A local family has a Stallion that has a slight pigeon toe left  front. Should that be an automatic gelding sentence. Or would people still breed. How big of a conformation flaw is slight pigeon toe 

Without naming names, there are a ton of big name stallions with really crooked legs. Some of those still sire nice straight foals.  

I guess I haven’t payed much attention. This stallion has the bloodlines and personality/disposition I am looking for. So wasn’t sure if that was a thing that was okay to breed too. He has three babies in the ground from last year and all have clean legs. 

You willing to put your money, your time and all the rest of your eggs in the basket of a crooked legged stallion when there are tons of nice ones with st8 legs? 

I'm not, and wouldn't even consider t for a second. 

I wouldn’t breed to one. I’ve seen great stallions that were over in the knee, but straight. I’ve never seen a great one that was pigeon toed. There are too many correct stallions out there for me to ever consider breeding to one that wasn’t straight. 

He’d be a gelding at my house.

I personally wouldnt either. Dealing with some pidgeon toed horses in my past, it has effected them and too many nice stallions without that risk. However, I am one of those that think stallions should be everything. Conformation, pedigree, temperment and preferably proven.

I would never knowlingly breed to one, but they do exist.  

What type of issues can come from pigeon n toed horses? 

Tha is for your comments. Still learning. I know somethings can be worse than others. Wasnt sure is pigeon toe was one of the bad ones

His cannon bones appear to be offset. They don’t come out from the center of his knee. They are offset to the outside. That’s not pigeon toed. Offset cannons are a huge fault. JMHO but he has not business producing babies.

I see what your saying guess I get star stuck and did not look past his color and personality 

These days, how do you know if they are pigeon toed? I'm guessing 80-90% of people booking to stallions never see them in real life. . . and we all know how much photoshop is used to someones advantage.

The OP had posted a picture. The horse wasn’t pigeon toed, he was bench kneed.

Yes learned be he is bench knee. I posted a picture not sure where it went. But I did a lot of research on bench knee and will definitely not be breeding to him. Don’t want to pass that on. 

Standing a horse in pastern/fetlock high grass to where you can’t see their hooves is also a huge red flag for me. I know some people don’t mind it, but I like seeing as much as I can in a picture (and you hope the owners are honest and haven’t doctored it).

This is a little off topic, but got me thinking. I know of a stud colt (2 yr old) that a breeder sold, and in his sale ad they fully disclosed he has a club foot. His new owners are promoting him as a stallion, but his promotional photos are in grass that covers his feet. How many stallion ads do we look at like this and never even think twice about?!

I would think as the breeder they would have had that colt gelded befor selling, 

The few I have known, have needed corrective shoeing and have had various lameness issues. One did very well but he definetely could have been more competitive had he been straighter in the leg IMO. But he was maintained really well by a vet so I think had he been raised in different hands he wouldnt have been as successful. The other I knew used to buck once ran too hard. A lot have had coffin joint issues. just not for me as far as breeding puposes. So expensive to get babies on the ground as it is, would hope to set myself up for the least amount of room for error as possible.

So many people don't disclose it, or even think of it as a good thing! I saw one stallion for sale that both fronts were definitely clubby, and the owners were using that as a positive selling point  it's very concerning to me that ads are being doctored or the sellers don't show certain views/angles, so as to not "reveal" certain things. I understand wanting your horse to look its best and be as marketable as it can, but not at the expense of hiding or failing to disclose issues. That's just unsound selling and breeding practices. But then again, there are people willing to completely overlook conformational flaws and focus solely on bloodlines, performance record, etc.

Anyone able to edit the photo so just legs are visible? I'm curious and want to learn more about general conformation.

The biggest reason is because pigeon toed horses bear most of their weight on the outside of the foot which is abnormal and puts stress on the other parts of their limbs and into the shoulder.The second reason is because people try to fix them... It's a conformation issue and can't be corrected with shoeing. Changing the angles just increases the stress on the coffin joint and other lower leg extremities. Your left with hoping that their knees and shoulders hold or corrective shoeing and hoping that their feet can withstand the extra stress.  

No reason to pass the quality on to offspring, no matter how slight the rotation is.

there are so many photoshopped stallion ads its crazy...... and so many barrel studs that have horrible conformation.  i dont care if they are a full brother to xyz if their tail comes out of their back and legs go every which way they need the boys chopped off