to a clinic. You would be amazed how much that will help. Go and try to absorb everything.
You are losing a lot of time in your turns and leaving the barrel. Also the horse looks like mine---a fat sausage. Get the horse trimmed down so it is not having to haul around so much weight.
I'm trying to get to a few clinics this year, it's in the works.
She's honestly just that type of horse. I had her on a starvation diet (only got turned out on green grass mornings and evenings, slow feed hay net the rest of the time, and a complete feed with noni and a few other supplements), rode nearly daily and did a lot of long trotting and conditioning and everything you're supposed to do.... and this is how trim she got:
I'm convinced she's just a chunk that that's all there is to it.
I've been trying to get a smaller pocket on 2nd, seems to be a recurring issue that we take that one wide.
And the video where she goes super wide on first, I made her do that because when I was practicing the day before, she kept wanting to murder that barrel so I played it safe and made sure she didn't, so that one was all me. |
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 2128
| First of all, you've done a great job!! Well done! I have a horse that looks chunky no matter how fit he is also, I feel your pain. I spent some time with Sarah Rose McDonald a couple of months ago and she really believes in super tight turns. She would have me run basically right at the barrels and just to the side enough to not hit them (when their hip is past the barrel) and have them come back to you and out of the turn. I visualize the pattern much differently now. I see it in my runs also. My turns are quicker /tighter with less steps. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I was going to go to a clinic put on by a really good barrel horse trainer, but of course, it falls on the same day as my college graduation!
I've been on the hunt for other clinics around, so I will try to get to as many as I can! |
|
| |
|
 Zeal Queen
Posts: 3826
Location: TEXAS | scwebster - 2017-04-19 1:33 PM First of all, you've done a great job!! Well done! I have a horse that looks chunky no matter how fit he is also, I feel your pain. I spent some time with Sarah Rose McDonald a couple of months ago and she really believes in super tight turns. She would have me run basically right at the barrels and just to the side enough to not hit them (when their hip is past the barrel) and have them come back to you and out of the turn. I visualize the pattern much differently now. I see it in my runs also. My turns are quicker /tighter with less steps.
Wouldn't that force a horse to have a roll back style? |
|
| |
|
Regular
Posts: 53
| Your losing a lot of time on the second. Ideally your horse should only have three strides around the barrel. Go back to your slow work. Look on YouTube under Sheri Cervi. She has videos of drills that she does with her horses. |
|
| |
|
Zeal Queen
Posts: 3826
Location: TEXAS | I'm about to try out a new tool Kimmie Wall has. It's $65 and you send her a video. It breaks your run down and shows where you are losing time. |
|
| |
|
 Too Skinny
Posts: 8009
Location: LA Lower Alabama | slacy09 - 2017-04-19 2:43 PM I'm about to try out a new tool Kimmie Wall has. It's $65 and you send her a video. It breaks your run down and shows where you are losing time.
Ill do that for $50 |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2128
| slacy09 - 2017-04-19 2:23 PM scwebster - 2017-04-19 1:33 PM First of all, you've done a great job!! Well done! I have a horse that looks chunky no matter how fit he is also, I feel your pain. I spent some time with Sarah Rose McDonald a couple of months ago and she really believes in super tight turns. She would have me run basically right at the barrels and just to the side enough to not hit them (when their hip is past the barrel) and have them come back to you and out of the turn. I visualize the pattern much differently now. I see it in my runs also. My turns are quicker /tighter with less steps. Wouldn't that force a horse to have a roll back style?
I see what you are saying and it crossed my mind as well. From what I gathered its almost like a rollback but you use your feet to round them out of the back of the turn. This would have been a great question for me to ask her when I had the chance. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I would say that the 2nd barrel is my biggest obstacle. If I set her up right for 1st, she snaps around it just fine. I just have to remember to set her up right for it.
I'm not sure if really riding her by 2nd would help or make it worse? In slow work, I work on a TON of rate, cause she needs it, and I do a lot of counter arcing on the back-side to get her finishing and leg yielding her to the left between 2 and 3 to reinforce finishing the barrel as well, but it has yet to really "stick" when it comes to running. I'm usually really happy with her slow work when I compare it to all of the videos of different exercises on youtube. I'm pretty sure that a lot of the issues are just me being a crappy jockey when we run. She's not seasoned, and really needs me to step up my game and give her the support she needs to make a smokin run.
I have a habit of just quitting riding between 2nd and 3rd, I need someone to scream and yell at me for that, too. She rates down and turns 3rd nice all on her own because of that.
I'm wondering if I should be really driving her into her turns more? Like sort of think of pushing her through her pocket before sitting down to turn? Also, is bitting down to a snaffle a good choice? She seems to just be more free and smooth if she can kind of "ignore" or the cues are more subdued in the snaffle. I do all schooling and slow work in this bit:
http://cdnll.doversaddlery.com/images/xl/0010177.jpg
It would be what I'd run her in too if the stars align lol. She rides in a bosal just fine I found out when I bought one for another horse, so I don't see why I couldn't run her in the snaffle....
I've exhausted nearly every barrel horse training video on youtube just to get this horse this far. Training one from scratch isn't a walk in the park, that's for sure. Making a half decent head or heel horse? I can do that. Ranch horse? Heck, they're all ranch horses first! Barrel horse? Way out of my element!!!!
Most days, I think I've somehow trained a horse that is beyond my ability.
I'm going to try to even just practice with and pick the brains of some good barrel racers/trainers in the area I'm moving to in a month. Every little bit helps!
Edited by QHriderKE 2017-04-19 3:24 PM
|
|
| |
|
 Saint Stacey
| What I'm seeing is a horse that lacks a little confidence. In some ways, you've done a beautiful job. In other ways, you've sort of set this horse up to fail. You seem to rely more on your hands than your body. You are basically running into your turns and then you pull the horse around. You barely sit so you aren't giving the horse a chance to rate and turn before you are pulling. I would walk to my rate point forward in the saddle and two handed. When I get to that point, I would roll my butt back, sit down deep, say Whoa and let the horse have a chance to stop before I pulled on the reins. Then I would let the horse move forward, twist my torso, inside leg off, outside on and maybe slightly lift on the rein to help finish. Concentrate more on your body telling the horse where to go and less on your hands forcing the turns.You've taken the snap out by making the horse anticipate the snatch on the mouth. Your horse WANTS to turn. Stop trying to force it and just let the horse work by using your body and feet.
On second, JMHO but you are starting your turn too soon and making your pocket too big. I'd drive straight across the pen, about 3' off the barrel, hold the horse straight until between his shoulder and my leg was even with the barrel, then let him turn. That gives you three strides around second instead of the five or six you are currently doing.
Also, not sure why you were loping through the pattern in the slop?? As slick as it was, practicing in that is a good way to injure one or take all the try out of them. Again, JMO.
These videos are a few years old. But they show what I'm talking about on second.
https://youtu.be/GCwVyMLig5M
https://youtu.be/wpdjLr6JPhw
https://youtu.be/eBp7cRhq9Ps
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I didn't think it was slop, it's a little slick but I didn't push her, so she could figure it out.
I plan to rodeo off this horse, so she'll have to get used to less than ideal ground sooner or later.
I've ranched off of this horse long before running barrels off her, I've roped cows in December in the ice and snow off her, if she can't handle a little slip, then it is what it is. |
|
| |
|
 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I remember when you posted these videos the first time, I say find a good clinic so you can learn how to help your horse and yourself..
You are jerking on her head to turn, you need to learn how to use your hands..
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2017-04-19 5:17 PM
|
|
| |
|
Saint Stacey
| QHriderKE - 2017-04-19 3:53 PM
I didn't think it was slop, it's a little slick but I didn't push her, so she could figure it out.
I plan to rodeo off this horse, so she'll have to get used to less than ideal ground sooner or later.
I've ranched off of this horse long before running barrels off her, I've roped cows in December in the ice and snow off her, if she can't handle a little slip, then it is what it is.
If you've ranched off of her in the mud, roped cows in the ice, etc then she knows how to keep her feet underneath her in crap conditions. She obviously knows the barrel pattern. She shouldn't need to be practiced in the slop to learn how to handle it. Don't make the mistake of potentially injuring a nice horse by having a teenager mentality when it comes to practicing. We've all done it at one point. Learn from the mistakes that some of us have already made. I don't know of any pro girls that practice in the mud. Ride in it, sure. Gallop a barrel pattern, no. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | At the moment it looked fine, until it got a bit deep and she had to fight the ground a little on third. It is what it is. I know this horse cant handle a slip here or there without hurting herself. She was bred to be a bronc or a pack-horse in the mountains after all...
Little slips here or there aren't going to worry me with this horse. The scar on her knee? Tried jumping a 6ft panel as a yearling.... and she's 100% sound on it. I have the confidence that this horse can handle a few slips. |
|
| |
|
  Sock eating dog owner
Posts: 4557
Location: Where the pavement ends and the West begins Utah | Apply square in slow work. Not round. Don't ask,let us know if the light bulb turns on. Good luck. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 516
| SKM - 2017-04-19 4:32 PM
What I'm seeing is a horse that lacks a little confidence. In some ways, you've done a beautiful job. In other ways, you've sort of set this horse up to fail. You seem to rely more on your hands than your body. You are basically running into your turns and then you pull the horse around. You barely sit so you aren't giving the horse a chance to rate and turn before you are pulling. I would walk to my rate point forward in the saddle and two handed. When I get to that point, I would roll my butt back, sit down deep, say Whoa and let the horse have a chance to stop before I pulled on the reins. Then I would let the horse move forward, twist my torso, inside leg off, outside on and maybe slightly lift on the rein to help finish. Concentrate more on your body telling the horse where to go and less on your hands forcing the turns.You've taken the snap out by making the horse anticipate the snatch on the mouth. Your horse WANTS to turn. Stop trying to force it and just let the horse work by using your body and feet.
On second, JMHO but you are starting your turn too soon and making your pocket too big. I'd drive straight across the pen, about 3' off the barrel, hold the horse straight until between his shoulder and my leg was even with the barrel, then let him turn. That gives you three strides around second instead of the five or six you are currently doing.
Also, not sure why you were loping through the pattern in the slop?? As slick as it was, practicing in that is a good way to injure one or take all the try out of them. Again, JMO.
These videos are a few years old. But they show what I'm talking about on second.
https://youtu.be/GCwVyMLig5M
https://youtu.be/wpdjLr6JPhw
https://youtu.be/eBp7cRhq9Ps
I completely agree with this. You're riding with your hands when you really need to ride with your body. I think that would fix a lot of the issues you're having.
Take some lessons to get your muscle memory where it needs to be, that's going to help you the most.
Like SKM said, give the horse a chance to turn before you're pulling on them. If you give them that option, they'll start hunting the turn and WANT to turn and you'll never have to worry about blowing barrels. |
|
| |
|
 Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | Eh, Red is still a "chunky" horse no matter what I do. Some are just like that. As long as you know you have her on a good exercise and diet plan; just have her as fit as you can.
We've talked about your 2nd barrel before.  And yes, it usually costs you a lot of time. I agree that you need to use your body more. I think Squiggs would be a lot faster if she was smooooother in her turns. He seems "choppy" and anytime you do that it loses momentum. If you need to rate your little speed demon, learn to use your seat. And be very steady and smooth with your direct rein. Just GUIDE her around the barrel; don't try to pull as that just creates that "choppy" movement.
Focus on having good clean patterns. No arcing into the turn, or arcs when you leave a turn. The more ground you have to cover, the more time you waste. Red's best runs are when he has "perfect" patterns. He might not be the fastest, so I have to focus on minimizing the amount of ground we need to cover.
In general, I think you usually come into your 2nd barrel TOO WIDE. I think Squiggs has the ability to really wrap around a barrel, so let her. Set your sights on your pocket, about 4 feet from the barrel. Based on the arena or how hard she is running will determine when you need to sit (sometimes sooner, sometimes later). Then just GUIDE her with your hand around the turn, use your legs, and "look" with your body (but not too soon, of course). Let her do the work -- just guide her.
As far as the snaffle, (in your slow work video), I think she does look happier in it. I used to run Red in a Jr. Cowhorse too and then I switched him a Little S and he likes that better. He too is very light and likes me to leave him alone.
On your run with the snaffle, again, it is going to be important for you to set her up right. Make sure you send her to that spot you need on your pocket. If you let her get too big of a pocket or too deep, you lose a lot of time. And use your body (seat and legs). Just guide with that hand. Also, I think your reins are too long.
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | ^^ Thanks!
I know I just have to get out of her way and let her do it, but it's so hard to break the habit of baby sitting. I'm going to exhibition or just haul to a new arena and treat it as a jackpot a couple times so I don't have to worry about time, and just practice finding the right spot on the second barrel for her.
Are my reins too long all the time? Cause when I breezed her through in a snaffle I was using split reins, lol. |
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Look at the riders on these two horses. The young lady on the bay bought the horse trained. The girl that sold the horse works with her weekly so that she rides the horse the same way every run. Will post several videos so watch her hands. The young lady is currently standing second in her region in college rodeo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddRqg2OlFbs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
This is a different horse but watch the rider. She rides the same way every time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQahg8qIDDo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXC_xD8HNLw
Both of these are young horses. Both are in the top 5 or 6 in horses the 1D running against 500 to 700 horses. Also, notice there is no wasted motion in any of the turns. Both are super nice horses.
Edited by streakysox 2017-04-20 12:02 PM
|
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | QHriderKE - 2017-04-20 10:33 AM ^^ Thanks! I know I just have to get out of her way and let her do it, but it's so hard to break the habit of baby sitting. I'm going to exhibition or just haul to a new arena and treat it as a jackpot a couple times so I don't have to worry about time, and just practice finding the right spot on the second barrel for her. Are my reins too long all the time? Cause when I breezed her through in a snaffle I was using split reins, lol.
Watching this run
https://youtu.be/N-i0CUrvzhg
Your reins are way too long. Look at how out in space your hand goes.
Ideally, your hand should be staying near or around your saddle horn. Again, you are just GUIDING your horse. You should be making smooth quiet cues. Right now, you are moving your hand way too much.
For example, with the video in question, watch as you approach your 2nd barrel. Granted, you had to "fix" coming out wide from your first, but you have your inside hand on the opposite side of her neck trying to hold her off the 2nd barrel (instead, use that inside LEG ... not your hands). Crossing your inside hand over the neck often will make them dive that shoulder in. Then, when you get to the barrel, you are yanking your hand very suddenly to turn her, and moving your hand from the opposite side of her neck to WAY out to your left very quickly. That's what makes that turn so choppy and she's bouncing all over the place.
Also, watch your body position. You tend to lean alot.
Your best body position is actually on the first barrel, as far as you sitting nicely (you just sat way too late......) and staying fairly quiet with your body around the first. You don't lean very much on your first barrel, but are leaning foward and inside on your 2nd and 3rd. Stay centered.
|
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota |
Great examples. OP, look at where this rider is keeping her hands (quiet and low). That's what you should work toward. And yes, shorten your reins!! |
|
| |
|
 Chasin my Dream
Posts: 13651
Location: Alberta | Not sure how far you are from Ponoka, Alberta...as I see you're in SK. Charmayne James is coming there in May and I believe are looking for more participants. Look on the Everything Barrel Racing Alberta Facebook Page. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2128
|
I know that duo! :) He is special but so is the jockey and trainer. |
|
| |
|
A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | This thread is like DaJaVu,, LOL...
A good clinic to help you, your horse seems to be doing good, but to me its all about timing and hand placement.. I remember when all this was discussed once befor. 
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2017-04-20 2:42 PM
|
|
| |
|
 Gotta Have a Gray
Posts: 899
Location: Tex. Panhandle | I will say that a good clinic can be worth every penny! I was recently able to attend 1 with 3 NFR qualifiers and it really helped me fix my riding. Now they didnt really go over anything I wasnt aware of..... but I def wasnt doing what I needed to in my riding (both running and dry work). Fixing a few things has made a world of difference. My horses are working so much better and I'm riding so much more confidently! My horses are young experience wise so my confidence is really helping them step up. Excited to enter and see where we are. |
|
| |
|
 Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | Good news is, you have a lot to clean up in your turns which will probably put you where you want to be, bad news is (not that it's bad news) like said above you need to find someone to help you get there that has the experience!!!! I train my own horses but I also train with two professionals every week and each time I go I learn something new!! You can never stop learning or improving if you allow yourself to do so! I see so many people stuck in their ways and are to humble to ask for help. |
|
| |
|
Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| RnRJack - 2017-04-20 4:34 PM Good news is, you have a lot to clean up in your turns which will probably put you where you want to be, bad news is (not that it's bad news) like said above you need to find someone to help you get there that has the experience!!!! I train my own horses but I also train with two professionals every week and each time I go I learn something new!! You can never stop learning or improving if you allow yourself to do so! I see so many people stuck in their ways and are to humble to ask for help.
Even the best in my area who win everything and train their own take horses to my trainer to work out any kinks. I agree it is worth every penny.
Edited by rodeomom3 2017-04-20 5:16 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1612
Location: Cocoa, Florida | rodeomom3 - 2017-04-20 4:52 PM
RnRJack - 2017-04-20 4:34 PM Good news is, you have a lot to clean up in your turns which will probably put you where you want to be, bad news is (not that it's bad news) like said above you need to find someone to help you get there that has the experience!!!! I train my own horses but I also train with two professionals every week and each time I go I learn something new!! You can never stop learning or improving if you allow yourself to do so! I see so many people stuck in their ways and are to humble to ask for help.
Even the best in my area who win everything and train their own take horses to my trainer to work out any kinks. I agree it is worth every penny.
Exactly!! Even my trainers bump ideas off of each other because they ride and train very differently! One thIng I've been blessed to learn is how to ride and train the different styles, it's not easy running 2-3 different turning styles/running styles etc! I often over ride my open horses because I'm in "training" mode lol |
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| RnRJack - 2017-04-20 5:29 PM
rodeomom3 - 2017-04-20 4:52 PM
RnRJack - 2017-04-20 4:34 PM Good news is, you have a lot to clean up in your turns which will probably put you where you want to be, bad news is (not that it's bad news) like said above you need to find someone to help you get there that has the experience!!!! I train my own horses but I also train with two professionals every week and each time I go I learn something new!! You can never stop learning or improving if you allow yourself to do so! I see so many people stuck in their ways and are to humble to ask for help.
Even the best in my area who win everything and train their own take horses to my trainer to work out any kinks. I agree it is worth every penny.
Exactly!! Even my trainers bump ideas off of each other because they ride and train very differently! One thIng I've been blessed to learn is how to ride and train the different styles, it's not easy running 2-3 different turning styles/running styles etc! I often over ride my open horses because I'm in "training" mode lol
I have trained my own horses for 50 + years. I learned 40 years ago to get help when you need it. The buckskin horse in the videos is my horse. She lives at the trainer's. Her little sister is my ride. Same person trained her. Makes life so much easier |
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | rodeomom3 - 2017-04-20 4:52 PM RnRJack - 2017-04-20 4:34 PM Good news is, you have a lot to clean up in your turns which will probably put you where you want to be, bad news is (not that it's bad news) like said above you need to find someone to help you get there that has the experience!!!! I train my own horses but I also train with two professionals every week and each time I go I learn something new!! You can never stop learning or improving if you allow yourself to do so! I see so many people stuck in their ways and are to humble to ask for help. Even the best in my area who win everything and train their own take horses to my trainer to work out any kinks. I agree it is worth every penny.
I agree!
I routinely go ride with a reining trainer in my area. He knows how to get a horse using it's body correctly and it has been very beneficial for our barrel racing!
And pumped I get to go to both a Ryan Lovendahl clinic and a Jolene Montgomery clinic this summer!
You never stop learning.
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | My video person messed up, but here's the last half of my run today. Had a little bauble coming into 2nd, but got it wrapped up nice and... snug.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jlMr7Yquo
Still waiting to find out where our time put us. MAN does this mare love to RUN! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Results are up and we got 5th in the 2D with that run, making it the 12th fastest time of the day. Once we get smoother turns figured out, the 1D is in sight! |
|
| |
|
 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | QHriderKE - 2017-04-30 10:08 AM
Results are up and we got 5th in the 2D with that run, making it the 12th fastest time of the day. Once we get smoother turns figured out, the 1D is in sight!
 |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I know the video is awful, but you can see that she came off of second a lot nicer than before. I looked at a flag on the fence right behind the barrel and rode to it. Had a much straighter line between second and third! Also, ran her in a three-piece snaffle that day too. I'm excited! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Actually, now that the final results came in, we were 8th fastest of the day (5th in 2D) and rolled our time over to the second jp for 9th fastest(6th in 2D).
I'll take it! |
|
| |
|
 Mighty Elk Slayer
Posts: 2428
Location: Lewisburg, Tennessee | cow pie - 2017-04-19 4:39 PM Apply square in slow work. Not round. Don't ask,let us know if the light bulb turns on. Good luck.
HA! This made me laugh out loud - I totally get what you're saying but it took me having Connie Combs hand-walk a horse around a barrel before my "light bulb" went off. Good advice! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I think I need to breeze her a little more, get some "air" in her.
This also landed us in the 2D with lots of room for improvement. Once I move my horse here with me I'm going to be on the hunt for a clinic or even someone I can just pay to ride with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJFr9eK8ZCw
Blowing first here was all my fault, didn't rate her enough dangit!! It's hard to get used to such a big pen and a horse that just wants to run all over it haha!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmsbbwMsaBE |
|
| |
|
 To the Left
Posts: 1865
Location: Florida | First, once your horse is trained don't exhibition. Just Stop. Every time you enter an alleyway you horse should know this is it. Go all out evey time. Too much practice makes you sloopy. I have never understood why anyone would drill a made horse, it confuses and bores them, Just run like you mean it, every time. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I've never exhibitioned this horse?
Everyone I've entered her, I've yet to hold her back or "train" we just... "go for 90" for lack of a better term lol
I also do as little slow work and drills as possible, I spend more time conditioning and checking cows and using her for ranch work than drilling her.
Edited by QHriderKE 2017-05-18 9:01 PM
|
|
| |
|
 Veteran
Posts: 110
| I agree with what has been said but I also think you should work on cleaning up your lines. What is happening is that you come across the pen to wide and your mare is collapsing on your pocket. When you leave a barrel you should be level with your rate point for the next. This helps you run a smaller pattern but also keeps your horse more confident in the turn. Good luck! |
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | QHriderKE - 2017-05-18 9:00 PM I've never exhibitioned this horse? Everyone I've entered her, I've yet to hold her back or "train" we just... "go for 90" for lack of a better term lol I also do as little slow work and drills as possible, I spend more time conditioning and checking cows and using her for ranch work than drilling her.
I would agree that Squiggs probably does not need exhibitions .... but I'd almost beg to differ on doing drills and slow work.
It is evident that you need some practice on being consistent with guiding her, and I don't mean that in a bad way because I'm going through the same thing myself with getting back into the swing of things with my horses. But I think some slow work and drills would help you. It would help you be able to work on your hands and body, and help you practice to set her up for a clean pattern -- go into that turn with a nice pocket, and help her keep her butt engaged and body rounded and shaped, and come out headed straight to your next barrel.
Riders need practice too!
Plus ... if all you do during the week is check cows and condition on the trails, you are not conditioning her body to make turns with her body shaped like you do on the barrel pattern. So something to think about there too.
On your run where she blew the first; rider error or not, it really seemed like she didn't listen to you (sticking her nose in the air and resisting ) . Slow work helps with that!
|
|
| |
|
| IMO it looks like you are over riding her. I would step back for awhile and focus on your horsemanship skills. It also looks like she doesn't have a rate spot instilled in her.
Others have offered good advice. Make sure you are riding your horse one step at a time. The picture below shows that you are asking your horse to go to the 3rd barrel, but you aren't even finished with the 2nd barrel yet.
 (1.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
 1.jpg (52KB - 197 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| QHriderKE - 2017-05-18 9:00 PM
I've never exhibitioned this horse?
Everyone I've entered her, I've yet to hold her back or "train" we just... "go for 90" for lack of a better term lol
I also do as little slow work and drills as possible, I spend more time conditioning and checking cows and using her for ranch work than drilling her.
This says volumes here. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly. |
|
| |
|
Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could. I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly. There are lots of drills you can do off the pattern that teach you and your horse how to prepare for a turn and finish it properly. When I take a lesson the majority of the one is spent on these drills and she will have me cruise through one time at the end.
Remember smooth is fast, don't worry about your time till you get three good turns-the clock will follow. I have one that is so efficient in his turns that I can high lope to a 2D check. My girls can get on him and be in the 1D money.
Edited by rodeomom3 2017-05-23 9:31 AM
|
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could. I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
Since you are having issues, I would be doing more slow work.
The point of drills are to fix issues.
No one is saying you have to go through the same drill 500 times. I agree that when they "get it right", quit that drill and go do a different drill or go do something else.
......Or you can just keep doing what you are doing and stay at the level you currently are. I don't mean that to be snarky; but you are getting lots of great advice here that can help you. You asked how you can get her in the 1D. You have to be willing to put in the work.
|
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM
I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
This horse has been drilled to death before she was ever started on barrels. She was exhibitioned for a year before she ever ran. She was just out of the top 10 in the 1D at the Reunion at Joseys. This is tough competition from all over the United States. If you expect to run in the 1D you better be prepared or at least around here. You refine your turns and leaving a barrel with slow work and drills. You als teach your horse rate. If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. I really think that people are trying to help you here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIV0H7w-8NE&t=79s
Here is a video of my YOUNG friend Abby Phillips. Her horse gets drilled every week to keep him running like he does. She is on her way to the College National Finals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
Both of these are young horses. I work my 14 year old on drills to refine his basics.
|
|
| |
|
 Experienced Mouse Trapper
Posts: 3106
Location: North Dakota | Here's a different point of view....you have plenty of "whoa" in your body going to second and none going to first-set your horse up to throttle down on the first and the rest will come into play more correctly. You are rating your horse a little over half way across from 1-2 and you are just letting her fly into 1-why? If you can switch your actions to rate more at 1 and fly into 2 you will be much better off! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Did a bit of slow work the night before this race, used some of everyones ideas!
I didn't push her and held on to her a bit going into 1st to be in the money in the 2D. I tried to just set her up nicer for the turns and used more leg to turn and really tried to not over-ride her as well. I kinda lost my seat a little coming out of first, hence my arm flying up when I went to go 2-handed. All in all, turned out pretty well and I know she has about 3 more gears to open up between barrels. I want to just cruise her through a couple more times like this and then start pushing her more again?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N7Q7zGY_ho
Edited by QHriderKE 2017-05-28 11:40 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | streakysox - 2017-05-23 10:36 AM
QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM
I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
This horse has been drilled to death before she was ever started on barrels. She was exhibitioned for a year before she ever ran. She was just out of the top 10 in the 1D at the Reunion at Joseys. This is tough competition from all over the United States. If you expect to run in the 1D you better be prepared or at least around here. You refine your turns and leaving a barrel with slow work and drills. You als teach your horse rate. If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. I really think that people are trying to help you here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIV0H7w-8NE&t=79s
Here is a video of my YOUNG friend Abby Phillips. Her horse gets drilled every week to keep him running like he does. She is on her way to the College National Finals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
Both of these are young horses. I work my 14 year old on drills to refine his basics.
If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. (I don't know how to highlight)
This is not a fair statement. I have seen some wild turns and crazy runs win it all! Im in a very tough area! Betty Roper "Sis" Would blow off the 3rd barrel and blow everyone away! If she turned tight I seen her loose the race or just place, but if she blowed off it you better watch out. Every horse has their style and sometimes pretty turns don't win it. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | QHriderKE - 2017-05-28 11:31 PM
Did a bit of slow work the night before this race, used some of everyones ideas!
I didn't push her and held on to her a bit going into 1st to be in the money in the 2D. I tried to just set her up nicer for the turns and used more leg to turn and really tried to not over-ride her as well. I kinda lost my seat a little coming out of first, hence my arm flying up when I went to go 2-handed. All in all, turned out pretty well and I know she has about 3 more gears to open up between barrels. I want to just cruise her through a couple more times like this and then start pushing her more again?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N7Q7zGY_ho
Just keep hauling and what I do is try to improve at least one thing from the run before. Don't try to change everything at once! you will get to fretting and trying to remember everything instead of you and the horse being relax and have a good time. Example people like Lisa Lockhart make it look so easy and fun. I think it is because she is having fun. (I know bout the money too) but love what you do! Nice horse! Again if there anything you want to change do it one run at a time! Good luck! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | ^^
I'm going to just try to make the same run as last weekend a couple/few times in a row and then add a little more speed. I mean if she wants to clock at the top of the 2D on her own, I won't have to work very hard to add a little more speed once we get our timing and my riding through the turns figured out and organized! |
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Turnburnsis - 2017-05-29 9:13 PM
streakysox - 2017-05-23 10:36 AM
QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM
I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
This horse has been drilled to death before she was ever started on barrels. She was exhibitioned for a year before she ever ran. She was just out of the top 10 in the 1D at the Reunion at Joseys. This is tough competition from all over the United States. If you expect to run in the 1D you better be prepared or at least around here. You refine your turns and leaving a barrel with slow work and drills. You als teach your horse rate. If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. I really think that people are trying to help you here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIV0H7w-8NE&t=79s
Here is a video of my YOUNG friend Abby Phillips. Her horse gets drilled every week to keep him running like he does. She is on her way to the College National Finals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
Both of these are young horses. I work my 14 year old on drills to refine his basics.
If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. (I don't know how to highlight )
This is not a fair statement. I have seen some wild turns and crazy runs win it all! Im in a very tough area! Betty Roper "Sis" Would blow off the 3rd barrel and blow everyone away! If she turned tight I seen her loose the race or just place, but if she blowed off it you better watch out. Every horse has their style and sometimes pretty turns don't win it.
This is probably true but not where we run or in the futurity world.
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Well my horse is a mutt horse that was bred to buck or pack, it's a miracle we've gotten this far. I'm not planning to go pro or anything like that, just want to place 1D locally and enter some rodeos but imo there's no point in rodeoing if you know you usually just run a second or so behind gals who are rodeoing |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | streakysox - 2017-05-30 10:51 AM
Turnburnsis - 2017-05-29 9:13 PM
streakysox - 2017-05-23 10:36 AM
QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM
I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
This horse has been drilled to death before she was ever started on barrels. She was exhibitioned for a year before she ever ran. She was just out of the top 10 in the 1D at the Reunion at Joseys. This is tough competition from all over the United States. If you expect to run in the 1D you better be prepared or at least around here. You refine your turns and leaving a barrel with slow work and drills. You als teach your horse rate. If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. I really think that people are trying to help you here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIV0H7w-8NE&t=79s
Here is a video of my YOUNG friend Abby Phillips. Her horse gets drilled every week to keep him running like he does. She is on her way to the College National Finals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
Both of these are young horses. I work my 14 year old on drills to refine his basics.
If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. (I don't know how to highlight )
This is not a fair statement. I have seen some wild turns and crazy runs win it all! Im in a very tough area! Betty Roper "Sis" Would blow off the 3rd barrel and blow everyone away! If she turned tight I seen her loose the race or just place, but if she blowed off it you better watch out. Every horse has their style and sometimes pretty turns don't win it.
This is probably true but not where we run or in the futurity world.
Texas not that much different than Oklahoma. And I went to Fort Smith and watched the derby and futurity world. :)) Each horse has there own turning style . I've seen different turning styles win. :)) In the futurity and rodeos |
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Turnburnsis - 2017-05-31 12:07 AM
streakysox - 2017-05-30 10:51 AM
Turnburnsis - 2017-05-29 9:13 PM
streakysox - 2017-05-23 10:36 AM
QHriderKE - 2017-05-23 9:22 AM
I personally just don't see the point in drilling and drilling a horse. I drilled and drilled her for a couple years before ever really entering. And when I entered her, I just let her pick her own speed and tried it go with it best I could.
I try to only work her on barrels once a week at most. Usually ends up that I take her out for some slow work a few days before a jackpot. It's not that I never do any slow work, but I try to keep it to a minimum and just try harder to get the most out of 3 jogs/lopes or walks around the pattern than doing it 20 times poorly.
This horse has been drilled to death before she was ever started on barrels. She was exhibitioned for a year before she ever ran. She was just out of the top 10 in the 1D at the Reunion at Joseys. This is tough competition from all over the United States. If you expect to run in the 1D you better be prepared or at least around here. You refine your turns and leaving a barrel with slow work and drills. You als teach your horse rate. If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. I really think that people are trying to help you here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIV0H7w-8NE&t=79s
Here is a video of my YOUNG friend Abby Phillips. Her horse gets drilled every week to keep him running like he does. She is on her way to the College National Finals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ADlxrR9Qbc
Both of these are young horses. I work my 14 year old on drills to refine his basics.
If you don't make your turns like this mare, you will not get in the 1D. (I don't know how to highlight )
This is not a fair statement. I have seen some wild turns and crazy runs win it all! Im in a very tough area! Betty Roper "Sis" Would blow off the 3rd barrel and blow everyone away! If she turned tight I seen her loose the race or just place, but if she blowed off it you better watch out. Every horse has their style and sometimes pretty turns don't win it.
This is probably true but not where we run or in the futurity world.
Texas not that much different than Oklahoma. And I went to Fort Smith and watched the derby and futurity world. : ) ) Each horse has there own turning style . I've seen different turning styles win. : ) ) In the futurity and rodeos
This is very true. What I was trying to say is that one little mistake of any kind and you can forget placing. AND this is our LOCAL COMPETITION. Our little local jackpots have 125+. Anything else has 300+. Many of the people that did well at Ft. Smith come to the barrel races around here. That is common. I just thought that was the competion that the OP was competing against. I strive for excellence with all of my horses and expect them to perform. |
|
| |
|
Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | QHriderKE - 2017-05-28 11:31 PM Did a bit of slow work the night before this race, used some of everyones ideas! I didn't push her and held on to her a bit going into 1st to be in the money in the 2D. I tried to just set her up nicer for the turns and used more leg to turn and really tried to not over-ride her as well. I kinda lost my seat a little coming out of first, hence my arm flying up when I went to go 2-handed. All in all, turned out pretty well and I know she has about 3 more gears to open up between barrels. I want to just cruise her through a couple more times like this and then start pushing her more again? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N7Q7zGY_ho
I think your speed was appropriate going into the first barrel, but you've got to set up that pocket correctly. You went too deep.
You lean in your turns; especially evident on your second barrel. Keep your weight square and body centered. If anything, your weight should be slightly to the outside (think centripital motion and physics). You are leaning to the inside and somehow standing in your stirrups with each stride around the barrel.
As far as drills go: I just attended a Ryan Lovendahl clinic last month. And that's all they do with their horses = DRILLS. And he's obviously winning big races and big money with his horses. So you most certainly cannot over-drill a horse, so long as it's done correctly. Now, I'm not saying you should do drills every day (I can't ... because me as the rider would be bored!!! Plus I do other things with my horses besides barrels.) but there isn't any reason you couldn't do drills.
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | ^^^ thanks beau!
I'm not totally against drills, but I would only like to do drills maybe a max of twice a week, once a week seems to be the going rate lately though. I'm working away from home and haven't moved my horses here yet so I've enlisted my dad to use this horse to go check cows. He even roped a cow off of her yesterday!
anyways, once I get my horses settled in here with me, I'm planning to get together with some gals that are far better barrel racers than me and learn as much as I can from them. And hopefully start running this horse a bit more consistently
.
|
|
| |
|
 Firecracker Dog Lover
Posts: 3175
| QHriderKE - 2017-06-01 1:54 PM ^^^ thanks beau! I'm not totally against drills, but I would only like to do drills maybe a max of twice a week, once a week seems to be the going rate lately though. I'm working away from home and haven't moved my horses here yet so I've enlisted my dad to use this horse to go check cows. He even roped a cow off of her yesterday! anyways, once I get my horses settled in here with me, I'm planning to get together with some gals that are far better barrel racers than me and learn as much as I can from them. And hopefully start running this horse a bit more consistently .
What is your definition of drills? Slow work on the pattern does not necessarily mean working the actual pattern. It means slow work drills for both horse and rider to get your timing, feel, and muscle memory down in the turns. You do not need to overdo this and a couple of times a week will suffice but Uncle Ed once told me that not doing slow work on a finished horse was the dumbest thing he'd ever heard. I miss Uncle Ed's candor. In any case - you have a nice horse - she really wants to work. The more slow work you do, the easier it will be engrained in your head and the less you feel you will have to override her. Do the circle in and out at a walk, trot, and lope at each barrel. Set up sets of barrels and walk, trot, and lope each direction in both circles and barrel turns - this will also help you control her body easier too. Good luck. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I rarely drill the three barrels at home. Most of the time I just set up one or two. Or use a lick tub out in the cows as a "barrel". I do lots of spiraling in and out with this horse, and throw a transition in there like as the circle gets bigger, pick up a lope and as it gets smaller break down to a trot kind of thing. I also do a lot of anticipation/rate drills too. Like getting to your pocket and counter arcing out and making a figure 8 to come back to the pocket, really helps her think about her shoulder. I've drilled rate into this horses brain so much that she should be a push style by now lol, I've tried every rate trick I've ever heard of.
Sometimes I just ride in a smaller pen and work on transitions and lengthening and shortening stride, and body control just to bring her back to the basics and remind us both of the basics. I try to keep dry work of any kind to 2-3 times a week at most. Lately it's been more like once a week and then we ranch the rest of the week. Dragging calves to the pot is so good for a horse, especially rope horses and barrel horses. Just gives them something slow and entirely new and as a rider you can work on body control, like nudging the hip over a couple steps this way, or side passing a step the other way... stuff like that. All of my rope or (potential) barrel horses are used as a ranch horse first of all and not really started on anything else until they have a branding season and fall roundup season under their belts.
Edited by QHriderKE 2017-06-01 6:43 PM
|
|
| |
|
Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| My horse is 14. He has been running barrels since he was 5. He does not need to work on the pattern. The drills I do are basic horsemanship. Moving straight forward with head tipped to left or right. I set up a pattern with cones and practice working my horse around those at a walk trot or very slow lope. Picking up a lead from a stop. Moving off my leg at different gaits. As a test to see how well I have done, I go to the local judged show and work their pattern in horsemanship or equitation. My 4 year old will becoming home from the trainer soon and she told me ride her like a do at home. All of my horses ride like that. All successful barrel horses need to ride like that. One thing that I never do is rollbacks. We do not run that style. They all need drills but not necessarily concerning a barrel. Heather Smith book that has drills in it is very helpful. |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Made it into the 1D AND IN THE MONEY today! Video to come!!! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Here's the video, my horse was really firing on all cylinders!
I can't believe we placed in the 1d just out of the blue too, just awesome!
https://youtu.be/bA5WY_n16Cg |
|
| |
|
I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Too cool! Congratulations!!  |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2128
| Way to go!!! |
|
| |
|
 Total Germophobe
Posts: 6443
Location: Montana | Nice!!! |
|
| |
|
 Ms. Marine
Posts: 4641
Location: Texas | Awesome! Congratulations! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | Thanks everyone!
The photographer got some pretty wicked photos of the run too, will post when i buy digital copies!! |
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 378
Location: Saskatchewan | I had to buy a few of the pictures, couldn't resist!
 |
|
| |
|
 Guys Just Wanna Have Fun
Posts: 5530
Location: OH | Congrats---that sure is a GREAT feeling. |
|
| |
