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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
  
Location: California | Am I driving everyone crazy with questions yet? Lol
Long story short; Dr Sutherland at Reata Equine thinks this diagnosis is the end of my mare's career. I sent the xrays and info to Dr Honnas and he says my mare is very mild, not a candidate for surgery, and after the inflammation is brought down and kept down she should be able to go back to running barrels without her vertebrae touching.
So my question; I was raised that injections were a last ditch effort because they could cause damage in the long run. Now that's with joints, is it the same with going between the vertebrae? I don't want temporary relief if in the long run its not a smart plan....
Anybody manage KS without injections? |
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The Advice Guru
Posts: 6419
| It all depends on what vets are injecting into the joint.
Depo, betamethasone, and corticosteroids I won't use as they reduce the inflammation, but there are studies that show the metabolites left in the joint can last months and prevent healing, and destroy the cartilage in the joint.
Trimisclinone, is the only steroid that has proven to regenerate cartilage in the joint when used in conjunction of HA.
I have had freak injuries where there was the potential for joint issues down the road. I injected as a preventative measure to protect the joint.
As with anything there are risks, joint flare, and infection of the joint. Neither is good, and as a horse owner you need to be diligent on who is injection, their sterile practices, and the after care.
I injecting joints can be a last resort, if you weren't injecting, what is the horses quality of life, is the horse going to be in pain? Are you willing to keep a horse who is useless?
You can get many years out of a horse if you inject smart. I had one we injected every 6 months at the age of 6, and he retired at the age of 18 after passing a flexion test with flying colors. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
Location: California | cheryl makofka - 2015-10-02 1:23 PM
It all depends on what vets are injecting into the joint.
Depo, betamethasone, and corticosteroids I won't use as they reduce the inflammation, but there are studies that show the metabolites left in the joint can last months and prevent healing, and destroy the cartilage in the joint.
Trimisclinone, is the only steroid that has proven to regenerate cartilage in the joint when used in conjunction of HA.
I have had freak injuries where there was the potential for joint issues down the road. I injected as a preventative measure to protect the joint.
As with anything there are risks, joint flare, and infection of the joint. Neither is good, and as a horse owner you need to be diligent on who is injection, their sterile practices, and the after care.
I injecting joints can be a last resort, if you weren't injecting, what is the horses quality of life, is the horse going to be in pain? Are you willing to keep a horse who is useless?
You can get many years out of a horse if you inject smart. I had one we injected every 6 months at the age of 6, and he retired at the age of 18 after passing a flexion test with flying colors.
This mare I will keep no matter what as long as she can be happy in a pasture she has a home for life. Now if it was in her best interest to euthanize because pain free wasn't an option then we would cross that bridge as we had to..
Thank you for all that insight! I need to update Dr Sutherland and then we were going from there. I'll discuss it all with her as well but I really wanted a better understanding of everything before I talked with her. |
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 Ms. Poutability
Posts: 2362
Location: In my own world | After having my horse diagnosed with KS and doing back injections I will say this and it's only my opinion. I feel like my mare was in pain. She didn't buck but she hollowed out her back and didn't carry herself properly. She lost topline and look skinny. Once I did injections and the pain went away she looks completely different. Yes we have worked ok carrying herself correctly but I don't think I could ever get her to do that without injections. So even if it is a pasture ornament I would bet your has is having pain issues now. I did use depo medrol but if I hadn't done injections I wouldn't have a horse I could ride. I'm on my phone or I would post picks of how much my mare has changed. I'm sorry there is no easy answer I don't think!!! Welcome to my boat. I like company so I will help anyway I can!! |
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Expert
Posts: 3514
| I would start her on Cur Ost EQ Total. This will reduce the inflammation and pain. And if this was my mare I would add the Cur Ost Pure. I love the results that I have got and there is a lot of others on this board that have got amazing results. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
Location: California | Thank you guys! It's hard to change the way you were raised to think in just a week. But for my mare I need to. Sheven also has left front coffin joint inflammation. So vet wants to inject that too. I couldn't afford it at the time or I would have done it right then and there.
I would LOVE to put her on CurOst but do to my bf leaving my bills now outweigh my income. As soon as I can get a second job or a main job with more hours that is on my to get list! Right now I have her on Golden Paste (turmeric) not sure how well it'll help but her lots of good things so I figured it couldn't hurt! |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Serenity06 - 2015-10-02 5:02 PM
Thank you guys! It's hard to change the way you were raised to think in just a week. But for my mare I need to. Sheven also has left front coffin joint inflammation. So vet wants to inject that too. I couldn't afford it at the time or I would have done it right then and there.
I would LOVE to put her on CurOst but do to my bf leaving my bills now outweigh my income. As soon as I can get a second job or a main job with more hours that is on my to get list! Right now I have her on Golden Paste (turmeric) not sure how well it'll help but her lots of good things so I figured it couldn't hurt!
Sending more positive thoughts your way!! |
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 Expert
Posts: 1440
Location: Texas | I have been Blessed to have two horses with KS. One was able to be managed with injections and the other one was not. I went ahead and did surgery on the one that injections did not hold. Honnas is the Heston this particular area so I would give him a shot. People who go to pain management doctors all the time to have their backs injected so why would it not be ok for horses. Just food for thought |
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 Midget Lover
Location: Kentucky | My mare was just diagnosed at Rood and Riddle with KS. She has two vertebrae touching and they injected with a depo mix in both spots. They told me to give her turnout for a week then start light riding. The x-rays looked incredibly painful. I feel awful that she's gone so long with this problem. I'm hoping injections help. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
Location: California | I'm thinking I will have to do injections. My mare has been on pasture rest for the last month. Finally got a diagnosis last weekend and I couldn't afford injections on top of my already $400 vet bill (had a $300 vet bill prior to that which that vet said she was fime). So we did 5 days Bute and muscle relaxers, she's moving better but I can tell she's still in pain. I can't stand seeing her in pain :( |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 926
| First, smart to go to Honnas.
I too always heard...injections bad. I think that's old school frankly. You have to have injections with kissing spine. Also try mesotherapy, it can help at times.
My has KS 2 rounds of injections and mesotherapy and still in pain and not able to work. Honnas is doing his surgery in about 10 days. Good luck to you. |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 1062
Location: Probably On the Road to the Next Barrel Race! | Dr. Honnas is the Gold Standard in this line ....whatever he says, I'd feel comfortable with that, and seek his advice on possible supplements. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 383
| I highly recommend the book " straightening the crooked horse"- he talks about kissing spine in the book- and it really shows you how to help your horse carry themselves properly ( I have ridden my whole life) I was taught very young by my mother who was very successful and a very good hand with horses -I say all that to say I was amazed when I read this book as to some of the things I was missing to help my horses build their rear, back and legs properly to carry themselves properly which in turn takes a lot of stress off of the back and joints- its less than $20 on amazon I can promise you - it is worth the read |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
Location: California | Thank you so much everyone! Dr Honnas hasn't responded to my last email about some questions I had but since I'm not a "client" I'm just happy with his thoughts on her xrays! It did give me a lot of hope. My biggest hurdle right now is affording everything to help her. My life has taken a dive bomb which included my bf moving out so now my bills are pretty high with just my income paying them. In the process of applying for a 2nd job and better paying main jobs, whichever happens first will be what I do.
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My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | Serenity06 - 2015-10-04 9:09 AM
Thank you so much everyone! Dr Honnas hasn't responded to my last email about some questions I had but since I'm not a "client" I'm just happy with his thoughts on her xrays! It did give me a lot of hope. My biggest hurdle right now is affording everything to help her. My life has taken a dive bomb which included my bf moving out so now my bills are pretty high with just my income paying them. In the process of applying for a 2nd job and better paying main jobs, whichever happens first will be what I do.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1165
Location: California | Just wanted to do a quick update. My mare is moving MUCH better but is still not completely sound on her front left. So it looks like I will be using my paycheck to inject and if her back still shows it needs it we will be doing those injections as well. Still haven't had much success in landing a 2nd job or a better main job but its a horrible time of year to be looking.
I'm doing tax preparation classes right now and will be working for Jackson Hewitt for Jan-April pulling as many hours as I want though so in January things will look better and I can play catch up on bills! |
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