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Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | I have an older mare (20) who has always been hard to settle. We did have 1 foal, 3 years ago. That is the only time we've been able to get this mare in foal. She tends to retain fluid in her cervix. What has everyone else done to prevent this issue or get one settled despite of it? |
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  That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
 
| If it is pooled urine they have some surgery options that could help. Sometimes it is just they right oxytocin treatments at the right time. A good repro vet would be my suggestion. Its going to be costly but that is probably the only way you will get a baby out of a 20 year old mare with breeding issues. |
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 Champ
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Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Do you mean she's pooling urine or is does she have fluid in her uterus? The cervix is not a place they can accumulate fluid. It's the gateway into the uterus and when the mare isn't in heat the cervix is closed. |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: God's country | If she's accumulating some fluid my vet uses flushes & oxytocin to get it out. We just bred a mare that accumulated a lot of fluid after breeding & she used DMSO flushes and a slightly larger dose of oxytocin. |
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Veteran
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Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | My understanding is it is fluid, not urine, that is building up. Her cervix doesn't open much, if at all, when she is cycling. This last time around, vet dilated the cervix then used oxytocin and then flushed. We'll know if we have a baby on board on Friday. It sounds like she must be doing the prescribed treatment but is anyone else having much luck with this or is it a huge and expensive gamble? |
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| Chance Of Rein - 2016-06-01 7:56 AM
 I have an older mare (20) who has always been hard to settle.  We did have 1 foal, 3 years ago.  That is the only time we've been able to get this mare in foal.  She tends to retain fluid in her cervix.  What has everyone else done to prevent this issue or get one settled despite of it?
Had a baby 3 years ago meaning 2013??
Always been hard to settle meaning you have tried 10+ times??
I think you have a text book idiot for a vet...
Mare has no caslick
vet thinks cervix has fluid in it
vet waits on ovulation and misses it ..
vet has no idea what happens when using oxytocin directly before or after insemination
no mention of a saline antibiotic flush
no mention of going to stringent methods to keep everything sanitary
no mention of the viability or strength of stallions semen
no mention of using the entire ejaculation of fresh semen with no extenders ..
no mention of live coverage ..
no mention of using a local stallion for the above 2 items
no mention of cervix being closed or very tight
no mention of ever running a culture
no mention of the overall condition of her uterus or cervix
no mention of affects if mare has inflammation or bacterial problems
no mention if mare is exceptionally bred or you are possessed with having another of her babies for whatever reason
no mention if you sold or still own her only foal ..
YOU GET THE IDEA ..
*****************************************************
If I wanted to waste money one more time trying to get her in foal ..
I would adhere to the following with no BS or changes ...
start the following at the end of a (missed) heat cycle ...
Oxytocin to rid uterus of urine
saline w/antibiotics flush
IMMEDIATE CASLIC designed to accept insemination straw and to prevent air sucking creating bacteria and any manure contamination
48 hours before vet sez she will ovulate on like a Thursday .. which means you are checking her on a Monday ..
keep in mind you are going to inseminate this mare 24 hours prior to her possible ovulation!!! Decent semen should be good for 48-96 hours inside of mare ..
Monday ...
another oxytocin to clear any urine fluids ..
Saline wide range antibiotic flush
*******************************************************
Already have it arranged with stallion owner to get a full ejaculation of fresh semen ... no extenders ... if he is collected on M-W-F get an agreement to collect him twice on same day to get a full ejaculation or on an off day too .. like a Tuesday ..
**************************************************************
If M-W-F ... order it today/Monday for immediate pickup or for Tuesday delivery
if collecting on Tuesday is OK .. order it to be picked up on Tuesday or delivered on Wednesday
Whether you pick it up on Monday or Tuesday or have it delivered on Tuesday or Wednesday .... you are going to immediately inseminate prior to her ovulating
(if picked up no extenders ... if shipped you will have to use extenders)
Semen arrives ... you make sure tech or vet washes and sterilizes exterior of her vulva very thoroughly ... with tail tied out of the way .. to keep contamination to a minimum ..
If semen comes in 2 syringes .. vet is going to inseminate both without removing the straw ..
NOW ... VET IS GOING TO GIVE MARE A 24 HOUR SHOT TO BRING HER INTO FULL BLOOM ..
and you are going to walk the mare around outside for the next 30 minutes before loading and taking her home .. and then turn her out for the next 11-12 months to foal ... it is common for older mares to carry a full year ..
Since this is your last try to get her in foal ........ you are going to wait 30 days before you check to see if she is in foal .. embryo should be easy to find and see at this time .. no extra looking or piddling around or looking for heart beats ..
NO MORE MARE CHECKS .. FOR ANY REASON ...
she is either in foal or not in foal..
This is my standard procedure using cooled semen on young or older mares and time frame is same if standing my own stallion I would breed her twice on Tuesday and Wednesday with no other changes ... still give her the 24 hour shot and the 30 minute walk arounds ... (caslick is not used if vulva is in proper position on younger mares and on older mares if it is deformed in anyway or they are showing any fluids in uterus)
Using these simple procedures which enhance getting maiden or older mares in foal with cooled semen ... my success on getting mares in foal on first shipment has been 100%... no diddling with the time frames stay on your time plan to get things done ..
I am curious to know pedigree on stallion and the mare ..
GOOD LUCK
Edited by BARRELHORSE USA 2016-06-02 4:31 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 188
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | I can't blame the failure on one vet. I've actually used 2 different vets over the last few years. Both of which have pretty high success rates in mares. I'm not sure how many they deal with that have the issues mine does. We have hand walked her in the past. This last time we bred her, vet came to my house as she paced the fence and lost a lot of weight at the vets last spring.
Mare has no caslick - no, never
vet thinks cervix has fluid in it - issue with both vets I've used for breeding
vet waits on ovulation and misses it .. ?
vet has no idea what happens when using oxytocin directly before or after insemination ?
no mention of a saline antibiotic flush done
no mention of going to stringent methods to keep everything sanitary unsure what stringent methods are beyond normal sanitation-please explain
no mention of the viability or strength of stallions semen - when it came in last year it was very viable, didn't ask this year, same stallion
no mention of using the entire ejaculation of fresh semen with no extenders .. - not sure if owners use extenders, will ask.
no mention of live coverage .. Have tried 3 times in past. No foal, only ended up with an infection that was treated and cleared immediately
no mention of using a local stallion for the above 2 items - see above
no mention of cervix being closed or very tight - has been an issue by both vets
no mention of ever running a culture - every spring before breeding- always clean
no mention of the overall condition of her uterus or cervix - unsure what to ask vet in this regard
no mention of affects if mare has inflammation or bacterial problems - none known
no mention if mare is exceptionally bred or you are possessed with having another of her babies for whatever reason - mare was an awesome reining horse and means a lot to me otherwise, wouldn't bother
no mention if you sold or still own her only foal .. foal was euthanized January 2015 due to kidney disease that was untreatable - potentially due to issues from Potomac fever when just a few weeks old. Mare was also treated for a nasty colic when about 3 months into pregnancy. Hard to say what caused the kidney issues.
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Location: NE Texas | I would like to preface this with saying that by no means am I a breeding expert or even close! As of recent is my only experience with breeding.
We have a 17 year old maiden mare. Fortunately, I'm familiar with this mares cycle as I started paying close attention once we decided to try and get a foal out of her (this is a foal we plan to keep in the family so not breeding to sale).
Pretty sure I caught her on first day of cycle, took to reproductive guy on Friday and she had a follicle greater than 35 so he gave her a shot to induce ovulation and then we headed to the stud and she was bred live cover a couple of hours later. Checked two weeks later and she was not in foal.
One week after the check (21 days exactly from last cycle) she came back in season. This time I took her to the reproductive guy on a Friday (she came into heat on a Wednesday). She had a follicle greater than 35, she did have some fluid pooled so this time we went another route (this was my final attempt as it does get expensive). I took the mare back home and then gave her 3cc (I believe it was 3cc) of oxytocin every 6 hours (so she got a shot at 12pm Friday, 6pm and again at midnight. Saturday morning at 8am she got another 3cc and Saturday about 10am he checked for fluid again and there was none. Yay - so off to the stud we go again. This time she keeps the mare a few days but Breeds her Saturday night (the was due to ovulate on Sunday as when he checked her on friday he gave a shot to induce ovulation and generally that happens within 2 days from the shot - from what I understand). So she was bred live cover Saturday night and on Monday we took her back for another check to make sure she had ovulated - fortunately she had ovulated and there was still no fluid. Took her back 3 weeks later (weather, work and life got in the way of taking her at 2 weeks vs 3 weeks this round). He said she is in-foal but it's small for 3 weeks and he would like to have her back again in another week as by that time there should be a heart beat. Also, forgot to mention that after the second breeding we started her on 10cc of regumate 3 days after she ovulated to help maintain the pregnancy - we check blood work at 45 days to see if we can discontinue the use of regumate.
With all that said - not sure how this will play out and if she will carry it full term - just wanted to share my story with you on our older maiden mare in-foal challenge! Best of luck - hope it all works out like you want it to!
Edited by reese_tx 2016-06-02 4:19 PM
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| reese tx ...
Your story is why I get critical of a lot of vets... or re-pro vets I trust even less .. too much text book and not enough common sense ... lol
Your "re-pro vet" should have bowed out after saying your mare was pooling and told you to take your mare to the live cover stallion at first signs of cycling and to leave her for 10 days or for 26 days to check if in foal.
The stallion owner probably would have given her a shot of oxytocin and perhaps a saline antibiotic flush for the pooling ... then would have proceeded letting his stallion and mare tell him when to start the live cover .... once started usually mare gets bred every other day until she refuses stallion ...
Back to re-pro vet ... this nutso said she was pooling but ignored the need for doing a caslick after she is pronounced in foal ..... grrrrrrrrrr ...... and then sez embryo is small and wants to dig around in there a week later ... shows vet was just guessing and sells you some regumate $$$'s ... for 45 days not telling you the change in hormones when stopping the regumate could create a miscarriage .... still no caslick ...
Some of the worst vets in the world have great personalities but graduated in the lower half of their class ... and never owned a horse in their lives ... lol
HOPING ALL IS WELL and you get your foal this spring !!
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Veteran
Posts: 188
Location: Under the Big Sky - Montana | Thanks, I am hoping so too. The funny thing is, we didn't have the fluid issue the one and only time she settled. It is also really tough because most people with decent stallions do not live cover and I don't blame them for not doing so. It just makes it harder for people with mares like mine and I would rather go with no foal than breed her to a lesser stallion. |
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Regular
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| BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-06-02 4:26 AM Chance Of Rein - 2016-06-01 7:56 AM I have an older mare (20) who has always been hard to settle. We did have 1 foal, 3 years ago. That is the only time we've been able to get this mare in foal. She tends to retain fluid in her cervix. What has everyone else done to prevent this issue or get one settled despite of it? Had a baby 3 years ago meaning 2013?? Always been hard to settle meaning you have tried 10+ times?? I think you have a text book idiot for a vet... Mare has no caslick vet thinks cervix has fluid in it vet waits on ovulation and misses it .. vet has no idea what happens when using oxytocin directly before or after insemination no mention of a saline antibiotic flush no mention of going to stringent methods to keep everything sanitary no mention of the viability or strength of stallions semen no mention of using the entire ejaculation of fresh semen with no extenders .. no mention of live coverage .. no mention of using a local stallion for the above 2 items no mention of cervix being closed or very tight no mention of ever running a culture no mention of the overall condition of her uterus or cervix no mention of affects if mare has inflammation or bacterial problems no mention if mare is exceptionally bred or you are possessed with having another of her babies for whatever reason no mention if you sold or still own her only foal .. YOU GET THE IDEA .. ***************************************************** If I wanted to waste money one more time trying to get her in foal .. I would adhere to the following with no BS or changes ... start the following at the end of a (missed ) heat cycle ... Oxytocin to rid uterus of urine saline w/antibiotics flush IMMEDIATE CASLIC designed to accept insemination straw and to prevent air sucking creating bacteria and any manure contamination 48 hours before vet sez she will ovulate on like a Thursday .. which means you are checking her on a Monday .. keep in mind you are going to inseminate this mare 24 hours prior to her possible ovulation!!! Decent semen should be good for 48-96 hours inside of mare .. Monday ... another oxytocin to clear any urine fluids .. Saline wide range antibiotic flush ******************************************************* Already have it arranged with stallion owner to get a full ejaculation of fresh semen ... no extenders ... if he is collected on M-W-F get an agreement to collect him twice on same day to get a full ejaculation or on an off day too .. like a Tuesday .. ************************************************************** If M-W-F ... order it today/Monday for immediate pickup or for Tuesday delivery if collecting on Tuesday is OK .. order it to be picked up on Tuesday or delivered on Wednesday Whether you pick it up on Monday or Tuesday or have it delivered on Tuesday or Wednesday .... you are going to immediately inseminate prior to her ovulating (if picked up no extenders ... if shipped you will have to use extenders ) Semen arrives ... you make sure tech or vet washes and sterilizes exterior of her vulva very thoroughly ... with tail tied out of the way .. to keep contamination to a minimum .. If semen comes in 2 syringes .. vet is going to inseminate both without removing the straw .. NOW ... VET IS GOING TO GIVE MARE A 24 HOUR SHOT TO BRING HER INTO FULL BLOOM .. and you are going to walk the mare around outside for the next 30 minutes before loading and taking her home .. and then turn her out for the next 11-12 months to foal ... it is common for older mares to carry a full year .. Since this is your last try to get her in foal ........ you are going to wait 30 days before you check to see if she is in foal .. embryo should be easy to find and see at this time .. no extra looking or piddling around or looking for heart beats .. NO MORE MARE CHECKS .. FOR ANY REASON ... she is either in foal or not in foal.. This is my standard procedure using cooled semen on young or older mares and time frame is same if standing my own stallion I would breed her twice on Tuesday and Wednesday with no other changes ... still give her the 24 hour shot and the 30 minute walk arounds ... (caslick is not used if vulva is in proper position on younger mares and on older mares if it is deformed in anyway or they are showing any fluids in uterus ) Using these simple procedures which enhance getting maiden or older mares in foal with cooled semen ... my success on getting mares in foal on first shipment has been 100%... no diddling with the time frames stay on your time plan to get things done .. I am curious to know pedigree on stallion and the mare .. GOOD LUCK
I didn't really want to touch on much of anything except for this advice.
I understand your concern, BARRELHORSE, is regarding the mare either being in foal or not in foal, but you have forgotten to mention the critical 16 day post-ovulation window you have to check for twins. If you wait 30 days to check the mare for pregnancy and she does end up carrying twins, now not only are the conceptus "fixed" in the uterus, but they also may be too close together to reduce only one. If this occurs, you are now faced with more than likely terminating the pregnancy to avoid putting the mare and her unborn foals' lives at risk.
Twins are HIGHLY undesirable and they should be avoided by any and all means necessary. |
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Location: NE Texas | BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-06-02 8:57 PM
reese tx ...
Your story is why I get critical of a lot of vets... or re-pro vets I trust even less .. too much text book and not enough common sense ... lol
Your "re-pro vet" should have bowed out after saying your mare was pooling and told you to take your mare to the live cover stallion at first signs of cycling and to leave her for 10 days or for 26 days to check if in foal.
The stallion owner probably would have given her a shot of oxytocin and perhaps a saline antibiotic flush for the pooling ... then would have proceeded letting his stallion and mare tell him when to start the live cover .... once started usually mare gets bred every other day until she refuses stallion ...
Back to re-pro vet ... this nutso said she was pooling but ignored the need for doing a caslick after she is pronounced in foal ..... grrrrrrrrrr ...... and then sez embryo is small and wants to dig around in there a week later ... shows vet was just guessing and sells you some regumate $$$'s ... for 45 days not telling you the change in hormones when stopping the regumate could create a miscarriage .... still no caslick ...
Some of the worst vets in the world have great personalities but graduated in the lower half of their class ... and never owned a horse in their lives ... lol
HOPING ALL IS WELL and you get your foal this spring !!
Everyone has their own opinions and experiences and you've made a lot of assumptions. If you ask 20 different people you're going to get 20 unique answers. At best, all we can do is educate ourselves and make the best decisions for our situation.
My choice not to leave the mare at breeders for a month as we live nearby and it saved me $ to not pay for mare care.
Research shows that multiple breeding's increase the mares chances of infection so it's optimal to breed only once
I have found no research that states palpation (by a qualified person who knows what their doing) will harm the pregnancy, but agree that poking around in there isn't in the best interest of baby makin'.
Vet did not sell me regumate. I purchased from a friend at wholesale cost. We are going back to check for heart beat and to measure blood work to see if she can be removed from regumate so I'm not continuing to pay for something that she may not need at this point and we would not stop regumate completely - slowly ween her off.
Not every mare that pools fluid needs a caslick.
and thank you - we hope so too! |
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| suiteperformance - 2016-06-03 9:37 AM
BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-06-02 4:26 AM Chance Of Rein - 2016-06-01 7:56 AM  I have an older mare (20) who has always been hard to settle.  We did have 1 foal, 3 years ago.  That is the only time we've been able to get this mare in foal.  She tends to retain fluid in her cervix.  What has everyone else done to prevent this issue or get one settled despite of it? Had a baby 3 years ago meaning 2013?? Always been hard to settle meaning you have tried 10+ times?? I think you have a text book idiot for a vet... Mare has no caslick vet thinks cervix has fluid in it vet waits on ovulation and misses it .. vet has no idea what happens when using oxytocin directly before or after insemination no mention of a saline antibiotic flush no mention of going to stringent methods to keep everything sanitary no mention of the viability or strength of stallions semen no mention of using the entire ejaculation of fresh semen with no extenders .. no mention of live coverage .. no mention of using a local stallion for the above 2 items no mention of cervix being closed or very tight no mention of ever running a culture no mention of the overall condition of her uterus or cervix no mention of affects if mare has inflammation or bacterial problems no mention if mare is exceptionally bred or you are possessed with having another of her babies for whatever reason no mention if you sold or still own her only foal .. YOU GET THE IDEA .. ***************************************************** If I wanted to waste money one more time trying to get her in foal .. I would adhere to the following with no BS or changes ... start the following at the end of a (missed ) heat cycle ... Oxytocin to rid uterus of urine saline w/antibiotics flush IMMEDIATE CASLIC designed to accept insemination straw and to prevent air sucking creating bacteria and any manure contamination 48 hours before vet sez she will ovulate on like a Thursday .. which means you are checking her on a Monday .. keep in mind you are going to inseminate this mare 24 hours prior to her possible ovulation!!! Decent semen should be good for 48-96 hours inside of mare .. Monday ... another oxytocin to clear any urine fluids .. Saline wide range antibiotic flush ******************************************************* Already have it arranged with stallion owner to get a full ejaculation of fresh semen ... no extenders ... if he is collected on M-W-F get an agreement to collect him twice on same day to get a full ejaculation or on an off day too .. like a Tuesday .. ************************************************************** If M-W-F ... order it today/Monday for immediate pickup or for Tuesday delivery if collecting on Tuesday is OK .. order it to be picked up on Tuesday or delivered on Wednesday Whether you pick it up on Monday or Tuesday or have it delivered on Tuesday or Wednesday .... you are going to immediately inseminate prior to her ovulating (if picked up no extenders ... if shipped you will have to use extenders ) Semen arrives ... you make sure tech or vet washes and sterilizes exterior of her vulva very thoroughly ... with tail tied out of the way .. to keep contamination to a minimum .. If semen comes in 2 syringes .. vet is going to inseminate both without removing the straw .. NOW ... VET IS GOING TO GIVE MARE A 24 HOUR SHOT TO BRING HER INTO FULL BLOOM .. and you are going to walk the mare around outside for the next 30 minutes before loading and taking her home .. and then turn her out for the next 11-12 months to foal ... it is common for older mares to carry a full year .. Since this is your last try to get her in foal ........ you are going to wait 30 days before you check to see if she is in foal .. embryo should be easy to find and see at this time .. no extra looking or piddling around or looking for heart beats .. NO MORE MARE CHECKS .. FOR ANY REASON ... she is either in foal or not in foal.. This is my standard procedure using cooled semen on young or older mares and time frame is same if standing my own stallion I would breed her twice on Tuesday and Wednesday with no other changes ... still give her the 24 hour shot and the 30 minute walk arounds ... (caslick is not used if vulva is in proper position on younger mares and on older mares if it is deformed in anyway or they are showing any fluids in uterus ) Using these simple procedures which enhance getting maiden or older mares in foal with cooled semen ... my success on getting mares in foal on first shipment has been 100%... no diddling with the time frames stay on your time plan to get things done .. I am curious to know pedigree on stallion and the mare .. GOOD LUCK
I didn't really want to touch on much of anything except for this advice.  I understand your concern, BARRELHORSE, is regarding the mare either being in foal or not in foal, but you have forgotten to mention the critical 16 day post-ovulation window you have to check for twins. If you wait 30 days to check the mare for pregnancy and she does end up carrying twins, now not only are the conceptus "fixed" in the uterus, but they also may be too close together to reduce only one. If this occurs, you are now faced with more than likely terminating the pregnancy to avoid putting the mare and her unborn foals' lives at risk.  Twins are HIGHLY undesirable and they should be avoided by any and all means necessary.
With 150,000 mares of all breeds foaling each year ... the average number of documented twins is 10 sets per year ...
Mother Nature knows what she is doing and will absorb one of the embryos ....
the more man tinkers and messes with MN the crazier everything gets ..
During the first 30 days the embryo doubles in size each day ... 14-16 days is tuff to see or find it ... on good sound broodmares I check at 20 days .. embryo easier to find and if not in foal ... mare is usually starting her next heat cycle for vet to evaluate where she is at .. on this mare since this may be the last chance .. I would do the 30 day check etc etc ...
****************************************************
With the history of this older mare is where I pointed my advice not to do any extra piddling around .....
*****************************************************
I will answer the statement made by the owner of the mare on caslicks ... if mare is pooling or getting infections ... 99% of the time the shape, size of the vulva is the problem and sewing her up is the answer .... majority of fillies on the race track are sewed up to keep them from sucking air and creating infections in the uterus ... better safe than sorry ... simple procedure
Live cover infections are rare ... stallion is washed down after covering the mare and multiple covers is so you don't miss the ovulation and not have a vet digging around in there creating stress and an unnecessary procedure on checking the mare ... your vets have already missed this mare multiple times .... so I would trust the stallion/mare love affair more than I would them ... lol
Edited by BARRELHORSE USA 2016-06-03 12:09 PM
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| BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-06-03 12:03 PM
suiteperformance - 2016-06-03 9:37 AM
BARRELHORSE USA - 2016-06-02 4:26 AM Chance Of Rein - 2016-06-01 7:56 AM  I have an older mare (20) who has always been hard to settle.  We did have 1 foal, 3 years ago.  That is the only time we've been able to get this mare in foal.  She tends to retain fluid in her cervix.  What has everyone else done to prevent this issue or get one settled despite of it? Had a baby 3 years ago meaning 2013?? Always been hard to settle meaning you have tried 10+ times?? I think you have a text book idiot for a vet... Mare has no caslick vet thinks cervix has fluid in it vet waits on ovulation and misses it .. vet has no idea what happens when using oxytocin directly before or after insemination no mention of a saline antibiotic flush no mention of going to stringent methods to keep everything sanitary no mention of the viability or strength of stallions semen no mention of using the entire ejaculation of fresh semen with no extenders .. no mention of live coverage .. no mention of using a local stallion for the above 2 items no mention of cervix being closed or very tight no mention of ever running a culture no mention of the overall condition of her uterus or cervix no mention of affects if mare has inflammation or bacterial problems no mention if mare is exceptionally bred or you are possessed with having another of her babies for whatever reason no mention if you sold or still own her only foal .. YOU GET THE IDEA .. ***************************************************** If I wanted to waste money one more time trying to get her in foal .. I would adhere to the following with no BS or changes ... start the following at the end of a (missed ) heat cycle ... Oxytocin to rid uterus of urine saline w/antibiotics flush IMMEDIATE CASLIC designed to accept insemination straw and to prevent air sucking creating bacteria and any manure contamination 48 hours before vet sez she will ovulate on like a Thursday .. which means you are checking her on a Monday .. keep in mind you are going to inseminate this mare 24 hours prior to her possible ovulation!!! Decent semen should be good for 48-96 hours inside of mare .. Monday ... another oxytocin to clear any urine fluids .. Saline wide range antibiotic flush ******************************************************* Already have it arranged with stallion owner to get a full ejaculation of fresh semen ... no extenders ... if he is collected on M-W-F get an agreement to collect him twice on same day to get a full ejaculation or on an off day too .. like a Tuesday .. ************************************************************** If M-W-F ... order it today/Monday for immediate pickup or for Tuesday delivery if collecting on Tuesday is OK .. order it to be picked up on Tuesday or delivered on Wednesday Whether you pick it up on Monday or Tuesday or have it delivered on Tuesday or Wednesday .... you are going to immediately inseminate prior to her ovulating (if picked up no extenders ... if shipped you will have to use extenders ) Semen arrives ... you make sure tech or vet washes and sterilizes exterior of her vulva very thoroughly ... with tail tied out of the way .. to keep contamination to a minimum .. If semen comes in 2 syringes .. vet is going to inseminate both without removing the straw .. NOW ... VET IS GOING TO GIVE MARE A 24 HOUR SHOT TO BRING HER INTO FULL BLOOM .. and you are going to walk the mare around outside for the next 30 minutes before loading and taking her home .. and then turn her out for the next 11-12 months to foal ... it is common for older mares to carry a full year .. Since this is your last try to get her in foal ........ you are going to wait 30 days before you check to see if she is in foal .. embryo should be easy to find and see at this time .. no extra looking or piddling around or looking for heart beats .. NO MORE MARE CHECKS .. FOR ANY REASON ... she is either in foal or not in foal.. This is my standard procedure using cooled semen on young or older mares and time frame is same if standing my own stallion I would breed her twice on Tuesday and Wednesday with no other changes ... still give her the 24 hour shot and the 30 minute walk arounds ... (caslick is not used if vulva is in proper position on younger mares and on older mares if it is deformed in anyway or they are showing any fluids in uterus ) Using these simple procedures which enhance getting maiden or older mares in foal with cooled semen ... my success on getting mares in foal on first shipment has been 100%... no diddling with the time frames stay on your time plan to get things done .. I am curious to know pedigree on stallion and the mare .. GOOD LUCK
I didn't really want to touch on much of anything except for this advice.  I understand your concern, BARRELHORSE, is regarding the mare either being in foal or not in foal, but you have forgotten to mention the critical 16 day post-ovulation window you have to check for twins. If you wait 30 days to check the mare for pregnancy and she does end up carrying twins, now not only are the conceptus "fixed" in the uterus, but they also may be too close together to reduce only one. If this occurs, you are now faced with more than likely terminating the pregnancy to avoid putting the mare and her unborn foals' lives at risk.  Twins are HIGHLY undesirable and they should be avoided by any and all means necessary.
With 150,000 mares of all breeds foaling each year ... the average number of documented twins is 10 sets per year ...
Mother Nature knows what she is doing and will absorb one of the embryos ....
the more man tinkers and messes with MN the crazier everything gets ..
During the first 30 days the embryo doubles in size each day ... 14-16 days is tuff to see or find it ... on good sound broodmares I check at 20 days .. embryo easier to find and if not in foal ... mare is usually starting her next heat cycle for vet to evaluate where she is at .. on this mare since this may be the last chance .. I would do the 30 day check etc etc ...
****************************************************
With the history of this older mare is where I pointed my advice not to do any extra piddling around .....
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I will answer the statement made by the owner of the mare on caslicks ... if mare is pooling or getting infections ... 99% of the time the shape, size of the vulva is the problem and sewing her up is the answer .... majority of fillies on the race track are sewed up to keep them from sucking air and creating infections in the uterus ... better safe than sorry ... simple procedure
Live cover infections are rare ... stallion is washed down after covering the mare and multiple covers is so you don't miss the ovulation and not have a vet digging around in there creating stress and an unnecessary procedure on checking the mare ... your vets have already missed this mare multiple times .... so I would trust the stallion/mare love affair more than I would them ... lol
...Mother Nature certainly will not always just "absorb the embryo." This is a completely inaccurate statement and you should at the very least label it as your opinion and/or experience. It seems as though you have a demeaning attitude toward everyone (Vets in particular) that doesn't breed mares they way you think they should be bred. You certainly sound like you are less-than-impressed by the two mentioned in this thread. It's rude of you to speak so poorly of these veterinarians.
You should always, always check for twins.
As far as the OP is concerned - we are hoping to get our 17 year old in foal this year. I wish you the best of luck, but it sounds like your vet is a reliable one. Let us know what you find out today! |
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