If the senate finds Pr. Trump not guilty can he then bring charges against those in the house or sue them for false charges, since the crimes he was charged with weren't even impeachment crimes? 

I don't know the answer to suing them, but here is some info.  If they find him not guilty, he won't leave office. 

When Adam Schithead gave the "parody" of the phone call to Ukraine, which was a total lie, they said Trump couldn't sue him.  This seems VERY backa$$ward to me, apparently they have immunity to lie in congress.  It seems to me, in OUR capital building they should be held to telling the truth. Now we know why our government is such a mess.  

Dont know the answer either, but I sure hope that the Dems as in ole Nancy Pelosi and her puppets will have serious consequences for all the lies that they all made up about Trump..Something needs to be done about them.

No, they cannot sue the House for wrongful impeachment.

As we have seen, the House can launch an impeachment on the flimsiest of pretenses.  In the case of impeachment, normal rules governing our system of jurisprudence do not apply.  Heresay and opinions were the cornerstones of the "abuse of power" charges.  Those are extremely flimsy tools, in normal criminal law.  Often, heresay testimony is struck down by presiding judges, and for good reason.  Trump exercised his constitutional right of "executive privilege" and, instead of using the judicial branch to settle the dispute, the Democrats arbitrarily grabbed this issue as the main pretense for the "Obstruction of Justice" charge.    
Hopefully, the voters will remind the Democrats that any attempt to use this last resort as a political weapon carries with it some potentially grave political consequences.

Meanwhile, the economy is humming along and Trump's approval appears to be on the rise.

Both houses of congress have QUalified Imunity. 

They also have the power to censure themselves but they won't. 

Also, it should be noted that Nixon was not impeached.  The strongly bipartisan approach in favor of impeachment compelled him to resign from office before impeachment could be completed.

The key word here is "bipartisan".  In the case of Trump, the only thing "bipartisan" was in the actual opposition to impeachment.

The thing that shold worry folks the most in this case is the Obstruction charge. 

It was based solely on the fact that POTUS did indeed exercise his excutive privledge and told congress they shove their subpenas up their arse. 

They in response took the stance that a congressioinal subpena was and carried the same weight as a judicial subpeana there by making the case that all three branches of the Fed were defacto one and the same 

This has been a sham, and a Railroad job from day one. 





PS. using my phone so plenty of typos

t. 

SCOTUS has ruled in the favor of the Pres. several times on this issue.

and add the comey fbi thing to the mix  its overwelhing to me

I have no idea what that means

Mitch McConnell gave a well thought out eye-opener speech this morning on the floor of the Senate going into specifics for one thing about how from even before he was inaugurated the Dems were planning on impeaching President Trump.  Nancy Pelosi was promising an "iron-clad" impeachment guarantee long before the Ukraine phone call.  They just needed something to jump on.  McConnell quoted sack of Schiff lies on several occasions in this speech.  Schiff even said once that if the President asserted his Constitutional rights that was only further evidence that he was guilty.  What???

From something I just read it would appear that Schiff is now primed to go after Pence.  He says "Pence may have known about the Ukraine phone call.  Give it up Adam.  You're chasing your tail.

That loony tune Pelosi won't even send it to the senate now.  Good grief.  Maybe they figured out that someone is going to get to question the crazies and they might actually have to tell the truth and it's going to bite them in the rear harder than it already has.  

Schumer was all grumpy and snooty about needing Pompeo, Mulvaney, Bolton and Blair to be witnesses in the Senate trial. That's after saying everything Dem Congress found is irrefutable....so what do they need witnesses for? McConnell pretty much told him to go fly a kite.  Trump wants Schiff, Hunter and Joe Biden, and the whistleblower to be witnesses if that's the case.  They're all saying they don't wanna do that.  Go figure.

I found it interesting that she said she wasn't sending the articles to the Senate until her trial terms were met. Withholding something unless she gets what she wants from them....sounds familiar. Just had to chuckle at that a little bit. They know they have no hope for his removal from office and are not just throwing a tantrum because he's also probably going to win the 2020. But looks like we'll have to wait in suspense until next year...

Nothing was made up. Even trump admits he made the call and the offer. 

But isn't it cute that the GOP'ers that impeached Clinton for lying about sex are up in arms about this?

Lindsey Graham is your poster boy!! Flip-flop, flip-flop.

Trump is guilty. There's a moujntain of evidence known and there's an even bigger mountain that trump doesn't want out there. That's why he's ordered the people that could clear his name to not testify. Yeah, that's how a not guilty man operates. 

But trump won't be convicted in the senate because it's not secret ballot. If it were secret ballot then he should start packing. The GOP does not have the courage to do what's right for the country. They shouldn't even pretend to have a hearing or trial. Just take the vote and aquit him. Trump could grab 10 women by the p#%$# at gunpoint in Times Square and the GOP senators would say that the Democrats are at fault.

No surprise here. You elect a clown you gotta know the circus comes with him. 

Now comes the personal attacks. But I get it, you got nothing else. 

But you should really do something about your hate before it's too late. 

you are quick with actuisation  clinton had sperm his sperm on dress.   yes he made a call but no quid pro.  and when did he so call grab women if hr did there would be a parade

they have and its on record  they want to get rid of him from get go. the democrats cherry pick the laws they want to follow

illegals get drivers license in ny  how the hell does that fly? they f illegall   guns they gonna take in virgina but tell ice no on illegals

democrat running for sherrif in nc say we may have to kill a few meaning citizen to get their gun yes it was on tv

Dude are you for real?  

Did I see something that said he's leading the Democrats in the polls?

Yes in all the battelground states.

Did you read the transcript? I did, never saw an offer of anything. 

1.) Turning over the transcript was the curveball that the Dems didn't expect.  That was the sweat bee that triggered the Democrats.

2.)  The only fact witness stated over and over that Trump said he wanted nothing....no quid pro quo. No, big fella, there was no "mountain of evidence".

3.) The other witnesses only presented heresay and rumors.

4.) Four liberal, Democrat, Hillary-supporting, constitutional scholars - all voted against Trump. One of them, Turley, blew the other 3 out of the water.  Read or watch his testimony.

5.) Pelosi and the rest of the Democrats decided to impeach Trump the day he was sworn in.  This Ukraine farce was all they could come up with.  

6.) Pelosi just a few months ago said impeachment could only go forward with bipartisan support. The only thing that was bipartisan was the opposition to impeachment.

7.) "Secret ballot"?  What is this?  A star chamber? The "central committee" of the Soviet Union?  Where did you come up with this idea?  You are showing your true colors.  We don't do secret ballots in congress.  You have us mixed up with Venezuela, comrade.

8.) The only clowns I saw throughout this charade were Democrats.  I was very impressed by the Republicans on both House Committees.  I've never witnessed unity like this in the GOP in my lifetime.  Every one of them delivered knockout punches.  All this under Trump. Go figure.

9.) Trump's popularity and approval ratings have both shot up during this farce.  People aren't swayed...on this witch hunt. 

10.) Trump's popularity with African Americans has been astonishing.....for good reason. 

If Trump is a clown, what does that say about your crazy party that has been hijacked by a bunch of dingbats like AOC and Ilhan Omar.

Get a good look at this face.

Democrats keep saying "This is a stain on the presidency."

The only stain I'm seeing is the stain on Trump's shoe, and it smells like Democrat as$.

I love it when the Bear discusses politics.  I dare anybody to try to outsmart him.

We tuned in to the hearing yesterday while I was working- Rep Doug Collins from Georgia aka "the gentleman from Georgia" had a superb statement. 

https://youtu.be/_p5X4aH2h9M 

ETA: fixed the link

Thanks for that and did you know that Doug Collins was a pastor at some time in his life.  You can almost sense it in his presentation.....a little bit of a sermon in his tone.

Brit Hume (wise old fella) made a remark yesterday.  Can't remember it word for word but it went something like they're going to impeach Trump over aid withheld from Ukraine that "was" paid and an investigation into the Biden's that "never" happened.

It seems to me from reading the 2 Articles they eventually decided on filing...that the first one doesn't actually Impeach him for what they claim he did (witholding aid) but rather for what they "say" his motive was for doing so...To invite foreign influence in the 2020 election.  That's a joke.  This entire impeachment sham is their attempt to influence that election.  They have made that clear. 

The second article...they sent a subpoena to the executive branch that they KNEW he would reject. (as is the right of a separate branch of government)...the correct course would have been to then take it to the judicial branch (the courts) to have them render a decision...but no...instead they used it to claim "obstruction of Congress" 

That's the best they could come up with after 3 years of non-stop trying?  After 2 months of a rigged 1 sided process in the House?  And now they have the cojones to try to demand a "fair" process in the senate?  The democrats have lost all perspective.

Well---some may not realize, he is a surgeon. Kind of a smart dude !!!!!!!!!!!!

watch the democrat debate last night biden showed glimpses of his true colors he uis a aggroant sob . i shake my head over the nonsense

i do believe wind and solar would help  but so expense  i would have it in heartbeat but.

then you got that  congressman that says hang  him

Berman then asked Rep. Clyburn how long he would be willing to withhold the Articles of Impeachment if the Senate does not cave.

“As long as it takes. Even if he doesn’t come around to committing to a fair trial, keep those articles here. So, keep it as long as it takes.

“If you know and he’s told you what he’s going to do, let’s give him a fair trial and hang him. It’s the reverse of that,” he said.

Berman,an anchor of one of the most powerful news networks in the world, did not say a word. He just moved on to the next question.

“As long as it takes? Are you willing to hold the articles indefinitely if Mitch McConnell doesn’t concede the points that you’re asking him to? Are you suggesting it’s possible you will never transmit the articles of impeachment?” Berman said, just skipping the part about mur

Thank you all for your imput. I hope this stays an interesting read. I think we all need all the true facts we can get on this.  I am so sick of all the fake forward post on Face book. If people would just take a little time to research stuff before they hit the share button and see if it is a fact or just more hate post it would be wonderful. Also if all of us could have a more open mind and see what the facts are it would be great. It seems the Dem are so eat up with hate for Trump they are blind to any truth.

Please try to play nice here. Thank you again

Me too! I came to this thread simply to read up on the replies, and was hoping I'd see input from Bear. 

Election Night---Bear and I were messaging back and forth all night--giddy like little school kids. Once we realized that he was going to win we both came to the realization that this was going to be a tough road ahead. That the establishment would fight tooth and nail to hold onto power---even then I could not imagine the extreme they would go to. It has been said before---they are like spoiled kids and a strict parent has come into the picture and they are throwing a temper tantrum but I never thought it would go on this long. The American public needs to wake up and realize that our elected officials have been robbing us blind for decades---not Republican or Democrat---all of them. This giving of foreign aid and the funneling part of it to themselves through back channels has been going on forever---Biden is just a tip of the iceburg.

We hired him to drain the swamp and the swamp is fighting back. That's it in a nutshell.  Pray for President Trump and the patriots that are helping and protecting him.  The swamp assassinated (or tried) any president that tried to resist them.  Think about that. 

This is a HUGE fear of mine also---there are players involved in the shadows, always has been, that absolutely do not want things to change.

Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms. Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.
Prepare.
For God & Country.
For Humanity.
We FIGHT!
Q

According to Noah Feldman, one of the smartypants attorneys who appeared as a witness in their last boring hearing, as long as Nancy holds up the Articles of Impeachment, then Trump isn't impeached.  Couldn't be clearer than that.

Here's my take on Trump, and I think it explains why he has incurred unprecedented wrath and hate from all directions.  Basically, he doesn't give a fart about stepping on a few toes or hurting a few feelings.  He's been editorializing about how our government is doing things wrong or ineptly for 40 years. His positions have changed a few times over the years, but for the most part he's been consistent.  He dabbled with the idea of running for POTUS a time or two, but he wasn't real committed.  He went all in for Romney in 2012, but inexplicably Romney let Obama off the ropes and went soft. Around that time I decided I was no longer a Republican and became an independent, because I was disgusted over the fact that the GOP didn't have any balls and they were feckless.  Finally, Trump, a multibillionaire, decided he had to get in the game and do it himself. He had it all and was in the twilight of his life with a great family and a beautiful wife. He knew he was jumping into the belly of the beast, but he committed to it.  He's lost a fortune in so doing. He seemed like a carnival side show at first..for a few weeks.  Then he proceeded to blow away 16 GOP candidates, followed by Hillary.  Heads exploded, and here we are.  "Drain the swamp" was not some meaningless slogan.  He meant it. They call him bombastic, mean, a pig, a dunce, and a liar.  People don't care about that, because when it comes to delivering on promises, he's doing it like nobody before him. In that sense, he just might be the most honest president we've ever had.  Now you might not like every aspect of his agenda, but he's been setting 'em up and knocking them down like bowling pins.  That, combined with his exposing the swamp is precisely why they are impeaching him.  He's exposed the swamp and the incompetence....they decided he has to go.

I believe they will try anything to get rid of him.....anything, literally.

Absolutely the best thing I've read in awhile that goes along with what I wholeheartedly agree with! 

I think what his opposition misses is that he's a streetfighter in many aspects and it isn't always wise to cross him.  He's waaaay smarter than they think he is.  Good analogy Bear.

Interesting, Trump Jr. was asked if he would ever consider running for President and he did not say no.  Totally up to the challenge.

I'll never forget that night.  There was a bunch of us on one of those FB groups posting back and forth too.

Carol, my wife was in the bedroom watching the returns on Fox Business News, because she hated how I seemed pessimistic, because she was cock sure he would win all along....all year long.  I wasn't so sure and I couldn't believe what was happening.  I made her nervous.  Yeah, Hoppel and I were messaging back and forth all night.  I still occasionally play those YouTube election night video montages from time to time just to watch the media melt down.  
Election night is light years away, in politics, but I'd sure love to see him re-elected.  The entertainment value afterwards would be priceless.  Right now, I just don't see anyone coming close to defeating him.  

Agree--where many crumble under the pressure he thrives from it.

I fell asleep watching TV a few minutes ago and woke up to a shrieking Maxine Waters (watching Laura Ingraham but she was showing a clip from CNN) blowing and going about how if the Senate exonerated Trump he was going to get "worse much worse" in time to come and she also knew that Putin would soon be visiting the White House.  I couldn't even wrap my head around what I was seeing (sleepy) but it was downright scarey.  This woman is insane.

Well since he's a head of state, he may get an invite to the WH.  So what? 

The ones that shriek the loudest have the most to lose.  Corrupt. Every. Last. One. Of. Them.  When it comes out all the money they've stolen from the taxpayers will astound all of us.  Trump keeps closing doors and windows on their cash cows.  That's why they are so desperate. 

For the life of me, I don't see why everyone is so paralyzed by fear over Russia.  They know dam well we would annihilate them in any armed confrontation.   Our military is 10 times the size of theirs.  All this Putin paranoia is way way overblown.  Russian mischief has been going on for decades.  Maybe if we had better relations with them we wouldn't be involved in so many proxy wars.   

i just read where como  just said federal judges  <veto bill> would have been able to officiate at wedding  cause they might be trump appointed

and trump does not  reflect what new yorkers  are. sooooooooooooo  i gues this is why they new yorkers are giving illegals drivers licenses

trump like law   como doe not      fyi why was ice not therr

The reason we have been in all these wars, is because the military-industrial complex (deep state) WANTS us to be in wars.  Russia is just the convenient "villan". Putin took over their bank in his country. They hate him now and want to push us into a war with him.  

During his administration Obama sent $350,000 in our taxpayer funds to an organization in Israel to try to influence the election against Netanyahu.  Now "that's" election meddling.  Why wasn't that an impeachable offense.  That and releasing 150 billion to Iran who celebrates a holiday named "Death to America."