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Veteran
Posts: 106
| Here is a bit of philosophizing for the day..Its not meant to be a flame post or stir a hornets nest but just a honest realistic discussion using logic with personal emotions set aside. I doubt that I can even word this the way it needs to be worded...
Do you ever think that we are doing a disservice to our youth riders by failing to teach them proper horsemanship? I think that the barrel racing community as a whole fails at teaching the next generation of riders. The sneering and mocking of helmets being used to the use of a magic seat for children and teenagers. The parents ability to over mount their kid but inability to realize that they have done so?
Whatever happened to teaching our kids to ride, to be horsemen and horsewomen? How did we become so dependent of the use of artificial aides?
Barrel racers do get a bad rep in relation to other equestrian sports but sometimes you have to ask yourself is that reputation not deserved..especially if we are not teaching todays youth to be better than we were. Don't get me wrong...there are barrel racers out there who are trying hard but there seem to be so many more who don't care...
Do you see in the Hunter/Jumper world the use of a magic seat? No you don't...how about the Cutting world, Reining? Saddleseat? No..because those kids are safely mounted and have been taught horsemanship skills. Those kids are taught to actually ride a horse and if they fall? They simply fall and hit the ground and get back up and start again.
Why don't more of our kids wear helmets? Most equestrian sports require the use of a helmet on anyone under the age of 18. Why cant our kids do the same? You say that is the because you are trying to honor our western heritage? How will that"heritage" help you when your kid suffers a traumatic brain injury from a fall? There are no do-overs.
We should do better...be better..
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  Warmblood with Wings
Posts: 27846
   
Location: Florida.. | Adults are now required to wear a helmut in dressage as well..in competitions.. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 617
Location: London Ontario | I AGREE 100%. I am 21 but when I started riding at 8, Safety was the #1 priority no ifs ands or buts. Now it seems whatever it takes to win. Don't get me wrong I love to win, but I refuse to put that in front of my safety, the safety of others and the well being of my horses. I seems like in most sport this is what it has come to, for instance the crazy hockey moms. |
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Veteran
Posts: 234
| You may not have intended to open a can of worms but I bet you do. That being said I have witnessed a lot of poor horsemanship in the last 15 years. 90 percent of the kids I see are way over mounted and I personally refuse to watch the 8 and under classes. They scare the bejesus out of me. I think we have done them a great injustice. I think the 4 and 5 D format has contributed greatly to this mindset. Yes it has been GREAT for barrel racing getting the number of entries up and NO I am not a 1D rider but those gentle horses are extremely hard to find anymore. I find just as many poor horsemanship adults in the warm up pen as I do children. I see poor horsemanship EVERYWHERE at barrel races from walking up behind horses to where they tie them people seem to think horses don't kick anymore. I try to stay away and park out by my myself and still people are walking up on my horse or kids are throwing balls and riding scooters and not paying any mind to what is around them. Not just the kids but a lot of people seem over mounted and out of control for their level of horsemanship skills I think we are lucky there are not more serious injuries at these big events. I breath a big breath every time I leave a race that someone has not run me over either on foot or in the warm up pen and I did not witness a wreck, or get beat up because I ask someone to give some space I DO NOT like having my horse run over because you are out of control. |
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 Am I really the Weirdo?
Posts: 11181
Location: Kansas | Wishful - 2015-03-23 11:25 AM Here is a bit of philosophizing for the day..Its not meant to be a flame post or stir a hornets nest but just a honest realistic discussion using logic with personal emotions set aside. I doubt that I can even word this the way it needs to be worded... Do you ever think that we are doing a disservice to our youth riders by failing to teach them proper horsemanship? I think that the barrel racing community as a whole fails at teaching the next generation of riders. The sneering and mocking of helmets being used to the use of a magic seat for children and teenagers. The parents ability to over mount their kid but inability to realize that they have done so? Whatever happened to teaching our kids to ride, to be horsemen and horsewomen? How did we become so dependent of the use of artificial aides? Barrel racers do get a bad rep in relation to other equestrian sports but sometimes you have to ask yourself is that reputation not deserved..especially if we are not teaching todays youth to be better than we were. Don't get me wrong...there are barrel racers out there who are trying hard but there seem to be so many more who don't care... Do you see in the Hunter/Jumper world the use of a magic seat? No you don't...how about the Cutting world, Reining? Saddleseat? No..because those kids are safely mounted and have been taught horsemanship skills. Those kids are taught to actually ride a horse and if they fall? They simply fall and hit the ground and get back up and start again. Why don't more of our kids wear helmets? Most equestrian sports require the use of a helmet on anyone under the age of 18. Why cant our kids do the same? You say that is the because you are trying to honor our western heritage? How will that"heritage" help you when your kid suffers a traumatic brain injury from a fall? There are no do-overs. We should do better...be better..
This is one reason I'm grateful for having been forced to compete in western horsemanship, western pleasure, reining and trail classes at local horse shows when I was starting out. My brothers and I all 3 set our sights on winning the age group high point buckle, only to be told we had to do every event all summer to have a shot at it. We rode our barrel horses in trail, reining, and used them in showmanship plus we tied goats, ran poles, the flag race and even the pickup race. We had a couple other horses to ride in horsemanship and pleasure but we learned quickly to ride quietly and effectively in order to have a shot at placing amongst the high dollar pleasure horses. I think every kid should have to do the judged events at least a few times because if they're competitive, they will try to improve their riding in order to place higher. If/when I have kids, they will go to shows like that when starting out. |
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 Veteran
Posts: 232
Location: Winging It in KY | jbw tx mom - 2015-03-23 1:09 PM You may not have intended to open a can of worms but I bet you do. That being said I have witnessed a lot of poor horsemanship in the last 15 years. 90 percent of the kids I see are way over mounted and I personally refuse to watch the 8 and under classes. They scare the bejesus out of me. I think we have done them a great injustice. I think the 4 and 5 D format has contributed greatly to this mindset. Yes it has been GREAT for barrel racing getting the number of entries up and NO I am not a 1D rider but those gentle horses are extremely hard to find anymore. I find just as many poor horsemanship adults in the warm up pen as I do children. I see poor horsemanship EVERYWHERE at barrel races from walking up behind horses to where they tie them people seem to think horses don't kick anymore. I try to stay away and park out by my myself and still people are walking up on my horse or kids are throwing balls and riding scooters and not paying any mind to what is around them. Not just the kids but a lot of people seem over mounted and out of control for their level of horsemanship skills I think we are lucky there are not more serious injuries at these big events. I breath a big breath every time I leave a race that someone has not run me over either on foot or in the warm up pen and I did not witness a wreck, or get beat up because I ask someone to give some space I DO NOT like having my horse run over because you are out of control.
I agree with this totally. It seems like most don't teach their kids horse show etiquette anymore. It never fails, I am like a magnet in the warm up pen for the kid with the out of control horse and the whip in their hand. I just have to shake my head. It is always an adventure. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 667
| I showed saddleseat starting at 4 years old. I even was taught "how to properly fall off" LOL, though I am not sure that that was a legit lesson. But regardless. I was mounted on a safe horse everytime and anything questionable was out of the question. My parents were all about safety and I appreciate and respect them for that. I think horsemanship and safety is key. I know that my kids will be taught the same way. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1898
| I have to agree. A huge injustice is done when parents over mount their children. I don't understand the concept of tying your child to the back of a 1000+ pound animal so they can win. And people can say what they want about they still have to "ride" the horse and know when to que but I just can't agree. I have seen horses so automatic all they need is a rider on their back and that rider doesn't have to do anything but sit there.
As for the helmets, I was anti-helmet for the longest time. My mother was anti-helmet and because of it neither my sister or myself would go to any event that required them, because we were simply not going to wear a helmet. My mom always offered to take us but because it was so ingrained in us that helmets were for "sissies", we weren't going.
Now as a mother, and I don't know if it was the fact that I had brain surgery last year or because there is no greater fear than that of a mother for the safety of her child, I make my daughter ride with a helmet. She started on a mini, I wasn't worried about it when she was riding him but as she has progressed and started riding the bigger horses it is a requirement. And let me tell you how incredibly happy I am for making this decision... Last fall for some reason, I felt like she absolutely had to have a helmet. It was such a strong feeling I went to town specifically to buy one, a 50 mile round trip I felt could not be put off for another day. She rode that day and every thing went well. The next day she was riding with a group of kids, her spur hung up in one of the other girl's rein. The girl froze up and started screaming, her horse panic'd and ran backwards with my daughter's spur still hung in the rein. The other girl jumped off and the horse went over backward, dragging my daughter, still hung up in the rein, off her horse, the back of her head smashed into the running board of the horse trailer and she ended up under the horse she was hung up to. That poor horse did everything he could not to hurt my daughter. Her boot came off in the rein and we were able to pull her out from under him. Luckily both my daughter and the horse came out with no real injuries. It was the second most horrific looking wreck I have seen, probably because my daughter was involved.
When I took her helmet off to assess her, the back of the brand new helmet was cracked completely in two. To this day I am so thankful I did not shrug that feeling off as a "worried mom thought". If I had, I am quite sure that my daughter would have sustained a pretty traumatic brain injury that day.
Edited by cyount2009 2015-03-23 1:15 PM
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | I grew up in 4H and at the time, I HATED having to show anything but the contest classes. However, the western pleasure, halter, showmanship, and drill team classes really taught me a lot about horsemanship. I also took judging and hippology classes and competed in state competitions. I still remember a lot of that foundation today. I was never overmounted and it seemed to take me a long, long time to move up to another horse. I think overmounting can cause not only horsemanship issues, but future confidence problems. |
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 I Chore in Chucks
Posts: 2882
Location: MD | cuckleburr - 2015-03-23 1:24 PM
jbw tx mom - 2015-03-23 1:09 PM You may not have intended to open a can of worms but I bet you do. That being said I have witnessed a lot of poor horsemanship in the last 15 years. 90 percent of the kids I see are way over mounted and I personally refuse to watch the 8 and under classes. They scare the bejesus out of me. I think we have done them a great injustice. I think the 4 and 5 D format has contributed greatly to this mindset. Yes it has been GREAT for barrel racing getting the number of entries up and NO I am not a 1D rider but those gentle horses are extremely hard to find anymore. I find just as many poor horsemanship adults in the warm up pen as I do children. I see poor horsemanship EVERYWHERE at barrel races from walking up behind horses to where they tie them people seem to think horses don't kick anymore. I try to stay away and park out by my myself and still people are walking up on my horse or kids are throwing balls and riding scooters and not paying any mind to what is around them. Not just the kids but a lot of people seem over mounted and out of control for their level of horsemanship skills I think we are lucky there are not more serious injuries at these big events. I breath a big breath every time I leave a race that someone has not run me over either on foot or in the warm up pen and I did not witness a wreck, or get beat up because I ask someone to give some space I DO NOT like having my horse run over because you are out of control.
I agree with this totally. It seems like most don't teach their kids horse show etiquette anymore. It never fails, I am like a magnet in the warm up pen for the kid with the out of control horse and the whip in their hand. I just have to shake my head. It is always an adventure.
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| My kids were with a "trainer" for almost 3 years. We knew nothing, kids had never ridden before. After a couple of years we started entering races and quickly observed how the other kids could sit and really use their body- something our kids were never taught. We switched to a new trainer and she told us I don't want to upset anyone, I know they have been taking lessons from so and so but we did to go the round pen for a while. We told her do what you need to do. They spent a month riding with no reins and no stirrups, the foundation that they never got from the other gal. Their riding drastically improved and so did their times.
Edited by rodeomom3 2015-03-23 5:55 PM
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 Jr. Detective
Location: Beggs, OK | The problem that I see around here are the instructors that are giving lessons NEED lessons themselves. |
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Veteran
Posts: 234
| Amen to that sister |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1074
| This is the exact reason I am doing my best to teach my daughter to ride! She wears a helmet and has since she started riding before she was 2 now she's almost 6. She doesn't know any different, so the helmet is no big deal to her. Now that Fallon has made a big deal of it, she's had tons of people come comment on it. We are constantly reminding her of the little things that can cause an accident. It's very sad to me to watch parents let their kids get into scary situations because of ignorance or stupidity. Some accidents can be prevented. Prevention is the best practice to me! |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| rachellyn80 - 2015-03-23 2:23 PM
The problem that I see around here are the instructors that are giving lessons NEED lessons themselves.
90% of ppl do NOT know what a broke horse is and are incapable of riding one. They can however take one someone else has trained and send him and win on him. These same ppl are now giving lessons.
I wish we would get more of a reining influence in our sport so people would know what a handle a horse can have on them. Most people think "well thats just the way he is" they have no idea you can change a horse and put a mouth on one. Kids get used to the send and yank mentality, from local to the highest levels. |
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Veteran
Posts: 276
| A huge problem I see is that parents will do whatever it takes for their kids to win 1st, which I find so silly because 99% of the events these kids are "winning" have absolutely no money in them and the prizes, well you could have bought them with all the money you spend chasing points. Now, I am a super competitive person, but I think you have to look at the life lessons and skills these kids need to be learning over cash, prizes, and titles they will probably forget over time. I can't stand when I see a kid on a crazy barrel horse that they can't even ride outside of the arena safely. What is that kid learning? Some of my greatest memories of junior/high school rodeo were riding around outside of the arena with my friends, not what happened during one of my 1,234,456,789 runs over the years. My horsemanship skills are definitely more important now to help me keep nice horses going, not the saddles, buckles or prizes. They are nice to win and I'm sure nothing is more awesome to watch your kid have success, but they need to be well-rounded individuals who succeed outside of the arena too. I think that is the most important. |
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 Balance Beam and more...
Posts: 11511
Location: 31 lengths farms | I hated it at the time but I in fact still go back to the drills the first person I ever got a lesson from did with us. We had to close our eyes and say "now" as we rode around the round pen when the foot she called out hit the ground. I remember rolling my eyes at 9 years old because I wanted to learn to take a lead so I could place in the WP classes on my pony that I ran gymkhana on so I could get more point for the all around at our shows. I thought that drill was the dumbest thing anyone had ever come up with, LOL!!! Oh man, I'm surprised "Auntie Lynn" didn't whoop me upside the head right then and there!!!
I absolutely think we do kids a disservice with a lot of the things we do in some respects and most usually its by the parents that try to live vicariously thru their kids that are the biggest culprits of it. I'll never forget in a horsemanship class in 4-H the judge had a tie amongst a couple of us. He had us dismount and unsaddle our horses, then saddle them back up. The girl that had won the County Wide project for horse the year before did not know how to do the tie on her cinch...kid you not. I almost felt bad for her and I was competing against her. I thought, "Okay, so that's what happens when you stand there in your show shirt and chaps and hold the horse while your mom saddles and does the finishing touches on your horse..." Sad. |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| I agree. I see this in the show steer/heifer world,too. Used to everyone got up and out to exercise their cattle at the show then washed them and fed hay and feed all before they were supposed to be in the barn by 8 a.m. The last few years we were definitely the minority. Very few walked their cattle, much less fed hay, it took too long and they were too tired to get up at 4 or 5 to take care of them. It is society in general- nobody wants to of it right - they wanto to do it NOW! |
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 The Vaccinator
Posts: 3810
Location: Slipping down the slope of old age. Boo hoo. | Often I judge rodeo queen contests. It has been very sad to watch horsemanship skills practically disappear in those contests. Years ago, the girls entering those queen contests could really ride. Now -- I often grimace and just pray the girls do not fall off. I'd say 90% do not even know how to catch the correct lead - - their stirrups are WAY too long and they depend on the reins and yanking to attempt a nice stop..... it's depressing.
I am sad, too, to see the lack or horsemanship at barrel races. Again, praying people do not get killed... Like others - I am very happy I spent years learning and showing horsemanship, hunt seat equitation, etc..... it certainly helped me with barrel racing -- a really good horsewoman can take an average horse and clean up.... |
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