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Elite Veteran
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| My gelding got sore on his left side after a run one day. Limping on his left hind. Made a vet app and he got hocks and stifles injected and we treated him for EPM. And for some odd reason he gave him a windstraw injection. A week later I had him chiroed and his left hip was way high. I stayed off him for 2 weeks before I got back on him and no change. Still did not want to engage his rear end....working off his front end and hitting so hard I was lifted out of the saddle. I called said vet I took him too and waited for 6 days for a call back...never got it. Took him to another vet. Extensive lameness exam and sure enough still off on left hind. Xray his back feet and he was sitting to low in back...he got acupuncture and acupuncture injections in his hind end. They did block the foot and stifle...he was better going in circles but still off on straight away. Was told to put hind shoes on which I did. Got on him yday after a week of rest from last vet visit and no change. Does not want to use his butt. He is sore in that hip and high again on it. Called vet back today and was told to put him on Bute for 5 days to see if it's a pain issue...well I know he is in pain. I'm so upset and disappointed. Any advice would be helpful. I won't disclose vets name on this thread but will answer any pm's. The first vet I went to because I could not get into my regular one I use. Sorry so long...im just beat down and broke now. My gelding is 15. TIA
Edited by mmfarms 2018-09-04 10:58 AM
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 The One
Posts: 7997
   
Location: South Georgia | Was his high hip ever adjusted? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| Yes it was adjusted |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 928
Location: Northern CA | SI joints? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| halter_ego - 2018-09-04 12:00 PM
SI joints?
I asked about that to and they said no. |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 575
| Maybe his muscles are still tight and they're continuing to pull his hip out? Maybe looking into massage to loosen it up and then adjust again? Just spit-balling ideas... |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| I have been massaging him. We are suppose to get adjusted tonight again. Thank you for the input. I appreciate it . He is super tight in the hip.
Edited by mmfarms 2018-09-04 12:13 PM
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | I would worry about a pelvic injury, even a mild one involving ligaments. Time off, massage/chiro and inject that SI area to relieve soreness. Mesotherapy is wonderful too. Might even rest in a small pen. I had a gelding break his pelvis and NEVER knew. He was in pasture for the winter and I saw them daily when I broke their tank open and cleared the ice every morning. Found out when I started to haul him again and he wouldn't finish his 2nd barrel.
My show horse has chronic back and SI soreness and is higher on the right side. We have looked at every joint/feet issue there could be and find nothing. We guess it happened when he was being started under saddle. Must have had a wreck with all the other things that guy did wrong. I massage/stretch and lunge to limber him up before I ride. I am going to inject his SI twice next season and see if he can hold out for a show year. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-04 12:12 PM
I would worry about a pelvic injury, even a mild one involving ligaments. Time off, massage/chiro and inject that SI area to relieve soreness. Mesotherapy is wonderful too. Might even rest in a small pen. I had a gelding break his pelvis and NEVER knew. He was in pasture for the winter and I saw them daily when I broke their tank open and cleared the ice every morning. Found out when I started to haul him again and he wouldn't finish his 2nd barrel.
My show horse has chronic back and SI soreness and is higher on the right side. We have looked at every joint/feet issue there could be and find nothing. We guess it happened when he was being started under saddle. Must have had a wreck with all the other things that guy did wrong. I massage/stretch and lunge to limber him up before I ride. I am going to inject his SI twice next season and see if he can hold out for a show year.
I inquired about his pelvis also but was shut down on that. They haven't injected the SI yet either. |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw
So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below.
It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine.
A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere.
What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic?
Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking.
It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM
I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw
So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below.
It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine.
A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere.
What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic?
Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking.
It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve.
They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is.
Edited by mmfarms 2018-09-04 5:31 PM
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Boot Detective
Posts: 1898
| Bless your heart. It sounds like there has been much speculation and it is costing you a fortune. If one hip is high and they are not addressing that, they are dropping the ball. Has he rotated his pelvis or broke his pelvis? That needs to be determined. In the vets defense I know it is difficult and sometimes impossible to pinpoint a deep hip injury. That is a large area they can't go deep enough into. I would xray his pelvis before going any farther and inject his SI. I would put him on methacarbonal to relax his muscles and keep him on anti-inflammatories for a total of 7-10 days. (Aloe vera juice on his feed to help combat ulcers.) I'm not a vet but I had a 3 yr old that was hurt really bad in a freak accident and it was obvious he had severe damage deep in his hip but they never could determine exactly what all was torn up. I ended up having to put him down after trying everything for 11 months. (long story) When all else fails, if a horse is hurt and the vets can't figure it out, turn them out for a year and let them heal on their own. If it doesn't heal in a year, it most likely never will no matter what modalities are used. Good Luck and hang in there. I know how you feel.
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Elite Veteran
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| quickdraw - 2018-09-04 5:58 PM
Bless your heart. It sounds like there has been much speculation and it is costing you a fortune. If one hip is high and they are not addressing that, they are dropping the ball. Has he rotated his pelvis or broke his pelvis? That needs to be determined. In the vets defense I know it is difficult and sometimes impossible to pinpoint a deep hip injury. That is a large area they can't go deep enough into. I would xray his pelvis before going any farther and inject his SI. I would put him on methacarbonal to relax his muscles and keep him on anti-inflammatories for a total of 7-10 days. (Aloe vera juice on his feed to help combat ulcers.) I'm not a vet but I had a 3 yr old that was hurt really bad in a freak accident and it was obvious he had severe damage deep in his hip but they never could determine exactly what all was torn up. I ended up having to put him down after trying everything for 11 months. (long story) When all else fails, if a horse is hurt and the vets can't figure it out, turn them out for a year and let them heal on their own. If it doesn't heal in a year, it most likely never will no matter what modalities are used. Good Luck and hang in there. I know how you feel.
Thank you. It has been really disappointing and expensive for a poor gal. I hope they can fix him. He is 15 so he isn't young. |
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You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM
casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM
I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw
So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below.
It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine.
A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere.
What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic?
Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking.
It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve.
They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is.
Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination.
It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done.
I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two.
Edited by casualdust07 2018-09-04 6:49 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 6:48 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM
casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM
I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw
So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below.
It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine.
A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere.
What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic?
Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking.
It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve.
They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is.
Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination.
It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done.
I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two.
I'm past depressed. He is my only horse so I don't have a back up to run. I feel your pain too...especially winning and then getting hurt. I wish they could talk. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | mmfarms - 2018-09-04 6:22 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 6:48 PM mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below. It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine. A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere. What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic? Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking. It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve. They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is. Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination. It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done. I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two. I'm past depressed. He is my only horse so I don't have a back up to run. I feel your pain too...especially winning and then getting hurt. I wish they could talk.
Edited by wyoming barrel racer 2018-09-04 7:31 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 928
Location: Northern CA | I have had 2 seperate horses correctly diagnosed with "hip issues" via rectal ultrasound. One has spurs in his Si joints, the other had a bad (permanant) injury with seperation and soft tissue damage. I am not sure if you are using a performance horse vet that specialzes in lameness, but although the inital cost can be quite high, it is so much cheaper than guessing and chasing shadows. I sort of comapre it to going to general practioner for a knee replacement instead of an orthopedic surgeon, human doctors specialize, I feel it is the same for horses. |
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-04 8:30 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 6:22 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 6:48 PM mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below. It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine. A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere. What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic? Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking. It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve. They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is. Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination. It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done. I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two. I'm past depressed. He is my only horse so I don't have a back up to run. I feel your pain too...especially winning and then getting hurt. I wish they could talk.
This,at least rule it out,best vet you can get and rectal exam,I sure wouldn't be riding him or turning him out at this point,this should be a fairly inexpensive thing to try.Good luck. |
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You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | mmfarms - 2018-09-04 7:22 PM
casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 6:48 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM
casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM
I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw
So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below.
It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine.
A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere.
What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic?
Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking.
It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve.
They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is.
Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination.
It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done.
I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two.
I'm past depressed. He is my only horse so I don't have a back up to run. I feel your pain too...especially winning and then getting hurt. I wish they could talk.
The only reason I have something to run is my little sister graciously stepped off her 4YO and let me get on him. She is busy in nursing school and they were a little hit and miss anyway.. so it's helping her that I season him so she can focus on school. She hadn't gotten him in the 1D yet either or she may have not let me LOL. But had she not let me, I would be SOL. I tried to get back on my other mare I bred last year and she isn't sound. |
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Gettin Jiggy Wit It
Posts: 2734
| high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-04 7:30 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 6:22 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 6:48 PM mmfarms - 2018-09-04 4:47 PM casualdust07 - 2018-09-04 2:56 PM I think you mean winstrol instead of windstraw So what i would do is i would start from the foot up with blocking... and I would do a peroneal tibial nerve block. If it’s above the hock he shouldn’t improve after the block, but should if it’s below. It’s really hard to prove hip pain in a horse, and not much you can do about it other than rest and alternative medicine. A bone scan may be helpful if you’re really convinced it’s in the hip and not elsewhere. What meds did you use for the EPM treatment? Did your vet think he looked neurologic? Also, if there’s like a 60-70% improvement after a stifle block we consider that a successful block. There’s so many components to stifle pain that aren’t articular you rarely get 100% improvement even if you’re dang convinced the problem is within the joint pouch you’re blocking. It’s also possible that if there is some sort of hip Injury, it’s going to take a long time to improve. They did block him. As I said he was better in a circle but on the straightaway he was still off. The vet told me I should just treat him for EPM and not waste the Money on the test. Excuse my spelling...i had never even heard of this shot nor do I want my guy to have another one. EPM med was Diclazuril 8.3%...Levaminsole 3% and vitamin E 10,000 IU. He is high on his left hip. You can see it from the back clearly and I can see it standing at his side also. Well I'm sad to think I might be off him for a while. I am a sponsor in a barrel race for childhood cancer awareness and it is this weekend. It is close to my heart since my baby girl battled cancer at the age of 7. Thank you for your input. Are you a vet? Yes you are a vet. The stifles also had fluid on them...vet said prob secondary to where the pain is. Yeah that’s unfortunate for sure. I do agree with the not testing for EPM because there’s such a grey area with the testing anyway. The meds you used were good, I like that combination. It sounds like you’ve got a frustrating case for sure. All of your bases were covered pretty much other than ultrasounding your suspensories. I would be scratching my head too if there was no improvement after everything you’ve done. I feel your pain on the time off. My 4yo filly this year started the year phenomenally. She was winning three saddles where I run, open 1D, Adult 1D, and novice horse. Out of the blue she somehow ended up with bone edema in her front feet and I’ve been off her since May. She had won the last two races I went to...hit a barrel to break a record at another. I did the MRI and everything. And she’s just healing slow. Slower than they thought. I was supposed to be back on her and it’s looking like she needs another month or two at least. We definitely lost the novice saddle, but I’m on another horse who’s keeping my head above water for the other two. I'm past depressed. He is my only horse so I don't have a back up to run. I feel your pain too...especially winning and then getting hurt. I wish they could talk.
I will for sure have it done |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| halter_ego - 2018-09-04 7:33 PM
I have had 2 seperate horses correctly diagnosed with "hip issues" via rectal ultrasound. One has spurs in his Si joints, the other had a bad (permanant) injury with seperation and soft tissue damage. I am not sure if you are using a performance horse vet that specialzes in lameness, but although the inital cost can be quite high, it is so much cheaper than guessing and chasing shadows. I sort of comapre it to going to general practioner for a knee replacement instead of an orthopedic surgeon, human doctors specialize, I feel it is the same for horses.
I use Oak Ridge. That's all they specialize in. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:03 PM
high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ?
His left hip is not even with his right it is higher. After his injections I was told to have him chiroed and after he was worked on his left hip was even with his right but it didn't stay that way. |
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Gettin Jiggy Wit It
Posts: 2734
| mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:24 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:03 PM
high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ?
His left hip is not even with his right it is higher. After his injections I was told to have him chiroed and after he was worked on his left hip was even with his right but it didn't stay that way.
chiro won't fix a physically lower hip. If it did I'd be on that asap since my mare is permanently lower. Sadly if there is a fracture, chiro is something you absolutely do not want to do because you could displace the fracture. If it's physically lower definitely like Wyoming said, get a rectal ultrasound from a good lameness vet it's good you had the si injected tho. Good luck and keep us posted! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:29 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:24 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:03 PM
high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ?
His left hip is not even with his right it is higher. After his injections I was told to have him chiroed and after he was worked on his left hip was even with his right but it didn't stay that way. chiro won't fix a physically lower hip. If it did I'd be on that asap since my mare is permanently lower. Sadly if there is a fracture, chiro is something you absolutely do not want to do because you could displace the fracture. If it's physically lower definitely like Wyoming said, get a rectal ultrasound from a good lameness vet it's good you had the si injected tho. Good luck and keep us posted!
He is only sore on his left side. Acupuncture showed increased pain on his left side...butt hip area. I took him to the chiro because the vet told me to after his hock and stifle injections. He started swinging his butt around the barrel instead of dropping it like he always,does and he was hitting hard on his front end when slowing him down for his pocket. After this abnormal run he was limping on his left hind. And you know the rest of the story.They have not injected his SI.
Edited by mmfarms 2018-09-04 11:00 PM
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 Scooters Savior
Location: "Si Fi" Ville | I’m a little puzzled by the EPM meds since he traveled better in a circle, I woulda assumed not EPM.
The rectal ultrasound exam would be my choice if I had this issue. I snapped a pic of this thread for future reference. A lot of really good advice! |
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Boot Detective
Posts: 1898
| I sent you a PM with some pertinent information. I also want to add that I think this horse has an injury, not EPM but since EPM has been mentioned, I don't know why vets say it is cheaper to treat them than to test them for it and rule it out. That is not true. I have had several horses tested for EPM via a blood test and it cost about $60 and then you know for sure. If they do have it, you need to treat them for 2 months for best results. It's expensive to treat. The blood test is not 100% accurate but it is pretty reliable. The test using spinal fluid is more expensive and more accurate but I'm content doing the blood test.
Something you can do to sort of check one for EPM is cross their hind feet or place one hind foot right in front of the other. That is not a natural way for them to stand and they should move a foot within 30 seconds or less. If they stand that way for a minute or so, it is more likely they have EPM and can't tell where their hind feet are. You can also cross their front feet. Also use a whip and a short lead rope and make them work a tight circle around you. Watch to see if they start stepping on themselves (sign of EPM) or do they continuously keep stepping up underneath themselves with the inside hind leg like they should? With them standing still or trotting a straight line, push pretty hard and sudden on the side of their hip to stagger them and see if they lose their balance or struggle to recover. Sometimes they will pull their tail to one side a few times while trotting a straight line to see if they are weak on one side. I know EPM is a problem but I also think it may be overdiagnosed when they simply don't know what is wrong with the horse. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| treasurehunter - 2018-09-05 2:10 AM
I’m a little puzzled by the EPM meds since he traveled better in a circle, I woulda assumed not EPM.
The rectal ultrasound exam would be my choice if I had this issue. I snapped a pic of this thread for future reference. A lot of really good advice!
The first vet is the one that treated him for EPM. He never worked him in a circle just straight away. He had been tripping alot too and I already had 2 horses test positive for it so I opted to treat him for it. Actually another horse I used to own was diagnosed through acupuncture. When she told me he was hot on his EPM points I basically called her silly. I took him home (and by the way he was showing no signs.)...after a couple of days I got scared and took him to a local vet just to pull blood and send it off...that vet laughed at me for doing it. Test was positive...very high so I'm a big believer in acupuncture. So I just bypassed the 150 blood test and treated this gelding. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| quickdraw - 2018-09-05 4:01 AM
I sent you a PM with some pertinent information. I also want to add that I think this horse has an injury, not EPM but since EPM has been mentioned, I don't know why vets say it is cheaper to treat them than to test them for it and rule it out. That is not true. I have had several horses tested for EPM via a blood test and it cost about $60 and then you know for sure. If they do have it, you need to treat them for 2 months for best results. It's expensive to treat. The blood test is not 100% accurate but it is pretty reliable. The test using spinal fluid is more expensive and more accurate but I'm content doing the blood test.
Something you can do to sort of check one for EPM is cross their hind feet or place one hind foot right in front of the other. That is not a natural way for them to stand and they should move a foot within 30 seconds or less. If they stand that way for a minute or so, it is more likely they have EPM and can't tell where their hind feet are. You can also cross their front feet. Also use a whip and a short lead rope and make them work a tight circle around you. Watch to see if they start stepping on themselves (sign of EPM) or do they continuously keep stepping up underneath themselves with the inside hind leg like they should? With them standing still or trotting a straight line, push pretty hard and sudden on the side of their hip to stagger them and see if they lose their balance or struggle to recover. Sometimes they will pull their tail to one side a few times while trotting a straight line to see if they are weak on one side. I know EPM is a problem but I also think it may be overdiagnosed when they simply don't know what is wrong with the horse.
The test here is 150. I have had 2 horses diagnosed with EPM. One of them was showing no signs. I had acupuncture done on him for his shoulder and the vet said he was hot on his EPM points....i called her silly and took him home. After a couple of days I got scared and took him to a local vet to have blood pulled and sent off. He laughed at me and told me I was wasting my money because my horse looked and acted fine. Test came back positive and his reading was very high so that's another reason I did it. |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:08 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:29 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:24 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:03 PM
high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ?
His left hip is not even with his right it is higher. After his injections I was told to have him chiroed and after he was worked on his left hip was even with his right but it didn't stay that way. chiro won't fix a physically lower hip. If it did I'd be on that asap since my mare is permanently lower. Sadly if there is a fracture, chiro is something you absolutely do not want to do because you could displace the fracture. If it's physically lower definitely like Wyoming said, get a rectal ultrasound from a good lameness vet it's good you had the si injected tho. Good luck and keep us posted!
He is only sore on his left side. Acupuncture showed increased pain on his left side...butt hip area. I took him to the chiro because the vet told me to after his hock and stifle injections. He started swinging his butt around the barrel instead of dropping it like he always,does and he was hitting hard on his front end when slowing him down for his pocket. After this abnormal run he was limping on his left hind. And you know the rest of the story.They have not injected his SI.
This is how mine with the broken pelvis was running. Would flat turn first, swing around 2nd and nearly be a run off and then would wrap 3rd and run home. When he slowed up and jigged out of the gate he was limping ever so slightly in the hind end. I have a video somewhere. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-05 11:11 AM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:08 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:29 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-04 9:24 PM
WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-04 9:03 PM
high on one side? What do you mean exactly? Do you mean they are asymmetrical... One hip is physically lower? I'd be worried about a fractured pelvis or sacroiliac subluxation of the ligaments. My mare came up lower on her left tuber sacrale and via rectal ultrasound they found a fracture on her pelvis. 2 years later she's healed but lower on the left tuber sacrale. The other injury, a subluxation, my best friends mare was higher on the left tuber sacrle because she tore the sacroiliac ligament. Both injures show a Lower/higher tuber sacrale. Is that where you are seeing the difference is in the hip/pelvis or the tuber sacrale ?
His left hip is not even with his right it is higher. After his injections I was told to have him chiroed and after he was worked on his left hip was even with his right but it didn't stay that way. chiro won't fix a physically lower hip. If it did I'd be on that asap since my mare is permanently lower. Sadly if there is a fracture, chiro is something you absolutely do not want to do because you could displace the fracture. If it's physically lower definitely like Wyoming said, get a rectal ultrasound from a good lameness vet it's good you had the si injected tho. Good luck and keep us posted!
He is only sore on his left side. Acupuncture showed increased pain on his left side...butt hip area. I took him to the chiro because the vet told me to after his hock and stifle injections. He started swinging his butt around the barrel instead of dropping it like he always,does and he was hitting hard on his front end when slowing him down for his pocket. After this abnormal run he was limping on his left hind. And you know the rest of the story.They have not injected his SI.
This is how mine with the broken pelvis was running. Would flat turn first, swing around 2nd and nearly be a run off and then would wrap 3rd and run home. When he slowed up and jigged out of the gate he was limping ever so slightly in the hind end. I have a video somewhere.
I am headed to oak ridge now. He is worse today :( |
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | prayers for you and your boy,please update when you can. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
Edited by mmfarms 2018-09-05 6:30 PM
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Go Get Em!
Posts: 13503
Location: OH. IO | mmfarms - 2018-09-05 7:12 PM
My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
oh man,I'm sorry for your boy,hopefully he will get better with this treatment,keep us posted,many prayers. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| jake16 - 2018-09-05 7:05 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-05 7:12 PM
My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
oh man,I'm sorry for your boy,hopefully he will get better with this treatment,keep us posted,many prayers.
Thank You! I just treated him for it. But I guess we will go another round |
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | mmfarms - 2018-09-05 5:12 PM My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
I can't say I am glad it is EPM, we don't deal with EPM in WY, but I am happy it isn't a pelvis injury.. I hope you have a fast recovery with him  |
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Regular
Posts: 79
| My understanding; absolutely no steroids when treating EPM. Please check with an EPM educated vet, but that is what I've been told from WSU Veterinarians.
Best of luck, keep us posted! |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| J Cunningham - 2018-09-05 9:09 PM
My understanding; absolutely no steroids when treating EPM. Please check with an EPM educated vet, but that is what I've been told from WSU Veterinarians.
Best of luck, keep us posted!
This is what they treat horses with EPM. Same drugs he treated my other horse with. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-05 9:02 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-05 5:12 PM My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
I can't say I am glad it is EPM, we don't deal with EPM in WY, but I am happy it isn't a pelvis injury.. I hope you have a fast recovery with him
I was relieved it wasn't his pelvis too. But I hate EPM :( |
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Gettin Jiggy Wit It
Posts: 2734
| mmfarms - 2018-09-05 9:54 PM
wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-05 9:02 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-05 5:12 PM My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
I can't say I am glad it is EPM, we don't deal with EPM in WY, but I am happy it isn't a pelvis injury.. I hope you have a fast recovery with him
I was relieved it wasn't his pelvis too. But I hate EPM : (
Prayers for him! I hope he gets better soon. |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Sending prayers and good thoughts for your boy  |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| Chandler's Mom - 2018-09-06 12:53 AM
Sending prayers and good thoughts for your boy
Thank you so much :) |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1045
| WetSaddleBlankets - 2018-09-05 10:15 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-05 9:54 PM
wyoming barrel racer - 2018-09-05 9:02 PM
mmfarms - 2018-09-05 5:12 PM My gelding is not lame....his back end isn't working...EPM .....Dr Hague said some drugs do not work on some horses. He is,now on Levamisole and Decoquinate 480 mg packets. His hinny is like jello. In 2 days he has basically went to pot. I assume the windsrol shot kept him looking good for a month. He has lost 50 pounds in a week. I could not get him to Hague when all his problems surfaced so I used another vet. ...who injected his hocks and stifles...put him on his EPM med and gave him the windsrol injection. He acts like he doesn't know where his backend is. So now to treat him again. Thank you all for your input and your pm's with encouraging words. It is very much appreciated.
I can't say I am glad it is EPM, we don't deal with EPM in WY, but I am happy it isn't a pelvis injury.. I hope you have a fast recovery with him
I was relieved it wasn't his pelvis too. But I hate EPM : (
Prayers for him! I hope he gets better soon.
Thank you so much :) |
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Help....sore hip after 2 vet visits please any help would be appreciated