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 Maybe Someday
Posts: 4551
  
| I recently started one of my horses on RG.Has made a big difference.feed it with Alfalfa pellets and grass hay.Considering adding alfalfa cubes to really get him filled out.So far it's looked good and he eats it up.
Edited by Tennbarrelracer 2017-02-09 8:15 PM
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 Expert
Posts: 2258
| wyoming barrel racer - 2017-02-08 5:48 PM
rodeomom3 - 2017-02-08 12:02 PM casualdust07 - 2017-02-08 12:59 PM rodeomom3 - 2017-02-08 10:39 AM Bear - 2017-02-08 10:27 AM For that matter, what's so bad about GMO feed? For me it is not about GMO but the added fillers like soy products that are not good for horses. Soy is really not bad for horses. Most of the "soy is bad" hype comes from human literature in which women over consume soy (as a replacement for meat ) and then have hormonal consequences because of it. However, horses are strict herbivores- they are not like people or dogs or cats- and they must eat plant based proteins. The amino acid requirements of soy are very similar to what horses need. I've seen this come up where people are stopping soy products for reproductive reasons for what they've seen in people, but horses are just not the same. 
I stopped all soy due to a mare who has a sensitivity to it and easier if everyone here eats the same thing. THE was great to work with and just changed my formula to Chia seed meal instead still works great and an excellent option if you do need to avoid soy. | |
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 Three in a Bikini
Posts: 2035
| winwillows - 2017-02-08 12:38 PM
I knew that I should not have started this conversation. My point was that Food grade ingredients are handled differently, and that all the ingredients in every product that we make is also Non-gmo as a way to insure that those standards can be controlled. We do this partly because it guarantees that it gets its own storage considerations in the mill and therefore remains at the intended quality level without ever being potentially mixed with off grade ingredients. We make equine products, poultry products, and dog food using a very wide range of ingredients, and use this standard as one way to maintain quality in all of them. If one product does not have GMO variants available that does not change the fact that there are no GMO ingredients in that product. As to rice being only grown for food use, that is the intent, but the resulting raw rice bran, grade 5 rice that results from cold mold, heat or other damage all sells into the feed market when they can find a buyer. That commonly does end up in equine feed, and we will not use any of those ingredients. There was some GMO rice grown in trials in the South in the past, they are NOT finding it in any testing, and Southern rice is certainly considered non-GMO. There has never been GMO rice grown in California where I grow rice, even though there was a push to experiment with it. Cooler minds prevailed on that. There has been GMO flax produced, and we require a Non-GMO certification from our supplier. Many flax suppliers will not provide that.
I am going to jump on this...
And then I am going to jump off...
But I feel like this should be stated, the fact that an ingredient is GMO or Non-GMO has no effect on the level of quality associated to the final product.
What I would really like to know is whether or not the facility is certified to a GFSI standard?
That tells me quite a bit more about the level of management commitment than anything else I have read. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 268
| I just bought my first bag of RG. What kind of differences are you seeing? What type of supplements are people adding? CurOst? Joint? Healthy Coat? Can you mix with a handful of oats? TIA. We feed alfalfa mix hay and in summer they are on pasture 24/7. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1695
Location: Willows, CA | Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-10 8:41 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-08 12:38 PM
I knew that I should not have started this conversation. My point was that Food grade ingredients are handled differently, and that all the ingredients in every product that we make is also Non-gmo as a way to insure that those standards can be controlled. We do this partly because it guarantees that it gets its own storage considerations in the mill and therefore remains at the intended quality level without ever being potentially mixed with off grade ingredients. We make equine products, poultry products, and dog food using a very wide range of ingredients, and use this standard as one way to maintain quality in all of them. If one product does not have GMO variants available that does not change the fact that there are no GMO ingredients in that product. As to rice being only grown for food use, that is the intent, but the resulting raw rice bran, grade 5 rice that results from cold mold, heat or other damage all sells into the feed market when they can find a buyer. That commonly does end up in equine feed, and we will not use any of those ingredients. There was some GMO rice grown in trials in the South in the past, they are NOT finding it in any testing, and Southern rice is certainly considered non-GMO. There has never been GMO rice grown in California where I grow rice, even though there was a push to experiment with it. Cooler minds prevailed on that. There has been GMO flax produced, and we require a Non-GMO certification from our supplier. Many flax suppliers will not provide that.
I am going to jump on this...
And then I am going to jump off...
But I feel like this should be stated, the fact that an ingredient is GMO or Non-GMO has no effect on the level of quality associated to the final product.
What I would really like to know is whether or not the facility is certified to a GFSI standard?
That tells me quite a bit more about the level of management commitment than anything else I have read.
First, certification. I am not aware of any dedicated non- pet food plant or Feed Mill that has individual GFSI specific certification. There are some that follow those standards, and we are one of them. We follow those standards as they apply to non- pet food feeds. There may be some that actually hold actual certification from GSFI and that is fine, but I am not aware of any straight feed mills that do.
As to Non- GMO signifying a difference in quality, that was not my point. Of course there are GMO ingredients that are food grade and of high quality. My point was that our food grade ingredients, being certified non-GMO requires that they be stored separately and therefore have no chance of being mixed with any ingredients that may be of inferior quality.
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Three in a Bikini
Posts: 2035
| winwillows - 2017-02-11 9:27 AM
Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-10 8:41 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-08 12:38 PM
I knew that I should not have started this conversation. My point was that Food grade ingredients are handled differently, and that all the ingredients in every product that we make is also Non-gmo as a way to insure that those standards can be controlled. We do this partly because it guarantees that it gets its own storage considerations in the mill and therefore remains at the intended quality level without ever being potentially mixed with off grade ingredients. We make equine products, poultry products, and dog food using a very wide range of ingredients, and use this standard as one way to maintain quality in all of them. If one product does not have GMO variants available that does not change the fact that there are no GMO ingredients in that product. As to rice being only grown for food use, that is the intent, but the resulting raw rice bran, grade 5 rice that results from cold mold, heat or other damage all sells into the feed market when they can find a buyer. That commonly does end up in equine feed, and we will not use any of those ingredients. There was some GMO rice grown in trials in the South in the past, they are NOT finding it in any testing, and Southern rice is certainly considered non-GMO. There has never been GMO rice grown in California where I grow rice, even though there was a push to experiment with it. Cooler minds prevailed on that. There has been GMO flax produced, and we require a Non-GMO certification from our supplier. Many flax suppliers will not provide that.
I am going to jump on this...
And then I am going to jump off...
But I feel like this should be stated, the fact that an ingredient is GMO or Non-GMO has no effect on the level of quality associated to the final product.
What I would really like to know is whether or not the facility is certified to a GFSI standard?
That tells me quite a bit more about the level of management commitment than anything else I have read.
First, certification. I am not aware of any dedicated non- pet food plant or Feed Mill that has individual GFSI specific certification. There are some that follow those standards, and we are one of them. We follow those standards as they apply to non- pet food feeds. There may be some that actually hold actual certification from GSFI and that is fine, but I am not aware of any straight feed mills that do.
As to Non- GMO signifying a difference in quality, that was not my point. Of course there are GMO ingredients that are food grade and of high quality. My point was that our food grade ingredients, being certified non-GMO requires that they be stored separately and therefore have no chance of being mixed with any ingredients that may be of inferior quality.
So if RG is following those standards I assume you had a breakdown of a CCP or perhaps a PRP.
The product purchased by the consumer is under grade at best due to a failure in the purge system.
But your follow-up action is to fire the person on the line?
How about a review of the process controls? Or an evaluation of your HA if need be?
This entire post rubs me the wrong way to be honest.
I won't respond again because there is no need to stir the pot any further... but trust me, as a fellow worker in the non-pet food industry, this does not read well.
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-11 1:22 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-11 9:27 AM
Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-10 8:41 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-08 12:38 PM
I knew that I should not have started this conversation. My point was that Food grade ingredients are handled differently, and that all the ingredients in every product that we make is also Non-gmo as a way to insure that those standards can be controlled. We do this partly because it guarantees that it gets its own storage considerations in the mill and therefore remains at the intended quality level without ever being potentially mixed with off grade ingredients. We make equine products, poultry products, and dog food using a very wide range of ingredients, and use this standard as one way to maintain quality in all of them. If one product does not have GMO variants available that does not change the fact that there are no GMO ingredients in that product. As to rice being only grown for food use, that is the intent, but the resulting raw rice bran, grade 5 rice that results from cold mold, heat or other damage all sells into the feed market when they can find a buyer. That commonly does end up in equine feed, and we will not use any of those ingredients. There was some GMO rice grown in trials in the South in the past, they are NOT finding it in any testing, and Southern rice is certainly considered non-GMO. There has never been GMO rice grown in California where I grow rice, even though there was a push to experiment with it. Cooler minds prevailed on that. There has been GMO flax produced, and we require a Non-GMO certification from our supplier. Many flax suppliers will not provide that.
I am going to jump on this...
And then I am going to jump off...
But I feel like this should be stated, the fact that an ingredient is GMO or Non-GMO has no effect on the level of quality associated to the final product.
What I would really like to know is whether or not the facility is certified to a GFSI standard?
That tells me quite a bit more about the level of management commitment than anything else I have read.
First, certification. I am not aware of any dedicated non- pet food plant or Feed Mill that has individual GFSI specific certification. There are some that follow those standards, and we are one of them. We follow those standards as they apply to non- pet food feeds. There may be some that actually hold actual certification from GSFI and that is fine, but I am not aware of any straight feed mills that do.
As to Non- GMO signifying a difference in quality, that was not my point. Of course there are GMO ingredients that are food grade and of high quality. My point was that our food grade ingredients, being certified non-GMO requires that they be stored separately and therefore have no chance of being mixed with any ingredients that may be of inferior quality.
So if RG is following those standards I assume you had a breakdown of a CCP or perhaps a PRP.
The product purchased by the consumer is under grade at best due to a failure in the purge system.
But your follow-up action is to fire the person on the line?
How about a review of the process controls? Or an evaluation of your HA if need be?
This entire post rubs me the wrong way to be honest.
I won't respond again because there is no need to stir the pot any further... but trust me, as a fellow worker in the non-pet food industry, this does not read well.
If you read his first response he said some one MAY lose their job depending on what the investigation and the production logs showed. | |
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Expert
Posts: 1695
Location: Willows, CA | GLP - 2017-02-11 1:32 PM
Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-11 1:22 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-11 9:27 AM
Kry5ta1 - 2017-02-10 8:41 PM
winwillows - 2017-02-08 12:38 PM
I knew that I should not have started this conversation. My point was that Food grade ingredients are handled differently, and that all the ingredients in every product that we make is also Non-gmo as a way to insure that those standards can be controlled. We do this partly because it guarantees that it gets its own storage considerations in the mill and therefore remains at the intended quality level without ever being potentially mixed with off grade ingredients. We make equine products, poultry products, and dog food using a very wide range of ingredients, and use this standard as one way to maintain quality in all of them. If one product does not have GMO variants available that does not change the fact that there are no GMO ingredients in that product. As to rice being only grown for food use, that is the intent, but the resulting raw rice bran, grade 5 rice that results from cold mold, heat or other damage all sells into the feed market when they can find a buyer. That commonly does end up in equine feed, and we will not use any of those ingredients. There was some GMO rice grown in trials in the South in the past, they are NOT finding it in any testing, and Southern rice is certainly considered non-GMO. There has never been GMO rice grown in California where I grow rice, even though there was a push to experiment with it. Cooler minds prevailed on that. There has been GMO flax produced, and we require a Non-GMO certification from our supplier. Many flax suppliers will not provide that.
I am going to jump on this...
And then I am going to jump off...
But I feel like this should be stated, the fact that an ingredient is GMO or Non-GMO has no effect on the level of quality associated to the final product.
What I would really like to know is whether or not the facility is certified to a GFSI standard?
That tells me quite a bit more about the level of management commitment than anything else I have read.
First, certification. I am not aware of any dedicated non- pet food plant or Feed Mill that has individual GFSI specific certification. There are some that follow those standards, and we are one of them. We follow those standards as they apply to non- pet food feeds. There may be some that actually hold actual certification from GSFI and that is fine, but I am not aware of any straight feed mills that do.
As to Non- GMO signifying a difference in quality, that was not my point. Of course there are GMO ingredients that are food grade and of high quality. My point was that our food grade ingredients, being certified non-GMO requires that they be stored separately and therefore have no chance of being mixed with any ingredients that may be of inferior quality.
So if RG is following those standards I assume you had a breakdown of a CCP or perhaps a PRP.
The product purchased by the consumer is under grade at best due to a failure in the purge system.
But your follow-up action is to fire the person on the line?
How about a review of the process controls? Or an evaluation of your HA if need be?
This entire post rubs me the wrong way to be honest.
I won't respond again because there is no need to stir the pot any further... but trust me, as a fellow worker in the non-pet food industry, this does not read well.
If you read his first response he said some one MAY lose their job depending on what the investigation and the production logs showed.
Reading well or not, our protocols are very specific, and only an equipment failure or gross negligence on the part of the crew responsible for carrying out those protocols can allow that situation to happen. An equipment failure would have stopped the run and generated an inspection. Negligence is what let that bag through. Everyone involved in our production was called in to review the photos sent to us by the OP. This was a corner cut by a crew member, and not confirmed as clear to package by the crew Forman. It was also missed by the crew member responsible for lining up the filled bag going into the sewing unit. He is to look in every filled bag that he touches. That takes two seconds, and there is no reason for him not to do so. Three back ups not done. I Do not know where you work in the industry, but I make a premium product that uses food grade ingredients. This is not allowed in our production. The employees were not fired, but put on probation with a scheduled follow up review. I respect the guys and girls that work on out product, but just saying "hey guys, don't do that again" does not make a lasting impression that prevents this from happening again. There are three backups that should have prevented this. More protocol is not the answer, more responsibility is. My Grandfather always said that "responsibility is taken not given", and each of these guys involved needs to. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 105
| As a business owner I respect everything Win has done to solve the problem in multiple ways. I happen to own a horse that is allergic to both corn and oats plus other products so this product is perfect for me. I had bought another top dress product that I had reactions to . While talking with someone else she stated there was mold in hers and she called a rep and their answer was thank god it is you and dropped. In my opinion The whole lot should have been recalled. | |
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | I just opened a new bag I bought yesterday, and its perfect. My horse loves this product! I figure that a horse's life revolves around eating, he should get something he really likes and does well on. I had tried another Stabilized Rice Bran and my horse got gassy from it. Don't have a clue why but I quit feeding it and gave it to the deer. | |
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 Certified Snake Wrangler
Posts: 1672
Location: North MS | I stopped at every tractor supply between Biloxi and Tupelo last year and never found a bag. They would only order it if I pre-payed and bought 3 bags a month. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 851
Location: West Texas | I really think starting a feed company has opened my eyes. Win is being very responsible in this matter. I wish everyone that has an unrealistic expectation for feed production could walk a week or so in the feed producers shoes. Some thing are unsafe, some things are negligence and I am 100% against those, but things don't always go as planned, people make mistakes and equipment fails. A feed company you can trust, that is honest, and works hard to ensure the best product possible (ingredients and manufacturing) should be valued. | |
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