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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7268
   
| Cindy Hamilton - 2014-10-09 9:38 AM This is very sad for everyone....my one question in these situations is.. with all the "free" birth control, how do these irresponsible mothers keep getting pregnant??...I think I could make a good case for paying high risk or government owned women a monthly "bonus" to NOT get pregnant...it would save us all money in the long run...
I really feel sorry for these kids, and I hope they don't continue the cycle, but they probably will...
That is an awesome idea - of course, they keep getting preggo so they can mooch even MORE money off the system.
I feel so, so sorry for those poor kids - our animals probably have it better and how sad is that? | |
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 Coyote Country Queen
Posts: 5666
| I did not read all of the responses so this has probably already been mentioned. Fight it. Make child services verify the mother is in compliance, do follow ups, etc. My in-laws took in a nieces children. They had been removed from the home at least one other time. Child services was prepared to give the children back because the mother "said" she had met all of the requirements. When my in-laws pushed for information it was revealed that she was not telling the truth (imagine that). The children were permanently removed and found a loving family that adopted all of them. Don't give up for the sake of these children. I pray for them. I cannot imagine anyone being willing to put children back in situations like this. My limited experience made me lose faith in the system.
Edited by Jenbabe 2014-10-09 2:49 PM
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  If it Ain't a Paint it Ain't!
Posts: 8519
Location: Mansfield, Tx | Our SYSTEMS suck....
Prayers for the little ones....  | |
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 Toastest with the Mostest
Posts: 5712
Location: That part of Texas | rodeomom3 - 2014-10-09 9:52 AM firewaterfuelsme - 2014-10-09 9:48 AM They need to get the court appt advocate into this meeting tommorrow. Law states children in foster care be appointed an advocate. Hopefully they are strong and can gather enough facts from the meeting tommorrow to give the judge enough to at least extend the case. One argument I would make is the new pregnancy..mom is too irresponsible to prevent until her life is more stable then how is she going to be responsible with the children she already has....also hold her feet to the fire about completing ALL of her services offered by CPS. The advocate is who they are meeting with and who was present at the court hearing. Therapist recommended no visitation till mother proved clean and stable for 6 months, court ruled to start visitation immediately after release from prison. Judge is known to have given childen back even if all the conditions have not been met.
Edited to add thank you for your help.
I've had judges do this to my client's before too but it's not always a bad sign though when they do. I've had a judge do this a time or two not because they were trying to be lenient but because they've already basically made up their mind on how they see the case going and it's a tactic to give the non-compliant party enough rope to hang themselves on so-to-speak. Sometimes you can fast track a case easier that way and terminate rights (or severly limit them) sooner than later. It seems counter-intuitive to do it that way but sometimes it results in getting the kids in their final (and stable) environment quicker.
I wish the best of luck to your niece though. Those cases are very tough to handle as the outside party trying to help the kids and you have no guarantees on what will happen. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 887
Location: MN | I pray it ends up as a good report. I just don't get it and will never get over feeling sick when I hear stories of such abuse and neglect! Even worse when people speak up but processes fail. There recently was a story brought to light in MN. Several reports were made to CPS for a little boy, but the reports were either not investigated at all or didn't find any fault. Because of failed processes (and failed parents), that little boy died.
http://www.startribune.com/local/273325741.html?page=all&prepage=1&c=y#continue
Edited by Echo 2014-10-09 4:34 PM
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | Proves our justice system is badly broken.
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 Expert
Posts: 1273
Location: South Dakota | Oh this is so sad. | |
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 Don't Wanna Make This Awkward
Posts: 3106
Location: Texas | Red Raider - 2014-10-09 4:12 PM rodeomom3 - 2014-10-09 9:52 AM firewaterfuelsme - 2014-10-09 9:48 AM They need to get the court appt advocate into this meeting tommorrow. Law states children in foster care be appointed an advocate. Hopefully they are strong and can gather enough facts from the meeting tommorrow to give the judge enough to at least extend the case. One argument I would make is the new pregnancy..mom is too irresponsible to prevent until her life is more stable then how is she going to be responsible with the children she already has....also hold her feet to the fire about completing ALL of her services offered by CPS. The advocate is who they are meeting with and who was present at the court hearing. Therapist recommended no visitation till mother proved clean and stable for 6 months, court ruled to start visitation immediately after release from prison. Judge is known to have given childen back even if all the conditions have not been met.
Edited to add thank you for your help.
I wish the best of luck to your niece though. Those cases are very tough to handle as the outside party trying to help the kids and you have no guarantees on what will happen.
This is a much better way of viewing it... I hope this is what the judge has in mind. | |
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10D Crack Champion
| Cindy Hamilton - 2014-10-09 9:38 AM This is very sad for everyone....my one question in these situations is.. with all the "free" birth control, how do these irresponsible mothers keep getting pregnant??...I think I could make a good case for paying high risk or government owned women a monthly "bonus" to NOT get pregnant...it would save us all money in the long run...
I really feel sorry for these kids, and I hope they don't continue the cycle, but they probably will... I would be fine with my tax money going to pay for vasectomy procedures, tubes tied, and of course contraceptives.
Problem is these people will not make use of anything like this provided for them. Read some of Ruby Payne's research and information. To them, children are like property. Their way of having ownership of something. The "they belong to me, they are mine" type of mentality. These men only have relation with women who seem desperate and having children by more than one guy means they are women who will put their own social relations above anything else, that they enjoy sex, easily manipulated, with low expectations, and can't make it on their own needing a man at all times. The women look at these kinds of men as someone who will help them or take care of them and of course they think they don't deserve better.
They all like to stay with someone who will stay down and not try to better themselves too.... their parents don't even want the children to better themselves for fear they will leave them and not return...or make them feel like they aren't good enough.... so they want to keep everyone around them down too. They would rather live this life than try to better themselves and fail. The fear of failing is far worse than not trying at all along with those around them pulling them down.
Throw in a drug or alcohol addiction it just makes it all so much worse. The addiction ranks over everything.
Edited by sodapop 2014-10-09 10:46 PM
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 Go For It!
Location: Texas | As a CASA, and a mom and grandma, I can certainly understand your families frustration. I also have a cousin who is a foster parent with 3 boys ranging in age from 1 to 5, so I generally have a pretty interesting perspective on my cases. A CASA would definitely be beneficial in this situation, but either way, Mom has to be clean before they will do even a monitored return. She has to be doing random drug testing and testing clean, if they are considering a return.
This is the difficult part of being a foster parent. You have to understand that reunification is the goal. Not all kids are going to grow up in a good stable environment, I know I didn't it, but that doesn't mean that they aren't going to turn out okay. My advice… Pray for Mom and those children. Meth is a horrible drug and 90% of our CPS cases are drug related. It is very sad to witness some of this stuff, but I feel blessed to be a small part of these kids lives. I have a 14 year old that I would love to keep, but I know that just isn't going to happen, he and his sister are on a monitored return right now, and they're doing good. Mom certainly doesn't meet my expectations, but she is doing the best she knows how to do.
These cases are usually generational… Mom was one of those kids that had it really tough, so what she does seems normal to her. There is no doubt in my mind... she loves her kids, she just doesn't have the skills to parent as effectively as the rest of the world would like her to. I'm all about fix the parents and you'll fix the kids. They all need help.
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Industrial Srength Barrel Racer
Posts: 7268
| grinandbareit - 2014-10-10 1:47 AM As a CASA, and a mom and grandma, I can certainly understand your families frustration. I also have a cousin who is a foster parent with 3 boys ranging in age from 1 to 5, so I generally have a pretty interesting perspective on my cases. A CASA would definitely be beneficial in this situation, but either way, Mom has to be clean before they will do even a monitored return. She has to be doing random drug testing and testing clean, if they are considering a return. This is the difficult part of being a foster parent. You have to understand that reunification is the goal. Not all kids are going to grow up in a good stable environment, I know I didn't it, but that doesn't mean that they aren't going to turn out okay. My advice… Pray for Mom and those children. Meth is a horrible drug and 90% of our CPS cases are drug related. It is very sad to witness some of this stuff, but I feel blessed to be a small part of these kids lives. I have a 14 year old that I would love to keep, but I know that just isn't going to happen, he and his sister are on a monitored return right now, and they're doing good. Mom certainly doesn't meet my expectations, but she is doing the best she knows how to do. These cases are usually generational… Mom was one of those kids that had it really tough, so what she does seems normal to her. There is no doubt in my mind... she loves her kids, she just doesn't have the skills to parent as effectively as the rest of the world would like her to. I'm all about fix the parents and you'll fix the kids. They all need help.
The random drug test are the best idea EVER - it should be that way in all of the cases - but of course, I think people should have to pass a drug test to collect WELFARE - I had to pass one to WORK to earn the money to pay for it - but I'm so mean. | |
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 Chatty Kathy
Posts: 6635
Location: In Ky following Barrel Races & Walker hounds. | Many, many prayers. That poor little girl.... I cant even imagine what is going to go through her poor little mind :(
We are learning ourselves how crooked CPS and the court system is, my sisters bf has a 2yr old daughter he has had on his own for over half of her life, his exwife took off and left them in NY and come back to KY. He moved back here and started seeing my sister a few months ago, now her "mom" wants to be mother of the year and have her stay the night all of the time(there is no official custody agreement yet), but she has her convicted sex offender(child pornography) brother living with her. The court system told him they cant do anything until something happens to the kid.. CPS went to the house and found a lot of "alarming" things, but they are dragging their feet to help.
Why do they even have the agencies if they arent actually going to DO anything??? Sorry for the book, this just irritates me so much. They worry more about protecting people fresh out of prison than they do children.... | |
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 Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| grinandbareit - 2014-10-10 1:47 AM As a CASA, and a mom and grandma, I can certainly understand your families frustration. I also have a cousin who is a foster parent with 3 boys ranging in age from 1 to 5, so I generally have a pretty interesting perspective on my cases. A CASA would definitely be beneficial in this situation, but either way, Mom has to be clean before they will do even a monitored return. She has to be doing random drug testing and testing clean, if they are considering a return. This is the difficult part of being a foster parent. You have to understand that reunification is the goal. Not all kids are going to grow up in a good stable environment, I know I didn't it, but that doesn't mean that they aren't going to turn out okay. My advice… Pray for Mom and those children. Meth is a horrible drug and 90% of our CPS cases are drug related. It is very sad to witness some of this stuff, but I feel blessed to be a small part of these kids lives. I have a 14 year old that I would love to keep, but I know that just isn't going to happen, he and his sister are on a monitored return right now, and they're doing good. Mom certainly doesn't meet my expectations, but she is doing the best she knows how to do. These cases are usually generational… Mom was one of those kids that had it really tough, so what she does seems normal to her. There is no doubt in my mind... she loves her kids, she just doesn't have the skills to parent as effectively as the rest of the world would like her to. I'm all about fix the parents and you'll fix the kids. They all need help. I dont disagree with most that you have posted. As I said in my first post and others, I do pray for the young mother and my heart goes out to her. My neice is hoping to maintain a relationship with her so she can help her give these girls a better life. The mother does love her children and yes, this is generational. However there these girls suffered horrible, physical, emotional and sexual abuse by a "stepdad". Court has attributed this abuse to the man but the children have different feelings about that. No one protected these children, no one took them to a doctor. The mother had 5 months to attend counseling classes and get a job and only in the 9th hour did she start going to classes and she has had a job for only 2 weeks, she did not look for a job in the past 5 months. Is going to a few classes enough to really learn how to be a good parent? She has already moved another man into her life and made another baby instead of focusing on getting her children back. The CPS worker told our family that CASA was not available in their area and that judges did not ike them, something we have now found out to not be true. CASA is now being brought in on the case. We are new to the foster care world and were relying on CPS to help naivgate it :(. No, not all kids are brought up in a stable home, but when a child has an opportunity and the mother, while checking off the boxes to get her child back, has clearly not changed her lifestyle, it seems like decisions shoud be made in favor of the child in an attempt to save the child and break this cycle, maybe we are missing opportunities for this to not perpetually be a generational issue- lets stop it when we can and maybe CPS and CASA won't have so many cases with the next generation. It definitely would still be heartbreaking to not have this little girl in our lives but that would be measured with a little hope and happiness for this young mother and her girls if there were any evidence that she was making real changes in her life and these girls were going to be safe, healthy and happy. At the very least, delay returning the girls until the mother has lived at least had a job for an extended amount of time, maintained the same residence for an extended amount of time and had recieved more than a few parenting and life skills classes. There are homes who want to give these children what the mother cannot or is not able to and I don't mean material things.
Edited by rodeomom3 2014-10-10 7:46 AM
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Shelter Dog Lover
Posts: 10277
| I don't know what the normal process is but this young mother has not had any unsupervised visits yet because the 2 year old will sometimes have meltdowns while in the middle of playing, mom nor CPS can console her so they take her to foster mom or dad waiting outside and she quiets down. I just don't know how CPS can already determine that she is going back in 2 months if they have not had unsupervised visits and overnight visits. | |
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 Special Somebody
Posts: 3951
Location: Finally horseback again.... | firewaterfuelsme - 2014-10-09 9:17 AM The children should have a court appointed advocate. What is the CASA viewpoint on where the children live? Also if the children are making statements of abuse it needs to be reported to law enforcement so a forensic interview can be scheduled. CPS is so overwhelmed with cases and they have a checklist and a timeline they follow they do not always seek what is best for the child but what is within their policy and timeframe. If mom has not completed ALL of her services then the CASA can reccommend the case be extended. In my experience Courts listen to CASA and the child's attorney over CPS reccommendations.
100% agree!!
My daughter adopted two children through CPS.
They tried to send the younger two back at one point, the older girl made an outcry and they were removed.
They need to report this and get the ad lidem attorney involved.
My grand babies sister was five when she made the outcry. It stopped my grand babies from having to be placed back in the abuse.
Many prayers for these babies and your family.
Foster care can be so rewarding and devastating at the same time.
Sometimes I wonder what CPS is thinking but I think alot depends on the caseworker.
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