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Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What

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WhatNext
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2015-06-16 10:03 AM
Subject: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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I have a fairly new horse, He was brought from Florida and to GA. He only ate the peanut hay ( which I heard was excellent ). Long story short, He doesn't seem to be adjusting very well. He is on pasture all the time but he eat more weeds and leaves and dirt than a goat. He has also started eating my other horses tail off. He gets Neutrena special care, loose white and mineral salt free choice. I am concerned he is not getting something vitamin/mineral wise he needs. Do they not get enough from the grain? A month ago he developed a fever of 106. No reason the vet could find. tested for flu/herpes. She said it was viral. He was on bannamine for over a week for the fever. He is definitely more "not himself " now. Just would like some opinion on where to go from here. Best ulcer preventative after the treatment. Best multivitamin supplement. I hate to feed 10 different things and not sure of the problem. I know I can scope him but paying the 635 vet bill for the fever first. Most say to just treat anyway. Help.
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abrooks
Reg. May 2006
Posted 2015-06-16 11:03 AM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


Good Ole Boys just Fine with Me


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What type of hay are you feeding now and what type of grain (I see the grain type now)? What type of grain was he getting?

Edited by abrooks 2015-06-16 11:07 AM
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OregonBR
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2015-06-16 11:31 AM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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Unusual Eating Behaviors in Horses Explained
Unusual Eating Behaviors in Horses Explained
If you observe individual horses exhibiting unusual eating behaviors—such as coprophagy, or eating manure—evaluate their diet's nutritional balance, forage availability, and the general environment for potential causes of the behavior.
Photo: The Horse Staff
We expect our horses to eat grass, hay, grain, and maybe treats like carrots or apples. We don't expect them to eat things like dirt or manure, but sometimes they do. While this type of behavior can be both offensive and worrisome, is it actually harmful to the horse?
The term “pica” refers to persistent eating of non-nutritive substances for at least one month’s time. Many mammals, including humans, are known to do this, and it is most common in younger animals. In some cases specific nutritional deficiencies might trigger unusual cravings, such as a long-term phosphorus deficiency causing cattle to eat bones or significant amounts of dirt. In horses these behaviors are not defined as stereotypic stable vices because they appear to represent a normal physiologic or foraging response.
Unusual oral behaviors in horses include coprophagy and geophagia. Coprophagy, eating manure, is normal in young horses from 5 days to 2 months of age. Foals typically eat their mothers’ manure but occasionally consume their own or an unrelated adult’s feces. This practice is more common in foals confined to stalls than those on pasture, and is uncommon after 6 months of age. Researchers and veterinarians speculate that the coprophagy in foals is a mechanism for populating the digestive system with bacteria and protozoa necessary for a fully functioning cecum. These microbes are required for effective fiber digestion, which is necessary for a foal to fully utilize a grass or hay diet as he grows and consumes more forage and less mare’s milk.
Scientists have not identified a nutritive motivation for coprophagy in foals, but mature horses eating protein-deficient diets will often begin eating their manure as well. In these cases coprophagy ceases when adequate protein is provided. Horses in starvation situations or those without adequate forage (consuming less than 1.3 pounds of hay per 100 pounds of body weight) have also been observed to eat manure.
There are also reported cases of coprophagy in horses older than 6 months of age consuming diets that provide very adequate levels of protein, fiber, and vitamins and minerals. These reports appear to be more common in the springtime in stabled horses and are reported most frequently in young stallions. Boredom could be the reason coprophagy appears more in confined horses than pastured horses. Parasite infestation is a concern in these animals, so routine facility cleaning and a good deworming program are important.
Geophagia refers to eating dirt and is reportedly fairly common in feral horses. Geophagia refers not to horses taking in dirt while grazing close to the ground or eating grain off the ground, but is a behavior where horses actively bite into the ground with the intent of eating dirt. Researchers have proposed that horses eat dirt in search of salt or minerals, but soil analyses shows no consistent mineral profile of consumed versus nonconsumed soils; in fact, the soils tested varied tremendously in mineral content. Domestic horses consuming diets containing plenty of salt and mineral have also been seen consuming dirt.
Anecdotal evidence indicates dirt eating might be more common in stallions than mares or geldings, but no studies of gender effects on geophagia have been reported. Although geophagia is generally harmless, consuming sandy soil can cause colic or diarrhea. Some horses are more prone to eating sand than others, even when eating the same diet under the same conditions as horses that don't consume sand. Grazing sparse pastures on sandy soil, consuming grain from the ground, and being thin and/or young are all factors that contribute to increased sand ingestion.
If owners observe individual horses exhibiting unusual eating behaviors such as coprophagy or geophagia, they should evaluate that animal's diet for nutritional balance, forage availability, and the general environment for potential causes of the behavior. A veterinary exam to detect parasite infestation or other health issues could also be warranted. If the diet is adequate, the horse is healthy, and other factors are not at play, then it might be a simple case of boredom. Decreasing time spent in confinement, providing a companion, or increasing exercise might help alleviate the problem.
ABOUT THE AUTHOR
Karen E. Davison, PhD
Karen Davison, PhD, is an equine nutritionist and sales support manager for the horse business group at Purina Animal Nutrition. Her expertise includes equine nutrition, reproduction, growth, and exercise physiology. She received her MS and PhD from Texas A&M University.
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WhatNext
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2015-06-16 11:33 AM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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He is just out on grass now. Through the winter he got hay fescue/orchard grass hay. Here in GA, there is no where to get nice hay without it being hauled in. I tried to get Alfalfa from one guy and it was just brown sticks.
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WhatNext
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2015-06-16 11:37 AM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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I'm sorry I fogot. They do not feed grain where he was purchased. Just the peanut hay
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classicpotatochip
Reg. Mar 2011
Posted 2015-06-16 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



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10 days x 1 full tube Ulcergard
10 days x 1/2 tube ProBios Equine Gel x twice daily
Begin Forco, full scoop, twice daily
Begin Equishure, full scoop, twice daily.
Begin SmartGI Ultra, twice daily.

This will fix it. If you can't do the supplements, the Ulcergard and ProBios will give you good results on their own. Forco is also a big deal when they're eating dirt. He's trying to kickstart his digestive system. He's currently only got bugs to handle a certain type of hay. You've got to get his gut digesting properly again.

Edited to add:
You can free choice alfalfa cubes, or give 15 lbs daily, and it would probably really help, and adding 2-4 lbs rice bran also does wonders.

Edited by classicpotatochip 2015-06-16 12:09 PM
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WhatNext
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2015-06-16 12:23 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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Thank you very much. I am ordering the ulcergard today. I already bought the probios.( not the gel though) I will check on the other supplements. I had thought about the cubes. I will have to get some of those. and I can do the rice bran. Just want him better and start running again. He is a very nice barrel horse.
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Cowgirl Kat
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2015-06-16 12:27 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



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Good luck with your horse! I like to use GastroPLUS with Forco. Has always helped my horses with digestional issues and ulcers. See what works best for him. :
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livexlovexrodeo
Reg. Oct 2009
Posted 2015-06-16 12:42 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



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Location: Pacific Northwest
The SafeChoice Special Care is for easy keepers...it might be lacking something he needs. And with all grains, unless you're feeding the specified amount of feed for their weight/work load they won't get all of the vitamins in it. I would try adding a vitamin supplement. I use Horse Guard, its a vitamin formulated for horses that live in my area (the Pacific Northwest). You might do some research and see what your area is typically low in, or have blood work done to see what your horse is missing specifically.

As for ulcers, I've treated with UlcerCure OTC (which I guess is no longer available) and then I kept the horse on SmartGut Ultra (from SmartPak). She wasn't eating at all and after I did both of those things she eats everything I put in front of her and has been like this for over a year.
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WhatNext
Reg. Dec 2014
Posted 2015-06-16 1:00 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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The labs recently were not vitamin specific but it did show calcium was high. I agree with the recommended amounts of feed. I did start weighing it. I know my area is possibly vit e and selenium deficient. I am looking into changing feeds even though the vet stated he might be a candidate for metabolic syndrome. He doesn't seem like it to me.
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lindseylou2290
Reg. Aug 2013
Posted 2015-06-16 4:36 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



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Cowgirl Kat - 2015-06-16 12:27 PM Good luck with your horse! I like to use GastroPLUS with Forco. Has always helped my horses with digestional issues and ulcers. See what works best for him. :

THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^^  
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Barnmom
Reg. May 2006
Posted 2015-06-16 9:32 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



Hog Tie My Mojo


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Do a search for Bluebonnet Stride DSI, I have had really good luck with that lately. If you don't have a Bluebonnet dealer near you, it can be ordered from thier website.

We feed peanut hay and I haven't found anything around here that comes close to it forage wise. You may need to feed some type of concentrate to make up for what he is not getting in forage now, especially if he is trying to get over an illness.  Peanut hay is very digestable and the horses get a lot out of it, it would be hard to replace it with anything but concentrate or very high quality forage.



 
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Fairweather
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2015-06-17 8:43 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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Location: East Tennessee but who knows?!
 As far as weight and not having good hay, chaffhaye is a good alternative. It has enzymes , etc in it to help with digestion. Alfalfa cubes are another good alternative. I feed a decent grass hay for filler but add at least 2 pounds of Alf cubes or Chaffhaye. Then also rice bran for added omegas/fats.

My gelding also spiked 106 temp last month, no idea what from, he hadn't been off the farm. I switched him to low starch from Strategy, switched from cubes to Chaffhaye to be a little easier on his digestive tract. The change has been good for him. 
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streakysox
Reg. Jul 2008
Posted 2015-06-17 10:13 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What



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If the horse is used to hay and no feed it sounds to me like he is having trouble adjusting to the feed. I would feed alfalfa cubes and change to a different feed. I do not know what feeds you have available so you are going to have to choose something you can get. You may have to try till you find what works. Platinum Performance has many necessary things (too many to type) but it does have probiotics. I would add that. Sometimes horses chew tails because they are bored. A young filly chewed off my paint horse's tail once and never did it again. Just so happened it was right before the world paint show so not good. He looked like he should have been at the draft horse show.
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cheryl makofka
Reg. Jan 2011
Posted 2015-06-17 11:04 PM
Subject: RE: Ulcer/Vitamin definiency or What


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WhatNext - 2015-06-16 1:00 PM

The labs recently were not vitamin specific but it did show calcium was high. I agree with the recommended amounts of feed. I did start weighing it. I know my area is possibly vit e and selenium deficient. I am looking into changing feeds even though the vet stated he might be a candidate for metabolic syndrome. He doesn't seem like it to me.

Why not test the horse for metabolic syndrome, then you will know.

There are many horses who cannot process simple starches and do not look like the classic cushings horses.

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