Not denying some great horses out there and many products and techniques to help them run faster. Just seems like a few all of a sudden have every horse in the barn short of the companion pony kicking hiney everywhere. It only takes a few quicker strides to win I the 1D vs 3D or not at all. 

Do you think barrel racers are using stimulants like "frog juice" to win at local races where no urine checking takes place? The drill is hop then block to prevent detection of illegal stimulants. I am not speaking of bute or other non steroidal anti inflammatories either.

A few weekend jackpots with added money add up fast. Haul 3 or 4 who all place in the 1D? It adds up.

What do you think? Are you competing evenly or is your competition using stimulants to account for the milliseconds to score the win? And if so- what local jackpot could afford to test winners for these substances? 

I highly doubt it happens at the local level.  That crap is expensive and if you add up everything you have in to one run a $200 win at a local jackpot is not going to cover your expenses, and is killing your horse.

So...Testing or not if someone wants to do it, they will. Eventually those horses will stop working.  Be happy for the trainer that has a set of nice horses.  If they can't catch it or stop it in the race barns they for sure won't stop it at the barrel races.

Yes it goes on at a lot of levels.  The thing is, people that go frequently know who is doing it.  Probably not so much local, for the reason Clover Girl says, but higher levels, certainly.  There will always be someone who is going to cheat to win.  Those to whom the horse is only a means to an end will blow them up and use them up just to win a few dollars.  Yes, it is too expensive to test for especially at the local levels.

 There is an old saying........ a horse can only run as fast as that horse is able to run. No drug will change that. However, there are drugs that encourage a horse to run as fast as they are capable of running. If its obtained through a vet under their advice, I have no problems with it. 

If someone is drugging their horses, that will reflect badly on their character and will catch up to them eventually. 

Crying foul *just because* someone can run multiple horses in the 1D? That only speaks to your character. 

I have never heard of anyone giving their horses stimulants where I am from and I rodeo/barrel race in Washington and in Montana. I never even knew there was such a thing called "frog juice". Locally, most people come to the barrel race to just have fun or season young horses. People wouldn't go to great lengths to use stimulants to win. The people who are winning and running fast 1D times,where I am from, are the people who have the horse power and talent. No amount of stimulants are going to out work that in my opinion. Now, I do not know if that is happening at the barrel races with 200+ people because I do not know them all personally. But the same people you see kicking butt at the little barrel races where I am at locally, are also usually the people hitting the 1D/2D at the big shows too. I also have quite a few competitive barrel racers where I am from so that is also a factor.  

There’s a certain person from my area who no longer comes to the smaller shoes but is winning a TON of the bigger ones and they gives their main horse a cocktail of multiple different drugs. Sad part is the horse doesn’t even need it and it’s obvious when they give it. 

 I thought "frog juice" was a pain blocker. Using a stimulant on a barrel horse is counterproductive. On a horse that runs a straight line, it's not.  Are you sure the "drugs" being used are what you think they are? Because I know a lot of people run horses that bleed that need lasix. You may not know what's in the syringe. IMO people who use non-therapeutic drugs on their horses will not have a horse very long. 

In any sport there will be people trying to cheat. I have no doubt in my mind that there are horses out there running on a cocktail of drugs.

The question I have is.. what should be done about it? Mandatory testing at shows with a certain number of entries? How do you police the smaller shows or require producers to do the testing? Do they only test the horses in the 1D or do they test all horses in all the divisions? Do they test only the horses that place? Random drug testing?

No matter which way you look at it and no matter what tests they use or how they decide to enforce it, there will still be people out there cheating the system.

In my opinion, the people out there drugging their horses (for non-medical reasons) know who they are and have a reputation for it, but they still dont care because they are winning. It is bad for the horse in the long run obviously but they dont care about that. All they care about is making money. Period. 

I think a lot of people give stuff people may not expect like banamine or bute or lasix. Some may give a vitamin mix like they do at the track to a lot of horses. Some may give stimulants. I will say this, so long as they were prescribed the drug, aside from WPRA for the most part, its not 'officially' considered cheating. No one else is doing much in the way of drug testing. To most other people they would say it was, but most barrel associations either don't have a rule or don't enforce one in the sense that they don't test. Other than that, it's not really my business I suppose. You can always walk up and ask someone if they are giving a shot. A lot of people, if you are polite, will probably tell you and even tell you the specific reason they gave it (often therapeutic). A number of people are are giving something that is meant to 'hop' the horse up will even tell you that. But if there is no rule and no test, wellll there ya go. I do agree with some others on here that said, a horse will only run as fast as it is capable of anyway. If they don't already have the horsepower, no drug will replace that.

It's been tried (to police drug use in barrel horses) and failed (no entries). So I'm thinking nothing has really changed.    

Been at this a LONG time and many assumptions can be made but a lot of times it is just B12 or Lasix being given. As already stated, Frog Juice is just a pain blocker and hopping a horse to where they lose focus would hurt more than help. I think some may give a little squirt of Ace to bring them down a notch to help them focus rather than hop one up. JMO though.

Very respectifully, if you don't think it doesn't happen - you are pretty niave. Those that do it aren't going to just come out and announce it. I don't think that it is done a lot at the smaller shows- the money isn't there to make it worth it. But I have personally seen it happen at the big shows. I know the difference between the necesary lasix/pain killer/ b12 coctails and the "special recipes".  I've seen a rider share a line of cocaine with their horse, I've seen stalls better equiped that some county hospitals, and I've overheard conversations between an husband and wife when a very big name horse at the time didn't run quite up to par. The hubby promised that he'd get the mixture right the next day. This particular horse was a very nice, but not blow your doors off, local horse - but he "thrived on the atmosphere and ran harder" at big shows. My ass.. When he sold for 6 figures, I know for a fact that information about the proper mixture was included in the sale.

I have no problem with someone using anything that is prescribed by a vet. Herbs- blood builders- therapies -whatever. That is just doing what is legal to help your horse feel good. I do not agree with the special concoctions. I know that at the big shows I'm getting beat by some naturally talented horse and riders (that aren't using anything fishy - because not all the good ones do), and also being beat by some that are chemically enhanced. It's the way the game is played.

No. Most “local type” barrel racers don’t have the knowledge or connections to get things like “frog juice”, synthetic adrenaline, Red Bull or whatever concoction is being used at the moment. 

Not to be rude, but the fact you mentioned frog juice with a question about stimulants is proof of what I’m talking about. Frog juice is a painkiller, not a stimulant that makes them run faster. If you see a barrel racer giving a shot at a race, 99% of the time it’s lasix and everyone just assumes that since a needle is involved...it’s an illegal substance.

Now big shows with a lot of money...that’s a different ball game. Those shows do have questionable ethics at them.

I just went back and read all the replies. A lot of them had me shaking my head. Most barrel racers aren’t giving stimulants. A lot of them do block. 

The race track is where stimulants happen. Especially with match racers. A lot of the stimulants they use will explode the heart within 10  outs. Horses are disposable. Most barrel racers aren’t that heartless. Plus they can’t make the huge amounts of money that the match racers bet.

The problems they run into on the track with testing is that it is next to impossible to test for the latest craze...until someone flips and gives them specifics as to what’s being used and what to test for. Hair analysis is a different thing. But it’s fairly expensive and would be really hard to use in the barrel pen. 

There will always be people using the needle to win. But that isn’t happening at small, local type shows...unless someone is truly stupid. Big shows, especially futurities...yes, there are evil people that don’t care what it takes to win. But those aren’t the normal barrel racer or futurity trainer. 

A lot of these comments in this thread are based on assumptions, not facts. And we all know how assumptions can make a person into an ass.

Whether it is or isn't happening is irrelevant to me.  I used to run my horses on hay, grain, water and good conditioning/training and nothing was going to change that. If I was getting beat by people who used drugs...so be it. But I wasn't playing that game. I got out of racing horses on the track because the juice you had to use was more expensive than the purse you win.  I didn't want to win that way.  Sold my racehorses and got out. It's like anything else, if you want to win, you have to play the game the way the winners are playing. Be it halter horses or racehorses.  

Myself and many others have discussed this topic over and over. Some people have tried to police the drugs and it just doesn't work with a barrel race or rodeo that lasts all day or over a span of several days.  Then there's paying for it.  To keep a vet on hand to draw blood to test is expensive.  Some horses are complete bearcats to needle.  If you have one of those, you're not going to like someone chasing it around trying to draw blood from your $200K barrel horse.  

ETA: The 3rd thing to think about is, if you are at a barrel race where you are staying for a few days or even overnight, who is going to anti up for the security to make sure horses don't get drugged by an unscrupulous person trying to sabatage someone. Don't think it doesn't happen. It's happened to me. 

This is why I got out of the TB racing game also---they said in order to compete you do not read about horses, you read medical magazines and seen what the latest drugs were and then try them on horses---I wasn't doing it. My argument then and it still holds true is racetracks need to build a seperate barn---100 stalls maybe. If you are in tomorrow---your horse has to be in there 24 hours ahead of time and have cameras up---BOOM. Problem solved, but like many things---they do not really care to fix it. 

I know a fut trainer in my area who won't run any horse unless he gives them winstrol. I think the cocktails or whatever one wants to call it is done more at the futurities than anywhere else. I am all for drug testing. It worked when I showed jumpers as a kid. The top 10 placements got tested. Back then they only did the urine test, but they checked & in the jumping world, they still do drug testing. I knew a girl in my area who needled her horse even at a dinky nbha jackpot. She was so into herself that she had to beat everyone. She made no bones about doing it either. She had a wonderful horse with a heart of gold. She ruined him & he died at a young age because of her drugs. And who did she get those cocktails from ? Her vet of coarse.  He was a pig anyway, so I'm not surprised with him giving her the syringes. 

I remember being followed around at the hunter/jumper shows by the tech with the jar and long stick lol! Most of the time my horse would wait till we took him back to his stall to pee, theyd wait around till as long as it took to get their sample! 

Yup, us kids called him the pee man   My trainer showed my horse at the forum international. He placed & the pee guy wanted his sample as soon as kathy walked out of the arena. She told him he needed to come to the stall cause Koko would pee as soon as you put him in his stall. Pee guy didn't believe that, so he waited. Kathy said, I'm telling you, follow me to our barn. Finally he did & kathy un tacked koko & as soon as she put him in his stall, here came the stream.