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| I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!!
Edited by Mrs.Stepniak 2017-07-12 1:51 PM
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 Take a Picture
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| New farrier immediately. Aluminum shoes on front with fine nails and A very long time with great patience |
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| streakysox - 2017-07-11 8:27 PM
New farrier immediately. Aluminum shoes on front with fine nails and A very long time with great patience
I have only been using my current farrier for about 6 months now and he is fantastic. This horses hooves are the best they have ever been since he started shoeing him so I am not changing farriers. Thank you for the suggestion on the aluminum shoes though, I had thought about that myself and wondered if it would help. |
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  Ms. Marine
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Location: Texas | Is there any way he can shorten the toe? Is he putting a mustang roll on it so that it will break over faster than without? In my experience horses typically only overreach if their toes are too long for them to move properly. |
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Take a Picture
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| Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:37 PM
streakysox - 2017-07-11 8:27 PM
New farrier immediately. Aluminum shoes on front with fine nails and A very long time with great patience
I have only been using my current farrier for about 6 months now and he is fantastic. This horses hooves are the best they have ever been since he started shoeing him so I am not changing farriers. Thank you for the suggestion on the aluminum shoes though, I had thought about that myself and wondered if it would help.
My trainer used the best farrier around here and my horse could not keep her left front on. Trainer decided to change. I went with her the first time she took my horse. I told the guy my objectives were to keep her sound and knock a couple of tenths of a second off. He accomplished that and her shoe stays on now. Hasn't pulled one off since. Trainer drives 4 hours and it costs $200 but is well worth it. The quickest way to have an injury is improper shoeing. This horse runs at the top of the 1D with 400 to 500 entries and the small changes made did knock off several tenths of a second.
By any chance was the horse pulling a shoe before 6 months ago?
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 A Barrel Of Monkeys
Posts: 12972
Location: Texas | I've had that problem. New farrier fixed it. Basically, the farrier has to speed up the front breakover (less toe), and slow down the hinds (slower breakover-longer toe). If that doesn't work, he can square off his hind feet toes (would not be my first choice). |
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 Thick and Wavy
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Location: Nebraska | Bell boots 24/7 can help too |
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| streakysox - 2017-07-11 11:14 PM
Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:37 PM
streakysox - 2017-07-11 8:27 PM
New farrier immediately. Aluminum shoes on front with fine nails and A very long time with great patience
I have only been using my current farrier for about 6 months now and he is fantastic. This horses hooves are the best they have ever been since he started shoeing him so I am not changing farriers. Thank you for the suggestion on the aluminum shoes though, I had thought about that myself and wondered if it would help.
My trainer used the best farrier around here and my horse could not keep her left front on. Trainer decided to change. I went with her the first time she took my horse. I told the guy my objectives were to keep her sound and knock a couple of tenths of a second off. He accomplished that and her shoe stays on now. Hasn't pulled one off since. Trainer drives 4 hours and it costs $200 but is well worth it. The quickest way to have an injury is improper shoeing. This horse runs at the top of the 1D with 400 to 500 entries and the small changes made did knock off several tenths of a second.
By any chance was the horse pulling a shoe before 6 months ago?
Yes he has been pulling shoes for much longer than 6 months and I've used 3 different farriers
Edited by Mrs.Stepniak 2017-07-12 5:27 AM
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| brlracerchick - 2017-07-12 1:28 AM
Bell boots 24/7 can help too
He pulls them even with bell boots...im thinking of trying Shoe Secures or quarter boots underneath regular bell boots |
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 Having Smokin Bandits
Posts: 4572
Location: Woodstown, NJ | One of my horses continually loses his front shoes and it's not the farrier. I've been through a ton of farriers and it doesn't matter WHO I use. He has terrible quality feet. I just restarted him on Biotin 100 from Nanric. The stuff is gold. You can practically see their feet growing before your eyes. But anyway, I finally pulled his shoes the last time he lost a front because it's not good for his feet to keep ripping them off. And not fair to the farrier to have to keep coming back. He's tenderfooted. But I'm not barrel racing him. Or riding him. And it's very soft outside. We're sandy and pretty rock-free. If I WAS going to try to barrel race him, I'd ride him in Easy Boots or some other kind of protective boot during exercise and take them off before a run because the arenas are soft so he'd be okay there and I wouldn't feel comfortable actually racing in the Easy Boot. Maybe you're going to have to give up and try something like that? |
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| SmokinBandits - 2017-07-12 7:37 AM
One of my horses continually loses his front shoes and it's not the farrier. I've been through a ton of farriers and it doesn't matter WHO I use. He has terrible quality feet. I just restarted him on Biotin 100 from Nanric. The stuff is gold. You can practically see their feet growing before your eyes. But anyway, I finally pulled his shoes the last time he lost a front because it's not good for his feet to keep ripping them off. And not fair to the farrier to have to keep coming back. He's tenderfooted. But I'm not barrel racing him. Or riding him. And it's very soft outside. We're sandy and pretty rock-free. If I WAS going to try to barrel race him, I'd ride him in Easy Boots or some other kind of protective boot during exercise and take them off before a run because the arenas are soft so he'd be okay there and I wouldn't feel comfortable actually racing in the Easy Boot. Maybe you're going to have to give up and try something like that?
I wish going barefoot was an option but he needs corrective shoeing for a wonky front hoof |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: Ohio girl moved to PA | I also recommend a new farrier. I know you said this one has been doing well but, I also had a front shoe puller. 4 times in a in a row, same shoe, and all within just under 2 months. He hot shod, put clips on, lived with bell boots on and that still didnt help. My farrier(at the time) said not his fault. I switched farriers and he hasnt pulled a shoe since, and that was over 2 years ago. Now he doesnt have to live with bell boots on anymore either. I do keep him on DAC foundation formula and that has helped so much, but switching farriers is whats helped the most. |
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 Hummer's Hero
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Location: Smack Dab in the Middle | Unfortunately, a new farrier is also my suggestion. My last two have been good...really good. But my good horse was a chronic shoe puller, and I just thought it was his big stride. It was so bad for a while that I was literally duct taping the heel bulb so that it was harder for him to catch his shoe, and I counted shoes after every run and every time I brought him in from the turnout (always turned out in bell boots). I'd have to have a shoe reset usually at least once in every set of shoes. My current farrier is really, REALLY good. He sets him back and squares and rolls his toes. He's been shoeing this horse about 9 months now and we've not had to reset a single pulled shoe. |
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| Does your horse have hind shoes? I had a horse that would pull a front shoe every time we left him barefoot on the hind end. If he had shoes on then he wouldn't pull. Also, if you go with aluminum I would recommend a pad, I had a horse have a terrible time in aluminum shoes without pads. Don't know if it was reaction to the aluminum or the vibrations, but she was dead lame with them. Took them off and she was fine. Happened on two separate occasions with two different farriers. |
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Veteran
Posts: 113
Location: Wyoming | Square off his toes in the hind end, put him on a pure biotin supplement (the most that is recommended on the directions) and look into wedge shoes on the front. Kirkharts specifically.
Edited by hoofs_N_bridles 2017-07-12 9:32 AM
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A Barrel Of Monkeys
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Location: Texas | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-12 8:05 AM SmokinBandits - 2017-07-12 7:37 AM One of my horses continually loses his front shoes and it's not the farrier. I've been through a ton of farriers and it doesn't matter WHO I use. He has terrible quality feet. I just restarted him on Biotin 100 from Nanric. The stuff is gold. You can practically see their feet growing before your eyes. But anyway, I finally pulled his shoes the last time he lost a front because it's not good for his feet to keep ripping them off. And not fair to the farrier to have to keep coming back. He's tenderfooted. But I'm not barrel racing him. Or riding him. And it's very soft outside. We're sandy and pretty rock-free. If I WAS going to try to barrel race him, I'd ride him in Easy Boots or some other kind of protective boot during exercise and take them off before a run because the arenas are soft so he'd be okay there and I wouldn't feel comfortable actually racing in the Easy Boot. Maybe you're going to have to give up and try something like that? I wish going barefoot was an option but he needs corrective shoeing for a wonky front hoof
Unless the corrective shoeing is for a club foot, I doubt correction is helping him. It may be what's hurting him. |
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 Serious Snap Trapper
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Location: In The Snow, AZ | Curious as to what the wonky foot does? Is it a club foot? Is that the shoe he pulls? |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Do you have any pictures of your horses hooves? I would like to see how his fronts look since you said hes got problems with them. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
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| A good barefoot trimmer should be able to correct a wonky hoof without shoes.
My little man was s chronic puller through 3 or 4 farriers. We gave up and he runs barefoot just fine. |
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| ~BINGO~ - 2017-07-12 10:10 AM
Curious as to what the wonky foot does? Is it a club foot? Is that the shoe he pulls?
It's his right front, he had absolutely no heel, long toe, very neglected hooves when I got him. After nearly two years his hoof has improved so much but he still needs more heel and he has a flare that looks like was never corrected in the past so that is slowly improving as well. He is dead lame without shoes so I've obviously never tried going barefoot. He tends to pull the right shoe often but I honestly think he had pulled his left front just as much. My newest farrier did say his left front looks a little clubby |
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| Southtxponygirl - 2017-07-12 10:15 AM
Do you have any pictures of your horses hooves? I would like to see how his fronts look since you said hes got problems with them.
I'll try and post some |
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A Somebody to Everybody
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Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-12 12:05 PM Southtxponygirl - 2017-07-12 10:15 AM Do you have any pictures of your horses hooves? I would like to see how his fronts look since you said hes got problems with them. I'll try and post some
That would give us an ideal of what your dealing with if we saw how he looks, its hard to say without seeing  |
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Unless your horse is putting his feet in the fence and yanking them off (don't laugh I had one that did this), your problem is the timing of his stride. There a few little things he can do to change the stride length or get the front foot out of the way of the hind, i.e. speed up the front and slow down the hind. Fix the angles of the front foot to correspond with the angle of the pastern. IF the angles are correct (I've seen MANY shoe jobs were the angles in the front feet are too low). There's a few other things he can do. Pulling the front shoe back on the hoof a little and leaving the hind shoe out to the toe. Keep the angles correct for his conformation and pastern angles. Measure the toe length of his front and hind feet. If he's got 3.5" toes on the front, try to leave him 3.75" of toe on the hind feet. If' he's got 3.25" toes on the front, leave him 3.5" toes on the hind. If neither of those work, have him square off the toe of his hind shoes so they are less likely to grab the branch of the front shoe. And never, ever use a rim shoe on this horses hind feet. If he were to grab a heel with a rim shoe he can severely cut his front heel.
I caution against the farrier fitting the front shoe so tight that the shoe is overgrown right away, so I don't recommend that at all. It will cause more problems with his hoof quality which sounds like you are already trying to help. |
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Location: On My Horse! | I had a horse that had a severe clubbed foot. Shoe pulling was a major issue. At one time there was so many nail holes that I had to just take the shoe off and keep him stall bound for months until there was some growth. What we ended up doing was actually making a small shoe for him. It covered the toe, but didn't run all the way back under the heel. He grew heel like crazy and would get very toe sore, so this did work out to my advantage. After we started doing this he quit pulling shoes. I too, went through several different farriers and even drove almost 4 hours one way for one of them. Barefoot was not an option because he would be dead lame instantly. Sometimes you just have to get creative. I know the stress and struggles all to well!
Edited by JRJ 2017-07-12 12:30 PM
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Champ
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Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | After going back and reading the whole thread, does your farrier use a hoof gauge to check angles? I used to use a hoof gauge and a tape measure every time I shod a performance horse to make sure the toes and angles on the front feet were identical to each other and the same with the hind to each other. Then if I had any issues, I would know what I could do to correct for it. He may need to put a wedge shoe on the low angled foot. And I can't stress enough the horse needs to be at the same angle as the pastern. Too steep and they pinch between P3 and P2 on the bottom of the joint. To low and they pinch on the top of P3 & P2 top of the joint. Either will cause problems with pain, affect stride length and performance.
Edited by OregonBR 2017-07-12 12:35 PM
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 Swiffer PIcker Upper
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Location: Four Corners Colorado | Pics of the feet will help a bunch. I went barefoot on all my horses years ago and it was the best decision ever. I couldn't find a good trimmer or farrier so I learned to do it myself and now do it professionally. Most problems are easy to fix with the right trim. |
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 Unknown Drip
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Location: Back in MT BABY!!! | Fun2Run - 2017-07-11 10:42 PM
I've had that problem. New farrier fixed it. Basically, the farrier has to speed up the front breakover (less toe), and slow down the hinds (slower breakover-longer toe). If that doesn't work, he can square off his hind feet toes (would not be my first choice).
I agree with this...I would also get a gauge and see exactly what his angles are both on the front and on the hind. Get a starting point and would first start with adjusting the angle of the hind feet. To slow the hind down you will need less of an angle. |
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| Hopefully I can get them to post, I'll include confo pics |
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Unknown Drip
Posts: 5624
Location: Back in MT BABY!!! | OregonBR - 2017-07-12 11:32 AM After going back and reading the whole thread, does your farrier use a hoof gauge to check angles? I used to use a hoof gauge and a tape measure every time I shod a performance horse to make sure the toes and angles on the front feet were identical to each other and the same with the hind to each other. Then if I had any issues, I would know what I could do to correct for it. He may need to put a wedge shoe on the low angled foot. And I can't stress enough the horse needs to be at the same angle as the pastern. Too steep and they pinch between P3 and P2 on the bottom of the joint. To low and they pinch on the top of P3 & P2 top of the joint. Either will cause problems with pain, affect stride length and performance.
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| Pics are too large, how do I resize them? |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-12 12:41 PM Pics are too large, how do I resize them? I resize with paint thats the easy way for me, I go to edit the picture and then use Paint
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2017-07-12 12:46 PM
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 Damn Yankee
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Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | I am not going to read through all the posts since my time is always limited....I ready enough comments "new farrier" to not want to read more.
Would changing farriers yet again work? Possibly. But not a guarantee.
Some horses just do this. And it's not because they are messed up, or the farriers suck. Guess what, some horses have a very naturally LONG stride. Growing up we were taught the rear foot should land exactly where the front foot was. I have no idea if this is true or not and it's the last thing I really worry about. But it's something I have watched as a kid. And yea, most horses do land like that.
But not all. My current open 1D horse is the perfect example. His rear foot will land about 10 inches in front of his front (yes I said 10 inches). He is 12. He has competed from SC, to GA/FL, MO, OK, Iowa, etc etc, so he's been around the block more then once. He has had over a dozen farriers attempt to keep front shoes on him. Some were ok farriers not doing it right, and some were the best of the best. We tried EVERYTHING. The only way to shoe him in order to prevent him from taking them off is to squeeze the front heels in.....BIG mistake for any horse by the way.
So we said screw it.....the SOB just don't wear back shoes........ever....
It works. For him. We make it work for us.
Edited to add that after viewing your photos above, I would change farriers. I would worry less about him stepping shoes of and worry more about that fact that he is terribly unbalanced, at least that is how it looks in the photos. When my husband started shoeing all my horses including the open gelding I mentioned above, he wanted to figure out how to make his front feet so he would be less likely to step off shoes. I told him that he was starting off on the wrong foot and to BALANCE the hoof. It works. We worry more about the specific balance then anything.
Edited by missroselee 2017-07-12 2:44 PM
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Serious Snap Trapper
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Location: In The Snow, AZ | Those pictures aren't THE BEST. But I kinda like the 2nd farrier more than the current. |
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 Expert
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Location: The best kept secret in TX | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!!
Have you looked into an over reach boot such as Veredus Brand boots?
I worked for a lady who kept Veredus Carbon Fiber Shield Over Reach boots on her stud horse at all times. She never had a problem after she bough those over reach boots.
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Veteran
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| IRunOnFaith - 2017-07-12 3:18 PM
Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!!
Have you looked into an over reach boot such as Veredus Brand boots?
I worked for a lady who kept Veredus Carbon Fiber Shield Over Reach boots on her stud horse at all times. She never had a problem after she bough those over reach boots.
I actually looked at those last night, they are pretty pricey but may be worth it in the long run. I'm thinking of trying quarter boots underneath bell boots first but those may certainly be an option. Thanks! |
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Expert
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Location: The best kept secret in TX | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-12 3:31 PM IRunOnFaith - 2017-07-12 3:18 PM Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!! Have you looked into an over reach boot such as Veredus Brand boots?
I worked for a lady who kept Veredus Carbon Fiber Shield Over Reach boots on her stud horse at all times. She never had a problem after she bough those over reach boots. I actually looked at those last night, they are pretty pricey but may be worth it in the long run. I'm thinking of trying quarter boots underneath bell boots first but those may certainly be an option. Thanks!
Absolutely. I've seen people wrap a hoof woth a hoof boot or trail boot as well... |
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| missroselee - 2017-07-12 2:40 PM
I am not going to read through all the posts since my time is always limited....I ready enough comments "new farrier" to not want to read more.
Would changing farriers yet again work? Possibly. But not a guarantee.
Some horses just do this. And it's not because they are messed up, or the farriers suck. Guess what, some horses have a very naturally LONG stride. Growing up we were taught the rear foot should land exactly where the front foot was. I have no idea if this is true or not and it's the last thing I really worry about. But it's something I have watched as a kid. And yea, most horses do land like that.
But not all. My current open 1D horse is the perfect example. His rear foot will land about 10 inches in front of his front (yes I said 10 inches). He is 12. He has competed from SC, to GA/FL, MO, OK, Iowa, etc etc, so he's been around the block more then once. He has had over a dozen farriers attempt to keep front shoes on him. Some were ok farriers not doing it right, and some were the best of the best. We tried EVERYTHING. The only way to shoe him in order to prevent him from taking them off is to squeeze the front heels in.....BIG mistake for any horse by the way.
So we said screw it.....the SOB just don't wear back shoes........ever....
It works. For him. We make it work for us.
Edited to add that after viewing your photos above, I would change farriers. I would worry less about him stepping shoes of and worry more about that fact that he is terribly unbalanced, at least that is how it looks in the photos. When my husband started shoeing all my horses including the open gelding I mentioned above, he wanted to figure out how to make his front feet so he would be less likely to step off shoes. I told him that he was starting off on the wrong foot and to BALANCE the hoof. It works. We worry more about the specific balance then anything.
Can you explain how he is unbalanced because honestly Im embarrassed to say that I do not know |
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| I had the same problem with my horse. He would pull a shoe once a week. I did everything possible to keep shoes on him. I even considered going barefoot because he was without a shoe half of the time anyways. I got a new shoer and he has not pulled a shoe since. |
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Take a Picture
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| Heels appear to be very under run which would be causing the front and rear not to break over fast enough. Most leg injuries are cased by improper shoeing. |
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Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | Maybe he is out of whack in his body somewhere. Maybe he needs a chiro or vet work. Good luck |
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Veteran
Posts: 118
| Turnburnsis - 2017-07-13 1:34 AM
Maybe he is out of whack in his body somewhere. Maybe he needs a chiro or vet work. Good luck
I've considered this as well, thank you |
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Swiffer PIcker Upper
Posts: 4015
Location: Four Corners Colorado | The second farrier is doing a better job but you are still dealing with a low heel. Most farriers start wedging at this point and that just crushes the heels further. Your horses body posture shows how off his feet are. It is very difficult to find a farrier who can fix this with shoes on.
I actually just got a horse with the same issues. He has been shod by probably 10 different farriers and none have really been able to fix him. I'll be doing a whole blog series on his rehab. I don't know if going barefoot is something you would consider but if it is, I would be happy to share my procedure on these sorts of horses.
Farriers used to recommend letting your horse go barefoot occassionally but the trend today is to do back to back shoeing for the life of the horse.
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 Namesless in BHW
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Location: At the race track with Ah Dee Ohs | Pics are really small. That being said, it looks like everything is too far forward. Toe needs pulled back and so does heel. He is too far forward and has no support. |
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Veteran
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| equussynergy - 2017-07-13 8:10 AM
The second farrier is doing a better job but you are still dealing with a low heel. Most farriers start wedging at this point and that just crushes the heels further. Your horses body posture shows how off his feet are. It is very difficult to find a farrier who can fix this with shoes on.
I actually just got a horse with the same issues. He has been shod by probably 10 different farriers and none have really been able to fix him. I'll be doing a whole blog series on his rehab. I don't know if going barefoot is something you would consider but if it is, I would be happy to share my procedure on these sorts of horses.
Farriers used to recommend letting your horse go barefoot occassionally but the trend today is to do back to back shoeing for the life of the horse.
Im not sure if going barefoot is an option for him but that being said I had a talk with my farrier today and he said "where there is a will there is a way", so he seems open to trying it if it comes to that. I am most certainly interested in what you will be doing with your horse. |
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Swiffer PIcker Upper
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Location: Four Corners Colorado | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-13 8:17 AM equussynergy - 2017-07-13 8:10 AM The second farrier is doing a better job but you are still dealing with a low heel. Most farriers start wedging at this point and that just crushes the heels further. Your horses body posture shows how off his feet are. It is very difficult to find a farrier who can fix this with shoes on.
I actually just got a horse with the same issues. He has been shod by probably 10 different farriers and none have really been able to fix him. I'll be doing a whole blog series on his rehab. I don't know if going barefoot is something you would consider but if it is, I would be happy to share my procedure on these sorts of horses.
Farriers used to recommend letting your horse go barefoot occassionally but the trend today is to do back to back shoeing for the life of the horse.
Im not sure if going barefoot is an option for him but that being said I had a talk with my farrier today and he said "where there is a will there is a way", so he seems open to trying it if it comes to that. I am most certainly interested in what you will be doing with your horse.
Edited to add, there is a huge difference in how barefoot trimmers trim and how farriers trim.
Edited by equussynergy 2017-07-13 9:52 AM
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 Born not Made
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Location: North Dakota | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!!
Any possible undeteced lameness problems?
My Red pulled shoes like crazy one summer until we figured out he had a catchy stifle on the right hind. Got that taken care of and the pulled shoes magically stopped. He probably was "scrambling" more than he had to because of the stifle and thus would catch a shoe.
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 Experienced Mouse Trapper
Posts: 3106
Location: North Dakota | total performance - 2017-07-13 8:11 AM Pics are really small. That being said, it looks like everything is too far forward. Toe needs pulled back and so does heel. He is too far forward and has no support.
i think I agree with this-want to preface with I don't hardly ever shoe a horse-was reading your thread because I have a horse that we've tried shoes on because he really gets in the ground and had trouble staying on his feet one year when it was so dry but he CONSTANTLY pulled one of the fronts. One of the best shoers in our area couldn't keep them on-we decided to give up. With that said-your horses feet look terrible, that foot looks like it is set an inch too far forward than it should be-which can be causing all kinds of trouble.........I'm going back to even a bad barefoot trim won't wreck a horse as bad as a mediocre shoe job. |
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Member
Posts: 36
| I agree with most of the replies about him being too far forward. From looking at the pictures, he is even more forward in the back than in the front, his angle is way off. Is he having any lameness problems besides pulling the shoe? The back feet and legs are my concern from looking at the pictures. Getting the back fixed would probably fix the front as well. Focus on all four feet, not just the one with the shoe being pulled off.
As for supplements, I am old school. I had a horse that couldn't hold a shoe, QH with four white feet. He had been foundered, and stood in a stall for 4 of his 5 years when I got him. I could scratch hoof off with my fingernail. We started giving him flavored gelatin (yes Jello) with his feed, and it helped to fix his feet. And a lot cheaper that supplements. He like cherry and orange the best, and would like his feed pan clean.
With all this being said, good luck, and remember it takes TIME to correct things. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| equussynergy - 2017-07-13 8:10 AM
The second farrier is doing a better job but you are still dealing with a low heel. Most farriers start wedging at this point and that just crushes the heels further. Your horses body posture shows how off his feet are. It is very difficult to find a farrier who can fix this with shoes on.
I actually just got a horse with the same issues. He has been shod by probably 10 different farriers and none have really been able to fix him. I'll be doing a whole blog series on his rehab. I don't know if going barefoot is something you would consider but if it is, I would be happy to share my procedure on these sorts of horses.
Farriers used to recommend letting your horse go barefoot occassionally but the trend today is to do back to back shoeing for the life of the horse.
I would be very interested in following your blog. Could you tell how to find it? |
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Veteran
Posts: 118
| r_beau - 2017-07-13 10:43 AM
Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!!
Any possible undeteced lameness problems?
My Red pulled shoes like crazy one summer until we figured out he had a catchy stifle on the right hind. Got that taken care of and the pulled shoes magically stopped. He probably was "scrambling" more than he had to because of the stifle and thus would catch a shoe.
He has a sticky right stifle, although it is improving with hill work. What did you do to fix your horses stifle? |
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Veteran
Posts: 118
| I feel like I need to clarify because I am starting to get a complex over this horses hooves. I hope no one is looking at the photos in the wrong order. I will try and post them again and make them larger. I know they are not perfect, his conformation is FAR from perfect but dang I didn't think they look that bad lol. Especially compared to what they looked like before. I looked back at my records, my new farrier started in early February, so if Im correct he has put shoes on him 4 times. |
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 Legal Beagle
Posts: 2809
Location: Central Okla. | I would find a shoer that is good at corrective stuff and really willing to listen. We have a horse with crooked legs and terribly weak hoof walls. He always used to pull his front left shoe off. Our shoer takes the time to properly set him and shape that shoe so that he never pulls it off anymore. He's a head horse and barrel horse. Good luck. |
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Damn Yankee
Posts: 12390
Location: Somewhere between raising hell and Amazing Grace | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-12 4:43 PM missroselee - 2017-07-12 2:40 PM I am not going to read through all the posts since my time is always limited....I ready enough comments "new farrier" to not want to read more.
Would changing farriers yet again work? Possibly. But not a guarantee.
Some horses just do this. And it's not because they are messed up, or the farriers suck. Guess what, some horses have a very naturally LONG stride. Growing up we were taught the rear foot should land exactly where the front foot was. I have no idea if this is true or not and it's the last thing I really worry about. But it's something I have watched as a kid. And yea, most horses do land like that.
But not all. My current open 1D horse is the perfect example. His rear foot will land about 10 inches in front of his front (yes I said 10 inches). He is 12. He has competed from SC, to GA/FL, MO, OK, Iowa, etc etc, so he's been around the block more then once. He has had over a dozen farriers attempt to keep front shoes on him. Some were ok farriers not doing it right, and some were the best of the best. We tried EVERYTHING. The only way to shoe him in order to prevent him from taking them off is to squeeze the front heels in.....BIG mistake for any horse by the way.
So we said screw it.....the SOB just don't wear back shoes........ever....
It works. For him. We make it work for us.
Edited to add that after viewing your photos above, I would change farriers. I would worry less about him stepping shoes of and worry more about that fact that he is terribly unbalanced, at least that is how it looks in the photos. When my husband started shoeing all my horses including the open gelding I mentioned above, he wanted to figure out how to make his front feet so he would be less likely to step off shoes. I told him that he was starting off on the wrong foot and to BALANCE the hoof. It works. We worry more about the specific balance then anything. Can you explain how he is unbalanced because honestly Im embarrassed to say that I do not know
Some have already touched base on some of the obvious issues. No heel, really forward, which may be some conformation.
Underslung heel, off balance when looking at him from the front. Talk to your farrier about concentrating more on balance then anything, start with that. Sometimes if you work too hard to fix what you think is wrong instead of balance, you create more problems. |
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Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-13 1:24 PM r_beau - 2017-07-13 10:43 AM Mrs.Stepniak - 2017-07-11 8:09 PM I am desperate for suggestions on how to deal with a chronic front shoe puller. Has any one dealt with one and what did you do that helped? He has weak hooves, we are working on that. I use Keratex hoof hardener and bell boots but he overreaches and pulls them clean off. I am open to all suggestions except to get a new farrier. I have had 3 different farriers with this horse and my current guy is fabulous. He is short backed, long strided, nothing I can do about his conformation. TIA!! Any possible undeteced lameness problems?
My Red pulled shoes like crazy one summer until we figured out he had a catchy stifle on the right hind. Got that taken care of and the pulled shoes magically stopped. He probably was "scrambling" more than he had to because of the stifle and thus would catch a shoe.
He has a sticky right stifle, although it is improving with hill work. What did you do to fix your horses stifle?
I didn't look at your pictures closely. Of course, if there is a shoeing issue it needs to be fixed. But I use a fantastic farrier for my horse so I know it was not his shoes. His sticky stifle was mild so it has slowly gotten better with routine exercise. I do LOTS of backing up ditches. Every ride I do it a couple times while we are out on the trail. I also make sure he stays collected while riding, especially at the trot because that's when it prone to catch him the most. I tried injecting it early on but that didn't make much difference. I did just inject him yesterday (hocks and stifles) but only b/c the vet was indicating he was sore in the stifles and he has now started fusing on the other hock.
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| Balance as mentioned can be a significant factor in the problem. I had to resort to making the farriers measure the feet so that not only each foot is balanced but they are the same. can make a difference. |
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 Peat and Repeat
Posts: 2773
Location: IN MY OWN LITTLE WORLD AT LEAST THEY KNOW ME HERE | Have your shoer roll in the ends of the shoes.
The horse is reaching up under him/herself and clipping the exposed shoe heel ends on fronts.
The shoe will be more pronounced and more closed up C.
The ends will be curled in and under the heels somewhat.
Fronts only.
Edited by Yakima 2017-07-14 9:00 PM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 787
Location: NE Pa-Gods Country | if it is the same front shoe that is pulled, it could be the stifle cords loose. My mare did this 3 times in a row at the same time in her schedule...4 wks. diagnosed with loose cords/stifle on that side. different shoeing technique required
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| I don't see any pictures of feet.
Some quick ways to prevent horses from pulling shoes.
Square the toe in the front it causes the break over faster.
Put trailers on the back so it pulls their foot to the outside so they won't track ontop of the front foot.
Just remember everything we do to these guys there is a negative consequence as well. |
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Expert
Posts: 4766
Location: Bandera, TX | Fun2Run - 2017-07-11 11:42 PM I've had that problem. New farrier fixed it. Basically, the farrier has to speed up the front breakover (less toe), and slow down the hinds (slower breakover-longer toe). If that doesn't work, he can square off his hind feet toes (would not be my first choice).
This is what my new farrier did for my horse. Has worked like a charm. |
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