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Miss Not Exciting
Posts: 3279
   
Location: Ft Worth TX | Let me start by saying, lameness exam she was very sound, chiropracticly sound, teeth are good.
When I first got this mare she ran to the left first with minor alley issues, I switched her back to the right because IMO she runs better to the right first. Either way she tried to shoulder the crap out of first and crash it even trotting- fixed that for the most part. Sometimes after left off it will rear its ugly head again. She's so broke its making a lot of this work easy to do... So I haul her to exhibition, resolved minor alley issues a while back as well but now we go down the alley and she realizes we are going right first and she flat refuses to do so AWAY FROM HOME- I never had this issue at home... So I get her to the first and around it the rest is great. She also throws a fit about taking her right lead when she knows she's going in to work BUT takes it fine anywhere else including the warm up pen...
Has anyone ever dealt with anything like this? My next step is to scope her after a run and see if she may be a bleeder- I cannot think of anything else to check. She's such an awesome mare at home I just WISH she would be the same away from home!
Also I did spend several month ridding her outside getting away from the barrel pen and ranching on her just trying to get her head... | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Maybe she has decided she is not a barrel horse. We had a mare like this. She was a barrel horse first and when we got her, we started working cows on her too because we did that with all our horses. She started messing up only at one barrel. Vet checks, teeth done, saddle fit checked. You could fix her problem only to have her mess up somewhere else in the pattern. She didn't refuse to go in the arena, just didn't work the barrels well. She LIVED to work bad cows. She should have been a working cowhorse. We finally respected her and quit doing barrels and just used her for cattle work. Best cow horse we ever had. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 3815
Location: The best kept secret in TX | Have you had her ovaries checked? | |
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 Take a Picture
Posts: 12841
| My horse had minor alley issues and did not want to turn the first barrel. I had an idea he had EPM. Three vets later (told them I thought he had EPM) he was treated and was much better. His is so mild that it is unnoticeable. Unfortunately, he seems to have a chronic problem. He gets his meds and works like a champ. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-18 11:22 AM Let me start by saying, lameness exam she was very sound, chiropracticly sound, teeth are good. When I first got this mare she ran to the left first with minor alley issues, I switched her back to the right because IMO she runs better to the right first. Either way she tried to shoulder the crap out of first and crash it even trotting- fixed that for the most part. Sometimes after left off it will rear its ugly head again. She's so broke its making a lot of this work easy to do... So I haul her to exhibition, resolved minor alley issues a while back as well but now we go down the alley and she realizes we are going right first and she flat refuses to do so AWAY FROM HOME- I never had this issue at home... So I get her to the first and around it the rest is great. She also throws a fit about taking her right lead when she knows she's going in to work BUT takes it fine anywhere else including the warm up pen... Has anyone ever dealt with anything like this? My next step is to scope her after a run and see if she may be a bleeder- I cannot think of anything else to check. She's such an awesome mare at home I just WISH she would be the same away from home! Also I did spend several month ridding her outside getting away from the barrel pen and ranching on her just trying to get her head...
These tell me you have not found the soundness problem yet.
Go to the best vet you can afford. You need a vet with "an eye" for lameness. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 287
| I would have this horse checked for bleeding, I had one doing similar things, mostly at races, found out he was a bleeder, he never bled out and never showed me any classic signs of being one, so we never checked, numerous attempts at the vet assuming it was lameness, treated about everything but for bleeding. When we finally found out what the issue was, I had to lay off of him for several months because he was so sick. Brought him back slow, now use a nebulizer and a little bit of lasix on him. Horse is back running in the 1D, walks right in the alleyway, loves doing his job. Just an idea...good luck! | |
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Veteran
Posts: 129
| NFRhereIcome27 - 2015-03-18 12:54 PM
I would have this horse checked for bleeding, I had one doing similar things, mostly at races, found out he was a bleeder, he never bled out and never showed me any classic signs of being one, so we never checked, numerous attempts at the vet assuming it was lameness, treated about everything but for bleeding. When we finally found out what the issue was, I had to lay off of him for several months because he was so sick. Brought him back slow, now use a nebulizer and a little bit of lasix on him. Horse is back running in the 1D, walks right in the alleyway, loves doing his job. Just an idea...good luck!
What test do you do to find out if they are a bleeder? | |
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 Half-Eaten Cookies
Posts: 2076
Location: Fort Worth / Springtown | You have had chiro, but was she "out" anywhere? Usually out in the same places?
If her hoof angles are all correct/well-balanced, I'd also check saddle fit. For me that is a HUGE issue - and with my gelding I've been running for 15 years I really know the little details with him. In the first couple of years running him, he had first turn (right turn) issues. He's hard to fit, saddle-wise, but he also is slightly smaller on the right, so the saddle tilts slightly to right and digs into that shoulder when he drops to turn/complete the turn. I also ride heavier on my right side so have to really work to keep myself in the center and not leaning inside of the turn.
If the padding is too thick, it's too tight in his shoulders and even worse on his right shoulder.
When he is sore, he has alley issues (when I say issues, it is just hesitation, stiffness trying to get lead- never rearing or anything), but after massage or chiro, or saddle/pad change, he will be different at the next race.
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| What did the lameness exam entail? And was it done by a lameness expert?
Has the horse been treated for ulcers, if not I would and continue a maintenance dose?
Horses shouldering in at a trot, this should never happen, either the horse is extremely sore, not trained, or a rider issue. | |
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 Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
Location: Iowa | To check for a "bleeder" you will probably have to take them so a vet and get them scoped after exercise. I took mine to Iowa State and the vet had me breeze her then he scoped her and we found out she was a bleeder. Most horses are they just rarely bleed out. My mare sounds like yours...passed every test and acted fine until it was time to run then she would panic because she could barely breath from the bleeding. After time off and supplements she was later on the fast track! Best of luck! | |
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Miss Not Exciting
Posts: 3279
Location: Ft Worth TX | cheryl makofka - 2015-03-18 12:32 PM
What did the lameness exam entail? And was it done by a lameness expert?
Has the horse been treated for ulcers, if not I would and continue a maintenance dose?
Horses shouldering in at a trot, this should never happen, either the horse is extremely sore, not trained, or a rider issue.
I have not treated for ulcer but thats a GOOD IDEA! the mare came to me finished with these issues- when i say she shoulders at a trot its when you just let her work through. This mare is BROKE BROKE and does everything a professional started her, and a pro patterned and hauled her- then she was sold. The lameness entailed lots of flexing all the way around and palpating. I had my vet do it because he has found very minute lamenesses other vets i spent $100's at did not find. He is going to watch her work tmrw night. | |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-19 8:20 PM
cheryl makofka - 2015-03-18 12:32 PM
What did the lameness exam entail? And was it done by a lameness expert?
Has the horse been treated for ulcers, if not I would and continue a maintenance dose?
Horses shouldering in at a trot, this should never happen, either the horse is extremely sore, not trained, or a rider issue.
I have not treated for ulcer but thats a GOOD IDEA! the mare came to me finished with these issues- when i say she shoulders at a trot its when you just let her work through. This mare is BROKE BROKE and does everything a professional started her, and a pro patterned and hauled her- then she was sold. The lameness entailed lots of flexing all the way around and palpating. I had my vet do it because he has found very minute lamenesses other vets i spent $100's at did not find. He is going to watch her work tmrw night.
You may need to do X-rays on hocks and stifles, as most horses who experience pain in these areas will shoulder in a barrel.
Your vet what does he specialize in?
The reason I ask is I have a gelding fluroscoped at age of 6, had minimal cartilage left in joints in both front legs, pastern and coffin. Injected, adequan, oral suppliments etc done. At age of 18 another vet palpated and flexion tested him and passed him to boot this vet said he had the most fit tendons he had seen even though the horse had a 3 yr hiatus in the pasture. The vet who passed him is a well known highly liked equine vet in my area.
I have realized gate issues generally occur due to a soundness issue, I suggest a lameness locator, or find a better vet. | |
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Miss Not Exciting
Posts: 3279
Location: Ft Worth TX | cheryl makofka - 2015-03-19 8:00 PM
Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-19 8:20 PM
cheryl makofka - 2015-03-18 12:32 PM
What did the lameness exam entail? And was it done by a lameness expert?
Has the horse been treated for ulcers, if not I would and continue a maintenance dose?
Horses shouldering in at a trot, this should never happen, either the horse is extremely sore, not trained, or a rider issue.
I have not treated for ulcer but thats a GOOD IDEA! the mare came to me finished with these issues- when i say she shoulders at a trot its when you just let her work through. This mare is BROKE BROKE and does everything a professional started her, and a pro patterned and hauled her- then she was sold. The lameness entailed lots of flexing all the way around and palpating. I had my vet do it because he has found very minute lamenesses other vets i spent $100's at did not find. He is going to watch her work tmrw night.
You may need to do X-rays on hocks and stifles, as most horses who experience pain in these areas will shoulder in a barrel.
Your vet what does he specialize in?
The reason I ask is I have a gelding fluroscoped at age of 6, had minimal cartilage left in joints in both front legs, pastern and coffin. Injected, adequan, oral suppliments etc done. At age of 18 another vet palpated and flexion tested him and passed him to boot this vet said he had the most fit tendons he had seen even though the horse had a 3 yr hiatus in the pasture. The vet who passed him is a well known highly liked equine vet in my area.
I have realized gate issues generally occur due to a soundness issue, I suggest a lameness locator, or find a better vet.
He just an older race track vet- does not really specialize in anything he has extensive training in chiropractic work as well | |
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 You get what you give
Posts: 13030
Location: Texas | I would like to see radiographs of hocks, stifles as well.. and i would have her back radiographed too to look for kissing spine. I know it can be over diagnosed but, might as well look for it if you are not having luck with finding other problems. | |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| astreakinchic - 2015-03-18 11:45 AM Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-18 11:22 AM Let me start by saying, lameness exam she was very sound, chiropracticly sound, teeth are good. When I first got this mare she ran to the left first with minor alley issues, I switched her back to the right because IMO she runs better to the right first. Either way she tried to shoulder the crap out of first and crash it even trotting- fixed that for the most part. Sometimes after left off it will rear its ugly head again. She's so broke its making a lot of this work easy to do... So I haul her to exhibition, resolved minor alley issues a while back as well but now we go down the alley and she realizes we are going right first and she flat refuses to do so AWAY FROM HOME- I never had this issue at home... So I get her to the first and around it the rest is great. She also throws a fit about taking her right lead when she knows she's going in to work BUT takes it fine anywhere else including the warm up pen... Has anyone ever dealt with anything like this? My next step is to scope her after a run and see if she may be a bleeder- I cannot think of anything else to check. She's such an awesome mare at home I just WISH she would be the same away from home! Also I did spend several month ridding her outside getting away from the barrel pen and ranching on her just trying to get her head... These tell me you have not found the soundness problem yet. Go to the best vet you can afford. You need a vet with "an eye" for lameness.
Edited by rodeomom3 2015-03-20 7:00 AM
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-19 9:02 PM
cheryl makofka - 2015-03-19 8:00 PM
Whoop Z Day Z - 2015-03-19 8:20 PM
cheryl makofka - 2015-03-18 12:32 PM
What did the lameness exam entail? And was it done by a lameness expert?
Has the horse been treated for ulcers, if not I would and continue a maintenance dose?
Horses shouldering in at a trot, this should never happen, either the horse is extremely sore, not trained, or a rider issue.
I have not treated for ulcer but thats a GOOD IDEA! the mare came to me finished with these issues- when i say she shoulders at a trot its when you just let her work through. This mare is BROKE BROKE and does everything a professional started her, and a pro patterned and hauled her- then she was sold. The lameness entailed lots of flexing all the way around and palpating. I had my vet do it because he has found very minute lamenesses other vets i spent $100's at did not find. He is going to watch her work tmrw night.
You may need to do X-rays on hocks and stifles, as most horses who experience pain in these areas will shoulder in a barrel.
Your vet what does he specialize in?
The reason I ask is I have a gelding fluroscoped at age of 6, had minimal cartilage left in joints in both front legs, pastern and coffin. Injected, adequan, oral suppliments etc done. At age of 18 another vet palpated and flexion tested him and passed him to boot this vet said he had the most fit tendons he had seen even though the horse had a 3 yr hiatus in the pasture. The vet who passed him is a well known highly liked equine vet in my area.
I have realized gate issues generally occur due to a soundness issue, I suggest a lameness locator, or find a better vet.
He just an older race track vet- does not really specialize in anything he has extensive training in chiropractic work as well
I agree with everyone else, take the horse to a qualified lameness horse vet.
I also wouldn't work barrels till I find and treat the issue, no point engraining into the horse barrels are painful. | |
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| I would get x-rays, hocks in specific ASAP if you have not already. My futurity horse last year was not turning the first barrel. If I held his body position the right way and went just the right speed I MAY have gotten him to turn the first barrel. After the 1st barrel he would go and finish the 2nd and 3rd barrel beautifully like an old pro. I even took him to the left barrel first and he INHALED it, but would refuse 2 and 3. After months of thinking it was a training issue, I finally got fed up enough and took him to the vet. He has minor arthritis in his hocks. That was September and I am just now getting him to realize he is comfortable to go back to work again. I live in MN so it was easy for me to give him the winter off. This horse went from being "sticky footed" going up the alley,to eventually stopping and not wanting to go forward. Right now I have him to the point where he WANTS to go! He was never "hot" before, but exhibitioning him this spring I haven't seen him this willing on the pattern, ever. I am entering him for the first time this weekend and am crossing my fingers he is ready to come out and play.
It took me a long time to get him to lope a correct circle to the right. He was so mentally burned out from being sore I couldn't even get him to lope nice away from the pattern. It took a lot of riding and getting him softened back up to get him convinced he is feeling well.
Edited by WrapN3MN 2015-03-20 9:35 AM
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 600
Location: Oklahoma & Texas | Sounds like sore some where - could it be your saddle is pinching ? and so its not showing up at vet b/c not saddled and ridden? But also being one-sided - agree w/possible EPM or neuro issue maybe a pinched nerve even.. had a horse like this a long time ago - i was trying him - high dollar horse ran like an NFR horse at home - but literally freaked out when taken anywhere and would duck off the 1st barrel - i gave him a few chances and finally decided he wasn't for me i wasnt going to spend that kind of money on a horse that ducked off.. never had a problem w/him at home though - ran the same every time at home... but my opinion on what caused it was being sore at one time and the prior owner hauling him still - and the horse anticipating it and maybe a little fear/anxiety on his part when being hauled that that pain was going to show up... not sure on history on yours but sounds like a pain issue... also make sure to have someone video your runs - maybe you are cue-ing him but not realizing it.. i had one that ran perfect - she was solid never ducked off and then out of the blue started one day - come to realize only after video'ing the run - she was turning off before the barrel b/c she was turning when i switched hands w/my reins lol.. soon as i realized that - ran her and corrected MY issue w/changnig hands too soon and she never did it again.. maybe prior owner ran a different style than you and he is anticipating or not turning b/c of how you are riding him? compared to prior owner? Some horses get used to being cued a certain way and to them thats whats expected and until they get that exact combination or series of cues before turning they wont- or they wont finish barrel right.. might watch prior owner ride and then watch a video ofyour run to see if different in some way. | |
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