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Expert
Posts: 2685
   
| Please don't flame other people here. I just want to talk about it. I now have 3 horses with paint papers. 2 of them also have QH papers, so if I ever had to sell them I wouldn't have an issue, but this other filly is a solid running bred (mostly QH) paint and due to that, a lot of people won't even consider her. In my mind, if you don't want to breed a solid paint (or a paint at all) she's the equivalent of a gelding. People will be more apt to buy an AQHA gelding that doesn't have as nice of papers as she has (or as nice of training etc). It kills me. I'll be honest, I have never been a huge fan of paints, mostly because of resale value, but it wouldn't stop me from looking at one based on performance (if that's what I'm looking for).
I guess my point of this discussion is to ask if you think there is a stigma associated with paints, if so, do you think it is warranted? Why? Do you have any paint horses? What is the best way to go about marketing them? Emphasize their ability instead of breeding? |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
 
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | yep, emphasis on ability, very little on breeding. You can go to the Heritage and buy a Champion paint for under $10k and you wouldn't touch a similar bred AQHA Champion for less than $50-$75k I don't think. We stopped breeding them because even bred well and fancy colored they aren't popular. Same with Appy's. No one is saying they can't be good horses, they just aren't marketable. |
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 Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | I don't (and never have) care what color or breed the horse is ..... as long as it fits MY program. |
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 Saint Stacey
| From a race track standpoint, apps and paints aren’t as fast as QH are. We’ve watched trials for futurties, same day, same distance, same owners, jockeys and trainers. The fastest horse in the app and paint trials would have qualified 9th in the QH group.
That said, if I like an app or paint then I’d buy it. If a horse is proven enough, then what they are won’t matter when it comes to selling. It’s the ones that are mediocre that don’t sell as well. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | NJJ - 2018-02-11 12:06 PM I don't (and never have) care what color or breed the horse is ..... as long as it fits MY program.
Same here I did'nt care what breed are color as long as I liked the horse and did what I wanted it to do I bought it.  |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| SKM - 2018-02-11 1:10 PM
From a race track standpoint, apps and paints aren’t as fast as QH are. We’ve watched trials for futurties, same day, same distance, same owners, jockeys and trainers. The fastest horse in the app and paint trials would have qualified 9th in the QH group.
That said, if I like an app or paint then I’d buy it. If a horse is proven enough, then what they are won’t matter when it comes to selling. It’s the ones that are mediocre that don’t sell as well.
I do agree about the race horse statement. I am near Remington and the paints don't usually hold a candle to the QHs. |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Many top barrel horses are solid paints. Sadly, no one even knows that they are paints. Another sad fact is the management of APHA. They moved out of their nice building in Ft Worth out to the Stockyards. Their promotion of the breed is nonexistent. Don't know who is incharge of the PBRIP but they are limited in their knowledge of barrel racing which is a shame. Another fact is that paint popularity goes in cycles. Without the association to promote the breed, paints are going to continue losing popularity.
This is how efficient they are. The paint in my avatar won Reserve World champion in poles. When the class placing came out on the internet my horse was not even listed as an entry in the class at all. He earned his ROM at the World Show and I got it 4 years to the day after he earned it. I think it took 10 phone calls and an email to get the darn thing.
One other thing. APHA treats solid color paints like step children, they can't enter the regular registry classes. My horse obviously is not solid but it is still not fair. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| SKM - 2018-02-11 1:10 PM
From a race track standpoint, apps and paints aren’t as fast as QH are. We’ve watched trials for futurties, same day, same distance, same owners, jockeys and trainers. The fastest horse in the app and paint trials would have qualified 9th in the QH group.
That said, if I like an app or paint then I’d buy it. If a horse is proven enough, then what they are won’t matter when it comes to selling. It’s the ones that are mediocre that don’t sell as well.
Those statements right there have a major bearing on why people don't buy paints when they are looking for 1D or futurity horses |
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 Country Fried Chicken Gal
Posts: 7697
| I've always wanted a flashy paint...still do. With that said, I am not in the breeding or selling business. Usually anything I end up with stays with me. I get too attached to the darned things to sell them. Then, if I do sell I usually price too low becuase I'd rather make sure they go to a good home than just to try to make money off them. I'm a terrible horse business person. As to the answer to your question, yes I do think there is a stigma but I don't know why. To me, a horse is a horse is a horse. If it does what I need it or want it to do, I don't care about color or breeding. If I were looking at it for resale value, yes I'd have to consider breeding and color I suppose. |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| streakysox - 2018-02-11 1:53 PM
Many top barrel horses are solid paints. Sadly, no one even knows that they are paints. Another sad fact is the management of APHA. They moved out of their nice building in Ft Worth out to the Stockyards. Their promotion of the breed is nonexistent. Don't know who is incharge of the PBRIP but they are limited in their knowledge of barrel racing which is a shame. Another fact is that paint popularity goes in cycles. Without the association to promote the breed, paints are going to continue losing popularity.
This is how efficient they are. The paint in my avatar won Reserve World champion in poles. When the class placing came out on the internet my horse was not even listed as an entry in the class at all. He earned his ROM at the World Show and I got it 4 years to the day after he earned it. I think it took 10 phone calls and an email to get the darn thing.
One other thing. APHA treats solid color paints like step children, they can't enter the regular registry classes. My horse obviously is not solid but it is still not fair.
this is so sad. I didn't know the APHA was that terribly ran now. |
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Boot Detective
Posts: 1900
| Paints are known for having crappy white feet and for tending to be "goofy", maybe not the most intelligent breed. I have owned several and I own a solid paint now. Speaking from experience if you get one too hot, some of them will sull up and play dumb. The one I own now should have been dual registered with AQHA but her prior owners dropped the ball. She doesn't fit the stigma speedwise or mental attitude but she does have the white feet that will not hold shoes good. (sigh ;( ). I think the bigger issue that has turned so many against buying paints is the fact that so many people have invested in them and bred to paints expecting a paint colored up foal and they turn out solid. The solid paints just won't sell good unless you sit on them until they are grown and winning. So the investor is losing money raising them. |
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Veteran
Posts: 141
| We have a local lady that breeds her paint mare every year (almost) and its crapped out a bunch of winners, but its solid and most never know that the babies come from a paint mare.
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | I have a solid paint mare that’s at least 7/8 AQHA. She has a really nice AQHA daddy, her mama was bred real nice, and I would put this mare in the top 2 horses I have thrown a leg over. Unfortunately she crippled herself in a stall accident before I got to enter her and isn’t going to be able to run barrels. I thought I would be able to sell her as a broodie because of her breeding, but nope. People find out she has paint papers and run really fast the other way. |
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Regular
Posts: 94
Location: Texas | Well I have rode paint horses my whole life about 40 years worth and I can tell you that I have heard every Indian Paint Horse joke on the planet. But when I beat them in the arena they shut up real quick. :) As far as resale value, if they are winning they will bring $$. Paints are in high demand around here. An I like to ride a little bling in the arena don't you. :)
Edited by prober 2018-02-11 5:51 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 286
| I own a Poodle...that's enough white to have to keep clean for me. ;-)
Nothing against a Paint....I just don't want to have to try and keep one looking clean. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Three 4 Luck - 2018-02-11 5:18 PM
I have a solid paint mare that’s at least 7/8 AQHA. She has a really nice AQHA daddy, her mama was bred real nice, and I would put this mare in the top 2 horses I have thrown a leg over. Unfortunately she crippled herself in a stall accident before I got to enter her and isn’t going to be able to run barrels. I thought I would be able to sell her as a broodie because of her breeding, but nope. People find out she has paint papers and run really fast the other way.
Sad but true |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | prober - 2018-02-11 5:43 PM
Well I have rode paint horses my whole life about 40 years worth and I can tell you that I have heard every Indian Paint Horse joke on the planet. But when I beat them in the arena they shut up real quick. :) As far as resale value, if they are winning they will bring $$. Paints are in high demand around here. An I like to ride a little bling in the arena don't you. :)
I like a good looking sorrel or bay myself.. So where do you live thats in high demands for paints? Just curious  |
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 Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| I own a paint horse... I adore him... I never knew so many people didn't like them until I purchased him! Once they realized he was a paint, they just kinda wrinkled their nose and said "oh, he's a paint" ..he looks white .. until he gets wet then you can see he's an actual paint. He's a jam up head horse and he's taking to the barrels pretty well, plus he makes me smile!
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | want2chase3 - 2018-02-11 7:41 PM
I own a paint horse... I adore him... I never knew so many people didn't like them until I purchased him! Once they realized he was a paint, they just kinda wrinkled their nose and said "oh, he's a paint" ..he looks white .. until he gets wet then you can see he's an actual paint. He's a jam up head horse and he's taking to the barrels pretty well, plus he makes me smile!
I think he's a beauty---and if he makes you smile, nuff said!!
(Give J a hug for us!) |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| I think the mismanagement is because of their executive officer. They have moved out of their beautiful office and relocated to somewhere out around Will Rogers Coliseum. This is a color registry. You have to treat everyone equally--solid or not. At the World Show there were certainly a lot of solid horses. Don't even get me started on PBRIP. The Sweepstakes barrel race at the World Show is very poorly managed as well and again is split into solid and regular registry. If managed properly they could easily get 200 entries. As it is set up they get about 40.
Mine is one I raised. His job is to take care of me not necessarily to win--he has done that. I will say he does his job well.
Also I am an APHA member because I do own one. A few sponsors give you good deals on stuff. |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| want2chase3 - 2018-02-11 7:41 PM
I own a paint horse... I adore him... I never knew so many people didn't like them until I purchased him! Once they realized he was a paint, they just kinda wrinkled their nose and said "oh, he's a paint" ..he looks white .. until he gets wet then you can see he's an actual paint. He's a jam up head horse and he's taking to the barrels pretty well, plus he makes me smile!
That. Is. Awesome. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 695
Location: Windoming | I own a solid black gelding that a guy once asked me his breeding. He said, "And don't tell me he's a blankety blank paint!" I said, "He isn't, he's a Pinto!" lol His futurity year, they always put him down as a Paint, but he is a registered Pinto! Not a year goes by that someone doesn't try to buy him.
Edited by Silly Filly 2018-02-11 8:58 PM
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| My 4yo. Solid paint.. took to the barresl in no time, very quick and super smart!!
https://youtu.be/7qOkD7rr2s0
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/flashin+sixes2
I couldn't upload pics, but she's really something to look at.
Edited by moeman17 2018-02-11 9:43 PM
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Location: midwest mama | A number of great paint horses have qualified for the NFR.
Kim West, Suzzanne Faucett, Twila Haller, Joyce Jackson, Charmayne James........?just to name a few. So they can't be all bad! LOL
Personally I love paint horses. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 542
| I'm currently in love with that bay paint that Macy Ford is riding. She always enters him as Tommy so I dunno his breeding. Shes a FL girl so I'm assuming Tommy De Great is in there somewhere, maybe not. He just keeps getting better with her tho. Looked awesome this weekend in Perry, GA placing 15th outta like what 1500 head? It was a salty race for sure. |
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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7268
| want2chase3 - that's as cool as all get out! I've seen some spots when they get wet but WOW! And he's a beauty wet or not! |
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | They bought Hot Shot for $3.79 and a pack of double bubble.
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 534
Location: Ohio girl moved to PA | It really is such a shame how the paints are looked down on. I've got a APHA sorrel dun paint and he's been the best horse in my barn. Hes such a looker with a puppy dog personality. He's my go-to to babysit, he knows barrels, loves trail riding. He has quite a nice pedigree to boot. He gets his wild moments, but nothing anyone couldnt handle. I've always loved paints, ill never understand why they are so discriminated against. |
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 Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | Bought a solid paint and realized very quickly he was more quirky than the rest.
When presented with a stressful situation he would lose his mind.
Afraid of cattle. Afraid of ropes. He ran a good set of barrels and poles. Was a fantastic flag horse and parade horse but anything "stressful" and he would rear straight up and fall backwards. He was very dangerous when stressed.
He was my only solid. Only had him a few years.
Paints are quirky. And sometimes it's safe quirks. Others not so safe. I think I would give another paint a chance but I for sure would walk into the deal knowing that I couldn't resell for much more than I buy them for. |
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Warrior Mom
Posts: 4400
| Griz - 2018-02-12 5:45 AM
want2chase3 - that's as cool as all get out! I've seen some spots when they get wet but WOW! And he's a beauty wet or not!
Thank you! He's my favorite. I got him from a friend of ours who's a horse trainer. He had sold us a different horse a while back and I just couldn't get with that horse, I tried for a year to click with him because he was a super nice gelding but just wasn't in the cards for us. I hauled that gelding back to our friend and told him I couldn't get with him, he let me ride "cash" (the paint) for about 2 weeks at his place, we roped everyday and it was just an instant connection with him. We all knew I wasn't leaving without him lol! So we traded horses. He still has that other gelding and that turned into his main mount. I enjoy cash, I can put my kids on him and he's a great babysitter. He does have his quirks here and there but I don't know a horse who doesn't! It's funny because if I never got him wet, either with a bath or a good sweat no one would think he's colored like that! Hes,definitely unique |
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 I hate cooking and cleaning
Posts: 3314
Location: Jersey Girl | NJJ - 2018-02-11 1:06 PM I don't (and never have) care what color or breed the horse is ..... as long as it fits MY program.
Ditto.
I just bought a nice little grade paint mare (my first paint). I love how she rode when I tried her and she is exactly what I need. She's patterned and lots of fun to trail ride. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | I think the stigma is still there but getting less and less by the year. It's the same with the App's. I believe it comes from back in the day when both breeds had many breeders focusing more on the color then the quality. I feel for the most part those days are behind the breeds and the majority of the breeders now are concentrating on quality and with that the stigma will start to go away. At least one can only hope. I come from the App world and know if no one asked any of the solids I ride or ride with would be mistaken for a QH. and probably most of them are at least 50% QH along with that. |
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 Peecans
| I have to disagree with so many of the opinions I here all the time on paints, pour additude, bad feet, cant see if they have blue eyes and on and on and on and on....
I love paints and it really does frustrate me the backwords thinking on them. Ive seen horses of every breed be way too hot, have pour feet, crappy additudes ext....
This guys feet were increadible, acatualy the best feet on the place TBH when I owned him, and his blue eyes had no issues coming in arenas at 2AM slack and finding barrels, he could see before I could and was on his own until first at least. Consistantly placing at ammy rodeos when I sold him, went on and kept winning with youth riders.
My young girl Sweetness is solid breed with quarter horse infunce but shes awesome, very smart, willing, kind old sole type way easier to be around than by pure AQHA very well trained mare who can be overly senstive, reactive ding bat some days.
I have always had at least 1 paint around I seek them out, If my new girl is going to be as good as I think she is (watching her play and run the way she carries and holds her self) my AQHA boodmares are going to her dad.
There are of course lines in everbreed that not everbody can get along with ... APHA is no diffrent but I really do love them. Everbody says color dosent matter, a good horse is a good horse ... until its one they just dont like 
Basicaly to answer your question I do not think there is a stigma with paints I KNOW there is... there is a market but it IS small, and even smaller with solid paints, they can be hard to sell, and I find that really sad.
Ive always woundred what happned way back when when they got such a bad reputation, I pretend it was just some cowboy theif that hates them because they are hard to steal haha, nobody notices a new sorrel in my front pasture ... but they will slow down to look at the marked paint LOL
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1079
Location: MN | want2chase3 - 2018-02-11 7:41 PM I own a paint horse... I adore him... I never knew so many people didn't like them until I purchased him! Once they realized he was a paint, they just kinda wrinkled their nose and said "oh, he's a paint" ..he looks white .. until he gets wet then you can see he's an actual paint. He's a jam up head horse and he's taking to the barrels pretty well, plus he makes me smile! Same exact story with mine. Years ago, when I thought I wanted to sell my guy, a girl was looking for a high school rodeo horse and be competitive. My horse fit the bill to a tee until they found out he was a paint. Her dad said "absolutely not" and they never came to look at him therefore, I still have my heart horse. Love him to death and he will always be with me.
PS - your guy is gorgeous!!! 
Edited by Kay-DRacing. 2018-02-12 9:55 AM
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | 1DSoon - 2018-02-12 5:34 AM They bought Hot Shot for $3.79 and a pack of double bubble.
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| palgal - 2018-02-11 2:08 PM
I've always wanted a flashy paint...still do. With that said, I am not in the breeding or selling business. Usually anything I end up with stays with me. I get too attached to the darned things to sell them. Then, if I do sell I usually price too low becuase I'd rather make sure they go to a good home than just to try to make money off them. I'm a terrible horse business person. As to the answer to your question, yes I do think there is a stigma but I don't know why. To me, a horse is a horse is a horse. If it does what I need it or want it to do, I don't care about color or breeding. If I were looking at it for resale value, yes I'd have to consider breeding and color I suppose.
I will ditto this. I personally love paints and hope to own one some day. But I don't understand the stigma, I have heard the "goofy" description before but most of the paints I encounter are mostly QH bred so its ironic to me that they would have such weird traits from the limited paint lines in their background. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | della - 2018-02-12 8:43 AM I have to disagree with so many of the opinions I here all the time on paints, pour additude, bad feet, cant see if they have blue eyes and on and on and on and on....
I love paints and it really does frustrate me the backwords thinking on them. Ive seen horses of every breed be way too hot, have pour feet, crappy additudes ext....
This guys feet were increadible, acatualy the best feet on the place TBH when I owned him, and his blue eyes had no issues coming in arenas at 2AM slack and finding barrels, he could see before I could and was on his own until first at least. Consistantly placing at ammy rodeos when I sold him, went on and kept winning with youth riders.
My young girl Sweetness is solid breed with quarter horse infunce but shes awesome, very smart, willing, kind old sole type way easier to be around than by pure AQHA very well trained mare who can be overly senstive, reactive ding bat some days.
I have always had at least 1 paint around I seek them out, If my new girl is going to be as good as I think she is (watching her play and run the way she carries and holds her self ) my AQHA boodmares are going to her dad.
There are of course lines in everbreed that not everbody can get along with ... APHA is no diffrent but I really do love them. Everbody says color dosent matter, a good horse is a good horse ... until its one they just dont like
Basicaly to answer your question I do not think there is a stigma with paints I KNOW there is... there is a market but it IS small, and even smaller with solid paints, they can be hard to sell, and I find that really sad.
Ive always woundred what happned way back when when they got such a bad reputation, I pretend it was just some cowboy theif that hates them because they are hard to steal haha, nobody notices a new sorrel in my front pasture ... but they will slow down to look at the marked paint LOL
I agree that there are some that try and breed to better the paint horse. But the best example I can give is when black and white paints were popular. Anything that was black and white got bred and some of those were the most horrendous looking animals I had seen. Nothing positive about them other than color. They got a bad stigma because so many other things were over looked to get color. And now you have breeders that have them 7/8 QH and still can't sell them because if someone wanted a sorrel with a hind sock, they would get a QH and still be able to sell it. It is the same as any breed. There truly are stallions and mares that have the best of everything. In APHA that might mean a colored-homozygous mare/stud, that has a 10 disposition, conformation to die for and competed in it's particular event successfully. But since it is a colored breed, I believe it should have color. Buckskin registry...Appy registry etc. If it is a color registry the horses should have color IMO and it can be done via homozygous breeding. Not sure what to think of overos though since they can not be. Hmm food for thought.
Back to the reason they don't have the same value as a QH-they don't have the same speed on the track. As SKM stated same day time trials are night and day. Your best APHA might outrun the 10th AQHA. In cutting, the money as a competitor and breeder is in AQHA bloodlines. Same with the show events. Do APHA horses even have to qualify for the World Show or can anyone enter? I know Appy's don't have enough shows/entries nation wide so with that breed assoc anyone can go to the World Show. There is no elite of the elite. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 460
| I'm not one to stereotype breeds...BUT...I've owned three paints, and I have not like any of them =/ One was just plain mean, one was a bronc...and the other was very unpredictable. One moment she was a dead head, the next she was out of the world crazy. Purely based on my experience, I just can't see myself owning another one. But all horses are individuals, I know there are probably good ones out there! |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 823
Location: East Texas | Since so many of you guys don't like them, send your 1D horses that you are getting rid of cheap my way. I would add one in a heart beat to go with the one we already have. He has been an awesome horse. He is 18 and we started him on poles this past year....he had a 20 sec pole run this weekend. So yeah, we will take those crappy old paint buckets.
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 Expert
Posts: 2128
| Lets not forget that bad little sucker Samantha Lyne rode. Jimmy Choo. Hes owned by a young lady not far from me and he is still tough even with only one eye! Colby Lovell owned a nice paint that was roped on at the NFR several times. Brad Culpepper's yellow and white paint is another of my favorites. He was won a truck load heeling on him at every major rodeo and the NFR. I love that horse! My husband had a lot of success on a grade paint mare heeling. We still see her at the ammy rodeos. Shes probably 18 now and going strong.
We are always on the lookout for a special prospect that has eye catching color/good breeding. We picked up this little fella from Colby not long ago. He is bred similar to his other paint that did so well. I believe hes by a Smart Little Lena son out of a Delta Flyer mare (waiting on his papers to come back). Hes 18 MO. Has a fanastic mind. So far so good.
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 542
| Question Paint people didn't they just do away with the crop out rule this year? http://apha.com/news/take-a-shot-at-regular-registry-with-a-new-aph...
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | There is a stigma. I hear it all the time “I dont like paints but yours I would take”...and they are harder to sell in most cases. I once was not a fan either but...
I have a 1D paint daughter of Guys French Jet (Treasured Too on the bottom) and her winnings spend just as easy as any a QH would win (and we look fancier winning it too!).
Here she is this past weekend one of only 4 who ran 1D out of 160 horses.
https://youtu.be/ddWde53ZX4k
Best way to market one is to win on it. I think the stigma is slowly changing but still has a ways to go!
Edited by geronabean 2018-02-12 11:40 AM
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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7268
| Only horse I have REALLY regretted selling was a solid Paint by Treasured Too - to this day, I'm still kicking myself. He went on to be a really good rope horse, won numerous buckles, saddles and trailers. |
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | A |
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | I guess the stigma is still there to some extent. I personally look for the same attributes in paints as I do in any horse. At this time I have two paints in my barn - A son of Treasured Too who is still at 20 is running like a haint, and another by Country Quick Dash out of a Daughter of Judy's Lineage who is showing a lot of promise after a decent career on the track. We also have a QH mare that has full paint papers as a crop out. |
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 Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20915
Location: LouLouVille, OK | I started off on paints, and they were GREAT horses... If there was a paint out there I liked... I would buy it... I have NO problem with paints .... at all :)
As a matter of fact, my paints were grade too... lol and they had more try and heart then size... |
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 Shipwrecked and Flat Out Zapped
Posts: 16390
Location: DUMPING CATS AND PIGS IN TEXAS :) | Addressing paint speed:
You've obviously never seen Sparkles The Wonder Horse at feeding time at my crib lol. She can down right fly lol. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
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This just says that horse that are registered as solid paints can advance to the regular registry if they meet certain requirements.
CROP-OUT PAINTS are the foundation paints that were and still are AQHA horses that could not be registered in AQHA because of excessive white. (this policy has been relaxed by AQHA and I am sure BF Phillips would turn over in his grave). SOLID COLOR PAINTS do not fit the requirements for regular paint registry. In other words, they don't have enough white in certain areas.
At one time (as part of the let's screw up APHA project) they quit allowing CROP-OUTS to be registered. All paints had to have at least one paint parent. Someone woke up and realized how much money APHA was loosing because they were not registering these horses. The rule was rescended (changed back).
You need to understand that horse that are registered as solid color paints are NOT crop-outs. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 542
| streakysox - 2018-02-12 1:52 PM
This just says that horse that are registered as solid paints can advance to the regular registry if they meet certain requirements.
CROP-OUT PAINTS are the foundation paints that were and still are AQHA horses that could not be registered in AQHA because of excessive white. (this policy has been relaxed by AQHA and I am sure BF Phillips would turn over in his grave ). SOLID COLOR PAINTS do not fit the requirements for regular paint registry. In other words, they don't have enough white in certain areas.
At one time (as part of the let's screw up APHA project ) they quit allowing CROP-OUTS to be registered. All paints had to have at least one paint parent. Someone woke up and realized how much money APHA was loosing because they were not registering these horses. The rule was rescended (changed back ).
You need to understand that horse that are registered as solid color paints are NOT crop-outs.
No I understand that solid paints are not crop out AQHAs. I was confused on the wording bc it's an amendment to the original and said APHA parents only. I dunno all their lego. I guess that was about classes when showing.
I'm confused by all their rules I just remember it being a big uproar around all those Country Quick Dash AQHAs whipping up on the paint field.
Edited by runfastturnsmooth 2018-02-12 2:35 PM
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| We have been testing at school and captured me. Ugh!
Here is my vent about APHA. I have a list.
The APHA just had their world Show in SEPT. Not one word was mentioned in BARREL HORSE NEWS. AQHA had their world show in NOV. There was coverage (although sketchy) in BARREL HORSE NEWS. The only place that I saw anything was in the PAINT HORSE JOURNAL. How many of you get the JOURNAL? If you want to promote your barrel horses, get them out where barrel people will see them. Personally, I like to see who is winning up on the East Coast or in California so I thoroughly check out BHN. There are a lot of people who would like to see some paints winning.
At the APHA World Show there is a Sweepstakes Barrel Race which is advertised as 4D. Ad says $6500 added money. Sounds GOOD!!!!! This is how it works--not exactly 4D. Farnham gives $3000 which is awarded to the horse with the fastest time. (NOT SPLIT WITH THE 4D) Since APHA has to separate the regular registry horses from the solid paints, the remaining $3500 is split between between these two separate barrel races. so now we are talking $1750 added money in each barrel race. The entry fee is about $100 plus a mandatory stall fee of $60, office fee $40, and drug testing fee of about $25. You are looking at $225 entry fee to run for $1750. Around here we pay about $35 for that kind of added money. When I asked a representative of APHA I was told that Farnham wanted their money to go to the fastest time. They usually have about 40 entries. If they had it set up as a regular 4D with one race they would have over 200 entries.
PBRIP is almost as bad. I was at a barrel race which had 450+ entries. There was a PBRIP sidepot. It had $500 added money, 4D This was divided between two days. Fastest horse got the added money. There were about 8 entries, EIGHT!!! I am not upset that I did not win, but if it was supposed to be a 4D, that is the way the money should be paid out. Don't advertise all this added money if it is not split between the 4D's
Then there is the point system for the PBRIP. That goes by the number of barrel racers at a race. That is fine but when you have 8 entries it is a a little hard to get points. Also, 1D gets more points that 4D. So with 8 entries 4D gets maybe one point for first. You would have to see the "NEW" point system to understand. I understand that up North there are a lot of people who enter PBRIP but not around here.
Obviously, barrel racers haven't had a lot of input on this. |
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| BILLY SMITH Executive Secretary of APHA and the other entrenched non-horse
owners are the problem at APHA.
BILLY SMITH is one of the people that destroyed the Appy Horse Association by
crazy color rules and changing rules after breeders had setup their breeding
programs by the current rules for that breeding year.
APHA closed the doors on SBP racing prospects and so like other paint breeders
I sold off my paints even tho I am a life APHA member. You can't spend 5-6k$
raising a baby and sell for 2k at Heritage Place for very long when you have
APHA changing rules all the time.
SINFULLY SASSY blk/tobiano was the last of my paint barrel horses I sold ..
https://youtu.be/IRKVy_CZyhQ
https://youtu.be/dpxtk66pSzA
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/sinfully+sassy2
WINNER STORM
Ran out ~90K$ with SI 105. 102 etc including match race winnings.
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/winner+storm
ARTIC STORM one of the most talented arena horses I ever owned
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/artic+storm
R STAR .. I sold this mare when Marthas Six Moons passed away
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/r+star
HEMPENS EASY CRUISER .. fabulously bred mare and producer
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/hempens+easy+cruiser
Due to the craziest rules in racing by color the purses at tracks for
the paint horses are now half of what qh's are ... due to the fact
they can't make a field of 10 in a paint race since there are no
longer any serious breeders of paints.
APHA is like Washington DC .. lots of old swamp creatures running
the place ... you have to get rid of them before things will change at APHA!!
Edited by BARRELHORSE USA 2018-02-12 4:46 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 762
Location: NC | Currently have 2 solids in my pasture. Ones 22 this year and is still as stocky and wide as all get out. Has more energy then the energizer bunny but my 66 yr old mom runs him and I know shes safe. Have had him 14 years and hell never go anywhere. Most people think hes a qh.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22730052_1015511215899...
The other is my 15 yr old sorrel with 2 blue eyes. You can ride him in anything and he listens. He can be a bit nervous if he senses you are but hes not crazy about it.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20031575_1015484665184...
Like others said if they work with my program I dont judge
Edited by Racer4eva 2018-02-12 5:28 PM
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 Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | BFN - 2018-02-11 5:08 PM
I own a Poodle...that's enough white to have to keep clean for me. ;-)
Nothing against a Paint....I just don't want to have to try and keep one looking clean.
This is one of my reasons for not wanting a colored paint. The other reason is I don't want to have to pay double the membership fees, double the stallion reports and get nothing for them especially if they aren't colored. Then I recently sold my AQHA mares with lots of white too for reason number 1 and because if they do come out with belly spots (AQHA) I have to pay for parentage verification. Just a PITA all around. |
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | OregonBR - 2018-02-12 6:30 PM
BFN - 2018-02-11 5:08 PM
I own a Poodle...that's enough white to have to keep clean for me. ;-)
Nothing against a Paint....I just don't want to have to try and keep one looking clean.
This is one of my reasons for not wanting a colored paint. The other reason is I don't want to have to pay double the membership fees, double the stallion reports and get nothing for them especially if they aren't colored. Then I recently sold my AQHA mares with lots of white too for reason number 1 and because if they do come out with belly spots (AQHA ) I have to pay for parentage verification. Just a PITA all around.
Yall dont know about the green stuff!!! Its a spray to spray on and wipe off the white areas. Its the bomb! |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | geronabean - 2018-02-12 3:33 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-12 6:30 PM
BFN - 2018-02-11 5:08 PM
I own a Poodle...that's enough white to have to keep clean for me. ;-)
Nothing against a Paint....I just don't want to have to try and keep one looking clean.
This is one of my reasons for not wanting a colored paint. The other reason is I don't want to have to pay double the membership fees, double the stallion reports and get nothing for them especially if they aren't colored. Then I recently sold my AQHA mares with lots of white too for reason number 1 and because if they do come out with belly spots (AQHA ) I have to pay for parentage verification. Just a PITA all around.
Yall dont know about the green stuff!!! Its a spray to spray on and wipe off the white areas. Its the bomb!
Do you do the whole horse? Cause I live where there is mud 9 months of the year. They always roll and get covered in mud.
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | streakysox - 2018-02-12 11:52 AM This just says that horse that are registered as solid paints can advance to the regular registry if they meet certain requirements. CROP-OUT PAINTS are the foundation paints that were and still are AQHA horses that could not be registered in AQHA because of excessive white. (this policy has been relaxed by AQHA and I am sure BF Phillips would turn over in his grave ). SOLID COLOR PAINTS do not fit the requirements for regular paint registry. In other words, they don't have enough white in certain areas. At one time (as part of the let's screw up APHA project ) they quit allowing CROP-OUTS to be registered. All paints had to have at least one paint parent. Someone woke up and realized how much money APHA was loosing because they were not registering these horses. The rule was rescended (changed back ). You need to understand that horse that are registered as solid color paints are NOT crop-outs.
I miss the days of the crop outs. you could get you self a very nice Mr. Gunsmoke for cheap |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 542
| kwanatha - 2018-02-12 6:21 PM
streakysox - 2018-02-12 11:52 AM This just says that horse that are registered as solid paints can advance to the regular registry if they meet certain requirements. CROP-OUT PAINTS are the foundation paints that were and still are AQHA horses that could not be registered in AQHA because of excessive white. (this policy has been relaxed by AQHA and I am sure BF Phillips would turn over in his grave ). SOLID COLOR PAINTS do not fit the requirements for regular paint registry. In other words, they don't have enough white in certain areas. At one time (as part of the let's screw up APHA project ) they quit allowing CROP-OUTS to be registered. All paints had to have at least one paint parent. Someone woke up and realized how much money APHA was loosing because they were not registering these horses. The rule was rescended (changed back ). You need to understand that horse that are registered as solid color paints are NOT crop-outs.
HAHAHHA she know what i'm talking about 
Botttom line is APHA is a bag of DICKS |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | scwebster - 2018-02-12 10:27 AM
Lets not forget that bad little sucker Samantha Lyne rode. Jimmy Choo. Hes owned by a young lady not far from me and he is still tough even with only one eye! Colby Lovell owned a nice paint that was roped on at the NFR several times. Brad Culpepper's yellow and white paint is another of my favorites. He was won a truck load heeling on him at every major rodeo and the NFR. I love that horse! My husband had a lot of success on a grade paint mare heeling. We still see her at the ammy rodeos. Shes probably 18 now and going strong.
We are always on the lookout for a special prospect that has eye catching color/good breeding. We picked up this little fella from Colby not long ago. He is bred similar to his other paint that did so well. I believe hes by a Smart Little Lena son out of a Delta Flyer mare (waiting on his papers to come back). Hes 18 MO. Has a fanastic mind. So far so good.
Love the breeding on this cute little sucker! Hope you have much success with him |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| Chandler's Mom - 2018-02-12 8:59 PM
scwebster - 2018-02-12 10:27 AM
Lets not forget that bad little sucker Samantha Lyne rode. Jimmy Choo. Hes owned by a young lady not far from me and he is still tough even with only one eye! Colby Lovell owned a nice paint that was roped on at the NFR several times. Brad Culpepper's yellow and white paint is another of my favorites. He was won a truck load heeling on him at every major rodeo and the NFR. I love that horse! My husband had a lot of success on a grade paint mare heeling. We still see her at the ammy rodeos. Shes probably 18 now and going strong.
We are always on the lookout for a special prospect that has eye catching color/good breeding. We picked up this little fella from Colby not long ago. He is bred similar to his other paint that did so well. I believe hes by a Smart Little Lena son out of a Delta Flyer mare (waiting on his papers to come back). Hes 18 MO. Has a fanastic mind. So far so good.
Love the breeding on this cute little sucker! Hope you have much success with him
I never said there was anything wrong with the horses. The organization is the major part of the problem. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| geronabean - 2018-02-12 5:33 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-12 6:30 PM
BFN - 2018-02-11 5:08 PM
I own a Poodle...that's enough white to have to keep clean for me. ;-)
Nothing against a Paint....I just don't want to have to try and keep one looking clean.
This is one of my reasons for not wanting a colored paint. The other reason is I don't want to have to pay double the membership fees, double the stallion reports and get nothing for them especially if they aren't colored. Then I recently sold my AQHA mares with lots of white too for reason number 1 and because if they do come out with belly spots (AQHA ) I have to pay for parentage verification. Just a PITA all around.
Yall dont know about the green stuff!!! Its a spray to spray on and wipe off the white areas. Its the bomb!
I live on a red clay hill and don't have a problem keeping mine clean. Hardly ever give him a bath but if I do he stays really white for a month. Usually just rinse him with one of those wash wands. I can be pretty certain in my avatar he had not had a bath |
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 Thick and Wavy
Posts: 6102
Location: Nebraska | streakysox - 2018-02-12 2:54 PM We have been testing at school and captured me. Ugh! Here is my vent about APHA. I have a list. The APHA just had their world Show in SEPT. Not one word was mentioned in BARREL HORSE NEWS. AQHA had their world show in NOV. There was coverage (although sketchy) in BARREL HORSE NEWS. The only place that I saw anything was in the PAINT HORSE JOURNAL. How many of you get the JOURNAL? If you want to promote your barrel horses, get them out where barrel people will see them. Personally, I like to see who is winning up on the East Coast or in California so I thoroughly check out BHN. There are a lot of people who would like to see some paints winning. At the APHA World Show there is a Sweepstakes Barrel Race which is advertised as 4D. Ad says $6500 added money. Sounds GOOD!!!!! This is how it works--not exactly 4D. Farnham gives $3000 which is awarded to the horse with the fastest time. (NOT SPLIT WITH THE 4D) Since APHA has to separate the regular registry horses from the solid paints, the remaining $3500 is split between between these two separate barrel races. so now we are talking $1750 added money in each barrel race. The entry fee is about $100 plus a mandatory stall fee of $60, office fee $40, and drug testing fee of about $25. You are looking at $225 entry fee to run for $1750. Around here we pay about $35 for that kind of added money. When I asked a representative of APHA I was told that Farnham wanted their money to go to the fastest time. They usually have about 40 entries. If they had it set up as a regular 4D with one race they would have over 200 entries. PBRIP is almost as bad. I was at a barrel race which had 450+ entries. There was a PBRIP sidepot. It had $500 added money, 4D This was divided between two days. Fastest horse got the added money. There were about 8 entries, EIGHT!!! I am not upset that I did not win, but if it was supposed to be a 4D, that is the way the money should be paid out. Don't advertise all this added money if it is not split between the 4D's Then there is the point system for the PBRIP. That goes by the number of barrel racers at a race. That is fine but when you have 8 entries it is a a little hard to get points. Also, 1D gets more points that 4D. So with 8 entries 4D gets maybe one point for first. You would have to see the "NEW" point system to understand. I understand that up North there are a lot of people who enter PBRIP but not around here. Obviously, barrel racers haven't had a lot of input on this.
I'm in Nebraska and we maybe have 1 PBRIP race around here a year. Not worth it for me to even get my membership for that because I won't show APHA. I can run cheaper, on bettter ground, and win more money at a jackpot. I have two paints and love them to death. It would be cool if something changes by the time my 2 yr old is ready to run but I doubt it. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| If APHA would learn what a 4D barrel race was it would help.
This is the org version of how PBRIP works. You pay an entry fee. A certain amount goes to APHA. ANYONE can decide to have a PBRIP sidepot. The person that is in charge can take out any amount they want per horse. The rest is put in a jackpot. So let's say you pay $20 to enter. APHA gets $5. Person in charge gets $5. That means $10 is put in the pot. If you only have 8 entries you can't win back your entry fee. The point system is a mess-to be politically correct. APHA membership is about $35 and PBRIP enrollment is $35. Might be a good program if managed a LOT differently. As it is, it is just another way for APHA to suck money out of you. |
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Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | streakysox - 2018-02-13 7:24 AM If APHA would learn what a 4D barrel race was it would help. This is the org version of how PBRIP works. You pay an entry fee. A certain amount goes to APHA. ANYONE can decide to have a PBRIP sidepot. The person that is in charge can take out any amount they want per horse. The rest is put in a jackpot. So let's say you pay $20 to enter. APHA gets $5. Person in charge gets $5. That means $10 is put in the pot. If you only have 8 entries you can't win back your entry fee. The point system is a mess-to be politically correct. APHA membership is about $35 and PBRIP enrollment is $35. Might be a good program if managed a LOT differently. As it is, it is just another way for APHA to suck money out of you.
Are the points you earn at a PBRIP approved event, good for anything as far as APHA points on the horse. Like will they get you qualified for the World show? Or work towards earning any life time awards on the horse through APHA? |
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 Expert
Posts: 1343
Location: Oklahoma | The horse in my avatar is (obviously) a paint. He had his share of quirks, definitely, but was all in all a really good horse that I won a bunch of money on, first paint I ever owned. The girl I got him from told me that people would remember my runs - good or bad - because of his color. He was a medicine hat. |
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | We dont have PBRIP or many sanctioned or incentive races around FL so Im not up on the goings on. Would love to have more paint based sidepots and would love to run APHA world but I dont see either happening. |
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | ajs2002 - 2018-02-13 8:20 AM streakysox - 2018-02-13 7:24 AM If APHA would learn what a 4D barrel race was it would help. This is the org version of how PBRIP works. You pay an entry fee. A certain amount goes to APHA. ANYONE can decide to have a PBRIP sidepot. The person that is in charge can take out any amount they want per horse. The rest is put in a jackpot. So let's say you pay $20 to enter. APHA gets $5. Person in charge gets $5. That means $10 is put in the pot. If you only have 8 entries you can't win back your entry fee. The point system is a mess-to be politically correct. APHA membership is about $35 and PBRIP enrollment is $35. Might be a good program if managed a LOT differently. As it is, it is just another way for APHA to suck money out of you. Are the points you earn at a PBRIP approved event, good for anything as far as APHA points on the horse. Like will they get you qualified for the World show? Or work towards earning any life time awards on the horse through APHA?
no points needed for world show
Show in 2 APHA shows and pay entry fee
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| IRunOnFaith - 2018-02-12 9:04 AM
Bought a solid paint and realized very quickly he was more quirky than the rest.
When presented with a stressful situation he would lose his mind.
Afraid of cattle. Afraid of ropes. He ran a good set of barrels and poles. Was a fantastic flag horse and parade horse but anything "stressful" and he would rear straight up and fall backwards. He was very dangerous when stressed.
He was my only solid. Only had him a few years.
Paints are quirky. And sometimes it's safe quirks. Others not so safe. I think I would give another paint a chance but I for sure would walk into the deal knowing that I couldn't resell for much more than I buy them for.
Wow, he sounds like a lot of AQHA barrel horses I have known/owned. In fact, the one I have now is cowbred on the bottom and he is scared of cows to the point I can't even gather any in the clear pastures on him. He is not dangerous when stressed, but we did have a black quarter horse (registered) that was like yours. You could do anything on the ground you wanted to and she was fine, you put a saddle on her, still fine. You get on and it was like riding a building supercell thunderstorm. You could feel it coming and the energy in the air was incredible - in a bad way. There are quirky horses in every breed. |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | wyoming barrel racer - 2018-02-12 9:54 AM 1DSoon - 2018-02-12 5:34 AM They bought Hot Shot for $3.79 and a pack of double bubble.
BAHAHAHAHAHA I just spit out my coffee seeing this picture, it always makes me laugh |
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 Queen Bee Cat Owner
Posts: 3629
Location: Way up North | I cracks me up when you assign personality traits or poor training to an entire breed instead of just that particular horse or breeding line. I think people fail to actually look at a lot of paint horses papers because if they did they would see how much AQHA and TB tends to be on there. I have two full siblings right now, one is quirky and opinionated and the other is the biggest people pleaser you could ever find (guess which one is the gelding ), that's just horses for you. I have had just as many nice paints as I have AQHA and the same with the bad ones. Most of the paints I have had have been solid so I am sure most thought they were AQHA.
I can't say I have had any more trouble selling the paints in the past, a good broke horse usually can find a home regardless of the color. I will probably have to sell a solid paint gelding this spring to cover some medical bills so I guess I will see how hard it is now. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 502
Location: United States | I always say paints are the barrel racing worlds best kept secret and I sure am thankful for mine. Sad thing is no one would judge or know she were a paint unless I said something. As massive as the horse industry is, one would think APHA would be competitive with AQHA. |
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Red Bull Agressive
Posts: 5981
Location: North Dakota | I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me? |
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 Livin in the Dinosaur Age
Posts: 1993
Location: the other T-town, Oklahoma | streakysox - 2018-02-13 6:24 AM If APHA would learn what a 4D barrel race was it would help. This is the org version of how PBRIP works. You pay an entry fee. A certain amount goes to APHA. ANYONE can decide to have a PBRIP sidepot. The person that is in charge can take out any amount they want per horse. The rest is put in a jackpot. So let's say you pay $20 to enter. APHA gets $5. Person in charge gets $5. That means $10 is put in the pot. If you only have 8 entries you can't win back your entry fee. The point system is a mess-to be politically correct. APHA membership is about $35 and PBRIP enrollment is $35. Might be a good program if managed a LOT differently. As it is, it is just another way for APHA to suck money out of you.
There isn't a set price on a PBRIP side pot, and you don't have to have a pay out. It costs $25 to get one PBRIP approved, sent into APHA 30 days in advance, pretty simple. For every set of points you turn into PBRIP it is $2. Takes a minimum of 5 horses to count if you are chasing year end PBRIP points, no set number if you are trying to qualify for world by competing/entering in 2 shows. We have lots of local producers that are on board with PBRIP approved shows. They send in their $25, we enter, we each pay $7 on top of the jackpot entry fee. If 5 horses enter that covers the $25 the producer paid and the other $2 per horse gets turned in for points for each entered horse. I am already at the race to enter a jackpot, so what is $7 on top of it? So for a show I was already going to it cost me a few bucks more, we pay extra fees/office charges and all that good stuff anyways. An extra $7 a show enabled my horse and I to win one of the PBRIP saddles so all I can say is APHA has been great to me and my horse. He accomplished so many things within the registry this year, above and beyond my highest expectations. But again, I don't need a piece of paper in the mail or my name on the list of results to know what he is and what he isn't, humans making mistakes happens, especially when typing on a keyboard. The people in the APHA office have been amazing, and trust me I have thrown every question at them since horse shows are very new to me. I am not sure where he ends up since he was a AQHA the entire 18 years of his life, and only an APHA for the last 3 or so years and registered Pinto for about 6 months. He is exactly what he is no matter what his papers say as far as his breeding goes. We have never sent one away from our barn without giving them a fair shot no matter what the papers say, or even if they didn't have papers. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 823
Location: East Texas | So I looked at the for sale ads on BHW and could only find a few paints listed within 250 miles of here and they were priced about the same as the rest of the horses.
As far APHA and PBRIP, they have answered and taken care of whatever I asked in a timely manner. I am not breeding/training/selling/trying to make $ off of others so I can not speak to what they do or do not sell for, but see 1st sentence above.
PBRIP is just a sidepot for us, and sidepots are sidepots. Some will have a lot of entries and some will not. We have done pretty good in them so we will keep entering if one is available. We are not going to a race just because it is a PBRIP race. The PBRIP race this weekend has $2500 added and 32 of the 50 dollar pot fee is going to the payout (which is about normal $10 OF and 80% payout).
We went to the youth world show a couple of years ago and the sweepstakes paid way better than the show did, and if we go again we will prob just enter the sweepstakes race. Again, we are not looking to have something to put on a resume and try to sell one.
So, ya'll would pay less for a paint than a QH running the same or better times?
Edited by CrossDRanch 2018-02-13 1:00 PM
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 12:02 PM I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
I think using the {cheap} word is the wrong way of saying it, I would have used reasonably price. Using cheap just makes them sound worthless and I know that they are not worthless horses, I myself like paints and if I ever come across another one that I like I will snatch it up in a heart beat.  |
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Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | So you can use qualified PBRIP races to count as your 2 shows required to go to the world show? Do the points stay on the horses life time record the same as points accumulated at regular APHA shows? And I see 5 is the minimum to start earning points..... Is that the same as an APHA show?
Edited by ajs2002 2018-02-13 1:06 PM
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Livin in the Dinosaur Age
Posts: 1993
Location: the other T-town, Oklahoma | ajs2002 - 2018-02-13 1:05 PM So you can use qualified PBRIP races to count as your 2 shows required to go to the world show? Do the points stay on the horses life time record the same as points accumulated at regular APHA shows? And I see 5 is the minimum to start earning points..... Is that the same as an APHA show?
If you enter two PBRIP shows you are qualified for world, not just in barrels. My horse placed in the Honor Roll this year based only on the PBRIP shows that I attended. He is a bay overo, so there had to be 3 colored paint entries and him be the fastest spotted PBRIP horse entered and he got a point for APHA. That is the only way I know how to explain it since I don't fully undertand the horseshow lingo. Those are on his record with APHA, too. |
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Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | punkypower - 2018-02-13 2:21 PM ajs2002 - 2018-02-13 1:05 PM So you can use qualified PBRIP races to count as your 2 shows required to go to the world show? Do the points stay on the horses life time record the same as points accumulated at regular APHA shows? And I see 5 is the minimum to start earning points..... Is that the same as an APHA show?
If you enter two PBRIP shows you are qualified for world, not just in barrels. My horse placed in the Honor Roll this year based only on the PBRIP shows that I attended. He is a bay overo, so there had to be 3 colored paint entries and him be the fastest spotted PBRIP horse entered and he got a point for APHA. That is the only way I know how to explain it since I don't fully undertand the horseshow lingo. Those are on his record with APHA, too.
Thanks that explains it perfectly. So basically at a PBRIP show you have to have the same requirements to earn lifetime recorded points as you do at a APHA show. The PBRIP points are separate and a tad easier to earn but you can get regular points that stay with the horses record. ... cool......That is what I was looking for. Thanks!
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Veteran
Posts: 141
| OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me.
I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint. |
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Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| OregonBR - 2018-02-13 4:30 PM
joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me.
I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint.
The paint in my avatar ran in the top of the 2D at the third barrel race he was in. That has been a long time ago but I would say there were at least 200 entries. This is the first horse of managed I sent to my trainer. Poor training happens in any breed. Any horse can be an idiot in the wrong hands.
The only thing I don't like about mine is that he is sooooo destructive. Just always into everything. |
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Veteran
Posts: 141
| OregonBR - 2018-02-13 4:30 PM
joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me.
I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint.
So why is cheap a problem if winning is the goal?
You are basically telling young kids 14-22 yo, that they shouldnt buy an equally well bred horse for cheap and if you cant afford an expensive prospect youre SOL.
Thats great that you make the winners, most people put a mare and a stud together then sell the baby and act like they did something special when thats just the very tip of the iceberg. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | joemama - 2018-02-14 7:53 AM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 4:30 PM
joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me.
I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint.
So why is cheap a problem if winning is the goal?
You are basically telling young kids 14-22 yo, that they shouldnt buy an equally well bred horse for cheap and if you cant afford an expensive prospect youre SOL.
Thats great that you make the winners, most people put a mare and a stud together then sell the baby and act like they did something special when thats just the very tip of the iceberg.
You're delusional. I didn't tell anyone "You are basically telling young kids 14-22 yo, that they shouldnt buy an equally well bred horse for cheap and if you cant afford an expensive prospect youre SOL." How you interpret what I said to that, I have no idea.
When I was a kid, I had a $125 horse. I broke and trained her myself. She wasn't registered. But I got her registered hardship in APHA. Oh looky! I had a paint. So maybe I know a little. I bought another young horse (AQHA buckskin mare) at a sale for $560 because it's all the money I had. I broke and trained her too. I won a ton on both of those horses. I kept buying, training and selling horses. Some worked really well. Some were duds. I learned early on to look at pedigree and resale value. Why spend a bunch of time on a horse I can't get as much for?
Now I don't ride anymore. I raise a handful of horses every year. I don't want to raise horses I can't break even on. It costs the same to raise horses that I can only sell for $1000 as one I can sell for $3500. The thing about all this is if you want to buy a $1000 horse, they are out there. If you want to spend $500 on a horse, they are out there. If you want a free horse, they are out there too. Just have realistic expectations and be cautious.
What I tell people all the time is buy what you can afford, make it better than it was and sell for what it's worth. Then buy another one and make it better. If you're trying to work your way up to a more marketable horse, that's how I did it and how other people do it. You earn your way to a classier animal by working at it.
It does take a little knowledge to raise good horses. You don't know me and I don't know you. But I really think we got off on the wrong foot. Please stop putting words in my mouth I didn't say. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | streakysox - 2018-02-13 9:12 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 4:30 PM
joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM
OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM
cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM
I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me?
Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them?
To win?
We need to get back into the mindset of winning.
People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later.
Seems like a disturbing trend to me.
I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint.
The paint in my avatar ran in the top of the 2D at the third barrel race he was in. That has been a long time ago but I would say there were at least 200 entries. This is the first horse of managed I sent to my trainer. Poor training happens in any breed. Any horse can be an idiot in the wrong hands.
The only thing I don't like about mine is that he is sooooo destructive. Just always into everything.
Where are you guys getting that I don't think paints are trainable? I didn't say that at all. They are basically IDENTICAL to AQHA horses in every respect. EXCEPT you can't get as much money for the same quality animal. I don't want a paint anymore. I had one when I was a kid. She was good at her job. But raising horses costs the same for one you can sell for $1000 as one you can sell for $3500. The opportunities are greater for a registered AQHA horse than a APHA registered horse. Depending on your chosen sport. What part of that don't you understand? I don't care if YOU want all the paints in the world. I won't fight you for them. Just like I won't fight you for all the halter horses in the world. Knock yourself out. You can have them all. If they win, great. I still don't want one. |
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 The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | I like both paints AND Appies. But I no longer have either. And all of the ones I have had were colored. The reasons I don't have them anymore are: They are harder to sell, epseically if solid colored. I sell youngsters, not horses that are broke and going. You can hardly GIVE away a solid youngster, ESPECIALLY if it is red. My stallion is also gray, and I don't like gray paints or appies. It ruins the look. I like color, and when they also inherit the gray gene, eventually you can't see the color pattern. I really wish it was REQUIRE to breed a solid paing to a colored horse I have a REAL issue with breeding solid paints to AQHA stallions, knowing you ahve zero chance for a colored foal. I am NOT saying people should breed only for color. but they SHOULD breed trying to get it. Otherwise, they may as well have a breed that is "supposed" to be solid. |
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Veteran
Posts: 264
| You couldn't pay me to own a paint or appy. Do I think they are beautiful, yes. Do I think they can be athletic, yes. Do I think they will ever be as marketable as Quarter Horses, no. I've owned both and sold both.
Dealing with the harsh west coast sun makes the white coat a big issue. EVERY single paint and appy at our boarding facility has cancer of some sort. No thanks!
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Queen Bean of Ponyland
Posts: 24954
Location: WYOMING | turnedout - 2018-02-15 4:57 PM
You couldn't pay me to own a paint or appy. Do I think they are beautiful, yes. Do I think they can be athletic, yes. Do I think they will ever be as marketable as Quarter Horses, no. I've owned both and sold both.
Dealing with the harsh west coast sun makes the white coat a big issue. EVERY single paint and appy at our boarding facility has cancer of some sort. No thanks!
Lol! Our Florida sun is harsh too. I found that if I just leave them filthy dirty they dont get burned. Sounds crazy but its wotked so far!
Unless they are winning then I agree, much harder to sell and when they do its for less $. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | OregonBR - 2018-02-14 9:26 AM streakysox - 2018-02-13 9:12 PM OregonBR - 2018-02-13 4:30 PM joemama - 2018-02-13 2:22 PM OregonBR - 2018-02-13 12:46 PM cavyrunsbarrels - 2018-02-13 10:02 AM I can't fathom why people wouldn't like paints...oh darn I guess more pretty and cheap horses for me? Cheap is the problem. They don't bring the same money the same quality AQHA horse will, so why raise them? To win? We need to get back into the mindset of winning. People care more about selling a horse than winning on one. They dont even care if its trained like trash as long as the breeding is good enough to sell it later. Seems like a disturbing trend to me. I raise winners. What about a paint wins more than a quarter horse? Whose talking about training here? An AQHA horse trains up just as well as a paint. The paint in my avatar ran in the top of the 2D at the third barrel race he was in. That has been a long time ago but I would say there were at least 200 entries. This is the first horse of managed I sent to my trainer. Poor training happens in any breed. Any horse can be an idiot in the wrong hands. The only thing I don't like about mine is that he is sooooo destructive. Just always into everything. Where are you guys getting that I don't think paints are trainable? I didn't say that at all. They are basically IDENTICAL to AQHA horses in every respect. EXCEPT you can't get as much money for the same quality animal. I don't want a paint anymore. I had one when I was a kid. She was good at her job. But raising horses costs the same for one you can sell for $1000 as one you can sell for $3500. The opportunities are greater for a registered AQHA horse than a APHA registered horse. Depending on your chosen sport. What part of that don't you understand? I don't care if YOU want all the paints in the world. I won't fight you for them. Just like I won't fight you for all the halter horses in the world. Knock yourself out. You can have them all. If they win, great. I still don't want one.
I am with Oregon. As a breeder, I am not raising $1000 horses that cost just as much to get on the ground as $3500. I am one of the few that do this for a business and do not use a side job/ranch/town job to pay for the horses. So I raise what will turn a profit. I like paints and when I see a stunning one that has it all going on, I admire it. But I won't go out and buy any breeding stock to raise paints. My son's ranch horse is a dun breeding stock paint with blah blah lineage. He's only valuable as a kids horse-his breeding means nil. But I bought him thinking he was grade. That is where a paint can hold the same value as a QH. |
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