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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 555
 
Location: Puky midwest | I hope they change it, but remember, men don't change unless they want to. And sometimes they don't when they want to. No one is going to tell these men what to do. Unfortunately | |
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 Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
  
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | SKM - 2014-12-17 4:22 AM
Texas Tornado - 2014-12-16 11:59 PM
If the expected standard is awesome jackpot ground @ NFR then yes it was crap for sure.
So if that is the standard expectation for this then there should be disappointment, however if not I would consider it pretty darn good rodeo ground
No, it wasn't even good rodeo ground. We rodeoed in 7 states last year. One rodeo stopped slack and redid the ground because it was so bad (Akron CO ). Salt Lake was about like the NFR ground and those horses had heck on it. Ogden was about like the NFR. Rodeo ground has come a long way and most committee's are trying to make it better. If you think dangerous rodeo ground is the norm, you might want to broaden your horizons and go a little more because your knowledge is way off base.
Casper about a month ago stopped slack also. My horse that that normally stands on anything had trouble w/ it but it was better after they stopped, fixed it and reran whoever wanted to. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1767
Location: California | SKM - 2014-12-17 4:22 AM Texas Tornado - 2014-12-16 11:59 PM If the expected standard is awesome jackpot ground @ NFR then yes it was crap for sure. So if that is the standard expectation for this then there should be disappointment, however if not I would consider it pretty darn good rodeo ground No, it wasn't even good rodeo ground. We rodeoed in 7 states last year. One rodeo stopped slack and redid the ground because it was so bad (Akron CO ). Salt Lake was about like the NFR ground and those horses had heck on it. Ogden was about like the NFR. Rodeo ground has come a long way and most committee's are trying to make it better. If you think dangerous rodeo ground is the norm, you might want to broaden your horizons and go a little more because your knowledge is way off base.
This year I ended up driving a friend around to quite a few rodeos (she finished 18th) and I asked her where we went that she would consider a lot better than what was in the T&M, and the list was pretty short. It was just a different bad than a lot of other rodeos, but equally as bad as any of them. Unfortunately with rodeos, they use a lot of arenas that are not used all year long except for that weekend or when they go in buildings. Belton and Tuscon had horses fall and leave the arena without their riders. Reno ended one horses career and looked like it got another one in the short go but he ended up being alright. I watched 3 horses fall down at Casper in the slack, then Movin ran a 17.0 and then the majority went back to loosing their hind ends and skating around. At Colo Springs, they decided not to work the ground before the Finals because of the rain, it was like concrete by the Super Shootout time. Red Lodge, they stopped the rodeo after 50 girls, worked the ground and it still wasn't any better. At Greely in the short go it was super hard. Horses were loosing their hind ends and slipping pretty bad. My friend's horse fell on his knee at the third barrel. Another one got into a nasty wreck trying to stop. Vernal was good for slock, but it had rained quite a bit which looked like it really tightened up the ground. Lehi and Sheridan got pretty deep, if you weren't in the first few on the drag you probably weren't getting a check. Before our perf a thunderstorm passed through in Cody so it was a lake, but we heard it was good for slack. We were told that Cheyenne was the best it had been in years, and it looked pretty bad. A lot of horses got to that third barrel and said "forget this" and ended up really wide or decided to do a "Queen run" out of the arena. Livingston and Salinas were good, so was Spanish Fork from what I remember. It really seemed like everywhere we went, people would ask from home "How was the ground?" and my response was usually "Ehhh, I don't know, not great. Some horses fell then someone ran really fast. Go figure."
The committees try, but a lot of them don't know what they are doing (or they think it's a good idea to bring in sand and just leave it on top of the hard dirt!). If there was a higher standard all year long then it would be much easier to hold the NFR to a higher standard. But as long as a lot of these rodeos run on very similar ground (in terms of being bad) and the judges see it and think it's "alright" (even though it shouldn't be) then how do we as an association (the WPRA) begin to make changes? How to we hold the committees to a higher standard? I know some committees would just as easily not have the barrel race. I remember my friend and I talking about how we would gripe about the rodeo ground in California, but there was hardly anywhere this year that was much better! JMO. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 865
| Calibarrelrcr - 2014-12-17 1:33 PM
SKM - 2014-12-17 4:22 AM Texas Tornado - 2014-12-16 11:59 PM If the expected standard is awesome jackpot ground @ NFR then yes it was crap for sure. So if that is the standard expectation for this then there should be disappointment, however if not I would consider it pretty darn good rodeo ground No, it wasn't even good rodeo ground. We rodeoed in 7 states last year. One rodeo stopped slack and redid the ground because it was so bad (Akron CO ). Salt Lake was about like the NFR ground and those horses had heck on it. Ogden was about like the NFR. Rodeo ground has come a long way and most committee's are trying to make it better. If you think dangerous rodeo ground is the norm, you might want to broaden your horizons and go a little more because your knowledge is way off base.
The committees try, but a lot of them don't know what they are doing (or they think it's a good idea to bring in sand and just leave it on top of the hard dirt!). If there was a higher standard all year long then it would be much easier to hold the NFR to a higher standard. But as long as a lot of these rodeos run on very similar ground (in terms of being bad) and the judges see it and think it's "alright" (even though it shouldn't be) then how do we as an association (the WPRA) begin to make changes? How to we hold the committees to a higher standard? I know some committees would just as easily not have the barrel race. I remember my friend and I talking about how we would gripe about the rodeo ground in California, but there was hardly anywhere this year that was much better! JMO.
Calibarrelrcr you are exactly right!
Hopefully Barrelracer1983 read your post. | |
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Ms. Elvis
Posts: 9606
Location: Running barrels or watching nascar | FYI, I was not talking about Casper in July, rather the rodeo in the indoor arena in November. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 286
Location: GA | Email I sent to Mr. Christenson at LVE. pat@ lasvegasevents.com. Everyone should email Mr. Christenson, he may be in the position to do something for next years, and the following years NFR. Don't just let the concern fade away over this next year. If this year did not show people how bad it can be out there, then I do not know what can. Dear Mr. Christenson, I pray that Las Vegas Events will ensure professionally installed ground for next years National Finals Rodeo. Every event would benefit from it, from the best bucking stock losing their footing and going down in their hind end, to the best barrel racing horses in the world, slipping around and not being able to show their true power and speed. Not to mention, it's unsafe. I noticed the NASCAR post on LVE FaceBook page, I'm a huge fan of NASCAR! But, do you think that the race track officals out there at Las Vegas Motor Speedway would leave an oil spill in the turns of the track and say," Those guys are professional drivers, they can deal with those conditions." The answer is," Heck no, NASCAR is more professional than that!" This analogy is the same for both the stock, and contestants, at the Greatest Rodeo in the World! Shawn Davis with PRCA could have had professionals do the ground out there for years, but he has chosen not to for whatever reason. The people in power at PRCA/WPRA will say that it was just a freak thing out there this year with the ground and that it has always been good ground. The fact is, sir, that the ground in the Thomas and Mack has never been as good as the ground should be at the NFR. Last year it was as good as it has ever been, but not as good as professionally installed ground could be. Other professional sports would never think to not have the absolute best, professionally installed footing for their events. It behooves me to think that the management of the NFR does not do the same for the "Time Magazines Event of the Year". By not having professional footing, it makes the NFR appear amateurish in that aspect of the rodeo. The NFR should not look half done or amateurish on any level. Please, Mr. Christenson, help to see that next year, the "Super Bowl of Rodeo" is being professionally run and prepared for this once a year, as good as Rodeo gets, event.
Thank you,
Gloria Freeman
2x NFR Qualifier
Concerned Rodeo fan
Edited by clays mom 2014-12-17 11:23 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 286
Location: GA | I agree "rodeo ground" has become the normal description for bad ground. That is a total shame too. What example does the NFR ground set for committee's across this nation and Canada? It is long past time for the ground to be considered priority.If just one person on a ground committee had to drive the hours, invest the money , make the same sacrifices as the contestants do, I can assure you that the ground would be priority. Many just do not know the importance, others think the contractor does it, but a good many do try to make it as good as possible. The one thing that is for sure, is the people in charge of the NFR does not consider the ground a priorty. Shawn Davis does indeed have the final say as to how much work,effort and expense is put into the ground conditions at the Thomas and Mack. The PRCA trumps the WPRA when it comes to the NFR. I don't think it would matter too much who in the WPRA is working to get it better, SD has the final say. As far as knowing both sides to the story, so far, I have had an email from WPRA sent to me, a FB message from Jerri Mann (whom I totally respect and I know was trying her best) and Carolyn Vietor has called me twice. I don't know who I could've been talking to besides Shawn Davis himself that would know what was and wasn't done for the ground. I admit, I have not talked to SD directly; however, he may call me next.
Edited by clays mom 2014-12-17 11:02 PM
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10D Crack Champion
| Surely if an organization can afford to turn down $1 million from one network to actually pay another network to air the NFR for 10 days, then surely the same organization can afford to hire a top of the line professional grounds crew to make it the best ground available (with possibly brand new ground altogether).....not just rodeo ground.
Edited by sodapop 2014-12-18 12:52 AM
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 Expert
Posts: 2161
Location: NW. Florida | sodapop - 2014-12-18 12:50 AM Surely if an organization can afford to turn down $1 million from one network to actually pay another network to air the NFR for 10 days, then surely the same organization can afford to hire a top of the line professional grounds crew to make it the best ground available (with possibly brand new ground altogether).....not just rodeo ground.
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Veteran
Posts: 286
Location: GA | Here are some email addresses that you can send your concerns to. Please make them as cordial and professional as you can, and still get your point across.
Thank you,
Gloria Freeman
Shawn Davis - [email protected]
Karl Stressman's goes through his assistant, Anita Smith - [email protected]
PRCA
101 ProRodeo Drive
Colorado Springs, Co 80919
719-595-8840
At Las Vegas Events, Pat Christenson is who may can help.
pat@lasvegasevents.com
Edited by clays mom 2014-12-18 3:47 PM
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 I'm Cooler Offline
Posts: 6387
Location: Pacific Northwest | I grew up around rodeo. It wasn't until like 2009 I started going to jackpots and learned about the other side of barrel racing. I understand what it's like to have to run on less-than-stellar ground, and I've seen different committees put on rodeos or barrel races in the SAME arena, and depending on who works it, the ground is better. Just as an example, in my town we have an ammy rodeo. It's used as an arena year round but not really kept up all that great (raked every day with a tractor but not very deep). The guys that put on the rodeo don't really understand the ground so it's hit or miss every year. Sometimes it fast other times its slow. But when we put on jackpots there, and had a group of guys that KNEW how to work barrel racing ground, it was fantastic. However even for the rodeo it was never "dangerous", the horses just didn't always clock super fast.
That being said, there is a huge difference between "it's just rodeo ground, if you want perfect jackpot ground then go run at a jackpot" ground and "I really think I might witness a barrel horse break a leg during one of these 10 rounds" kind of ground. I've NEVER been nervous watching barrels before, EVER. Not even watching them run in mud. But I got super anxious every night this year, and not because I was excited, but because I was scared.
I have no idea what the grounds people at the NFR did or didn't do, I don't know if they really did all the could or not, etc. But I don't think the "it's rodeo, deal with it" is a good mind set to have. That's why the ground never gets better, because no one cares. But I'm sure everyone is going to start caring AFTER all these nice horses start breaking their legs. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 286
Location: GA | I edited the email addresses; they should be right now. Thanks
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 "Tamer of the Fiery Dragon"
Posts: 5418
Location: Depends where the next barrel race is..... | It's a testament to the kind of horses that ran at the NFR this year. Any lesser of a horse would have fallen completely down. It's pretty sad when they had to put ice nails in Fuzz's shoes for him to stand up. He works in anything. They were falling in practice times. It's not good for the animals, it's not good for the riders and it's not good for our sport to draw scrutiny on it on national television because the competition environment was not good. If this had been the Kentucky Derby and horses were slipping it would have been a national outrage. We can't afford to have a horse permanently injured on National Television. It's tough enough to keep those away that want to shut rodeo down. Remember, no horse has a choice when they head down the alleyway. It is up to us to make it as safe as we can. It's the right thing to do. | |
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