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| Long story short, we have a yearling stud colt who was pulled off the ranch about 3 months ago. He is the most flighty/snorty thing you have ever seen. Never had human interaction until we got him. He managed to bang his head pretty good and take the hide off yesterday in his pen (he was playing and didn't stop fast enough before the pole.) We have been working with him on a daily basis but still cannot get within 5 feet of him without him taking off. I did speak with my vet today and all he recommneded was a calming paste, but I don't thing that is going to do the job.
We need to doctor his head but cannot get anywhere near him to do so. Any kind of injectable sedative is out of the question. Is there such thing as an oral sedative or maybe something all natural that will calm him enough we can inject?
I know there is the gel but we cant get close enough to get it under his tongue. |
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 The One
Posts: 7997
   
Location: South Georgia | I don't know of anything that would help you. The oral sedatives are kind of hit or miss because, at least with Dermosedan, you have to get it under the tongue just right. With your scenario, you wont have enough time to be sure it gets to the right spot. This sounds totally cowboy and I don't even own a rope, but could you rope him in the pen, or maybe surround him with panels so you can get close enough for an injection? |
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 Expert
Posts: 5290
| Talk to your vet of course but you can always put a cc or so of ACE on some feed. Let him eat it and give it an hour. |
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 Stinky Cat Owner
Posts: 4097
Location: Oregon | Oxy Zen calmer is amazing!!! It's like Ace but is a natural alternative by Oxy-Gen. I use it on my boy - who is the jumpiest, flightiest horse - when there's fireworks, workers working in the field, combines in the fields, etc and it does the job for him. Love Zen! Any questions message me :) |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | I live in ranch country and know of a lot of horses that never have human interaction until they are weaned or even as yearlings. They don't act like that, he is either kind of a hard case or is just learning he can freak and get away. My own aren't touched unless something goes wrong until they are 5-6 months old. I highly suggest having someone that knows about unhandled colts come work with him. Roping him and teaching him he can't get away and to give to pressure (do not think "choke down") will be the best thing for him. We rope ours and I teach them to take a step when there is pressure, never have them flip or freak out, but it is hard to explain over the internet. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Katie's - 2018-06-11 3:39 PM Oxy Zen calmer is amazing!!! It's like Ace but is a natural alternative by Oxy-Gen. I use it on my boy - who is the jumpiest, flightiest horse - when there's fireworks, workers working in the field, combines in the fields, etc and it does the job for him. Love Zen! Any questions message me :)
She cant touch/catch the horse, needs something to maybe put in feed to really knock the fight out of him, can you put this in feed? |
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Stinky Cat Owner
Posts: 4097
Location: Oregon | Southtxponygirl - 2018-06-11 1:42 PM Katie's - 2018-06-11 3:39 PM Oxy Zen calmer is amazing!!! It's like Ace but is a natural alternative by Oxy-Gen. I use it on my boy - who is the jumpiest, flightiest horse - when there's fireworks, workers working in the field, combines in the fields, etc and it does the job for him. Love Zen! Any questions message me :) She cant touch/catch the horse, needs something to maybe put in feed to really knock the fight out of him, can you put this in feed?
Yep! It could just be added to the feed. All the Oxy products are super palatable so I've rarely heard of any horse not eating one of the products. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | Do you have a chute that you can run him in? I'm with Flit I would put some ace in his feed.. OR
I would get him into a stock trailer and take him where you can run him into a chute and get a halter and long drag rope on him, and keep the halter and long drag rope on him at all times so that you can at least do a little work with him, but I do agree if you dont have the right type of place for him so you can work with him I would not keep him, but if were mine I would get that halter on him and get him gelded and handle him every single day. And I have a friend that did use ace on this type of horse, you could not catch him so added a bit of ace to his feed but got to do this when hes calm dont be chasing him to where hes all worked up, leave him along for awhile and see how he does from there. But really you need someone that knows what they are doing with this type of horse you can get hurt real quick or he could kill himself since hes a flighty fella. This horse needs a horseman that knows what he/she is doing, even if you have to pay someone to come help you it would be worth it.
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2018-06-11 4:32 PM
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Expert
Posts: 2531
Location: WI | Yes, you have a few options. You can get Ace in powder form and pour on feed, that's stronger but only lasts a few hours. I used Reserpine (also available in powder form) for a horse that went bonkers on stall rest. He was tame though, I'm not sure it would be strong enough for what you are looking for. Reserpine is a long acting sedative - I gave about every 3 days. |
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| Whatever you do ..
If he is already upset and acting nuts …
DO NOT GIVE ANY ACE TO HIM …
ACE has a reverse action when a horse is already fighting you
and turns them into a panic stricken suicidal mess ….
It looks like he has already been cowboy'd and maybe pasture roped
to get him in a trailer …. so he is already panic stricken …
Clinton Anderson uses a common method to first teach a horse not to
climb your fence and put a calm well broke horse in with him to buddy
up with …
He has very good points to make and a step by step procedure …
If you get hurt .. you can only blame yourself for buying this horse
in the first place with your limited horsemanship skills …
My advice is get rid of it and spend more money to get you a calmer
horse …
HERE YOU GO … he can say it better than I can >>>>
https://youtu.be/oWU8YgIrNiY
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Member
Posts: 32
| Thank you tons for everyone that has replied, I will be trying Ace on his feed as well as looking into the oxy-gen paste.
Just a few touch points as I see where this is going.
-I am very well experienced, been around colts all my life he is just a special hard headed little one
-He's Playgun bred and I refuse to give up on him so selling to get something else is out of the question
-I have a mentor helping me with him as he has dealt with his fair share of wild ones
-We have cowboy'd him and took that better than we thought but will only focus on you for a few minutes before freaking himself out
-He has buddied up with my mare, they share a big pen but he is seperated into his own section of the pen
-He is flighty but has never tried to jump the fence or hurt us in anyway he simply just wants to run away from you
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 Loves to compete
Posts: 5760
Location: Oakdale, CA | wouldnt a vet have a dart gun to sedate him?? |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | kylee501 - 2018-06-11 5:23 PM Thank you tons for everyone that has replied, I will be trying Ace on his feed as well as looking into the oxy-gen paste.
Just a few touch points as I see where this is going.
-I am very well experienced, been around colts all my life he is just a special hard headed little one
-He's Playgun bred and I refuse to give up on him so selling to get something else is out of the question
-I have a mentor helping me with him as he has dealt with his fair share of wild ones
-We have cowboy'd him and took that better than we thought but will only focus on you for a few minutes before freaking himself out
-He has buddied up with my mare, they share a big pen but he is seperated into his own section of the pen
-He is flighty but has never tried to jump the fence or hurt us in anyway he simply just wants to run away from you
I wish you and this colt all the best, sounds like you might just have this all covered since you do have someone helping you out with him, he sounds like he needs a lot of hands on. Good luck,  |
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Member
Posts: 32
| Southtxponygirl - 2018-06-11 5:33 PM kylee501 - 2018-06-11 5:23 PM Thank you tons for everyone that has replied, I will be trying Ace on his feed as well as looking into the oxy-gen paste.
Just a few touch points as I see where this is going.
-I am very well experienced, been around colts all my life he is just a special hard headed little one
-He's Playgun bred and I refuse to give up on him so selling to get something else is out of the question
-I have a mentor helping me with him as he has dealt with his fair share of wild ones
-We have cowboy'd him and took that better than we thought but will only focus on you for a few minutes before freaking himself out
-He has buddied up with my mare, they share a big pen but he is seperated into his own section of the pen
-He is flighty but has never tried to jump the fence or hurt us in anyway he simply just wants to run away from you
I wish you and this colt all the best, sounds like you might just have this all covered since you do have someone helping you out with him, he sounds like he needs a lot of hands on. Good luck,
Thank you! He is the hardest colt I have dealt with. We will see what his future holds, he may become one that I have to cut my losses and let go or he may make something yet. |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | kylee501 - 2018-06-11 5:46 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-06-11 5:33 PM kylee501 - 2018-06-11 5:23 PM Thank you tons for everyone that has replied, I will be trying Ace on his feed as well as looking into the oxy-gen paste.
Just a few touch points as I see where this is going.
-I am very well experienced, been around colts all my life he is just a special hard headed little one
-He's Playgun bred and I refuse to give up on him so selling to get something else is out of the question
-I have a mentor helping me with him as he has dealt with his fair share of wild ones
-We have cowboy'd him and took that better than we thought but will only focus on you for a few minutes before freaking himself out
-He has buddied up with my mare, they share a big pen but he is seperated into his own section of the pen
-He is flighty but has never tried to jump the fence or hurt us in anyway he simply just wants to run away from you
I wish you and this colt all the best, sounds like you might just have this all covered since you do have someone helping you out with him, he sounds like he needs a lot of hands on. Good luck,
You just never know untill you give it some time, time will tell  |
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 Reaching for the stars....
Posts: 12704
| wyoming barrel racer - 2018-06-11 4:41 PM I live in ranch country and know of a lot of horses that never have human interaction until they are weaned or even as yearlings. They don't act like that, he is either kind of a hard case or is just learning he can freak and get away. My own aren't touched unless something goes wrong until they are 5-6 months old. I highly suggest having someone that knows about unhandled colts come work with him. Roping him and teaching him he can't get away and to give to pressure (do not think "choke down") will be the best thing for him. We rope ours and I teach them to take a step when there is pressure, never have them flip or freak out, but it is hard to explain over the internet.
I have a yearling filly that is like this and I consider her a hard case. We had to rope her down to treat an injured hock last fall. I am now going to bring in the same guy to sack her out. Tho she is somewhat handleable, she is also very prone to panicking and running off. I have seen horses roped down and sacked out a lot in the past but this guy made it look easy and stress free. I can't wait to see what he does with the sack out. For your colt I wouldn't try anything oral - either find someone who really understands how to rope one down or go with a dart gun. These panicky and flight based horses blow right through any light sedative. |
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 I hate cooking and cleaning
Posts: 3310
Location: Jersey Girl | Katie's - 2018-06-11 4:39 PM Oxy Zen calmer is amazing!!! It's like Ace but is a natural alternative by Oxy-Gen. I use it on my boy - who is the jumpiest, flightiest horse - when there's fireworks, workers working in the field, combines in the fields, etc and it does the job for him. Love Zen! Any questions message me :)
I have to disagree. I've tried this product and had zero results.
I would try the Ace in the feed suggestion. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 317
Location: MS | Silver Linings Keep Cool may help. It really takes the edge off and relaxes them.
You can give it everyday. May help him get out of the habit of acting like this. |
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Member
Posts: 32
| 1paintedjewel - 2018-06-12 8:05 AM Silver Linings Keep Cool may help. It really takes the edge off and relaxes them.
You can give it everyday. May help him get out of the habit of acting like this.
I was looking into this yesterday and seemed like a good option to try and take the edge off on a daily basis. Thank you! |
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Stinky Cat Owner
Posts: 4097
Location: Oregon | fulltiltfilly - 2018-06-12 5:12 AM Katie's - 2018-06-11 4:39 PM Oxy Zen calmer is amazing!!! It's like Ace but is a natural alternative by Oxy-Gen. I use it on my boy - who is the jumpiest, flightiest horse - when there's fireworks, workers working in the field, combines in the fields, etc and it does the job for him. Love Zen! Any questions message me :) I have to disagree. I've tried this product and had zero results.
I would try the Ace in the feed suggestion.
Isn’t that funny how one product can work for some horses and not others? It has literally been a LIFESAVER for me! |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol
Not a very proper way to be wording this.  |
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 Lived to tell about it and will never do it again
Posts: 5408
| You seem to be a very cruel person. Don't know the original poster so I'm not going to speculate on their experience or knowledge. People with your kind of reply's are what keep people from coming around this place. I haven't been here for awhile and you have reminded me why. Have a great evening |
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Expert
Posts: 5290
| BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 4:22 PM
You guys keep harping on using ACE
1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse ..
The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis
wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime ….
Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so
let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right
answers in their 4H manuals … lol
A little research is needed on your part here..........
1cc ace has been all that some of my horses have needed to really take the edge off without them losing their legs as they say. As for Sce causing penis paralysis , my performance horse vet said the ONLY time this has ever happened is to fully developed stallions in trailer hauling situations and there have only been a few isolated cases at that. |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | euchee - 2018-06-12 7:13 PM
You seem to be a very cruel person. Don't know the original poster so I'm not going to speculate on their experience or knowledge. People with your kind of reply's are what keep people from coming around this place. I haven't been here for awhile and you have reminded me why. Have a great evening
Thank goodness the good responses on here almost always outweigh the tacky. . . . |
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Expert
Posts: 2685
| I have had good luck with ace on feed for recip mares we cant get near.
Editing to add that I have given ace to some WHACKED OUT horses and it did not make them worse.... had a mare in a halter (3yo, 1100lbs that was dragging the poor man on the end of the lead rope all over my round pen. (He was dropping her off- yay projects). I was merely trying to swap halters on her and everything I got close, she bolted and drug him. I just took the need off my 3cc of ace and squirt it in her mouth. Took the edge off enough to manage her bolting but did not make her stop. She was 16.2 and 1100lbs though. She could have handled a lot more ace PO than that.
I will agree with some here that I dont think an OTC herbal yada yada is going to do the trick. Those are for "tame" horses.
Edited by RoaniePonie11 2018-06-13 6:47 AM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 678
Location: Canada | BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM
You guys keep harping on using ACE
1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse ..
The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis
wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime ….
Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so
let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right
answers in their 4H manuals … lol
I asked my vets about the issue with the retracter muscle and both said in their lifetimes they've never heard of a horse actually having long term effects from Ace. One is more of a farm vet and the other is the lameness and surgical expert for our province.
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | RunNitroRun - 2018-06-13 1:40 PM BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol I asked my vets about the issue with the retracter muscle and both said in their lifetimes they've never heard of a horse actually having long term effects from Ace. One is more of a farm vet and the other is the lameness and surgical expert for our province.
My vets have tolded me if the ace is being abused/using over and over and over and with a large amount used then there could be a problem but used just a few times and lightly then I would not worry about it. |
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Member
Posts: 32
| BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol
Just going to tell you this is why people get so discouraged in the barrel racing world as well as the horse industry period, its because of people like YOU!
I myself am greatful I take nothing to heart and can easily brush things off, but to make my point clear I am 24 years old and have a family full of cowboys and grew up all my life doing this, my late uncle personally worked and showed Poco Bueno.
Just recently I have been told by several people how great my horsemanship skills are because of the way I have trained and tuned several of my own and they are truly impressed. So thank you for your response but it was not needed on my post :)
**Update for everyone else that has replied, we took him into the round pen last night and made tremendous steps toward being able to touch him. He was cool calm and collected the whole time, never tried to get anxious or nervous. This was all WITHOUT any kind of sedative. Progess is being made!! |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | kylee501 - 2018-06-13 4:33 PM BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol Just going to tell you this is why people get so discouraged in the barrel racing world as well as the horse industry period, its because of people like YOU!
I myself am greatful I take nothing to heart and can easily brush things off, but to make my point clear I am 24 years old and have a family full of cowboys and grew up all my life doing this, my late uncle personally worked and showed Poco Bueno.
Just recently I have been told by several people how great my horsemanship skills are because of the way I have trained and tuned several of my own and they are truly impressed. So thank you for your response but it was not needed on my post :)
**Update for everyone else that has replied, we took him into the round pen last night and made tremendous steps toward being able to touch him. He was cool calm and collected the whole time, never tried to get anxious or nervous. This was all WITHOUT any kind of sedative. Progess is being made!!  Did you get to doctor his head?
Edited for my spelling 
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2018-06-13 4:42 PM
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Member
Posts: 32
| Southtxponygirl - 2018-06-13 4:39 PM kylee501 - 2018-06-13 4:33 PM BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol Just going to tell you this is why people get so discouraged in the barrel racing world as well as the horse industry period, its because of people like YOU!
I myself am greatful I take nothing to heart and can easily brush things off, but to make my point clear I am 24 years old and have a family full of cowboys and grew up all my life doing this, my late uncle personally worked and showed Poco Bueno.
Just recently I have been told by several people how great my horsemanship skills are because of the way I have trained and tuned several of my own and they are truly impressed. So thank you for your response but it was not needed on my post :)
**Update for everyone else that has replied, we took him into the round pen last night and made tremendous steps toward being able to touch him. He was cool calm and collected the whole time, never tried to get anxious or nervous. This was all WITHOUT any kind of sedative. Progess is being made!!
He is slowly starting to get curious about what I'm doing and why I won't leave him alone. I wasn't able to hold his attention long enough to put anything on his head, but I will be doing the same thing today and hopefully he will stay there long enough for me to do something! |
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A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | kylee501 - 2018-06-13 4:42 PM Southtxponygirl - 2018-06-13 4:39 PM kylee501 - 2018-06-13 4:33 PM BARRELHORSE USA - 2018-06-12 6:22 PM You guys keep harping on using ACE 1 cc isn't going to do anything even for a calm horse .. The other situation is ACE can leave a crazy acting male horse with his penis wiggle wagging outside his sheath for a lifetime …. Looks like our amateur has now become the bronc buster of all time so let her do her thing with her mentor and maybe they will find the right answers in their 4H manuals … lol Just going to tell you this is why people get so discouraged in the barrel racing world as well as the horse industry period, its because of people like YOU!
I myself am greatful I take nothing to heart and can easily brush things off, but to make my point clear I am 24 years old and have a family full of cowboys and grew up all my life doing this, my late uncle personally worked and showed Poco Bueno.
Just recently I have been told by several people how great my horsemanship skills are because of the way I have trained and tuned several of my own and they are truly impressed. So thank you for your response but it was not needed on my post :)
**Update for everyone else that has replied, we took him into the round pen last night and made tremendous steps toward being able to touch him. He was cool calm and collected the whole time, never tried to get anxious or nervous. This was all WITHOUT any kind of sedative. Progess is being made!!
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2018-06-13 4:45 PM
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | So happy you are having improvement!!! |
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Good news |
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Member
Posts: 32
| It's really not bad at all, when it happened he didn't bleed or anything like that he just took the hair off. I just want to put something simple on it to keep the flys off. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | so glad for the progress update. That's always such a great feeling! |
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Oral Sedative? All natural options?