Just looking for some hope here.  I have a just turned 4 year old, I posted about his 2 year old trainiing and he was a bad bronc early on but fast forward to now he is getting better as he gets older and I am now starting to really haul him around to see the different pens.  Most days no issues at all,  If there is an issue its usually cold and windy and he just needs to be tired.   We are gaining confidence together but I have to be very aware of his tightness right after saddling.  I respect his need to "soak" but not sure at what point I will ever trust him to make a barrel run.  Were gaining slow ground loping the pattern slowly and correctly..  He has never really done anything bad with me on him but ponying sometimes during a lope he will break into a pretty good crow hop..  I get on to him but im concerned he will always kind of be that way.  Some days better than others.  I know it takes a lot of time and I want to take him all the way but at our pace.  He is so athletic he is just kind of a goof with a neat personality.   I know trainers have to learn to get by these kinds of horses but is it just lots and lots of miles?  How do you professional trainers deal with such a horse?  Hes not mean, hes not a cheat he tries his heart out and doesnt hold a grudge but he just gets tight for 15-30 minutes after I saddle and I know not to just get on and go. so to speak.  He reminds me of a ranchy tough minded horse.  

Any examples of your horses that were like this at first but went on to be great? 

I had one of those. We raised him, he was given to my brother, my brother sold him, I bought him back after I was told he kept bucking people off. I never had a problem until I got in a hurry one night and kicked him up into a lope too soon. Sucker broke in two. He knew every dirty trick. I survived the storm. After that...I made sure to walk and jog for at least 15-20 minutes before loping off. He never offered to buck as long as you did that. Sold him to a 10 year old girl that started winning everything on him. Jackpots, open  rodeo’s, amateur rodeo’s, AQHA barrel races. I highly stressed to her and her parents how he needed to be handled. Luckily they listened.

I have a couple....

1. Bozo ( Kristie Petersons NFR horse) I have heard was that way and needless to say was amazing..

2. Nobody knows of this one probably but Kay Davis in Idaho had a horse named Roany. She went to the NFR on him. He was in a bucking string as I understand it. My God mother bought him and he was cold backed, would kick you if you didn't tell him you were putting boots on, hated vets and could see them a mile away so they had to be disguised. LOL He was just as amazing but thats been decades ago. 

I am not sure they fall into the exact category but i know Dolly ridden by Jill Moody could throw you for a bronc ride every now and again. Also I remember an interview with Hailey Kinsel how she was worried about Sister's spunk and thought may be a dud until she went rodeo brong one day but I dont think thats a consistent issue.

I’m not sure if Bozo was broncy. But he was darn sure mean. Story is that she got on him right after gelding him to get him broke. She bought a colt from us. When Chuck came to pick him up, he had Bozo on the trailer and they stayed the night. When we went to load the colt, Chuck handed Bozo to me and warned me to keep a close eye on him or he might take a piece of my hide. Kristie was about the only person at that time that Bozo seemed to like.

The late great Scamper was a bronc.. untill that cute little girl won him over..(Charmayne}

ohh sorry, no hope here. I had one. One day more than a year into hauling (and doing awesome) she exploded OUT OF THE BLUE, bucked me off, stepped on my arm and shattered it. Been out almost a yr now trying to heal.

Ohh sorry you had that happen that sucks!  At least mine is honest about it.  You can definitely tell when hes tight.  Once hes done hes done.  Prayers for quick healing. 

My Zipper (Zip Cash Glory) will buck to this day, and he's 22! But he's made me close to $100,000.

Important things that made the difference for Zipper; omeprazole whenever he went anywhere, and a feed supplement (T.H.E. is awesome) for in between. Also, I made an agreement with him; if he would try to behave a little better, I would never put a back cinch on him, and I would always take at least three minutes to tighten the cinch, walking in between.

But I've also had a couple that went bye-bye because they could never be trusted. I'm hoping yours will come around, and I think they will simply because you get a warning. Good Luck!

Zipper

Hot Shot - if I remember correctly he got Peyton Raney a couple time pretty hard. I don't know if he ever bucked with any of the Steinhoff girls off, but I think he was always a bit broncy.

I usually have one or two like you describe at all times. 90% of the time there’s a soundness issue. Sore front feet will sometimes make them Cold backed, so will PSSM. Sometimes putting them on a low starch diet will help them a lot. Especially if they’re  a real muscular horse that always seems tight muscled/ body sore they will usually have an immediate, positive response to low starch. When you say cold weather makes him worse, PSSM comes to mind.

If he still takes 15 min. to unwind, even when he’s being ridden every day, most likely, there’s an underlying issue. I might understand it if he’s fresh.

i do agree, there are a few that seem to be, just that way.

I know of two that compete at the UPRA/CPRA level. It is early in both of their careers but both are highly competitive now with only signs of improving. Both geldings and both will buck just about every time you get on. 

So if you think a 2yo, 3yo or even a 4yo will be the same every time you tack them up.......you need to keep riding youngsters.....especially breeds like TBs, Arabians or Welsh ponies for that matter.  Also I have noticed lots of people cinch up too tight too soon and DO NOT spend enough time warming up at the walk and trot.

If they might be PSSM1, you'd want to go low starch, etc.  If PSSM2, you will want protein & Tri Amino acids.  Many ration balancers will fit this.  Magnesium can help any of them.  Much more to it of course, but those are basics

I’m aware of the different diets for different types of PSSM. 

What I’m used to dealing with is horses that are untested. When I have certain symptoms showing up low starch is the first thing I try. I have yet to find anyone that wants to spend $300 on a test that isn’t generally accepted. I’m just trying to help he horse and the customer. Low starch doesn’t just help PSSM 1, it also helps EMS (that I’ve also had horses with).

Have underlying issues been investigated?

i have one who can be a bronc if he doesn’t get warmed up really well - like a couple really fast hot laps well.  He has kissing spines.

i think back on a few I’ve known to be “cold backed” and wished I’d known then what I know today and not just written them off as counterfeit.  Sure, some are.  But I think many are just undiagnosed.

I have not dealt with this personally, so take this with a grain of salt, but I've known of people using a back on track saddle pad liner on cold backed horses with success. IDK might be worth a shot. 

I have one. We raised him. He was a bad bronc and we almost sold him twice. My brother started picking up and hazing on him when he was 6. He would take him out back, get the buck out of him and then go use him. I started him on the barrels that same year. He bucked me off several times but the more I rode him I figured out when he was going to do it. It was usually when I went to step on, then I would step off, let him buck, and get back on and ride him. As he got older he pretty much had quit. Might try it a couple times a year but thats about it. I learned what would set him off and just "worked" around his quirks. Like, if I used a different saddle on him, cinched him up too fast, cold weather. He was a 1D, prorodeo earner and won several saddles, so I just learned to deal with his quirks. He was also an awesome head and ranch horse. I had a couple people offer me alot of money for him but I would never sell him. They would've ruined him in 6 months. He's 22 this year and I would give ANYTHING to run him again. He was amazing and sooo much fun to run.

Bayleigh Choate Phipps has a really good one that is broncy in the warm up pen and at home, and its winning everything right now.  Just won the WBRL Open World show.  Look her up on facebook

Dumb question - but when you suspect sore front feet, how do you determine what's wrong or what do you do to fix it?

Trip to a good lameness vet. They will do a lameness exam, block the feet to make sure pain is in the foot, xrays. If xrays don't show anything then there is always MRI for soft tissue ideas. 

The good Skips Watch Jo Lady mare I had was cold backed. It was worse if it was cold, or windy. I messed up a few times. You had to saddle her and let her soak. When you got on, if she felt tight most of the time you could back her up a few times and she would loosen up. On a bad day, you might have to jog for 30 minutes before she got level. It didn't make much difference if she was in a full time program, or had been turned out for a month. She was a true 1D horse with several riders, from professionals to handy youth.

I have two suggestions. Check for ulcers and check teeth.  

My Hired Gun filly was pretty broncy to start even still if she hasent been ridden in a while she needs a good long warm up. 

She's not dirty, but holly hell is she loud, squels and honks like some of thoes bucking horses. I stay on and look awesome so whatever lol. 

I'm not sure she will be a top barrel horse shes my rope prospect but I'll pattern her anyway. Shes just 3 now.