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Regular
Posts: 65
| What is everyones opinion on the buy back at barrel races? I personally don't like it. I think a barrel race should be what it has always been..... 1 run and whatever happens is what you take whether it's a knocked barrel, go off pattern, etc. Someone can be winning the barrel race and a person buys back in & runs the fastest time. How is that fair to the one that ran the fastest time in the actual barrel race. |
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 Zeal Queen
Posts: 3826
   
Location: TEXAS | I don't like it either! I have been beat out of money that way! |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 331
Location: Oklahoma | Don't agree with it ~~~ Don't like it at all!!  |
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Expert
Posts: 2122
Location: The Great Northwest | I feel buying back into a race has it place in some situations. |
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| I don’t think buy backs are fair to the horses. 98% of the time-the initial mistake that caused the unsatisfactory run was rider error. Don’t punish your horse for your mistake. Go home-get better- and try again next time.
It’s also unfair to rider’s that make good runs the first time and then get out ran by someone on their second run. Usually horses get faster with each run so buy backs are at an advantage and since I don’t buy back-my win percentage gets lowered.
If you didn’t like your run or need to get back in the arena to correct something-get an exhibition after the barrel race.
Yes-I know that at the big, tournament style rodeos girls make multiple runs in a very short amount of time but that is for BIG money.
I don’t mind the buy backs at The American Semis because those aren’t made on the same day and again, the stakes are much higher.
I just don’t care for people torturing their horses at a $40 jackpot because they didn’t do good enough the first time.
Edited by BigMomma 2018-04-02 11:09 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 534
Location: Ohio girl moved to PA | Im not really sure how i feel about it yet. Ill be heading to the Panty Raid Futurity here in a week and this is the first year they are offering it at the show and its kind of confusing to me. i took it as those that did the "buy back" would be in a seperate side pot, thats why you pay the Open fee plus the $100 buy back fee, Or am i understanding this wrong? If it goes along with the open then no i dont agree with it at all because as others have said its not fair to us others that only want our horses to run once. |
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| Buy back a chance to beat someone else out of placing who got it done the first time...ABSOLUTELY NOT.....just the wrong way to do it. A consolation or second chance race for all those who hit barrels or didn’t place....yes. Of course, if the entry form clearly states that they are doing buy backs...if people choose to enter knowing understanding what could happen....that’s their business and there should be no complaints. I,personally,would choose not to enter
I entered a barrel race once and they decided to do buy backs when the race ended..bumped me off winning the 2D. I was, of course, not a happy camper.
Edited by runs4fun 2018-04-04 5:43 AM
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| Around here the only places it’s been offered so far are small early season jackpots. I don’t agree with it, I don’t utilize it. I think I’ve seen where you can buy back into the consolation race at some NBHA races - you have to have tipped to buy in, and it’s a separate race run after the open/youth. |
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Expert
Posts: 1314
Location: North Central Iowa Land of white frozen grass | It is going to be an advantage to those with more wealth. It is also more profit for the producer of the event. In the long run it will ruin the event. When more and more people see the unfairness in what wealth can give you in an advantage of just paying more to get a better time. People will quit going to the event. |
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 Reaching for the stars....
Posts: 12708
| Most horses are fine with multiple runs in a day. Some top horses actually run better their 2nd run. I know two specifically that will loaf through their first run and kill their second set, both capable of winning the show. Now, just saying, those two 'knock' on their first run, knowing they can pony up and run again, knowing they will run better their second run.
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  Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 407
| It goes along with the rollover. I hate them both. Run the class and whatever it is it is. |
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| snoopyjoe - 2018-04-03 8:35 AM It goes along with the rollover. I hate them both. Run the class and whatever it is it is.
sorry, but I dont agree with this. I have no problem with carry overs. if someone wants to run in the youth or senior or whatever and the open, they shouldnt have to make their horse run twice. the classes are always run on the same day so its not like they are getting some sort of advantage of different ground. |
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 The Bling Princess
Posts: 3411
Location: North Dakota | runs4fun - 2018-04-03 7:16 AM Buy back a chance to beat someone else out of placing who got it done the first....ABSOLUTELY NOT.....just the wrong way to do it. A consolation or second chance race for all those who hit barrels or didn’t place....yes. Of course, if the entry form clearly states that they are doing buy backs...if people choose to enter knowing understanding what could happen....that’s their business and there should be no complaints. I,personally,would choose not to enter
I entered a barrel race once and they decided to do buy backs when the race ended..bumped me off winning the 2D. I was, of course, not a happy camper.
I completely agree with your post and am flabbergasted that the producer would make the decision to have buy backs after the race was already run! That's not right. If they are allowing buy backs it should be advertised as such so a person can make an informed decision as to whether or not they want to enter. |
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 Go Canada!
Posts: 2954
| Not a fan of buy backs. If they are offered, it plays a big part in my decision to enter or not. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Never was a fan of buy backs, seems like every time I was sitting well {in the money} someone would buy a buy back and knock me out at some point  . So when I was going I just tryed to go to a race that didnt do the buy backs but now adays its seems to be everywhere..  |
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 Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | barrel racing addict - 2018-04-02 8:34 PM What is everyones opinion on the buy back at barrel races? I personally don't like it. I think a barrel race should be what it has always been..... 1 run and whatever happens is what you take whether it's a knocked barrel, go off pattern, etc. Someone can be winning the barrel race and a person buys back in & runs the fastest time. How is that fair to the one that ran the fastest time in the actual barrel race.
If you're entered in the race, it's fair bc you agreed with the rules and entered.
If you don't like it, don't go to those races...I guess I'm used to the concept bc of team ropings.
It wouldn't bother me if a race had buy backs, what I would want to know is what they're doing with those fees...is it going in the producer's pocket, to the payout, etc. I would expect it to go into the payout like an additional "normal" entry...at the team ropings I'm pretty sure it just goes to the producer. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | I would advise if anyone dont like the buy backs call the producer that's putting on the race and ask if theres going to be buy backs so that way you will know for darn sure if you want to make that race or not and then you wont have any reason to complain about the race if theres is buy backs.  |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I have been to barrel races where buy backs weren't advertised, but suddenly DURING the race they announce they are doing buy backs and it was after a well known 1D rider knocked. That does make me mad. |
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Off the Wall Wacky
Posts: 2981
Location: Louisiana | GLP - 2018-04-03 10:00 AM
I have been to barrel races where buy backs weren't advertised, but suddenly DURING the race they announce they are doing buy backs and it was after a well known 1D rider knocked. That does make me mad.
While I don't mind buy backs, THAT would tick me off!!
I would voice my opinion, and be done with that producer. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| dashnlotti - 2018-04-03 10:10 AM
GLP - 2018-04-03 10:00 AM
I have been to barrel races where buy backs weren't advertised, but suddenly DURING the race they announce they are doing buy backs and it was after a well known 1D rider knocked. That does make me mad.
While I don't mind buy backs, THAT would tick me off!!
I would voice my opinion, and be done with that producer.
That producer is known for losing her s*#t when people question her, so I just don't go to hers. Interestingly, that 1D rider rarely does buy backs any more. When they first came out with buy backs, lots of people did it, but when I do go to help a friend, there aren't as many any more. |
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 Witty Enough
Posts: 2954
Location: CTX | I am on the fence about it. Actually used it once myself. My horse just acted like a plain ol' fool in the run and I was going to do an after race exhibition when I found out they did buy backs. ( Never read the rules before the race...) So I did that to make him work correctly.
Now if it wasn't advertised before hand and then implemented during the race I would not like it.
Now, the argument that a buy back can bump you out can be looked at from the other side also... What if you are out of the $$ and a buy back run puts you in... I kinda see it as some people run multiple horses.
But if my horse runs good and I mess up I will not use it. Not fair to my horse.
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 BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I don’t like it for obvious reasons, but some obviously think it’s good for business. We don’t really pay that much attention to whether or not there are buybacks. Unless you are consistently at the top of the 1D, it probably doesn’t have much effect, at the end of the day. If someone makes a 1D winning run on a buyback, it might actually help you, if you are bumped from the bottom of the 1D to top of the 2D, etc.... I don’t like mulligans, in general. If you don’t like them, b!tching at the pay window while paying entry fees doesn’t help.
If enough people pick another jackpot that doesn’t have them, I think the trend would drift away. In other words, as with any other business, you can let your pocket book send a message.
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | Not a fan of them myself. A few years ago at one of the bigger races here someone had a bad run for them, did a buy back and ran again, ended up winning the race and the 3D on the same horse so worked out for them. On one hand I get it, you may haul 12 + hours to get a big race, something goes wrong and if you have the option to buy back it makes sense, but it should be a second side pot or something maybe. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| run n rate - 2018-04-03 1:56 PM
Not a fan of them myself. A few years ago at one of the bigger races here someone had a bad run for them, did a buy back and ran again, ended up winning the race and the 3D on the same horse so worked out for them. On one hand I get it, you may haul 12 + hours to get a big race, something goes wrong and if you have the option to buy back it makes sense, but it should be a second side pot or something maybe.
I agree. I think if you do a buy back, the first time should be wiped off the books. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| GLP - 2018-04-03 1:59 PM
run n rate - 2018-04-03 1:56 PM
Not a fan of them myself. A few years ago at one of the bigger races here someone had a bad run for them, did a buy back and ran again, ended up winning the race and the 3D on the same horse so worked out for them. On one hand I get it, you may haul 12 + hours to get a big race, something goes wrong and if you have the option to buy back it makes sense, but it should be a second side pot or something maybe.
I agree. I think if you do a buy back, the first time should be wiped off the books.
Yeah.....at least where I’ve seen them if you buy back in you forfeit your first time, or you have to tip to buy back in.
In the case above they might as well just give you the option of entering twice right off the bat... |
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 Expert
Posts: 1613
Location: Wild Wild West | Do not like them. I think it is nothing but greed on the producers part. |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. |
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it.
Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 695
Location: Missouri | I thought the buy backs were only if you had a no time for the first run. No way should someone be able to place twice in the same horse in the ama class. They have them more in the team
Ropings around here. I think a couple of barrel races tried it and it didn't go over! |
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Regular
Posts: 65
| I'm old school where when you barrel raced it was fastest time won & there was no buy backs or divisions. It took me a little bit to get use to the divisional barrel racing but have come to love it. It gives the people that don't have the division 1 horse a chance to place & draw a check, like a lot of your beginners. It gives an incentive to keep more people in the barrel racing industry.
As far as the buy back, I don't like it. A barrel race should be one run and whatever happens is going to happen. I think it's more about the money in the producers pockets than a barrel racer getting a "2nd chance" to make it right. |
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 Not Afraid to Work
Posts: 4717
| I agree with most, I think buybacks are a ridiculous idea. I think you are offered one run, its a little bit of luck, a lot of riding well and not making mistakes. It's what makes this event such a blast to watch. Some of us have a slip and knock a barrel, sure its disappointing but it happens. Life has disappointment. You enter the next run and try again. If your horse is a fool, chances are he will be a fool in the next run, that's what exhibitions are for.
I don't know, the buybacks remind me of where society is headed. One shot, one opportunity and you either capture it or you don't. Then you enter the next one.  |
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Member
Posts: 30
Location: Illinois | Ohiobarrelracer - 2018-04-03 6:29 AM
Im not really sure how i feel about it yet. Ill be heading to the Panty Raid Futurity here in a week and this is the first year they are offering it at the show and its kind of confusing to me. i took it as those that did the "buy back" would be in a seperate side pot, thats why you pay the Open fee plus the $100 buy back fee, Or am i understanding this wrong? If it goes along with the open then no i dont agree with it at all because as others have said its not fair to us others that only want our horses to run once.
From what I've understood for the Panty Raid, it is on a side pot basis. The open will be normally conducted, being its own race.
For the Rebuy Side pot, you can choose to roll your open time or rerun (go to the office, re-enter, and get your draw #). Rebuy times do not go to the Open and apply only to the rebuy payout. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | stayceem - 2018-04-04 8:45 AM I agree with most, I think buybacks are a ridiculous idea. I think you are offered one run, its a little bit of luck, a lot of riding well and not making mistakes. It's what makes this event such a blast to watch. Some of us have a slip and knock a barrel, sure its disappointing but it happens. Life has disappointment. You enter the next run and try again. If your horse is a fool, chances are he will be a fool in the next run, that's what exhibitions are for. I don't know, the buybacks remind me of where society is headed. One shot, one opportunity and you either capture it or you don't. Then you enter the next one.
Nicey said I think, to me if you want a second, third, fourth shot then bring more horses and run them too ,lol.. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 993
Location: Northern California | Competition is where you go out and do your best. If you dont achieve your best, go home and practice some more. I think buy backs are part of the snowflake mentality where little Johnnie or Susie always get another chance.
Edited by Keepkick'n 2018-04-04 10:47 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 113
Location: Wyoming | I say only if it is: 1) advertised before the race 2) a sidepot only, not going in with the main run 3) for those that tipped ONLY
Any other way I saw no. |
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 Owner of a ratting catting machine
Posts: 2258
| SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM
casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it.
Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout.
This. This. This.
Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo....
Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons.
I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way.
I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal.
If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!!
Either way, everyone gets the option. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
Alrighty then, lol.. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 407
| *sorry, but I dont agree with this. I have no problem with carry overs. if someone wants to run in the youth or senior or whatever and the open, they shouldnt have to make their horse run twice. the classes are always run on the same day so its not like they are getting some sort of advantage of different ground.
Even if the races are on the same day and in the same arena the ground does change. You get a different tractor driver or they don't wet the ground every class. There are changes between classes. Ask the last 30 people who ran at the NHBA world show. The ground changed and they got shafted in that run in the finals. |
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Regular
Posts: 65
| Keepkick'n - 2018-04-04 10:46 AM
Competition is where you go out and do your best. If you dont achieve your best, go home and practice some more. I think buy backs are part of the snowflake mentality where little Johnnie or Susie always get another chance.
I like the way you put this Keepkick'n! Some people don't have that kind of money to even think about a buy back either like little Johnnie or Susie. Like any competition out there, it should be one shot. Whatever happens is going to happen. If you don't do well or like the outcome, go back home & practice, practice, practice. You don't see them doing this in football, basketball, or any of the olympic sports. You don't see it in any of the rodeo events so why have it in barrel racing? |
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 Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | I’m constantly telling my students that there are no do overs in real life. Now here goes barrel racing selling do overs. |
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Fact Checker
Posts: 16575
Location: Displaced Iowegian | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-04 11:19 AM classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
LOL .... kind of reminds me of the old adage "It's all about ME" (and screw you!) |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | NJJ - 2018-04-05 5:02 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-04 11:19 AM classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
My thoughts too,, LOL  |
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Expert
Posts: 2122
Location: The Great Northwest | I would read the rules for the race. If the producer offers buy-backs after race starts, it should be a separate pot, if not ask for your money back.
Is the money going to the producer? Don't enter if the rules don't agree with you.
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Location: In my own little world | I do buybacks at some of my races. Why? Because they are smaller jackpots that are low key, a place where you can make some training runs, bring your Futurity colts to get some runs, be a big inning barrel racer or bring your open horse that needs a tuning run. It is darn sure not "greed" in my part. It's another entry fee plain and simple. And people like having this opportunity. In saying this, do I care for it st the American Semi's or real big races or Assn Finals, no I don't. But if it's spelled out in the rules ahead of time I know that people may take advantage of the opportunity to enter again. So it's in me whether I want to enter that race or not.
It's how I view all barrel races, either enter or don't enter. You don't like certain ground, don't go. Don't like the entry gate set up, don't go. Don't like all the addon fees, don't go. Don't like buybacks, don't go. And yes, there are do-overs in a lot of things in life. |
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Nut Case Expert
Posts: 9305
Location: Tulsa, Ok | ropenrun - 2018-04-06 1:24 AM I do buybacks at some of my races. Why? Because they are smaller jackpots that are low key, a place where you can make some training runs, bring your Futurity colts to get some runs, be a big inning barrel racer or bring your open horse that needs a tuning run. It is darn sure not "greed" in my part. It's another entry fee plain and simple. And people like having this opportunity. In saying this, do I care for it st the American Semi's or real big races or Assn Finals, no I don't. But if it's spelled out in the rules ahead of time I know that people may take advantage of the opportunity to enter again. So it's in me whether I want to enter that race or not. It's how I view all barrel races, either enter or don't enter. You don't like certain ground, don't go. Don't like the entry gate set up, don't go. Don't like all the addon fees, don't go. Don't like buybacks, don't go. And yes, there are do-overs in a lot of things in life.
To me it is just that simple. READ the facts and rules and then decide to run or NOT. Certainly not worth five minutes of whining time that could be spent smiling and riding. |
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 Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | barrel racing addict - 2018-04-04 1:42 PM Keepkick'n - 2018-04-04 10:46 AM Competition is where you go out and do your best. If you dont achieve your best, go home and practice some more. I think buy backs are part of the snowflake mentality where little Johnnie or Susie always get another chance. I like the way you put this Keepkick'n! Some people don't have that kind of money to even think about a buy back either like little Johnnie or Susie. Like any competition out there, it should be one shot. Whatever happens is going to happen. If you don't do well or like the outcome, go back home & practice, practice, practice. You don't see them doing this in football, basketball, or any of the olympic sports. You don't see it in any of the rodeo events so why have it in barrel racing?
Actually - they offer it at quite a few team ropings.... I don't know about other events. |
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | classicpotatochip - 2018-04-04 10:56 AM SC Wrangler - 2018-04-03 6:32 PM casualdust07 - 2018-04-03 3:57 PM I don't care one way or the other about buybacks. If its available, its available for everyone who enters so it's not like I am being slighted because I can buy back too if I choose. I have yet to ever buy back...I don't like to run my horse more than once a day. But I don't lose sleep over anyone else doing it. Agreed! In the big scheme of things buy backs don't have a big effect on my life. Generally the additional fees go into the pot, so just that much bigger payout. This. This. This. Why in the world does anyone care about somebody getting a buy back????? It’s just another entry, what’s the problem? Everybody gets the same option, sooo.... Somebody who got a buyback this weekend might not do it next weekend, for various reasons. I’ve bought repeat runs on occasion, when I either felt I could speed one up, or maybe I just needed to go in and slow one down. Expensive exhibition. Sometimes I’ve hauled for eight hours to be there and ****ed if I’m going to leave first barrel on its side without trying again. My business totally either way. I’ve been at more races with a buy back option than I’ve bought buybacks. My deal. If I go in and win it on a buy back, people shouldn’t get their panties in a twist, because they could’ve entered up the same as me. If I go in and slow one down because he was being a psycho, and I win the 5D with 10,000 added, welp, I’d chuckle all the way to bank!! Either way, everyone gets the option.
Of all the things for people to get their panties in a wad over...this one is silly. The more entries, the better the race will pay - for EVERYONE - pretty much a win/win.
(and no, I've never bought back - but who knows - someday I might have the urge)
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-06 2:49 PM
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-06 2:53 PM
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Why did you single out NJJ shes not the only one on here that feels like that? Just saying  |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.  |
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:29 PM What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.
How do you know if you want a buy back, until after you've made your first run? It's an option - depending on how you run.
Most of the races around here leave books open until the last 25, 50 or the last horse. I despise that ancient rule that when the first horse runs, books are closed. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | MS2011 - 2018-04-06 4:08 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:29 PM What kinda buged me about the buy backs is that some of the races I went to and thats been a pretty good while since I'm not running anymore, but once the books were closed they started to sell buybacks, to me once the books are closed they are closed.
Most of the races around here leave books open until the last 25, 50 or the last horse. I despise that ancient rule that when the first horse runs, books are closed.
I didnt say anything about the books being close after the first horse ran its usually close to the end of the race when books are closed.. If theres going to be any buy backs they need to have it in print or on the entry forms at least, been to a few and then its announced in the middle of the race about being able to buy buy backs after barrel racers have left after their runs, I didnt think it was fair for the ones that had made their runs and then left, so thats why I think they should have it on the entry forms that there will be buy backs so at least some will have the option to buy one are not. I said I dont like the buy backs but if they want buy backs then let others know so they can decide to run at that race or not. Like I said I dont care for them, but I'm not going to sit at a race and complain about them if I myself knew that they were going to have them at that time, but if they spring them on us during the middle of the barrel race then I do have a problem with that, and thats my opinion. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:25 PM MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Still wondering when theres others on here that feel the same way as Norma? |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away |
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Location: In my own little world | kwanatha - 2018-04-07 12:41 AM
I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away
No flaming here. We are all entitled to our own way of thinking and reasons for it. Why isn't it "just another entry"? They could make a worse run than they did the 1st time, they could tip, they could break pattern. Their 1st run may have got them a check but the buyback run isn't going to get them a check (assuming they have to forfeit their 1st run like my rules are). Every entry fee is payout. Every entry is competition. It might be a 1D horse buying back or it might be a 4D horse. As far as it being an advantage to people with money, not necessarily. I feel its of great benefit for training purposes, however we all race for different reasons and that probably influences our way of thinking on this issue. I can think of several times I would have taken an advantage of making another run regardless if I was allowed to win money or not with it. But as I said before, I only like to see it at smaller, low dollar races. |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
Location: sunny california | ropenrun - 2018-04-07 12:49 AM kwanatha - 2018-04-07 12:41 AM I think buy backs are a bunch of crap. It is not the same as just another entry. It is allowing people with money to have practice runs. Maybe we can let the people with money buy up the first in the ground spots while we are at it
oh and i cant stand the argument or lack there of... i dont know why so many people get their panties in a wad over something so silly.
who says you get to proclaim what is silly. I think people who get upset over other people not in agreement are silly
flame away No flaming here. We are all entitled to our own way of thinking and reasons for it. Why isn't it "just another entry"? They could make a worse run than they did the 1st time, they could tip, they could break pattern. Their 1st run may have got them a check but the buyback run isn't going to get them a check (assuming they have to forfeit their 1st run like my rules are ). Every entry fee is payout. Every entry is competition. It might be a 1D horse buying back or it might be a 4D horse. As far as it being an advantage to people with money, not necessarily. I feel its of great benefit for training purposes, however we all race for different reasons and that probably influences our way of thinking on this issue. I can think of several times I would have taken an advantage of making another run regardless if I was allowed to win money or not with it. But as I said before, I only like to see it at smaller, low dollar races.
I still do not agree. Honestly i find most of the justification for them silly perhaps people need to learn how to lose. It is one of lifes most valuable lessons. I dont think appreciate a loser of the race getting to have a practice run then winning money. If it were for just for practice then ok. |
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BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I’m not going to sit here and lambaste producers over their decision to offer buybacks. It’s easy and maybe popular amongst the masses to imply the producers are “greedy”. For those who wish to take this stance, I have a dirty little secret for you. Producers do what they do for two reasons: 1.) they love barrel racing, and 2.) they want to make money by producing a product (jackpots) that generates profit.
Some call it “greed” but I call it “profit motive”. I think it unfairly denigrates producers by calling them greedy, when the producers are the ones who are willing to get up off their asses and do something that will both promote the sport, while demonstrating to younger people that there may be a way to earn income while being involved in a sport we all claim to love. I see a lot of hypocrisy here. These people are the ones willing to take a chance and attempt to earn income in developing a product that, hopefully, expands and promotes the sport. I don’t like buybacks, personally, for reasons that people have exhaustively stated, but that’s up to a producer.
If you are so adamantly against buybacks, your b!tching and whining rings hollow if you are still willing to enter. On balance, over the course of a year, it may well be that a buyback policy winds up has no net effect on your winnings. In fact, it’s possible that you come out ahead.
Again, my main thrust here is that lambasting the “greedy” producers
is a cheap shot. You don’t like it? Fine....take your money elsewhere.
That’s the simple solution. If enough people do that, those same “greedy” producers will adjust accordingly. We are ALL greedy, when it comes to generating a profit from our hard work. |
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BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | I’ll take this a step further. One can apply the same sort of argument to producers who offer “equal paybacks” at their 4D and 5D jackpots.
Producers don’t do this because they think it’s a nice gesture to those who don’t consistently run in the 1D. They do it because they think it is popular with many and will attract more entries. As with the “buyback” jackpots, “equal payout” jackpots will become more popular when producers have had a chance to evaluate their bottom line. That’s the beauty of free market capitalism.
I think the same basic kind of thinking is what gave rise to the “D” system in barrel racing, several years back. That system evolved out of a healthy profit motive, and the impact on our sport can’t be questioned.
“Greed is good”
- Gordon Gekko (also Ronald Reagan)
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Own It and Move On
Location: The edge of no where | Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 5:07 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-04-06 3:25 PM MS2011 - 2018-04-06 2:52 PM NJJ - 2018-04-03 8:30 AM It boils down to "greed" ...... more money in the Producer's pocket !!! Kinda curious NJJ - Have you ever produced a BIG event? Why would you deem a producer 'greedy' for simply allowing more entries? It's also more money being paid back to the barrel racers.........
Edited by MS2011 2018-04-07 6:05 PM
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BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | If you really think about it, producers generating a lot of profit would be a good thing for barrel racing. |
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Keeper of the King Snake
Posts: 7622
Location: Dubach, LA | Until you generate so much the little people can’t play. That’s going to be sad. |
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BHW Resident Surgeon
Posts: 25352
Location: Bastrop, Texas | CanCan - 2018-04-07 9:50 PM
Until you generate so much the little people can’t play. That’s going to be sad.
It’s not likely to happen. If it becomes that profitable, more people will produce more barrel races. Robust competition for entries will keep the fees affordable. Basic capitalism. |
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Regular
Posts: 65
| I agree, a producer has to make some profit off of putting on shows or they will not be doing it for long but I have seen some that nickel & dime ya so much with all their fees you do good to even think about breaking even. I do this sport because I love it. I know I'm not the fastest out there but I still have fun doing it.
I think a barrel race is a one run race & whatever happens is going to happen good or bad. If you are having issues, than go back home & do some more home work to try to make yourself or your horse better. I love the divisional barrel races because you don't have to be the fastest to have a chance to draw a check & it has definitely brought more people into the barrel racing industry.
I just don't agree with the buy backs that if you knock or don't like your run you can pay x amount of money to run again & possibly win the barrel race while the person winning it gets bumped down. If it's a side pot that does not interfere with the actual open barrels than I have no problem with that. |
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Expert
Posts: 1956
Location: Ky | Hell to the frickin NO!! It's wrong. You pay for one run and then you run one run. Someone said it's OK if they didn't get a time the first time. In that case there is no buy back. The person gets to run again for a time. They don't have to pay twice because of a timer error.
I'm the same on carry overs. That should not be allowed. If someone doesn't want to run their horse that many times then pick the class they do want to run. Ground conditions change. The barrels may not be in the exact same place. And it's not fair to the riders that do ride.
One race here or there may not seem like a problem but it sets a terrible precedent over time.
Why not just quit penalizing for a downed barrel if the knockers can just buy back until they make a clean run?
So, NO, NO, NO!! It's WRONG! |
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 Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | I understand it at ropings. Sometimes there are more misses than catches. Not sure I like it in barrel racing, with the exception of a broken pattern. |
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Buy back at barrel races