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  That's White "Man" to You
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| Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last.
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Location: Not Where I Want to Be | Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 3:52 PM Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last.
Stallions
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| 1DSoon - 2018-10-17 3:28 PM
Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 3:52 PM  Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last. Â
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Stallions
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Do specific stallions add legitimacy to a program? Like the pink buckle...As long as they pay, who cares?? |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| From the standpoint of someone who doesn’t breed, affordability is important to me.
If Pink Buckle is going to add thousands on to the price of a prospect, plus cost me hundreds each year for 1 race a year, I’m not sure ita A sandbox I can afford to play in - good for you if you can or already happen to own one. Of course we’ll have to wait and see if PB eligible foals start to carry a premium in the market - I wonder a bit since you have to pay in yearly to keep them eligible how much of a premium price they’ll command on the front end since they have a higher annual “maintenance” cost.
Future Fortunes seems much more affordable from the prospect purchasing side (or at least I see several I could afford) and there’s several races that I go to already that have nice FF incentives, getting me more chances at bang for my buck. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| OhMax - 2018-10-17 4:32 PM From the standpoint of someone who doesn’t breed, affordability is important to me. If Pink Buckle is going to add thousands on to the price of a prospect, plus cost me hundreds each year for 1 race a year, I’m not sure ita A sandbox I can afford to play in - good for you if you can or already happen to own one. Of course we’ll have to wait and see if PB eligible foals start to carry a premium in the market - I wonder a bit since you have to pay in yearly to keep them eligible how much of a premium price they’ll command on the front end since they have a higher annual “maintenance” cost. Future Fortunes seems much more affordable from the prospect purchasing side (or at least I see several I could afford) and there’s several races that I go to already that have nice FF incentives, getting me more chances at bang for my buck.
What is affordable to you? |
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 My Heart Be Happy
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Location: Arkansas | Bump |
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 You get what you give
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Location: Texas | Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 2:52 PM
 Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last. Â
Â
Breeder incentives for one.. I paid a handful of colts into the BBR stallion stakes, sold them, and then realized I get $0 from their program, they only pay stallion owner and owner of the colt. I stopped paying in then and there and will only pay into programs that will pay the breeder something.
I hope the Pink Buckle lasts and it works for me who is small scale. I can afford to pay my two into PB. If I had a ton of them, that wouldn't be feasible.
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 Living on the edge of common sense
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Location: Carpenter, WY | Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 1:52 PM Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last.
Good question. The way it's going now there will be alot of small operations that will just throw their hands up because they don't have deep enough pockets to compete and that's not saying the horses aren't just as good as anything out there. There are so many stallion enrollments that you can get into that I'd have to take a 2nd mortgage out to enter them all. I think it's going to create a divide between the futurity world and the rodeo world and whether you're doing it for personal reward or treating it like a business which is very easy to go very broke in LOL
Edited by teehaha 2018-10-18 7:23 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 542
| casualdust07 - 2018-10-18 3:50 PM
Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 2:52 PM
 Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last. Â
Â
Breeder incentives for one.. I paid a handful of colts into the BBR stallion stakes, sold them, and then realized I get $0 from their program, they only pay stallion owner and owner of the colt. I stopped paying in then and there and will only pay into programs that will pay the breeder something.
I hope the Pink Buckle lasts and it works for me who is small scale. I can afford to pay my two into PB. If I had a ton of them, that wouldn't be feasible.
I feel like every incentive that as a breeder of a horse you pay the horse into should pay the breeder. Race horse associations per state have been doing this for years and it has been very successful in some states where it was managed correctly. Everyone loves getting mailbox money from a horse they raised. |
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 Guys Just Wanna Have Fun
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Location: OH | As a small breeder, we drop around 15 babies a year and do not breed a lot of outside mares--by choice. I have trouble making the math work on a lot of these incentives--especially with us being in the East. That may change in the future---I like the idea of them. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 4:41 PM
OhMax - 2018-10-17 4:32 PM From the standpoint of someone who doesn’t breed, affordability is important to me. If Pink Buckle is going to add thousands on to the price of a prospect, plus cost me hundreds each year for 1 race a year, I’m not sure ita A sandbox I can afford to play in - good for you if you can or already happen to own one. Of course we’ll have to wait and see if PB eligible foals start to carry a premium in the market - I wonder a bit since you have to pay in yearly to keep them eligible how much of a premium price they’ll command on the front end since they have a higher annual “maintenance” cost. Future Fortunes seems much more affordable from the prospect purchasing side (or at least I see several I could afford) and there’s several races that I go to already that have nice FF incentives, getting me more chances at bang for my buck.
What is affordable to you?Â
Probably a lot less than other folks since we haven’t really dabbled into the futurity game, but if I get my finished gelding sold I’ll be shopping for a nominated prospect.
But if I have 2 yearling prospects who are similar in all respects, including breeding, both studs are FF and one is PB. Let’s say the one who is just FF is $5000 - how much do you think the PB nomination adds to the price of the second colt? $1000, $2000, more? I also have to consider that I’ll have an additional cost to keep the PB colt nominated (did I hear $500/yr? I honestly don’t know what it is). Has the cost to get the PB colt to the competition arena if you’re only considering purchase price and incentive payments just doubled over the cost the FF only colt?
The truth is we don’t really know yet, but I’d have to imagine the price of PB eligibke colts will be higher than FF and other smaller incentives, the same way FF colts carry a premium over colts not eligible for any incentives - by how much is the question. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| And I think that is why ff is still so nice. $250 or whatever it is as a weanling and its done. It may not add $ to the price but it does add value. The 250 nomination to ff seems so reasonable compared to the others. |
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 Champ
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Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | teehaha - 2018-10-18 5:20 PM
Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 1:52 PM  Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last. Â
 Good question. The way it's going now there will be alot of small operations that will just throw their hands up because they don't have deep enough pockets to compete and that's not saying the horses aren't just as good as anything out there.   There are so many stallion enrollments that you can get into that I'd have to take a 2nd mortgage out to enter them all. I think it's going to create a divide between the futurity world and the rodeo world and whether you're doing it for personal reward or treating it like a business which is very easy to go very broke in LOLÂ
This ^^^
I'm out. I only participate in the local 2 incentives. They allow me to donate stud fees or pay a nominal amount to benefit from the advertising they do for me. |
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That's White "Man" to You
Posts: 5515
| OregonBR - 2018-10-19 12:11 PM teehaha - 2018-10-18 5:20 PM Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 1:52 PM Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last.
Good question. The way it's going now there will be alot of small operations that will just throw their hands up because they don't have deep enough pockets to compete and that's not saying the horses aren't just as good as anything out there. There are so many stallion enrollments that you can get into that I'd have to take a 2nd mortgage out to enter them all. I think it's going to create a divide between the futurity world and the rodeo world and whether you're doing it for personal reward or treating it like a business which is very easy to go very broke in LOL This ^^^ I'm out. I only participate in the local 2 incentives. They allow me to donate stud fees or pay a nominal amount to benefit from the advertising they do for me.
I am not a fan of donating breedings. Some of the harder ones to deal with. |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Whiteboy - 2018-10-19 10:20 AM
OregonBR - 2018-10-19 12:11 PM teehaha - 2018-10-18 5:20 PM Whiteboy - 2018-10-17 1:52 PM  Discussion- What, in your opinion, makes an incentive program successful and able to last. Â
 Good question. The way it's going now there will be alot of small operations that will just throw their hands up because they don't have deep enough pockets to compete and that's not saying the horses aren't just as good as anything out there.   There are so many stallion enrollments that you can get into that I'd have to take a 2nd mortgage out to enter them all. I think it's going to create a divide between the futurity world and the rodeo world and whether you're doing it for personal reward or treating it like a business which is very easy to go very broke in LOL This ^^^ I'm out. I only participate in the local 2 incentives. They allow me to donate stud fees or pay a nominal amount to benefit from the advertising they do for me.
They also allow you to pay. Usually it's half the stud fee. |
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Married to a Louie Lover
Posts: 3303
| Whiteboy - 2018-10-19 12:00 PM
And I think that is why ff is still so nice. $250 or whatever it is as a weanling and its done. It may not add $ to the price but it does add value. The 250 nomination to ff seems so reasonable compared to the others. Â
Agreed, and for the part of the country that I run in, it makes more sense for FF as we have several larger shows with added FF $ - and often times not very many vying for it. We also have some smaller incentives that are available like the “Big 8 Performance Fund”.
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