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 Expert
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Location: Gainesville, TX | IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan. | |
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  Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | oija - 2015-12-09 9:30 AM IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan.
The injectables are good. I keep mine on THE for preventative, they came out with a new one that is great called JointFLEX. During the summer when I am starting to haul, I have my kids older horses on Pentosan and will probably put the hunter/jumper on it too. He had some crazy soundness issues as a 3yr old. Hoping it was just growing pains. We tested/treated for everything. Finally turned him out to pasture. Out of sight/out of mind and then sent him to be re started and he came back so good. | |
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Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | wyoming barrel racer - 2015-12-09 10:36 AM
oija - 2015-12-09 9:30 AM IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan.
The injectables are good. I keep mine on THE for preventative, they came out with a new one that is great called JointFLEX. During the summer when I am starting to haul, I have my kids older horses on Pentosan and will probably put the hunter/jumper on it too. He had some crazy soundness issues as a 3yr old. Hoping it was just growing pains. We tested/treated for everything. Finally turned him out to pasture. Out of sight/out of mind and then sent him to be re started and he came back so good.
Yep they are good stuff. I don't mind feed throughs as a support and I know THE has good stuff, but the BEST support is really the injectables. I've done the feed throughs, by themselves, before and seen a tiny bit of improvement. The injectables made a world of difference though. Ideally you'd want to do both. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 5290
| oija - 2015-12-09 8:43 AM
wyoming barrel racer - 2015-12-09 10:36 AM
oija - 2015-12-09 9:30 AM IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan.
The injectables are good. I keep mine on THE for preventative, they came out with a new one that is great called JointFLEX. During the summer when I am starting to haul, I have my kids older horses on Pentosan and will probably put the hunter/jumper on it too. He had some crazy soundness issues as a 3yr old. Hoping it was just growing pains. We tested/treated for everything. Finally turned him out to pasture. Out of sight/out of mind and then sent him to be re started and he came back so good.
Yep they are good stuff. I don't mind feed throughs as a support and I know THE has good stuff, but the BEST support is really the injectables. I've done the feed throughs, by themselves, before and seen a tiny bit of improvement. The injectables made a world of difference though. Ideally you'd want to do both.
LEGEND is given IV not IM. But I do agree, I like the injectibles more than feed throughs. | |
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 Whack and Roll
Posts: 6342
Location: NE Texas | My horses are typically young, under the age of 7, as I train them and sell them when they are ready to be competitive. I have only had to inject one horse in my entire life, including back when I had aged horse and was rodeoing. The one horse I did have to inject, we were actually trying to "fix" a lameness that never improved. We eventually did an MRI and found microfratures in the P2 and thankfully we stopped trying this and that and found the source of the issue, as it could have reslted in catastrophic injury had we kept running her.
For me and joint maintenance, I think prevention is worth a pound of cure, and if I can provide the body the nutrients it needs to manage the inflammatory response at the cellular level when a horse is young, the likelihood of severe arthritis developing later will be reduced. This is why I choose this route for my horses.
The Cur-OST is much different from other products in that it's intended treatment is to dig deeper and target the root of these problems, rather than the symptom we see. The particular horse that forced me to research a different approach was flexed off just as we began the Cur-OST journey. He was extremely sore behind and the vet suggested to inject SI, stifles, and hocks. Not all at once of course, but eventually he advised they all needed to be done. You could palpate this horse and he would drop to the ground. You couldn't brush him without him wincing. Flexed him off and he was 5 out of 10 on a scale. 3 weeks later I was back to riding him. Nothing had changed other than adding the Cur-OST and getting his respiratory issues under control. Vet was back out to sew up a horse who'd gotten cut. While there, I had him flex the colt who'd been so sore. He couldn't make him wince anywhere. We flexed him and he was completely non-reactive and trotted right off of all flexion tests.
This proved to me that joint pain and arthritis are absolutely tied into the hind gut and the immune response. Through treating the respiratory issues I also treated the joint soreness. Injecting would have been a band-aid and once the steroid wore off, i'd have been in the same boat again looking for something to help. This particular horse is a needle hater, so weekly or even monthly injections aren't an option for me. I've used them in the past though never been able to tell a huge difference in my horse. Perhaps it was more for me and my peace of mind than him. Perhaps my program now is also for my own peace of mind, but I absolutely have seen the changes first hand and the results of a horse who was off the charts from an inflammation stand point, then issues resolved by treating the source. When you start researching "leaky gut syndrome", it is truly amazing as to how many different diseases, chronic conditions, and even psychological issues are related and can be stemmed from a leaky gut.
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https://nouvelleresearch.com/index.php/articles/259-joint-therapies-compliance-and-effectiveness
Edited by Herbie 2015-12-09 11:16 AM
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Neat Freak
Posts: 11216
Location: Wonderful Wyoming | FLITASTIC - 2015-12-09 9:51 AM oija - 2015-12-09 8:43 AM wyoming barrel racer - 2015-12-09 10:36 AM oija - 2015-12-09 9:30 AM IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan. The injectables are good. I keep mine on THE for preventative, they came out with a new one that is great called JointFLEX. During the summer when I am starting to haul, I have my kids older horses on Pentosan and will probably put the hunter/jumper on it too. He had some crazy soundness issues as a 3yr old. Hoping it was just growing pains. We tested/treated for everything. Finally turned him out to pasture. Out of sight/out of mind and then sent him to be re started and he came back so good. Yep they are good stuff. I don't mind feed throughs as a support and I know THE has good stuff, but the BEST support is really the injectables. I've done the feed throughs, by themselves, before and seen a tiny bit of improvement. The injectables made a world of difference though. Ideally you'd want to do both. LEGEND is given IV not IM. But I do agree, I like the injectibles more than feed throughs.
I have tried Legend on a couple and just didn't see any diff at all. Tried Pentosan because so many on here had mentioned it. It made a world of diff in my 22 yr old. He has really bad knees. Also tried it on my horse that broke his pelvis and I was trying to bring him back. I also noticed a huge improvement but he was still not going to be sound enough to do much so he is a pasture pet now. Those 2 horses made me a believer, oh and my youngest son's 40'ish pony was on it last summer. He won the lead line buckle at the yr end. His last yr we'll haul him around, but it got him through. He is a pony so with the ornery-ness that comes with being a pony, he never showed he was sore. I just saw more pep in his step. | |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 999
Location: Sunny So Cal | I do the JointFlex from THE, Legend, and Adequan for the joints. For the calming I really like THE Calming Cookies and THE Calming Powder.  | |
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Expert
Posts: 1694
Location: Willows, CA | FLITASTIC - 2015-12-09 10:51 AM
oija - 2015-12-09 8:43 AM
wyoming barrel racer - 2015-12-09 10:36 AM
oija - 2015-12-09 9:30 AM IF you are looking for something specific to joints, you really need an injectable like Adequan or Pentosan. A high quality feed thru like THE or Cur-ost is not a bad addition but they tend to do a little bit of good in all the joints. More specific joint aid comes from the injectables, which are not broken down in the gut like feed throughs as they go directly into the bloodstream. And honestly Adequan every 6 months (at about $300 for 7 shots), equates to about $50 a month, essentially the same cost or lower than most of your feed supplements. And while there is a good bit of anecdotal evidence for feed supplements, there are not any peer reviewed studies. A number of peer reviewed studies exist for Adequan and Pentosan that they absolutely do work. A slightly cheaper version of adequan (at least in terms of chemical composition) but not absolutely shown to be as effective is Ichon. Legend is a great short term management strategy too for a performance weekend. And of course you can always directly inject into the joint itself if needed. But Adequan, Pentosan, and Legend are just done IM and pretty easy for the average horse owner to give once a month or in the 7 shot series every 6 months like with Adequan.
The injectables are good. I keep mine on THE for preventative, they came out with a new one that is great called JointFLEX. During the summer when I am starting to haul, I have my kids older horses on Pentosan and will probably put the hunter/jumper on it too. He had some crazy soundness issues as a 3yr old. Hoping it was just growing pains. We tested/treated for everything. Finally turned him out to pasture. Out of sight/out of mind and then sent him to be re started and he came back so good.
Yep they are good stuff. I don't mind feed throughs as a support and I know THE has good stuff, but the BEST support is really the injectables. I've done the feed throughs, by themselves, before and seen a tiny bit of improvement. The injectables made a world of difference though. Ideally you'd want to do both.
LEGEND is given IV not IM. But I do agree, I like the injectibles more than feed throughs.
The challenge with feed throughs is that there is a vast difference in ingredient quality and effectiveness because of this. There is no cheap way to make a joint health feed through that is highly absorbed and effective in the horses body. I do not make or sell one, but have formulated for a number of companies over the years, and actually participated in a 55 horse clinical trial with over 40,000 measurements calculated, using feed throughs. So, there is in fact a peer reviewed study on the effectiveness of feed through flex products. Unfortunately, my formulation, which was shown to be clearly effective in both inflammation control and range of motion improvement in that study, Flex+ from Absorbine, is no longer available in that original formulation. There are some good ones on the market though. Platinum, and THE seem to provide a worthwhile response. I am very interested in the Cur-Ost information, though I would rather feed it with Renew Gold than with whole oats for a number or reasons, and SherMar's product on the West Coast is proving effective. All that said, no feed through is going to be as effective as injectable treatments for chronic arthritic changes once that is a developed problem. I feel that a combination of a premium feed through and injectables can be a good course of action once you identify a specific problem. As a prophylactic treatment for performance horses, I think a high quality feed through alone can provide support that may limit the need for injectables in the long term.
Edited by winwillows 2015-12-09 1:21 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 509
| I never here anyone mention platinum performance cj anymore does anyone feed it? | |
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 My Heart Be Happy
Posts: 9159
Location: Arkansas | tin can - 2015-12-09 7:33 PM
I never here anyone mention platinum performance cj anymore does anyone feed it?
I feed the CJ to my three oldest horses--36, 20, and 15. Absolutely love it, from joint help to the way they look and feel, great results. I don't barrel race, and everyone has been on downtime since my bf messed up his back, so maybe my opinion won't count! Overall tho I am sold on it. Have been tempted to try the Cur-ost because of Herbie and the others on here that have had such great results. (36 year old has pretty significant arthritis and 15 year old has suspensory issues, so I'd love to see if it helped even more than the CJ. . . ) I just can't decide to make the leap tho! | |
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Member
Posts: 36
Location: Delaware | If I read right, you are looking for something calming as well?
If that is the case I would steer clear of feeding oats. Oats will amp one up whether by itself or added in with a feed.
I have heard good things about the OXY relax supplement although I have not personally used it. | |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1034
| megsm - 2015-12-10 6:41 PM
If I read right, you are looking for something calming as well?
If that is the case I would steer clear of feeding oats. Oats will amp one up whether by itself or added in with a feed.
I have heard good things about the OXY relax supplement although I have not personally used it.
Renew Gold isn't sold as a 'calming' supplement but I have found my horses lose their anxiety but still fire. Especially my mare who is ulcer prone and has gate issues. She doesn't kick so much in the trailer and has been walking right in the gate. | |
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 It's not my fault I'm perfect
Posts: 13739
Location: Where the long tails flow, ND | megsm - 2015-12-10 6:41 PM If I read right, you are looking for something calming as well? If that is the case I would steer clear of feeding oats. Oats will amp one up whether by itself or added in with a feed. I have heard good things about the OXY relax supplement although I have not personally used it.
Not necessarily, it is all in how you use them. They are only used as a binder in my situation with cur ost | |
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I just read the headlines
Posts: 4483
| megsm - 2015-12-10 6:41 PM
If I read right, you are looking for something calming as well?
If that is the case I would steer clear of feeding oats. Oats will amp one up whether by itself or added in with a feed.
I have heard good things about the OXY relax supplement although I have not personally used it.
I used to think oats amped my horse up, too. Then I found out he digestive/hindgut issues. I got that cleared up and the 2 lbs. a day of oats I was feeding no longer amped him up. I feed an alfalfa cube that has oats and flaxseed in it- Omni cubes - now and I am very happy with them. I believe at the amount I feed, oats are not a problem for him, but I wouldn't feed any horse more than a pound or two of oats a day after the research I have done. Also, my feed program is forage based. | |
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 Maine-iac
Posts: 3334
Location: Got Lobsta? | winwillows - 2015-12-07 5:41 PM ctdrumrunr - 2015-12-06 6:02 PM you guys are lucky you can get RG, I am in the Northeast and no one near enough to me has it. TSC said they could get it, but minimum buy is a pallet and I only have 1 horse. Do you know how long that pallet would last lol. I can get Total Equine since a nearby aquaintance is going to be selling it. I know there was a TE thread and a lot of people got off of it and went to RG because their horses stopped doing good on it. Do you all think TE would be a good change. You no longer need to order a minimum amount of Renew Gold for your Tractor Supply to get it. As of last month, Renew Gold is in every Tractor Supply distribution center. That means that any Tractor Supply store can order any amount they need as a simple addition to their regular orders. If you ask and they don't know this, just give them the item number 1054391 and ask them to look it up. The price should be between $29.95 and $31.95 per bag. New distribution and increased volumes has also created a lower distributor price to independent distributors East of the Rocky Mountains. This price drop should reach independent feed stores in the next few weeks.
I did this and I live in Maine! I get 4 bags at a time. They now keep it on hand for me. Shouldn't be a problem to get. | |
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 Expert
Posts: 2013
Location: Piedmont, OK | Animal Element Detox has HA, MSM, and glucosamine. It is great to help maintain joints as well as the rest of the body. | |
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 No Name Nancy
Posts: 2715
Location: never in the right place | Mainer-racer - 2015-12-11 10:51 AM winwillows - 2015-12-07 5:41 PM ctdrumrunr - 2015-12-06 6:02 PM you guys are lucky you can get RG, I am in the Northeast and no one near enough to me has it. TSC said they could get it, but minimum buy is a pallet and I only have 1 horse. Do you know how long that pallet would last lol. I can get Total Equine since a nearby aquaintance is going to be selling it. I know there was a TE thread and a lot of people got off of it and went to RG because their horses stopped doing good on it. Do you all think TE would be a good change. You no longer need to order a minimum amount of Renew Gold for your Tractor Supply to get it. As of last month, Renew Gold is in every Tractor Supply distribution center. That means that any Tractor Supply store can order any amount they need as a simple addition to their regular orders. If you ask and they don't know this, just give them the item number 1054391 and ask them to look it up. The price should be between $29.95 and $31.95 per bag. New distribution and increased volumes has also created a lower distributor price to independent distributors East of the Rocky Mountains. This price drop should reach independent feed stores in the next few weeks.
I was just there last week and they told me I have to buy a pallett. This is a new store and new employees but she did look it up in the computer because she told me they didn't sell it at first. I will ask them again. Thanks for the info | |
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Maine-iac
Posts: 3334
Location: Got Lobsta? | ctdrumrunr - 2015-12-11 2:03 PM Mainer-racer - 2015-12-11 10:51 AM winwillows - 2015-12-07 5:41 PM ctdrumrunr - 2015-12-06 6:02 PM you guys are lucky you can get RG, I am in the Northeast and no one near enough to me has it. TSC said they could get it, but minimum buy is a pallet and I only have 1 horse. Do you know how long that pallet would last lol. I can get Total Equine since a nearby aquaintance is going to be selling it. I know there was a TE thread and a lot of people got off of it and went to RG because their horses stopped doing good on it. Do you all think TE would be a good change. You no longer need to order a minimum amount of Renew Gold for your Tractor Supply to get it. As of last month, Renew Gold is in every Tractor Supply distribution center. That means that any Tractor Supply store can order any amount they need as a simple addition to their regular orders. If you ask and they don't know this, just give them the item number 1054391 and ask them to look it up. The price should be between $29.95 and $31.95 per bag. New distribution and increased volumes has also created a lower distributor price to independent distributors East of the Rocky Mountains. This price drop should reach independent feed stores in the next few weeks.
Good luck! I know I had to do the same thing, I gave them the item number and I could go from there. They said they had to order a minimum of 8 bags, but I didn't have to purchase that many. Just tell them every other TSC does it, why won't they?  | |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 396
| megsm - 2015-12-10 5:41 PM
If I read right, you are looking for something calming as well?
If that is the case I would steer clear of feeding oats. Oats will amp one up whether by itself or added in with a feed.
I have heard good things about the OXY relax supplement although I have not personally used it.
Actually my horses were more hot on my local feed mill processed feed than when I switched to whole oats. The whole oats does not make my horse hot at all. | |
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