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 Veteran
Posts: 178
 
| Okay so I have a nice 16hh mare that last year we had nice runs, her turns were awesome. She isn't good for the farrier with her back feet, and last year I noticed she sometimes wouldn't hold her lead loping circles (seemed to be worse to the left). She had the winter off, and I'm now starting to leg her back up. She's great at the walk and trot, but loping she will start cross firing and is kicking out. Not her normal self. I had her vetted, and she needed her stifles done, which were done two weeks ago. Nothing has really changed, she's still doing it. I'm taking her to another reputable vet (as the first one was) for a second opinion, but just looking for advice or anyone who has experienced this. (Also she gets Platinum Performance CJ) |
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Meanest Teacher!!!
Posts: 8555
   
Location: sunny california | go to a performance vet. it sounds like your horse's stifles are sticking |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 375
Location: San Antonio, TX | how do stifles sticK?
What do they do to stick? |
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  Ms. Marine
Posts: 4641
Location: Texas | Get a good chiropractor that knows what he or she is doing to look at your horse. One of my mares had an issue with her left stifle for a little while. Took three or four adjustments to get it right. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 383
| if she doesn't stand well for farrier - I would look at the si and I can tell you after many vet bills and 2 years of trying to figure out what the heck was going on with my boy- finally got the si injected and osteopath/chiropractor work done -within 1 week we can already see much improvement- my vet said to have mine chiro every 3weeks for a while cuz he has been out so long it will take a while to get him to stay in
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| Stifles are the knees to your horses back legs and are suspended in surrounding muscle tissue from his pelvic region ... all the shots and chiros in the world will only hide the real problem but will not fix the problem. Taller the horse the higher the hocks and front knees which increases the pressure received by all the joints above ...
90% of stifle problems are because the muscles holding them in place are strained or the joint has moved downward and changed the fulcrum pressure to move normally without favoring that leg or hip .
Human eyes are strange and will pick up on the leg doing the hopping when it is the other leg the horse is favoring .... the good leg is short stepping and trying to support the weight when the injured leg hits the ground ...
Google you some horse skeletons and muscle frames to get a better understanding of you horses body.... as you can see the skeleton is suspended in a mass of muscles and that is all that is holding your entire horse together ...
You have 6 months Plus++ of nothing but straight line work in order to get the muscles in shape, horse to learn to use his rear since his stifles/knees have moved or seriously strained ... .... the stronger and the more conditioned the muscles are the less likely to have stifle problems ...
right now you are just hoping the horse can adapt to the stifle angle change as if he was wearing high heels or shoes with no heels and you know how that feels to your agility in your feet and legs ... you will short step, hop step, protect your weakest leg and drag your toes and feet will land toe first ...
Straight line exercises only ... no jumping.... no backing ... no backing up hills ... no turns... no rollbacks ... no walking, trotting, loping the pattern... no extended trotting .... no flexing of legs etc etc ... STRAIGHT LINE ONLY SO GET OUT IN THE PASTURE ... you are working to reset the position of his stifles back to a permanent status by conditioning his muscles to be stronger and re-set to the new position of his stifles ..
Always remember ... each time you shoot something into a joint that joints lifetime use is shortened ... cartilage cannot be regrown ...
GOOD LUCK ... this simple advice will be attacked but it works a lot better than destroying the joints by covering up the real problem ...
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 Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | What are her angles of her feet?
is she sore in her back? like back just before her hips? |
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Veteran
Posts: 178
| The vet I used has an excellent reputation, and is a performance vet at a race track. I will be using another with similar background that I really trust for my second opinion (waiting to hear back on the appointment). Other than occasionally not holding the lead last year, I didn't feel she ran as hard as she could between the barrels, but as I said, her turns were always smoking. The vet did all of her acupuncture points, and she did not have any signs of soreness elsewhere (and still doesn't). I took her out yesterday and watched her move in the round pen so I could see her, and it was just alarming to me how she was kicking out and just straight up ****ed going to the left. It was SO unlike her. She's in good condition, her feet were just shod recently, her angles are good. Everything appears fine except this issue! Ahhh! I'm just dying to get to the bottom of it as soon as possible. Do you think it's okay for me to be riding her lightly just to keep her legged up? Walking and jogging only? |
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 683
Location: Ohio | joplin21 - 2014-04-28 2:37 PM The vet I used has an excellent reputation, and is a performance vet at a race track. I will be using another with similar background that I really trust for my second opinion (waiting to hear back on the appointment). Other than occasionally not holding the lead last year, I didn't feel she ran as hard as she could between the barrels, but as I said, her turns were always smoking. The vet did all of her acupuncture points, and she did not have any signs of soreness elsewhere (and still doesn't). I took her out yesterday and watched her move in the round pen so I could see her, and it was just alarming to me how she was kicking out and just straight up ****ed going to the left. It was SO unlike her. She's in good condition, her feet were just shod recently, her angles are good. Everything appears fine except this issue! Ahhh! I'm just dying to get to the bottom of it as soon as possible. Do you think it's okay for me to be riding her lightly just to keep her legged up? Walking and jogging only?
I would stay off her and let her rest. I wouldn't even be round penning her knowing she is hurting somewhere. Why risk possibly do more damage??  Keeping her legged up should be the least of your worries. |
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 Tough Patooty
Posts: 2615
Location: Sperry, OK | GrittyCowgirl - 2014-04-29 1:43 PM joplin21 - 2014-04-28 2:37 PM The vet I used has an excellent reputation, and is a performance vet at a race track. I will be using another with similar background that I really trust for my second opinion (waiting to hear back on the appointment). Other than occasionally not holding the lead last year, I didn't feel she ran as hard as she could between the barrels, but as I said, her turns were always smoking. The vet did all of her acupuncture points, and she did not have any signs of soreness elsewhere (and still doesn't). I took her out yesterday and watched her move in the round pen so I could see her, and it was just alarming to me how she was kicking out and just straight up ****ed going to the left. It was SO unlike her. She's in good condition, her feet were just shod recently, her angles are good. Everything appears fine except this issue! Ahhh! I'm just dying to get to the bottom of it as soon as possible. Do you think it's okay for me to be riding her lightly just to keep her legged up? Walking and jogging only? I would stay off her and let her rest. I wouldn't even be round penning her knowing she is hurting somewhere. Why risk possibly do more damage?? Keeping her legged up should be the least of your worries.
This is a double edged sword. You need the horse to be "sore" when you take her to the vet, so some light/moderate riding might be called for. Not to keep her legged up, but to keep her using herself, so the soreness is prevelant and possibley easier to find. But on the other hand, if it is something else, like soft tissue, you could be doing more damamge. Use your best judgement. |
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Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | joplin21 - 2014-04-29 1:37 PM The vet I used has an excellent reputation, and is a performance vet at a race track. I will be using another with similar background that I really trust for my second opinion (waiting to hear back on the appointment). Other than occasionally not holding the lead last year, I didn't feel she ran as hard as she could between the barrels, but as I said, her turns were always smoking. The vet did all of her acupuncture points, and she did not have any signs of soreness elsewhere (and still doesn't). I took her out yesterday and watched her move in the round pen so I could see her, and it was just alarming to me how she was kicking out and just straight up ****ed going to the left. It was SO unlike her. She's in good condition, her feet were just shod recently, her angles are good. Everything appears fine except this issue! Ahhh! I'm just dying to get to the bottom of it as soon as possible. Do you think it's okay for me to be riding her lightly just to keep her legged up? Walking and jogging only? And by good, her angles are at? 50 degrees? 53 degrees? 55 degrees? do you have a picture of her from the side, hoof included?
and if you run your fingers down her spine with pressure she doesn't give?
Edited by cindyt 2014-04-29 2:55 PM
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 Expert
Posts: 1367
Location: mi | My gelding is xrayed with hock issues is going in to be injected this week and his big "sign" is that he is crossfiring. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 375
Location: San Antonio, TX | did she pull with your farrier when you had the hind feet shod? Will she let you stretch her hind leg out behind her? |
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Veteran
Posts: 178
| No, that's exactly where the problem is with the farrier! He'll go to pick it up, but when he tries to pull it back she won't let him, she snatches it right back. I had to have her sedated. She was never good with the backs since I got her (a little less than a year ago), but this last time she was absolutely awful (which I understand if she's in pain), and now with not being able to lope correctly. The thing that baffles me is that she was fine last fall and it's when I went to go start legging her up and getting her ready for show season all of a sudden these issues got severe....
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 Expert
Posts: 3782
Location: Gainesville, TX | BHUSA has some good points. Take her to the vet again. Make sure its the stifle, but if so the cure is usually exercise, but only certain kinds. You need to be working in straight lines and mostly at a walk and trot. To add to his advice, it's good to do lots of walk/trot transitions, ground poles unevenly spaced, and going up and down hills (not backing up them). This is what I'm doing with my gelding who has these issues. It can take a while. |
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Ms Bling Bling Sleeze Kitty
Posts: 20917
Location: LouLouVille, OK | kle12 - 2014-04-29 10:28 PM did she pull with your farrier when you had the hind feet shod? Will she let you stretch her hind leg out behind her?
I am sure I am falling on deaf ears here lol but I am going to go ahead, since you somewhat are addressing what I am...
If the angles and breakovers are off, the horse will be off... period. And crossfiring is a good sign they are off... just because a farrier was out recently doesn't mean she was done correctly... and if she won't let him do her rears without sedation, you need to have her sedated so he can do his job properly.
No hoof no horse, hense why I asked for a side view...
I had a good horse a few years back if he wasn't stood up proper, he would crossfire... |
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Veteran
Posts: 178
| It ended up being her SI joint! I got her injected and am looking forward to seeing the results! |
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 I Freaking Love Ponies
Posts: 2717
Location: Not in Texas where I should be! | joplin21 -- how is your mare now?? any updates?? |
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Veteran
Posts: 178
| She is doing excellent! Running great, no issues riding, seems to be back to normal and in fact has had improved times! She still isn't better with the farrier, I wonder if she's had a bad experience before I got her. |
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