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Posts: 188
 
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | hI will try to make this story short. I bought a mare in November. She was a reiner, retired sound, as a broodmare at 7 years old. She had 4 foals and is now 13. Checked with past two owners and original trainer and was told she was sound. She had been being used as a college program horse the last 2 years also. I didn't vet her because she is worth as much as a broodmare as what I paid for her so I wasn't really concerned. Fast forward to now. I have been riding pretty steady 3-4 days a week and she is in decent shape. The issue I am having is her lead changes. They are not consistent unless I really hold her shoulders up. She likes to change front to back or try to throw a simple change in. She has a nice earnings record herself and I've seen video from when she was younger and this isn't a lifelong issue she has had. She hasn't taken a lame step since I brought her home. She has had a loading dose of pentosan with no change whatsoever. She has seen 2 different chiropractors and nothing major showed up. She is shod correctly and farrier has checked her over. Nothing. The only oddity I have found is a knot above and to the right of the top of her tail. Any ideas as to where to start in the vetting process to figure out why her lead chnges are off? |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
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Location: Kansas | are you sure it's just not a training issue with her? |
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Veteran
Posts: 188
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | Positive it isn't training. She was trained and shown by from age 2-7 by one of the trainers in the business. |
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 Expert
Posts: 1302
Location: California | Have you ridden reiners before? I ask because they have very specific cues and a way to set them up before you ask for a change and even the best will get confused or not do it correctly when they are asked incorectly. We always lift their shoulders up before asking them to change, so that is normal. Changing front to back means her hip needs to be pushed over more into the lead you are changing to. |
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Veteran
Posts: 188
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | little_bug - 2015-07-02 3:41 PM
Have you ridden reiners before? I ask because they have very specific cues and a way to set them up before you ask for a change and even the best will get confused or not do it correctly when they are asked incorectly. We always lift their shoulders up before asking them to change, so that is normal. Changing front to back means her hip needs to be pushed over more into the lead you are changing to.
I have, she is my 3rd. The first I showed for almost 10 years before retiring, the next retired to the broodmare pen unsound last fall (bought her unsound but was able to get her sound again for 2 years) and now this one. She was my step-up horse. I thought, at first it was because she has been off for a long time. I've taken a couple lessons with local trainers and they didn't seem too concerned. I expected it to get better with conditioning as she is beyond althetic in everything else I have asked her to do. Recently though, I climbed on my WP gelding that has been sitting for 6 months and can have 2 left feet and he changed beautifully for me so I know the issue isn't entirely me. I have a clinic coming up in a couple weeks so maybe I'll have the trainer try it and see where we are. |
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Expert
Posts: 1302
Location: California | Chance Of Rein - 2015-07-02 2:00 PM little_bug - 2015-07-02 3:41 PM Have you ridden reiners before? I ask because they have very specific cues and a way to set them up before you ask for a change and even the best will get confused or not do it correctly when they are asked incorectly. We always lift their shoulders up before asking them to change, so that is normal. Changing front to back means her hip needs to be pushed over more into the lead you are changing to. I have, she is my 3rd. The first I showed for almost 10 years before retiring, the next retired to the broodmare pen unsound last fall (bought her unsound but was able to get her sound again for 2 years ) and now this one. She was my step-up horse. I thought, at first it was because she has been off for a long time. I've taken a couple lessons with local trainers and they didn't seem too concerned. I expected it to get better with conditioning as she is beyond althetic in everything else I have asked her to do. Recently though, I climbed on my WP gelding that has been sitting for 6 months and can have 2 left feet and he changed beautifully for me so I know the issue isn't entirely me. I have a clinic coming up in a couple weeks so maybe I'll have the trainer try it and see where we are.
If you trainer isn't too concerned then I probably wouldn't be either, but since you have another lesson I would mention it to him and have him help you. Maybe even have him try it if you still can't get it. I ride a lot of horses and while they all essentially need the same things to switch leads they all have a different sensitivity and way of going about it. In the meantime definitely work on manipulating that hip and isolating it. As well as being able to push her shoulder and front end over to get it out of the way of the hind end. =) |
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 Money Eating Baggage Owner
Posts: 9586
Location: Phoenix | Hocks/SI...my ex-Reiner felt so weak in the back end and had hell getting into the correct leads until I injected. He does have arthritic hocks though. |
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Veteran
Posts: 188
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | little_bug - 2015-07-02 7:26 PM Chance Of Rein - 2015-07-02 2:00 PM little_bug - 2015-07-02 3:41 PM Have you ridden reiners before? I ask because they have very specific cues and a way to set them up before you ask for a change and even the best will get confused or not do it correctly when they are asked incorectly. We always lift their shoulders up before asking them to change, so that is normal. Changing front to back means her hip needs to be pushed over more into the lead you are changing to. I have, she is my 3rd. The first I showed for almost 10 years before retiring, the next retired to the broodmare pen unsound last fall (bought her unsound but was able to get her sound again for 2 years ) and now this one. She was my step-up horse. I thought, at first it was because she has been off for a long time. I've taken a couple lessons with local trainers and they didn't seem too concerned. I expected it to get better with conditioning as she is beyond althetic in everything else I have asked her to do. Recently though, I climbed on my WP gelding that has been sitting for 6 months and can have 2 left feet and he changed beautifully for me so I know the issue isn't entirely me. I have a clinic coming up in a couple weeks so maybe I'll have the trainer try it and see where we are.
Thanks! I've been working on a lot of moving the hip over at all gaits and doing quite a bit of counter canter and counter bend. Do you have any exercises you can add? We can always hit the changes 2 handed but it is usually a stride or two late when I go one handed, if I don't have her set up absolutely perfectly. I just know it shouldn't be this much work. |
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Veteran
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Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | hammer_time - 2015-07-02 9:05 PM Hocks/SI...my ex-Reiner felt so weak in the back end and had hell getting into the correct leads until I injected. He does have arthritic hocks though.
This has crossed my mind. I may end up x-raying the hocks eventually because at her age and level she's been shown at it is certainly a possibility. I am not ruling it out at all. I would have expected some change with the pentosan if that were the case though and I when I am showing she is on previcoxx. None of those have made a difference at all. |
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Expert
Posts: 1302
Location: California | Chance Of Rein - 2015-07-02 8:57 PM little_bug - 2015-07-02 7:26 PM Chance Of Rein - 2015-07-02 2:00 PM little_bug - 2015-07-02 3:41 PM Have you ridden reiners before? I ask because they have very specific cues and a way to set them up before you ask for a change and even the best will get confused or not do it correctly when they are asked incorectly. We always lift their shoulders up before asking them to change, so that is normal. Changing front to back means her hip needs to be pushed over more into the lead you are changing to. I have, she is my 3rd. The first I showed for almost 10 years before retiring, the next retired to the broodmare pen unsound last fall (bought her unsound but was able to get her sound again for 2 years ) and now this one. She was my step-up horse. I thought, at first it was because she has been off for a long time. I've taken a couple lessons with local trainers and they didn't seem too concerned. I expected it to get better with conditioning as she is beyond althetic in everything else I have asked her to do. Recently though, I climbed on my WP gelding that has been sitting for 6 months and can have 2 left feet and he changed beautifully for me so I know the issue isn't entirely me. I have a clinic coming up in a couple weeks so maybe I'll have the trainer try it and see where we are.
If you can nail them two handed then I would definitely think it is more you than her, assuming you are riding in a bridle when one handed. It is definitely much easier to manipulate the shoulders and hip two handed. I would work on getting that shoulder up and over in the bridle one handed. Also make sure you pick her up in the bridle a lit bit and make her set back onto her hind end. Make sure when you put that rain across her neck she instantly moves off of it. We practice our lead changes with half passes, counter leading on the fence, straight lines, ect. because the middle is where they expect it. However with the circles we come into the center and practice pushing their shoulders over very dramatically, rating them a bit, then push their hip into the new lead, but don't actually let them switch. I don't know if this makes any sense but hopefully some of it does! I have been teaching our two year olds lead changes all week and so it is definitely fresh in my mind and I have been doing a million different exercises lol. My seasoned show horse gets lazy and will not switch the hind on occasion so I make him half pass at a lope diagonally from one corner to the other and make his hip lead the entire time. Switching his lead this way really exaggerates the hip part and makes you be able to physically see his hip lead his body. |
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 Blond Bombshell..
Posts: 6628
Location: Hill Country of TEXAS!! | Hocks. Being a Reiner or gone through the training, her hocks have been used! I don't recall seeing her age but even young one will tend to need injections :( I'd take her to a good lameness vet and let him flex her. Maybe inject this one time with good injections. Not the steroid only dose. See how she does and decide if it helped if she doesn't flex bad. One of my horses will flex out fine but will crossfire if he needs ONE hock injected. We've never done the other and it fixes it. Good luck! |
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