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| If you were loaning a horse out to a rider what might you expect . They are paying all entries and travel (using my horses because theirs is down with an injury) I am feeding, taking care of feet, chiro and any vet expenses unless related to travel, I also just insured the horse, and I keep her fit. So far they have kept all winnings, this is a young horse who jumped out and became a 1D horse and has so far broke even and even made a little over their expenses. I have a hard time asking for a share although I think it would be fair as I spend a small fortune keeping her in top shape. I have nothing right now and am barely holding things together this little mare is the only thing keeping me believing in the future. I want to be fair and I could run the horse myself but it is a kid riding who has big dreams and was pretty devasted when her horse got hurt. Help me I have no business savvy in this situation. Be kind I am already stressed out |
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Location: midwest mama | Based on what each of you are contributing, at the very least it should be a 50/50 split on all earnings. |
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Expert
Posts: 1409
Location: Oklahoma | aww this may be touchy since you all didn't have an agreement ahead of time. Good luck I get myself in messes all time trying to help out! |
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| You need to get a contract. They pay half of of insurance/feed/vet/
gas and any other expenses. You in turn get 1/2 of winnings. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Mount money used to be 25% of earnings, but that was many years ago, it maybe more now.
Edited by GLP 2017-07-31 7:03 AM
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| Wow, that is a heck of a deal for them. Have they offered you anything at all? I think they should pay all expenses, shoes, feed etc if they want to keep all the winnings. I loaned a couple of mine to my trainer for her daughter to use, the horses did stay at her place, they paid for everything and kept all the winnings. I would just tell them if they are going to use her they need to help with the cost of maintaining her. It is very kind of you to let them use her. You can do percentage of winnings but I prefer a set amount each month because whether she draws a check or not, every run is more wear and tear on the horse and an opportunity to get hurt. Don't let the fact that you did not have this conversation at the beginning stop you from having it now. The flip side is they could have/should have offered to help with expenses too. You are not in the wrong for asking.
Edited by rodeomom3 2017-07-31 7:14 AM
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| Thanks for the information. We did talk about winnings a little after her very first run that she won by 7 tenths. They asked what is normal and we talked a little about that but then when I mentioned it again they kind of brushed me off. I have known this little gal since she was 3 not 12 and they needed a horse to ride because she is a sponsored rider looking for more sponsors and they wanted to try and do the jr nfr and an American qualifier. I just need to have a little backbone and just ask. I love helping when I can but we have had a really bad couple of years and anything a horse can do to help pay their own way is great. |
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Veteran
Posts: 233
| Are leases not common, where the leasee pays all maintenance costs and a monthly fee to the owner? Otherwise, if it's an ongoing thing but she's only riding the horse at competitions, I'd charge a daily use fee, say $50-$100. Miles on a horse are miles. |
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 Go For It!
Location: Texas | I would lease them the horse... they pay all expenses and give you $X. a month, if she's a super nice mare. Make sure they have insurance that includes major medical. You just have to decide for yourself what it's worth. One run could end your mare's career. Or just be kind and do it for them, pay it forward, help her reach her goals and let God give you the blessing! Either way, you just have to go with your gut.
Good luck! |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 534
Location: Ohio girl moved to PA | youre definitley getting the short end of the stick here. Its YOUR horse. Just be upfront and let them know how you feel and if they want to continue running the horse they need to help out in some way, especially since you are being so nice and letting them use your horse. I would expect them to pay for all upkeep. |
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 Too Skinny
Posts: 8009
Location: LA Lower Alabama | So when I borrow a horse 'for me' I feel like I should take care of it and pay for everything for it and if the owner wants a cut of the winnings then so be it. If I am riding it 'for the owner' then they provide it's care and get a cut of the winnings. Maybe you guys started as a "he just needs to be rode" and then it swapped to a lease type situation but you need to decide what is right for your set up. These are friends not just random people but they are getting the best deal possible. This may mean you need to be tough though and stop this before your horse gets used up and returned useless. |
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Expert
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| I normally just let people use my horses if needed I try to be as generous as possible. I have loaned a lot of horses over the years. This mare is pretty special. I am really struggling to survive right now financially so the added expense of keeping her running is a bit hard. Thanks for your thoughts |
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Expert
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| I am a control freak so the mare will stay in my care at all times and I travel with her. This is a younger girl who is a great little jockey but I feel like I still need to watch out for them. I wish I was in better shape financially and I wouldn't even think of it but we are literally barely eating and I am walking out of my shoes so some help would be great. I know I could sell this mare right now but if you have ever had that once in a lifetime kind of horse or just a special connection you know how hard that choice can be. I am trying to hold on to her so maybe I can have a shot at running her soon. |
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | First and foremost, you need to have a "sit down" with them. YOU are getting absolutely nothing out of this arrangement and taking all the chances should she get hurt. At the very least, they should be paying for her "upkeep" AND insurance. They would have to feed/vet/insure their own horse. And you should get a percentage of the winnings (25% if they pay upkeep). Or you could give them the option of a straight lease but, then, they would probably want to take the horse to their place. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| cutnrunqhmt - 2017-07-31 1:15 AM
If you were loaning a horse out to a rider what might you expect . They are paying all entries and travel (using my horses because theirs is down with an injury) I am feeding, taking care of feet, chiro and any vet expenses unless related to travel, I also just insured the horse, and I keep her fit. So far they have kept all winnings, this is a young horse who jumped out and became a 1D horse and has so far broke even and even made a little over their expenses. I have a hard time asking for a share although I think it would be fair as I spend a small fortune keeping her in top shape. I have nothing right now and am barely holding things together this little mare is the only thing keeping me believing in the future. I want to be fair and I could run the horse myself but it is a kid riding who has big dreams and was pretty devasted when her horse got hurt. Help me I have no business savvy in this situation. Be kind I am already stressed out
I would just tell them if they are going to use her, they must pay all the fuel costs, chiro and any other expenses related to them using her, including any replacements of blown out tires or repairs that happen when hauling them. I can't believe they didn't offer to do that in the first place. They must not know how lucky they are to have a friend like you to help them out. |
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Go Get Em!
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Location: OH. IO | with what you are paying out you should just run her yourself |
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Expert
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Location: California | NJJ - 2017-07-31 8:54 AM First and foremost, you need to have a "sit down" with them. YOU are getting absolutely nothing out of this arrangement and taking all the chances should she get hurt. At the very least, they should be paying for her "upkeep" AND insurance. They would have to feed/vet/insure their own horse. And you should get a percentage of the winnings (25% if they pay upkeep). Or you could give them the option of a straight lease but, then, they would probably want to take the horse to their place.
Never thought I would agree with you, but you just hit the nail on the head. I see too much potential for you and your horse to be taken advantage of. And I've always been leery of leases because people tend to not hold up their end or not give the horse back. I would be really careful, proceed with new guidelines and make sure there's a written, signed contract. |
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Expert
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Location: California | jake16 - 2017-07-31 9:18 AM
with what you are paying out you should just run her yourself
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 No Name Nancy
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Location: never in the right place | I am using a friends older horse right now and she needed to get off him to ride her younger one and not mess him up, so she offered older one to me since mine is hurt. IF I ever win any money I am planning on taking my entry fee out and splitting 50/50 the rest or if its a small amount just giving it to her. She is hauling, shoeing etc and just wants someone to ride her horse. I know she will not want to take it as she feels I am doing her a favor by riding him but she will find it somewhere in her truck or trailer if she doesn't take it from me. lol
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 Born not Made
Posts: 2937
Location: North Dakota | cutnrunqhmt - 2017-07-31 1:15 AM If you were loaning a horse out to a rider what might you expect . They are paying all entries and travel (using my horses because theirs is down with an injury) I am feeding, taking care of feet, chiro and any vet expenses unless related to travel, I also just insured the horse, and I keep her fit. So far they have kept all winnings, this is a young horse who jumped out and became a 1D horse and has so far broke even and even made a little over their expenses. I have a hard time asking for a share although I think it would be fair as I spend a small fortune keeping her in top shape. I have nothing right now and am barely holding things together this little mare is the only thing keeping me believing in the future. I want to be fair and I could run the horse myself but it is a kid riding who has big dreams and was pretty devasted when her horse got hurt. Help me I have no business savvy in this situation. Be kind I am already stressed out
The way you describe it, you are their "groom" keeping the horse fit and ready to go, and they jump on to ride the horse and hand the reins back when they are done. While you do get to maintain 100% control of how the horse is taken care of, you are giving yourself the short end of the stick. You are doing all the work and getting none of the winnings. Yes, they are paying the entry fees (and not you) but there still is a lot of expense with just maintaining the horse.
Of course, you can come to any sort of agreement you want. But if you are needing money right now, then I'd turn this into a lease so that they pay a portion of the horse's normal maintenance and you get a cut of the winnings.
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Expert
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| Thank you for all the answers. I think I would just appreciate the offer to help out as much as actually helping so we will have a sit down talk and make it clear what we both need. This is an awesome mare and her and the kid make a great team so hopefully we can keep them together. I appreciate everyones thoughts I am so nervous about it |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | cutnrunqhmt - 2017-07-31 2:17 PM Thank you for all the answers. I think I would just appreciate the offer to help out as much as actually helping so we will have a sit down talk and make it clear what we both need. This is an awesome mare and her and the kid make a great team so hopefully we can keep them together. I appreciate everyones thoughts I am so nervous about it
You're a good person cutnrunghmt with a huge heart  |
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | Southtxponygirl - 2017-07-31 4:41 PM
cutnrunqhmt - 2017-07-31 2:17 PM Thank you for all the answers. I think I would just appreciate the offer to help out as much as actually helping so we will have a sit down talk and make it clear what we both need. This is an awesome mare and her and the kid make a great team so hopefully we can keep them together. I appreciate everyones thoughts I am so nervous about it
You're a good person cutnrunghmt with a huge heart
I agree!!!!!! |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Southtxponygirl - 2017-07-31 3:41 PM
cutnrunqhmt - 2017-07-31 2:17 PM Thank you for all the answers. I think I would just appreciate the offer to help out as much as actually helping so we will have a sit down talk and make it clear what we both need. This is an awesome mare and her and the kid make a great team so hopefully we can keep them together. I appreciate everyones thoughts I am so nervous about it
You're a good person cutnrunghmt with a huge heart
These are some blessed people with having you in their lives this way |
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 Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | My 24 year old is loaned out to a 10 year old who's gaining confidence in the youth rodeo ranks, and her family is paying all his vet, shoeing and feed bills plus taking care of him and sending me updates & questions all the time. It's been a great deal for all of us because my horse loves to compete but had nothing else to prove with me in the saddle, the girl is becoming a much better rider, and I have only 4 horses to ride & run instead of 5.
No way would I be paying all the bills and someone else having the fun & winning all the money. You need to tell them that since the partnership is working out so well, some of the winnings need to go towards the horse's upkeep. If you're going to foot the bill, you should get to be the one winning on your horse. |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | sorry to hijack but what if you are paying someone to ride your horse in a race and all entry fees. What happens if they win money in that case? |
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Expert
Posts: 2258
| kwanatha - 2017-07-31 11:01 PM
sorry to hijack but what if you are paying someone to ride your horse in a race and all entry fees. What happens if they win money in that case?
Go ahead it is all interesting. I had one lady tell me she takes entries out of winnings and then rider and owner split winnings. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 629
| I'm in a similar situation, but we have different arrangements. I'm loaning my mare to a 13 year old boy who lost 2 horses in a row, and needed something ready to run while he brings a 5 year old up. He comes and rides several times per week. They pay entry fees. They haul her if I don't go to the same show. The boys dad is my farrier, and he's shoeing her, and not charging me. But, she lives at my house, I feed her, and I'm there when he rides and can continue to ride her if/when/as needed. They have offered to split winnings every time she's won, but its been varied amounts, and after you take entry fees out and split it, its not much. Since he's riding, I've just let him keep it. He's a good kid. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 253
Location: Back Creek Valley!!! | I lease a super broke kids pony out that my 19 yr old daughter will not part with.
They take care of board, vet, shoeing and any maintenance. Plus pay me $50.00 This is for a kid who is a first time horse owner. This gets them to understand the responsibilities of being a horse owner. So If she is running your horse you should get a monthly fee and she pays all bill. Let her keep her earnings if she paid the entry. Trust me you will still come out a head. :)
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 682
Location: Northwest | A good friend loaned me their horse for several months. During that time I paid for all it's feed, care, shoes, dental, chiro, and if any medical had come up I would have paid that too. I paid my own entries and I kept my winnings (which were pretty much next to nothing...I'm a cracks queen lol). No way would I have expected her to pay for all of that, that's just ridiculous. It ended up working out really well for both of us, and I actually ended up buying the horse.
Edited to add: never once did she tell me I had to pay for everything I did. It was never agreed on, I just did it. She is the most kind hearted person in the world and just wanted me to have something to ride after I sold my main mount. Your folks should be stepping up to the plate, just my two cents.
Edited by 07milch 2017-08-03 1:25 PM
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Expert
Posts: 2258
| Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 3:33 PM Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship.
Wow is all I can say, after all that you have been doing for them and never asked for any help in the up keep of your mare and they never offer while they ran her and when you do say something and thats how they answered is pretty selfish in my books. They dont deserved what you have all done for them, kinda like they thought that you owe us for riding her kinda attitude to me. Sad  |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 3:33 PM
Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship.
I think you've been wonderful, and maybe this is the Lord's way of showing you that you and your mare are supposed to be a team 
Good luck to you and thanks for being the kind of person that would share your special horse with someone that needed it, even if it didn't work out. |
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Expert
Posts: 2258
| Chandler's Mom - 2017-08-03 6:12 PM
cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 3:33 PM
Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship.
I think you've been wonderful, and maybe this is the Lord's way of showing you that you and your mare are supposed to be a team
Good luck to you and thanks for being the kind of person that would share your special horse with someone that needed it, even if it didn't work out.
Oh thanks. I was pretty sad about it because they make a great team but I guess I am going to suck it up and go run this weekend. I just have to have a little drink for courage! I am just getting back to riding hard again . I hope you are right and went and had a talk with my mare and hope I can do her justice. |
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 6:21 PM Chandler's Mom - 2017-08-03 6:12 PM cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 3:33 PM Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship. I think you've been wonderful, and maybe this is the Lord's way of showing you that you and your mare are supposed to be a team Good luck to you and thanks for being the kind of person that would share your special horse with someone that needed it, even if it didn't work out. Oh thanks. I was pretty sad about it because they make a great team but I guess I am going to suck it up and go run this weekend. I just have to have a little drink for courage! I am just getting back to riding hard again . I hope you are right and went and had a talk with my mare and hope I can do her justice.
Go have fun and don't try to live up to anybody else's expectations. Every horse I own is way better than I am, lol but they are with me for a reason even if I cannot run them to their potential yet. I am glad you got it worked out. |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 6:21 PM
Chandler's Mom - 2017-08-03 6:12 PM
cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 3:33 PM
Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship.
I think you've been wonderful, and maybe this is the Lord's way of showing you that you and your mare are supposed to be a team
Good luck to you and thanks for being the kind of person that would share your special horse with someone that needed it, even if it didn't work out.
Oh thanks. I was pretty sad about it because they make a great team but I guess I am going to suck it up and go run this weekend. I just have to have a little drink for courage! I am just getting back to riding hard again . I hope you are right and went and had a talk with my mare and hope I can do her justice.
I bet after your talk with her she's already forming a plan for the two of you 
Go have fun---and don't forget to keep us posted! |
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 Member
Posts: 38
| cutnrunqhmt - 2017-08-03 1:33 PM
Well I asked them to share with me what they thought was fair percentage of her earnings. They said 50/50 after all of their expenses but no account for mine. I said I would think about it and before I could answer they told me that since I won't sell her right now that they don't want to run her anymore. So that is fine I can run her it was a pretty good deal. I did all the leg work like keeping her fit, feeding, doing up legs, chiro, feed ect. I was willing to take into account entries . What it really comes down to is they wanted to buy her and kept pressuring me and I wouldn't sell. I need the money bad to so it was hard to not sell but this mare is so special to me that with all that is going bad in life right now I am trying to hold on to her. Thanks again for all the advice at least now I know where I stand in my friendship.
Well at least you know where she is in training and seasoning. Time for you two to get out their and mesh on the pattern. If that was the family's response then sounds like they were always just hoping you'd sell and enjoying the freedom from the nitty gritty work in the meantime. |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | So how are you and she doing??? |
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Expert
Posts: 2258
| Chandler's Mom - 2017-08-19 10:38 PM
So how are you and she doing???
I was just thinking I should update! The first weekend she needed her neck adjusted and we didn't have a lot of turn on 1st but she ran hard. I took her to a 3 day race last weekend and we were 6th in the 1D out of about 170, had a little trouble on first the next day but still about 12th in the 2D , there were about 300 runners and ran our fastest time the next day. She got faster each run and we ended up 8th in the 2D average. She is a good mare because things were not in her favor on Friday she was having weird cramps from her heat cycle and fired anyhow, then Saturday she hit herself so hard she drew blood through her boots and still ran her fastest time on Sunday. I gave her this week and weekend off to heal up her foot and getting her reshod to try and fix the hitting issue then back at it this coming weekend. She is a blast! Thanks for asking about our progress. |
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Member
Posts: 38
| Sounds like a great little mare you have there! |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Sounds great, hope she gets healed up and y'all keep having fun and taking money |
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