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Posts: 212
| I searched for this first but didn't see much input other than to do a surgery.... :) So.. long story short I bought a grandson of FG for very cheap about a year ago.. He was formerly a 1d horse then turned out for several years bc he has a bucking issue. I ran him for the summer, fall, and winter, he didn't ever buck and recently had started getting in the 1d/ 2d locally against 1d supershow horses. I never vetted him as he was 2000$... A couple months ago he started to be short on his right hind/ buck after a slip at he first. ...so I Rested him 2 weeks, still lame, took him in and got a full lameness exam. He went sound when his stifles were blocked. We did x rays. He has an OCD lesion, but the vet knows the situation with him not really having won enough yet to justify surgery (I am not heartless, I just paid for arthroscopic surgery on another horse and did IRAP)... she thought the lesion would probably be okay and maintained with injections for a few years. We injected him with and decided to do two weeks stall rest.. Well I turn him out/ lunge him and he is still bunny hopping on that leg and very short. Does anyone have any suggestions to possibly improve his lameness if injections did not do much? Pentosan, Adequan, Previcox, Equibone... is this a candidate for blistering or does that only work on a "catching" stilfe... I also have a respond laser. I do realize long term he will need the surgery, just wish I could get him running again and see if he is going to be worth the surgery. But I'm kind of in a mess because I obviously cant sell him if hes lame and am not comfortable lying or misrepresenting him to anyone. I guess the good news is we know why he will sometimes start bucking when in hard work, as I assume he has had the lesion for a long time. |
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 Pork Fat is my Favorite
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Location: The Oklahoma plains. | Since you are obviosly not against injecting one- I would try injecting again. Sometimes it takes 2 or 3 injections in a short amount of time to get all the inflamation out. Do you know how many mgs we put in the joint??
Or try straight steroid once- it wont hurt at this point, IMO.
But you might be money ahead to do surgery because that is likely where this will end up. Although I will say, stifle OCD's in general are not promising long term IMO. |
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 Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | My only experience with this was a really nice young gelding I got from Prehistoric as a 3. I trained (tortured) the poor horse through not wanting to bend and collect to the right, finally decided he had a stifle problem and went to a local vet who insisted it was EPM. Treated him for that, made no difference. I took him to a different vet who found an OCD lesion in his left stifle. We injected and did an internal blister (because he was catching, not just sore). When I started riding him again 10 days later, he was a totally different horse. I had already sold him cheap to a lady in Iowa by then and he was riding awesome when he left for her house. Last I heard, he was in training for barrels in AZ with a board buddy and doing really well. But I don't know if he stayed sound once he was running. I was told when he was diagnosed that surgery would probably work best, but regular injections and a light competition schedule should keep him sound at least for a few years. I didn't want to deal with it at the time, and didn't realize how much difference treatment would make, so I sold him and wish I hadn't. If I hadn't already had the money in my bank account when I got back on him, I would have taken him off the market. |
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Veteran
Posts: 212
| Thank you both for the replies! I am currently trying to find my discharge papers to see what exactly was injected. I know her injections are higher than most and are supposed to be high quality-- in the past have lasted me 2x as long as other vets. I will comment with that info as soon as I get it. Secondly, this first injection as done on 4/22.. is that too soon to reinject or how often did you mean by "in a short time".. and I agree with that. That's why its hard to decide on the surgery :( Ugh these horses will have me gray by 35.. ha! and I am probably about to sound very dumb but what exactly does it mean when one has catching stifles.. Like what does it look like? Would blister have been an option if the horse hadn't had both problems? How much pain was your horse in, some of the things I read on it make me feel like I would feel terrible making him work through it, but other people say their's only seemed mildly painful... thanks again for both replies.. If I can get him patched up and he continued to improve, I would get the surgery done. just at this exact moment I don't have the money and cant justify it. I wish I could. |
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Accident Prone
Posts: 22277
Location: 100 miles from Nowhere, AR | There's always Care Credit. No interest for 12 months, so it gives you some breathing room to pay it off over time. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | The simplest way to explain catching is it feels like someone has a hold of the leg and they kind of skip a step, like a hitch in your getalong :) It is a distinct feeling. And the inflamation from the OCD could cause the ligament to roll off but most likely it is just your OCD causing the pain.
In a short amount of time- I mean per your vets opinon but I have had one that I did 3 times in 3 months. Then he was good for almost a year. But that isnt a long term solution. You seem to know you are patching up for what runs you have left. It may be a sad, no where road.  |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| Osphos will help any bone issue not just navicular. Dr. Harvey at Outlaw Equine feels like it will soon become an every 6 month thing we do for bones. I will sing its praises on any bone issue.
I don't have much experience with OCD because we've always sold them or the owners sold any colts we've come across that have OCD issues. We usually try to cut our loses with them because they aren't going to last going up and down the road without a ton of money going in them. Plus we train to sale not to keep and they aren't very marketable with all the maintenance they need.
ETA- we disclose the issue and sale cheap disclosing the issue and the buyer knowing its the reason they are cheap, we are taking a loss, and that they will need to put money into the horse.
Edited by astreakinchic 2015-05-07 11:37 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 212
| Ugh. yes I know its not ideal to have this issue, hes only 9 and has only been ran for about 2.5 years total his whole life. He has a bad scar from an incident as a weanling, and has always had a bucking problem that's unpredictable. Like I said, I assume this is why, and to be honest figured he had pain somewhere so I just ran him on a gram of bute since Ive got him because he wasn't lame and wasn't in obvious pain... But I knew after that slip he was bad off and didn't run him. I have a video I am going to try to post later. I agree with trying to sell him, I just don't know what ill do if someone that's starting out and wanting something cheap (as they usually do) and is ok with a health problem is interested, bc he has bucked maybe 3x since I owned him, but I would never willingly set someone less experienced up to get hurt :( Plus, I was really starting to like him...She mentioned that sometimes with this type of problem, its in both legs, and due to money/ him visibly getting way better with just a R stifle block, we didn't x ray or inject that Left one. I am watching the videos now and wondering if the bad leg may be better, and now he's off on the other one bc the bad one feels better? Obviously that would be better, bc it would be an easy short term fix, but I don't know. Ive always had trouble with identifying the origin of hind end lameness when its not obvious, and he is bunny hopping either direction, but that could be the same leg I know. |
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Veteran
Posts: 212
| and what did you use osphos for? I have been interested in it for a horse with bad knees and would consider it with this one, vets down here aren't using it that much yet so I haven't been able to learn much |
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Expert
Posts: 1611
| alp341 - 2015-05-07 4:11 PM
and what did you use osphos for? I have been interested in it for a horse with bad knees and would consider it with this one, vets down here aren't using it that much yet so I haven't been able to learn much
We used it on an older gelding thats 17 and has been running hard since a 3yr old. He has no major issues just maintenance from years of running hard. Its like the fountain of youth for him! He has not moved this good in years! Talked to Dr. Josh Harvey at Outlaw Equine about it and he was singing its praises for any bone issue. Had the local vet write a script and we ordered it online for like $270. It takes 60 days to see an affect and can last up to a year or 6 months before you will need another injection. Josh really is seeing results with any bone issue and Dr. Hopper at Rood and Riddle is liking the results in his clients as well but was more dismissive of using it on young horses because he felt like it was wasting money if they didn't have issues by which you could measure flexion results on them. |
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Pork Fat is my Favorite
Posts: 3791
Location: The Oklahoma plains. | I have a friend who uses Outlaw and tried the osphos and didnt see any results like she had with Tildren. But that aside, I totally think you could be correct on maybe needing to inject both stifles. That is where the Lameness Locator program will save you money on diagnosing primary or secondary lameness. |
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