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 Keep those crap slapping tails away!
Posts: 8871
     
Location: Around here somewhere... | My mom's stallion is a palomino and has sired 19 foals, all of which are palomino, from black, bay, and sorrel mares. Is this simply a fluke, or could his creme gene be linked to another, causing him to throw all palominos? I would love to have him tested, but I don't even know what I'd have him tested for- I know that he is quite obviously not homozygous for creme, and obviously homozygous for red (otherwise he would not be palomino himself) Any ideas? |
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| When a palomino is crossed with another palomino you will get a diluted palomino. When a palomino is crossed with a dark color (sorrel, chestnut. Etc) the result will most likely be a palomino. There is a specific percentage of chance of getting a palomino from these color crosses but I'm not sure exactly what is is. I think I remember it being 80% but I'm not sure. The mares genes factor into it too. But roughly a palomino will be the result. |
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 Canine Carryout Queen
Location: Oklahoma | I think hes just a darn good color producer ... if he was homo creme, he'd be cremello ... so hes not ... but thats all hes thrown. thats pretty amazing! |
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 Always Off Topic
Posts: 6382
Location: ND | every mating is 50/50 as to whether he passes on the creme gene or not.........sometimes you roll 7's for a long time.........i had a gray mare (palomino base) that for years threw a palomino colt that turned gray.......the year that i spend some money to breed her to a particular stud, she had a sorrel.....lol |
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 The One
Posts: 7998
Location: South Georgia | Rodeodreamqueen - 2014-05-16 10:35 AM When a palomino is crossed with another palomino you will get a diluted palomino. When a palomino is crossed with a dark color (sorrel, chestnut. Etc) the result will most likely be a palomino. There is a specific percentage of chance of getting a palomino from these color crosses but I'm not sure exactly what is is. I think I remember it being 80% but I'm not sure. The mares genes factor into it too. But roughly a palomino will be the result.
This is not accurate. Any person that breeds for palominos wishes it were! lol It is not more probable to get a palomino. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1096
| So what happens when you cross a palomino and a dun? There are so many variations of those it seems.
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 Elite Veteran
Posts: 974
Location: In the wrong place at the wrong time | horsegirl - 2014-05-16 12:32 PM
Rodeodreamqueen - 2014-05-16 10:35 AM When a palomino is crossed with another palomino you will get a diluted palomino. When a palomino is crossed with a dark color (sorrel, chestnut. Etc) the result will most likely be a palomino. There is a specific percentage of chance of getting a palomino from these color crosses but I'm not sure exactly what is is. I think I remember it being 80% but I'm not sure. The mares genes factor into it too. But roughly a palomino will be the result.
This is not accurate. Any person that breeds for palominos wishes it were! lol It is not more probable to get a palomino.
Yep....I was just going to say the same thing.
I bred a sorrel mare to a gorgeous pally and have a gorgeous sorrel colt 
Edited by Cisco6340 2014-05-16 12:26 PM
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The Resident Destroyer of Liberal Logic
Location: PNW | Cisco6340 - 2014-05-16 11:50 AM
horsegirl - 2014-05-16 12:32 PM
Rodeodreamqueen - 2014-05-16 10:35 AM When a palomino is crossed with another palomino you will get a diluted palomino. When a palomino is crossed with a dark color (sorrel, chestnut. Etc) the result will most likely be a palomino. There is a specific percentage of chance of getting a palomino from these color crosses but I'm not sure exactly what is is. I think I remember it being 80% but I'm not sure. The mares genes factor into it too. But roughly a palomino will be the result.
This is not accurate. Any person that breeds for palominos wishes it were! lol It is not more probable to get a palomino.
Yep....I was jus going to say the same thing.
I bred a sorrel made to a gorgeous pally and have a gorgeous sorrel colt
I'm not 100% on the genetics here.... But wouldn't the palomino/bay cross ONLY have been able to throw buckskin or bay? The stud's creme gene would potentially dilute the red to yellow - but that Agouti gene is dominant for black points over the creme. So it would have been a buckskin, not a pally.... |
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Veteran
Posts: 155
Location: Riding or working in Texas | ok so what if you bred palemino to palemino??? if im not mistaken you could get a sorrel, palemino or cremello?? any thoughts or people who have bred pal to pal what were your results?? |
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  Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Genetically a palomino is single copy of the cream (or dilute) gene on a red based horse.
A buckskin is a horse with one black gene (black is dominant so they only need one to be black based, red may or may not be present but not expressed) an agouti gene (that causes the black to appear red on the body) and they need a single copy of the dilute/cream gene.
Dun is a completely different gene from dilute/cream. A horse can have one or the other or both. But the dun and the dilute/cream do not make a horse homozygous or a 100% color producer because either gene can be passed in single form or together to offspring. If both the dun and the dilute/cream gene are both present in the horse they will appear to be a remarkable color producer as they statistically have a 75% chance of passing on one or both the dun and the dilute/cream gene to every foal regardless of the mare's color. The base color that is passed from both parents would determine whether the foal is red based or black based.  |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 915
Location: SE KS | Turninhard - 2014-05-16 12:50 PM
ok so what if you bred palemino to palemino??? if im not mistaken you could get a sorrel, palemino or cremello?? any thoughts or people who have bred pal to pal what were your results??
https://www.animalgenetics.us/Equine/CCalculator1.asp
This should help!!!!
Offspring Color Probability
50.00% -Palomino
25.00% -Red (Chestnut/Sorrel)
25.00% -Cremello
Edited by lhighquality 2014-05-16 1:54 PM
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Keep those crap slapping tails away!
Posts: 8871
Location: Around here somewhere... | svincent - 2014-05-16 10:59 AM Cisco6340 - 2014-05-16 11:50 AM horsegirl - 2014-05-16 12:32 PM Rodeodreamqueen - 2014-05-16 10:35 AM When a palomino is crossed with another palomino you will get a diluted palomino. When a palomino is crossed with a dark color (sorrel, chestnut. Etc) the result will most likely be a palomino. There is a specific percentage of chance of getting a palomino from these color crosses but I'm not sure exactly what is is. I think I remember it being 80% but I'm not sure. The mares genes factor into it too. But roughly a palomino will be the result. This is not accurate. Any person that breeds for palominos wishes it were! lol It is not more probable to get a palomino. Yep....I was jus going to say the same thing.I bred a sorrel made to a gorgeous pally and have a gorgeous sorrel colt I'm not 100% on the genetics here.... But wouldn't the palomino/bay cross ONLY have been able to throw buckskin or bay? The stud's creme gene would potentially dilute the red to yellow - but that Agouti gene is dominant for black points over the creme. So it would have been a buckskin, not a pally....
Edited by Blaundee 2014-05-16 7:45 PM
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Keep those crap slapping tails away!
Posts: 8871
Location: Around here somewhere... | I know what the probabilities and possibilities are of getting a palomino every breeding... That's why I'm so taken aback that he had thrown ALL palominos. Like the "throwing 7s" comment, I think it's just an amazing streak of great luck... But I have to wonder if his creme gene could be linked to another gene, like in producing "sex-link" chickens. I can't think of any such links in horses, but I know they happen in other species and don't see why it couldn't happen that a horse's color genes could be linked to another gene... I would love to talk to a geneticist about it! LoL |
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Champ
Posts: 19623
Location: Peg-Leg Julia Grimm | Yep. I have a mare that has had 5 fillies and 1 colt. Statistically that's not probable. I have another mare that has had 2 fillies and 4 colts. Again it's statistically out of whack. I had a red mare than produced the color of the stallion every time bred. Bred to a red once, getting a red filly. She was bred to a gray twice with 2 gray foals and a palomino getting a palomino. Statistically that's unlikely. But it happens all the time. So that's what is happening in your case.  |
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| Look at the bloodlines of your mares bred to a palomino stallion ...
the more old foundation, ranch horse or cutting blood the mare has the more likely they will throw palomino or buckskin ...
The more current racing bloodlines of Dash For Cash thru First Down Dash sons and the Easy Jet thru Mr Jess Perry lines are the tuffest to over ride the red and bay colors and end up with a palomino or buckskin. The influence of the colors of the TB lines in these current racing bloodlines strongly deflect the palomino or buckskin colors ...
My own observations over the years tells me to look for a palomino stud with the following to tell if he will also throw buckskins ..... Look to see if he has dark hair in his ears and/or a dark lining around the edges of his ears.
We can quote DNA and color chart statistics all we want ... Mother Nature will come along and make fools of all of us ... lol
Edited by BARRELHORSE USA 2014-05-17 10:50 AM
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