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Member
Posts: 43
| CrossDRanch - 2015-12-04 9:07 AM
Since you refer to some of us as "old grazers", then you should listen young grasshopper...... I already have that biology/chemistry degree ya'll seek. So listen when I remind you of the famous quote that there are lies, **** lies, and statistics.
Is our environment in trouble is certain parts of the world, and could we do more? Without a doubt yes, but will NatGeo skew facts for a tv show? Without a doubt yes.
^^^this^^^ Honestly, there's very little on this whole thread that's anywhere near factually accurate. That's the problem with studies, data, statistics. You can make them into what you want instead of what they may/may not indicate or what they really prove. And I'm certainly not great at statistics and tearing apart studies but those that are, prove that fact over and over. | |
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 A Somebody to Everybody
Posts: 41354
  
Location: Under The Big Sky Of Texas | americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 2:11 AM komet. - 2015-12-03 6:26 PM americanpride08 - 2015-12-03 2:41 PM FOAMed - 2015-12-03 1:14 PM After reading this, I fear for the human race and it's difficulty with knowledge translation. Why exactly? Knowledge translation. It's either a fact or it's not. I've been following animal statistics and numbers since I was a child. The numbers are accurate. You're entitled to your opinion. But if you don't agree, just read and move on. What's the point in you commenting. You posted this expecting opinions.... So here is mine... Have you done your research? Before we moved out of caves, what do you think covered the 4 corners of the Earth? I'll tell you... Frting, belching cattle that provided food for lions, tigers and bears... and Humans... Research has shown us who is responsible for our situation today... and it ain't cows!!! (unless you think your farts don't stink )  Okay komet. You've always been extremely opinionated, and like most of the older forum grazers, you'll say what you want. So do what you do,I honestly don't have time to post links to all the facts for you out there. I'm rarely on here as it is. It was one facet of the show that I mentioned. But of course, the cattle is what gets your dander in a fluff. The facts are there for you to see if you ever choose to pull your blinders off. Combinations of many multitudes are the cause. Cattle IS an issue, regardless if you admit it or not. Amongst other things. ?? so continue to be an ostrich. This forum had become so incredibly combative. And honestly, it's not worth the energy even trying to convince you. I'll believe how I choose, you do the same. 
Edited by Southtxponygirl 2015-12-04 10:26 AM
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | scwebster - 2015-12-04 8:56 AM Its really sad what the human race has done to this planet. Even more sad, we arent doing enough to change it. This is what we are leaving our babies, and their babies. Most of us are just walking around with our heads in the sand not realizing the consequences of how we are living.
Everyone can do little things that make a big difference. Personally, I dont buy real fur anything (unless its cowhide) because I dont want to support poaching or the raising of animals simply for their hide (the furry ones at least, sorry alligators lol). I also try not to ever buy cosmetics that are tested on animals. I will soon begin to buy organic milk. If we ever get another dog I plan to adopt from a shelter. I make a point not to litter. These are small things I can do to support causes I believe in.
Consumers have an enourmous say... spend your money wisely.
What's better about organic milk?
People do eat alligator, so no need to feel bad about those.
And seriously, no one is more aware of the land and what we're leaving for future generations than farmers and ranchers. Many hunters and fishermen are environmentalists as well, in the truest sense of the word. I have found that many MANY of the "facts and statistics" used to vilify practices and effects on the environment are extremely outdated. The EPA, for example, is still insisting that 25% or more of applied fertilizer is running off from farm land. I have real life data taken over a period of years that proves the number is consistently more like 3-4%, with some being lower and worst case around 10%. Those numbers, however, do not suit their agenda. | |
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  Living on the edge of common sense
Posts: 24138
Location: Carpenter, WY | I didn't watch it. I knew I would end up in tears. My first husband was a entomolgist who specialized in hymenoptera and was one of the top specialists in this field in the world. I used to sit in some of the discussions amongst the scientists at the museum he was associated with and it was scary to hear them discuss the future of this planet and that was 30 years ago. I'm a old fart and to me it's just common sense that if you pollute just about anything and everything you come in contact with (water, air, soil) it is going to upset the natural balance of things in the long run. I feel sorry for my grandkids | |
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 Expert
Posts: 2128
| Three 4 Luck - 2015-12-04 9:31 AM scwebster - 2015-12-04 8:56 AM Its really sad what the human race has done to this planet. Even more sad, we arent doing enough to change it. This is what we are leaving our babies, and their babies. Most of us are just walking around with our heads in the sand not realizing the consequences of how we are living.
Everyone can do little things that make a big difference. Personally, I dont buy real fur anything (unless its cowhide) because I dont want to support poaching or the raising of animals simply for their hide (the furry ones at least, sorry alligators lol). I also try not to ever buy cosmetics that are tested on animals. I will soon begin to buy organic milk. If we ever get another dog I plan to adopt from a shelter. I make a point not to litter. These are small things I can do to support causes I believe in.
Consumers have an enourmous say... spend your money wisely.
What's better about organic milk?
People do eat alligator, so no need to feel bad about those.
And seriously, no one is more aware of the land and what we're leaving for future generations than farmers and ranchers. Many hunters and fishermen are environmentalists as well, in the truest sense of the word. I have found that many MANY of the "facts and statistics" used to vilify practices and effects on the environment are extremely outdated. The EPA, for example, is still insisting that 25% or more of applied fertilizer is running off from farm land. I have real life data taken over a period of years that proves the number is consistently more like 3-4%, with some being lower and worst case around 10%. Those numbers, however, do not suit their agenda.
Organic milk is produced under stricter guidelines of the USDA. The cows are not fed GMO feeds and certain antibiotics. Basically the milk is (supposed to be) produced in a more environmentally friendly way.
I agree farmers, ranchers and sportsman are doing more to preserve and are also more aware. I am speaking of the majority of society. There are a large number of people that only see food items in a grocery store and have no idea how those items are produced or harvested.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 629
Location: Roping pen | Haven't seen the show. But all I ask, is that before you form an opinion, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! Do not just jump on anybody's wagon. Question everything and learn!
One lesson in this world, is that everything and everybody has an agenda. NatGeo is to make money to promote their agenda, and the best way, is to create drama. Seems to be working.
I have been in this biz for 40 years, which possible qualifies me as an old grazer. One thing I have learned that every research project has flaws that can be contradicted by other research.
My research and opinion is that yes we have a problem. Has nothing to do with cattle. It is overpopulation and the over consumption caused by the human race-period.
Good luck with your life! | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 629
Location: Roping pen | One thing about "organic" products. That term actually guarantees nothing.
Just fyi-
"Organic" milk takes more of the earth's energy (carbon) to create than "non-organic" hence producing more "so called" bad things for the environment. Do your research!
Good luck! | |
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What Name?
Posts: 1994
| My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites.
Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet.
But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw.
And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one.
Edited by americanpride08 2015-12-04 10:22 AM
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | Spin Doctor - 2015-12-04 10:02 AM
One thing about "organic" products. That term actually guarantees nothing.
Just fyi-
"Organic" milk takes more of the earth's energy (carbon) to create than "non-organic" hence producing more "so called" bad things for the environment. Do your research!
Good luck!
Milk is antibiotic free. Period. All milk. When a cow gets sick and needs antibiotics, she is removed from production. In a conventional dairy, temporarily until the meds are cleared from her system. In organic production, the removal is permanent. Why? Every load of milk is tested for residue and if there is any present, it's dumped. No producer is going to risk that.
Now, what's wrong with GMO feed? | |
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What Name?
Posts: 1994
| Spin Doctor - 2015-12-04 9:59 AM Haven't seen the show. But all I ask, is that before you form an opinion, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! Do not just jump on anybody's wagon. Question everything and learn! One lesson in this world, is that everything and everybody has an agenda. NatGeo is to make money to promote their agenda, and the best way, is to create drama. Seems to be working. I have been in this biz for 40 years, which possible qualifies me as an old grazer. One thing I have learned that every research project has flaws that can be contradicted by other research. My research and opinion is that yes we have a problem. Has nothing to do with cattle. It is overpopulation and the over consumption caused by the human race-period. Good luck with your life!
Funny. That's what I said, but because the word cows was in there also people go all " oh no she didn't, my daddys a farmer." Over consumption of beef by a every increasing population leads to what..  HUGE NUMBERS OF CATTLE... Funny how that works. It's the same for the ridiculous amounts of chicken farms, pig farms, ect. Over population is responsible for pollution which is a domino effect and its transforming our oceans. I can tell few, if any actually watched this show. Because it was almost 2 hours long and the cattle was only a portion of it. I'm out of this conversation. I'm exhausted by the circles and constant finger pointing on this site. I forget that to have an opinion on here and in the world today that isn't share by the masses automatically puts you on the " ignorant side" So my final comment is. IF you want your kids to be able to swim in the oceans as adults and see the beauty you get to see today. You'll take notice of how you effect that world and how others do. Regardless of statistics, tv shows or other programed spoon fed views, the world is dying at a rate that should terrify you.
Edited by americanpride08 2015-12-04 10:35 AM
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:20 AM My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites. Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet. But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw. And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one.
Row crop and beef Ag is vastly different from poultry, pork, or veggie industries in that we are still independent producers and not vertically integrated. Don't lump it all together. Farmers are going to object if attacked. What else could you expect? No industry is perfect, but there is so much WRONG info out there about Ag, it's disheartening and infuriating. I know about this, I don't know anything about orangutans or the Amazon. I speak of what I know, I listen about what I don't. That's not being hypocritical. | |
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What Name?
Posts: 1994
| Three 4 Luck - 2015-12-04 10:33 AM
americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:20 AM My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites. Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet. But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw. And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one.
Row crop and beef Ag is vastly different from poultry, pork, or veggie industries in that we are still independent producers and not vertically integrated. Don't lump it all together. Farmers are going to object if attacked. What else could you expect? No industry is perfect, but there is so much WRONG info out there about Ag, it's disheartening and infuriating. I know about this, I don't know anything about orangutans or the Amazon. I speak of what I know, I listen about what I don't. That's not being hypocritical.
I actually never said anything about farmers until someone attacked me for my opinion. I made a statement that the amount of cattle was effecting climates due to gas emissions and the sheer numbers that we demand from the beef industry. But's it fine. Agree to disagree and I'm moving on. I honestly don't have time to play on this computer arguing about opinions. lol | |
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 I Prefer to Live in Fantasy Land
Posts: 64864
Location: In the Hills of Texas | The real problem is over population of humans. So do we start spaying and neutering people? | |
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 Strong Willed Woman
Posts: 6577
Location: Prosser, WA | Maybe by the time you are an old grazer you will understand what discussion is. :). You really shouldn't go on a public discussion board and think that no one will disagree with your posts. Old grazers don't blow sunshine and roses all day. LOL | |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:38 AM Three 4 Luck - 2015-12-04 10:33 AM americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:20 AM My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites. Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet. But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw. And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one. Row crop and beef Ag is vastly different from poultry, pork, or veggie industries in that we are still independent producers and not vertically integrated. Don't lump it all together. Farmers are going to object if attacked. What else could you expect? No industry is perfect, but there is so much WRONG info out there about Ag, it's disheartening and infuriating. I know about this, I don't know anything about orangutans or the Amazon. I speak of what I know, I listen about what I don't. That's not being hypocritical. I actually never said anything about farmers until someone attacked me for my opinion. I made a statement that the amount of cattle was effecting climates due to gas emissions and the sheer numbers that we demand from the beef industry. But's it fine. Agree to disagree and I'm moving on. I honestly don't have time to play on this computer arguing about opinions. lol
Saying a large part of our environmental issues is being caused by cattle would feel like an attack if one were in the cattle industry. Yes, there are problems, and things that need improvement, and these things make for good discussion, but the fact remains that statements like that are derived from agenda-driven statistics and even outright lies.
I don't watch propaganda documentaries because they are purely agenda driven. I know this because of the dozens that have been made about conventional agriculture, mostly on the anti side but it has happened on the pro side as well, that do not tell the truth AS I KNOW AND LIVE IT. People have become afraid to acknowledge issues as they actually exist in the real world because they know it will be misconstrued and used against them. And it's not just Ag. Things that are talked about within the industries are met with a brick wall if addressed by an outsider...that has to stop because it's doing a disservice to all of us, and gives the antis a foothold to convince people seeking answers that they are the ones holding them. JMO.  | |
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 Expert
Posts: 1898
| americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:38 AM
Three 4 Luck - 2015-12-04 10:33 AM
americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:20 AM My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites. Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet. But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw. And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one.
Row crop and beef Ag is vastly different from poultry, pork, or veggie industries in that we are still independent producers and not vertically integrated. Don't lump it all together. Farmers are going to object if attacked. What else could you expect? No industry is perfect, but there is so much WRONG info out there about Ag, it's disheartening and infuriating. I know about this, I don't know anything about orangutans or the Amazon. I speak of what I know, I listen about what I don't. That's not being hypocritical.
I actually never said anything about farmers until someone attacked me for my opinion. I made a statement that the amount of cattle was effecting climates due to gas emissions and the sheer numbers that we demand from the beef industry. But's it fine. Agree to disagree and I'm moving on. I honestly don't have time to play on this computer arguing about opinions. lol
I really thought your comment about cows was trolling for combative comments. Honestly, did you think coming on an ag based forum and making that statement was going to go without some kind of opposition? Your statement gave no information or fact, simply that cows are the cause. You really shouldn't get your panties in a wad when someone counters. And I never saw where you were "attacked", I only saw the opinion of others. None of your statements held any water when it came to "facts". Claiming that you are a what ever bio student with a what what ever minor and that you have watched the demise of your favorite species for a decade doesn't show proof or "facts". Unless you have been in the field, with hands on experience and first hand knowledge you haven't "witnessed" anything. You are simply spewing information that you read or saw somewhere. That's like saying you saw a train wreck but in all actuality you only heard the noise and rushed outside to see the aftermath.
I am not saying we can't do more for our planet, but seriously, it really seemed like you were digging for drama with that cow statement.
Edited by cyount2009 2015-12-04 11:44 AM
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Member
Posts: 43
| americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:38 AM
Three 4 Luck - 2015-12-04 10:33 AM
americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:20 AM My favorite part of this website is that people tell me I'm uneducated, because they jump to conclusions, assuming I'm incapable of doing my own research. Lord have mercy people I've been watching the desolation of my favorite animal species for nearly a decade. Statistics can be skewed, but so can your opinions. Say one thing about farmers on here and people get all out of sorts. But if I had said nothing about cows and spoke about darn orangutans in the Amazon few would have an opinion. Hypocrites. Born and raised farmer. Majority of farms are owned by the industry. Families do what their told by the industry. Not all, but most. The food, oil, manufacturing companies own America. Down to the policies. Just as you say they show statistics that I want to see and are skewed, then they can feed you the same. I've done research besides this show and it's right in our faces everyday besides. I simply started this post so people who are completely unaware would perhaps watch and investigate further. Regardless, more people need to recycle, and actively try to positively effect this planet. But it's okay. Take everything personally because I mentioned cows. Lol because if you go back and look, everything I said was about how farmers alone are wrecking the planet.- insert eye roll here- that was sarcasm btw. And no. The old grazer comment wasn't nice. So i retract it with an apology to the older forum members, as I have been on this site a long time and have many friends on here. However; verbally attacking someone because of their opinion, finger pointing and claiming they are ignorant is just as ugly. It's an opinion, you don't have to agree. But conduct yourself as an adult and keep it impersonal. Don't act like an ass if you don't want the label of one.
Row crop and beef Ag is vastly different from poultry, pork, or veggie industries in that we are still independent producers and not vertically integrated. Don't lump it all together. Farmers are going to object if attacked. What else could you expect? No industry is perfect, but there is so much WRONG info out there about Ag, it's disheartening and infuriating. I know about this, I don't know anything about orangutans or the Amazon. I speak of what I know, I listen about what I don't. That's not being hypocritical.
I actually never said anything about farmers until someone attacked me for my opinion. I made a statement that the amount of cattle was effecting climates due to gas emissions and the sheer numbers that we demand from the beef industry. But's it fine. Agree to disagree and I'm moving on. I honestly don't have time to play on this computer arguing about opinions. lol
Prob a good choice. | |
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 Undercover Amish Mafia Member
Posts: 9992
Location: Kansas | americanpride08 - 2015-12-04 10:33 AM Spin Doctor - 2015-12-04 9:59 AM Haven't seen the show. But all I ask, is that before you form an opinion, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH! Do not just jump on anybody's wagon. Question everything and learn! One lesson in this world, is that everything and everybody has an agenda. NatGeo is to make money to promote their agenda, and the best way, is to create drama. Seems to be working. I have been in this biz for 40 years, which possible qualifies me as an old grazer. One thing I have learned that every research project has flaws that can be contradicted by other research. My research and opinion is that yes we have a problem. Has nothing to do with cattle. It is overpopulation and the over consumption caused by the human race-period. Good luck with your life!
Funny. That's what I said, but because the word cows was in there also people go all " oh no she didn't, my daddys a farmer."
Over consumption of beef by a every increasing population leads to what.. HUGE NUMBERS OF CATTLE... Funny how that works. It's the same for the ridiculous amounts of chicken farms, pig farms, ect. Over population is responsible for pollution which is a domino effect and its transforming our oceans. I can tell few, if any actually watched this show. Because it was almost 2 hours long and the cattle was only a portion of it.
I'm out of this conversation. I'm exhausted by the circles and constant finger pointing on this site. I forget that to have an opinion on here and in the world today that isn't share by the masses automatically puts you on the " ignorant side" So my final comment is. IF you want your kids to be able to swim in the oceans as adults and see the beauty you get to see today. You'll take notice of how you effect that world and how others do. Regardless of statistics, tv shows or other programed spoon fed views, the world is dying at a rate that should terrify you.
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 Thread Killer
Posts: 7545
| Human activity has negative consequences on the environment. It's basically a given. Pointing fingers at a single industry isn't productive. As you can see by the posts on this thread, it yields a poor result. In addition, change will not happen overnight. I don't want the extinction of any species, but I don't want to screw over other humans. The Ag industry is being forced into a corner and that is a problem. Absolutes won't work in this case. | |
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Folks on-line