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Elite Veteran
Posts: 733
  
| Has anyone been on either side of a transaction where the seller retains an embryo from a mare they are selling? I have a mare I want to sell but I would like to get another embryo out of her, but I'm not sure if it is worth the hassle when selling her or how it will effect how easily she sells. Thank you!
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 Go For It!
 
Location: Texas |
I retained two from my DTF mare. They pulled a couple last year and wanted to know if I was ready to get mine, but I'm not ready for babies.
Just put it in your sale agreement and it shouldn't be a problem.
Good luck!
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 628
Location: Missouri | I have 2 mares right now that both originals owners have embryo rights on when I decide to plan a baby. It's simple. When I go to breed or pull embryos I will let them know. I am close to both ladies and keep them updated with my horses. |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| If I was looking at a horse, I would be hesitant to agree to any embryo transfer.
The reasons being
To get a mare to ovulate can be a painful experience for them, so if the seller decided to want an embryo, and I am currently running the mare, then I have to stay off of her for 14-30 days, as I won't ride a horse in pain.
What if she doesn't catch the first time, then I have to go through it all over again.
The fees, who is paying for the embryo transfer, who is paying for my fuel and time to haul her to and from the vet.
Liability, as with any procedure there is a chance of damage and even death, so what happens if while pulling the embryo the uterus ruptures and the mare has to have emergency surgery, who is paying. What happens if the mare dies, who is reimbursing me for my mare.
Then the other issues come in, how to value the mare if something happens to her, as the mares value may have increased, or even reduced. |
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Tried and True
Posts: 21185
Location: Where I am happiest | I wouldnt want to buy a horse with strings attached like that. Either sell the horse and forget about a embryo, or if you really want a embryo, then pull one and then sell. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2013
Location: Piedmont, OK | Just make sure what ever you do or want that it is all in writing..... |
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 The Color Specialist
Posts: 7530
Location: Washington. (The DRY side.) | If you want a foal out of the mare, get one and THEN sell her. There is NO WAY I would buy a mare if the owner wanted to retain embryos. If they want foals out of her THAT BAD, keep the mare! If I buy a mare, she is MINE to do with as I see fit. I am NOT jumping thru hoops like that for the previous owner.
I would also never sell a mare that I wanted future foals out of. If I want babies out of her I keep her! If I sell her, I am DONE. (Meaning I dang sure DON'T want any more foals out of her.)
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 628
Location: Missouri | If it helps, look into embryo transfer in cattle. Retaining embryos in cattle after a sale if VERY popular, the biggest difference though is that they are not performance animals and will get bred or flushed each year. I would make sure everything is in writing and your really research what all goes into embryo work. |
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | I have seen a number of deals like this described regarding performance mares especially. I would think so long as you had a good contract and the right buyer to work with it might be fine.
Any deal, so long as both sides are happy and a contract governs it, can work out well. |
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 Can You Hear Me Now?
Location: When you hit the middle of nowhere .. Keep driving | I'll be honest... I won't buy a mare with stipulations like this. If I buy the mare ... I own the mare and I don't want my breeding plans to have to revolve around someone else if they have a right to one. If it's in an ad I automatically just write them off. I agree with Racing QH... if you want a foal out of her then do it and keep her. |
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Go For It!
Location: Texas |
I know that some folks are saying that they wouldn't buy a horse if the owner wanted to retain embryos, but I think it depends on what you're buying. I sold a proven, winning, DTF mare, retained two embryos and the buyer never batted an eye. If your horse is nice enough, you won't have an issue. It's likely that the buyer will want to pull embryos as well, so you can do it at the same time. Evaluate your situation and make a decision based on what YOU want to do. But you need to be realistic about the caliber of horse you're selling, because that will be a big part of the equation.
Good luck!
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Veteran
Posts: 152
| Freeze one or two before you sell her!!!! =) |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | cheryl makofka - 2015-11-02 9:48 AM
If I was looking at a horse, I would be hesitant to agree to any embryo transfer.
The reasons being
To get a mare to ovulate can be a painful experience for them, so if the seller decided to want an embryo, and I am currently running the mare, then I have to stay off of her for 14-30 days, as I won't ride a horse in pain.
What if she doesn't catch the first time, then I have to go through it all over again.
The fees, who is paying for the embryo transfer, who is paying for my fuel and time to haul her to and from the vet.
Liability, as with any procedure there is a chance of damage and even death, so what happens if while pulling the embryo the uterus ruptures and the mare has to have emergency surgery, who is paying. What happens if the mare dies, who is reimbursing me for my mare.
Then the other issues come in, how to value the mare if something happens to her, as the mares value may have increased, or even reduced.
agree |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 733
| Thanks everyone for your input! I have a yearling out of her via ET already that I really like. I would plan on paying all fees and cover any costs to them. I was thinking that I would price her then say that price is neg if owner can retain embryos, also I was going to give them up to 5 years before they had to be pulled. This is a very nice 1D mare, she runs 16.9-17.4s on a standard good ground or rodeo ground. I don't have the money to go hard, I have gone a little bit with her and she is competitive. If I do get an embryo I would like to cross on a really nice (going to have a high fee) stud and I can't afford to do that and freeze the embryo with out selling her.
I was mostly wondering how many people it was a complete deal breaker to, fewer than I though honestly lol. I can say I don't know if I would want to buy a mare with strings like that attached, but if I was getting a good deal I might be open to it. |
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 Expert
Posts: 2457
| Whiteboy - 2015-11-02 9:00 AM
Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow.
Eggs are easier to freeze than embryo's ..... but both are routinely done in the cattle business.
OP - If you pull eggs from a "flush" then you get to choose the sire to make the embryo ... just pointing this out as several other comments on here make it seem that eggs and embryo's are the same thing - which they are not. |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | lindseylou2290 - 2015-11-06 10:41 AM Whiteboy - 2015-11-02 9:00 AM Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow. Eggs are easier to freeze than embryo's ..... but both are routinely done in the cattle business. OP - If you pull eggs from a "flush" then you get to choose the sire to make the embryo ... just pointing this out as several other comments on here make it seem that eggs and embryo's are the same thing - which they are not.
Glad that you said something about the egg and embryo not being the same  |
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Expert
Posts: 2457
| Southtxponygirl - 2015-11-06 11:04 AM
lindseylou2290 - 2015-11-06 10:41 AM Whiteboy - 2015-11-02 9:00 AM Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow. Eggs are easier to freeze than embryo's ..... but both are routinely done in the cattle business. OP - If you pull eggs from a "flush" then you get to choose the sire to make the embryo ... just pointing this out as several other comments on here make it seem that eggs and embryo's are the same thing - which they are not.
Yep ... two VERY different things and the cost is VERY different as well! Just another tid bit to add in there. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 733
| lindseylou2290 - 2015-11-07 8:41 AM
Whiteboy - 2015-11-02 9:00 AM
Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow.
Eggs are easier to freeze than embryo's ..... but both are routinely done in the cattle business.
OP - If you pull eggs from a "flush" then you get to choose the sire to make the embryo ... just pointing this out as several other comments on here make it seem that eggs and embryo's are the same thing - which they are not.
I'm aware that eggs and embryos are not the same, thank you though. I'm a little hesitant to freeze anything, it seems like your chances of everything working out seem to go down a lot. |
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Expert
Posts: 2457
| Rope-N-Run - 2015-11-06 4:42 PM
lindseylou2290 - 2015-11-07 8:41 AM
Whiteboy - 2015-11-02 9:00 AM
Cant you pull one and freeze it? That seems like the safe option, if the mare were to die tomorrow.
Eggs are easier to freeze than embryo's ..... but both are routinely done in the cattle business.
OP - If you pull eggs from a "flush" then you get to choose the sire to make the embryo ... just pointing this out as several other comments on here make it seem that eggs and embryo's are the same thing - which they are not.
I'm aware that eggs and embryos are not the same, thank you though. I'm a little hesitant to freeze anything, it seems like your chances of everything working out seem to go down a lot.
I understand the hesitancy. I'd be darn sure of my repro vets' ability and experience before undergoing it all; but it is do-able. |
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